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Re: Is it public land [Re: tigger] #8746547 12/01/22 12:13 AM
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Just gonna put this out to give some food for thought. I grew up in an area of CO where this sort of thing was pretty common. Back in the 1800s they kept one mile for the govt and deeded one mile to private interests over a large area which make it like a checker board. Accessing the public land via corner crossing was never an issue when it was all ranchers running cattle and sheep. It became a huge issue when the land was sold to people moving in from elsewhere and when the fascination with huge antlers came around and guides/outfitters began leasing everything. That is what caused it to be an issue. Look at the WY case this thread is about. The guy screaming and trying to prevent the public from using public land by crossing at the corners is not a native of that area, he is an outsider that bought a bunch of land and is intent on making huge $$$ off it and public hunters are a threat to this.

Back when it was just regular folks trying to take a buck or a bull for the freezer nobody cared. But toss the huge $$$ from the trophy hunting craze into it and you have a different animal. I fully realize a number of you born here in TX will take exception to my comment but TX has never had the history of public land hunting like WY, MT, UT, ID, CO etc... That is what makes this an issue. Feel free to disagree but remember I grew up in such an area in the 1960s and have seen the change and many of you did not grow up there and see it happen. I am of the opinion that no private land owner should be able to prevent the public from accessing public land.

I used to hunt a very hard to get to area south of Silt CO for elk and it was a great area. There was one public access road and it was one of the roughest roads you could ever imagine. One of the neighboring ranches was sold to a businessman from NY and he took it on himself to have the public road dug up with a backhoe to prevent the public from getting onto the public land. How do I know this? We were back in that area doing some preseason scouting when the road was dug up and we followed the backhoe tracks to his ranch road. We had to walk out over 15 miles and call the sheriff to make him fill in the dug out part so we could get our vehicles out. Such action is not only illegal but devious. I see denying crossing at corners in the same light. Public land belongs to the public and the public should be able to use those lands.

With that I am done and will not post again on this topic.


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Re: Is it public land [Re: QMC SW/EXW] #8746565 12/01/22 12:32 AM
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Originally Posted by QMC SW/EXW
Just gonna put this out to give some food for thought. I grew up in an area of CO where this sort of thing was pretty common. Back in the 1800s they kept one mile for the govt and deeded one mile to private interests over a large area which make it like a checker board. Accessing the public land via corner crossing was never an issue when it was all ranchers running cattle and sheep. It became a huge issue when the land was sold to people moving in from elsewhere and when the fascination with huge antlers came around and guides/outfitters began leasing everything. That is what caused it to be an issue. Look at the WY case this thread is about. The guy screaming and trying to prevent the public from using public land by crossing at the corners is not a native of that area, he is an outsider that bought a bunch of land and is intent on making huge $$$ off it and public hunters are a threat to this.

Back when it was just regular folks trying to take a buck or a bull for the freezer nobody cared. But toss the huge $$$ from the trophy hunting craze into it and you have a different animal. I fully realize a number of you born here in TX will take exception to my comment but TX has never had the history of public land hunting like WY, MT, UT, ID, CO etc... That is what makes this an issue. Feel free to disagree but remember I grew up in such an area in the 1960s and have seen the change and many of you did not grow up there and see it happen. I am of the opinion that no private land owner should be able to prevent the public from accessing public land.

I used to hunt a very hard to get to area south of Silt CO for elk and it was a great area. There was one public access road and it was one of the roughest roads you could ever imagine. One of the neighboring ranches was sold to a businessman from NY and he took it on himself to have the public road dug up with a backhoe to prevent the public from getting onto the public land. How do I know this? We were back in that area doing some preseason scouting when the road was dug up and we followed the backhoe tracks to his ranch road. We had to walk out over 15 miles and call the sheriff to make him fill in the dug out part so we could get our vehicles out. Such action is not only illegal but devious. I see denying crossing at corners in the same light. Public land belongs to the public and the public should be able to use those lands.

With that I am done and will not post again on this topic.


I like it. Well said.


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Re: Is it public land [Re: QMC SW/EXW] #8746878 12/01/22 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by QMC SW/EXW
Just gonna put this out to give some food for thought. I grew up in an area of CO where this sort of thing was pretty common. Back in the 1800s they kept one mile for the govt and deeded one mile to private interests over a large area which make it like a checker board. Accessing the public land via corner crossing was never an issue when it was all ranchers running cattle and sheep. It became a huge issue when the land was sold to people moving in from elsewhere and when the fascination with huge antlers came around and guides/outfitters began leasing everything. That is what caused it to be an issue. Look at the WY case this thread is about. The guy screaming and trying to prevent the public from using public land by crossing at the corners is not a native of that area, he is an outsider that bought a bunch of land and is intent on making huge $$$ off it and public hunters are a threat to this.

Back when it was just regular folks trying to take a buck or a bull for the freezer nobody cared. But toss the huge $$$ from the trophy hunting craze into it and you have a different animal. I fully realize a number of you born here in TX will take exception to my comment but TX has never had the history of public land hunting like WY, MT, UT, ID, CO etc... That is what makes this an issue. Feel free to disagree but remember I grew up in such an area in the 1960s and have seen the change and many of you did not grow up there and see it happen. I am of the opinion that no private land owner should be able to prevent the public from accessing public land.

I used to hunt a very hard to get to area south of Silt CO for elk and it was a great area. There was one public access road and it was one of the roughest roads you could ever imagine. One of the neighboring ranches was sold to a businessman from NY and he took it on himself to have the public road dug up with a backhoe to prevent the public from getting onto the public land. How do I know this? We were back in that area doing some preseason scouting when the road was dug up and we followed the backhoe tracks to his ranch road. We had to walk out over 15 miles and call the sheriff to make him fill in the dug out part so we could get our vehicles out. Such action is not only illegal but devious. I see denying crossing at corners in the same light. Public land belongs to the public and the public should be able to use those lands.

With that I am done and will not post again on this topic.

If I own it, I say who touches it. The only way to keep anyone off your property is to keep everybody off your property.


An unethical shot is one you take, that you know you shouldn't.
Re: Is it public land [Re: tigger] #8747014 12/01/22 02:54 PM
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Corner crossing yes, landlocked parcels miles form any road no way you should get access. Let the feds sell that land to the ranchers that surround it.

Sorry QMc but not all landlocked public lands should have access. Those with adjacent public lands you bet, but allowing some yahoos to cross miles of private to access a 40 A landlocked parcel should not be mandatory.

Re: Is it public land [Re: tigger] #8747058 12/01/22 03:26 PM
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Yeah the last sentence in that second paragraph is my only beef in the whole statement.

Re: Is it public land [Re: Wytex] #8747064 12/01/22 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Wytex
Corner crossing yes, landlocked parcels miles form any road no way you should get access. Let the feds sell that land to the ranchers that surround it.

Sorry QMc but not all landlocked public lands should have access. Those with adjacent public lands you bet, but allowing some yahoos to cross miles of private to access a 40 A landlocked parcel should not be mandatory.



I am a hunter, that's well known. I pay to hunt private land. I also hunt public land. I walk 3-5 miles in, and out sometimes with a 1/4'd deer in a backpack. There is private land all along, both sides of my walk in. No way I feel entitled to step one inch on their land, much less full access to get where I want to go. In our country when owners are told how their property is to be used, we don't have our country any longer and won't have guns to hunt with.


An unethical shot is one you take, that you know you shouldn't.
Re: Is it public land [Re: QMC SW/EXW] #8747083 12/01/22 03:50 PM
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Originally Posted by QMC SW/EXW
Just gonna put this out to give some food for thought. I grew up in an area of CO where this sort of thing was pretty common. Back in the 1800s they kept one mile for the govt and deeded one mile to private interests over a large area which make it like a checker board. Accessing the public land via corner crossing was never an issue when it was all ranchers running cattle and sheep. It became a huge issue when the land was sold to people moving in from elsewhere and when the fascination with huge antlers came around and guides/outfitters began leasing everything. That is what caused it to be an issue. Look at the WY case this thread is about. The guy screaming and trying to prevent the public from using public land by crossing at the corners is not a native of that area, he is an outsider that bought a bunch of land and is intent on making huge $$$ off it and public hunters are a threat to this.

Back when it was just regular folks trying to take a buck or a bull for the freezer nobody cared. But toss the huge $$$ from the trophy hunting craze into it and you have a different animal. I fully realize a number of you born here in TX will take exception to my comment but TX has never had the history of public land hunting like WY, MT, UT, ID, CO etc... That is what makes this an issue. Feel free to disagree but remember I grew up in such an area in the 1960s and have seen the change and many of you did not grow up there and see it happen. I am of the opinion that no private land owner should be able to prevent the public from accessing public land.

I used to hunt a very hard to get to area south of Silt CO for elk and it was a great area. There was one public access road and it was one of the roughest roads you could ever imagine. One of the neighboring ranches was sold to a businessman from NY and he took it on himself to have the public road dug up with a backhoe to prevent the public from getting onto the public land. How do I know this? We were back in that area doing some preseason scouting when the road was dug up and we followed the backhoe tracks to his ranch road. We had to walk out over 15 miles and call the sheriff to make him fill in the dug out part so we could get our vehicles out. Such action is not only illegal but devious. I see denying crossing at corners in the same light. Public land belongs to the public and the public should be able to use those lands.

With that I am done and will not post again on this topic.


I think the NY should have been fined severely for not maintaining a prescriptive easement that was written in well before he owned property.

Colorado is really good about punishing people who post Public as private and lock legal easements.

I and my family have been hunting a piece that has a mile walk in trail prescriptive easement since 70’s. It’s on its third owner since I’ve been hunting it. Current one saw me picking up trash and told me I could hunt his hay field any time i just needed to call first.

He has had it for 10 years and the entitlement he deals with would cause me not to ever buy land with easement or corner. Not just hunters but hikers also.



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Re: Is it public land [Re: tigger] #8747115 12/01/22 04:28 PM
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First and foremost, OnX is not the 'Bible' on where property lines are; I can think of multiple instances where property lines are SIGNIFICANTLY off from what exists on the ground. That is what surveyors are for. I cannot stand when I hear, "But OnX shows....."


I'm of two minds on the topic of 'hemming' public land within the boundaries of private land. I cannot decide what the 'right' answer is. On one hand, the public (me, us) should not have a barrier to access lands that are public; we pay for them its our right to access them. However, the ranch I took my elk on this year has done this same exact thing. I had to sign a release of liability to hunt the ranch with permission; John Q Public is a freaking litigious moron. No way would our ownership allow Johnny to cross the ranch, possibly stub his toe on a pebble, and sue everyone under the sun looking for a payday. Ultimately, the government/controlling agency should have retained access easements to these lands - they failed us .... again (shocker).

The only guaranteed thing about this issue is that the lawyers will make money and everyone else loses.

Re: Is it public land [Re: HuntnFly67] #8747124 12/01/22 04:43 PM
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Originally Posted by HuntnFly67
First and foremost, OnX is not the 'Bible' on where property lines are; I can think of multiple instances where property lines are SIGNIFICANTLY off from what exists on the ground. That is what surveyors are for. I cannot stand when I hear, "But OnX shows....."



Anyone remember the notorious deer game warden case on here where onX was wrong? The county line was wrong I believe in onX?


To be determined
Re: Is it public land [Re: TurkeyHunter] #8747169 12/01/22 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted by TurkeyHunter
Originally Posted by HuntnFly67
First and foremost, OnX is not the 'Bible' on where property lines are; I can think of multiple instances where property lines are SIGNIFICANTLY off from what exists on the ground. That is what surveyors are for. I cannot stand when I hear, "But OnX shows....."



Anyone remember the notorious deer game warden case on here where onX was wrong? The county line was wrong I believe in onX?


OnX has disclaimers for this exact reason. With that said old surveys vs new surveys may differ. How much do you want to spend to defend yourself? Same with fence lines.


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Re: Is it public land [Re: tigger] #8747189 12/01/22 06:15 PM
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Yeah I find a lot of errors on onX. Cracks me up. When things are grey or tight borders I always reference better maps put out by the controlling authority.

Re: Is it public land [Re: tigger] #8747195 12/01/22 06:20 PM
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Here is one I thought of. OnX shows that private splitting and public going right through. Obviously that’s way off. Surely no goofy rascal has assumed that onX was right and walked that field. I can tell you from one encounter that land owner is a grade A, 1st class jerk. He thinks he owns that little area there and that nobody but his boys should be back there. I couldn’t imagine what he’d be like if you were on the other side of the fence.

Re: Is it public land [Re: ducknbass] #8747198 12/01/22 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by ducknbass
Yeah I find a lot of errors on onX. Cracks me up. When things are grey or tight borders I always reference better maps put out by the controlling authority.

I like onX. I use it. It's great and has it's place. That said, it's like velocity on a box of ammo. Verify.


An unethical shot is one you take, that you know you shouldn't.
Re: Is it public land [Re: ducknbass] #8747208 12/01/22 06:29 PM
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Originally Posted by ducknbass
Yeah I find a lot of errors on onX. Cracks me up. When things are grey or tight borders I always reference better maps put out by the controlling authority.


100%


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Re: Is it public land [Re: tigger] #8747670 12/02/22 03:56 AM
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You could, with grounds, sue someone for breaking your airspace while on a sidewalk. Whether they violated your property rights or not the main question would be damages. Just like I have the right to demand tree limbs be kept from encroaching my property or demand a leaning fence be straightened. The remedy is to stop the encroachment. There are almost no damages. In this suit, the damages are almost zero. Land owner cannot argue damages because they were on public land. Cannot argue they killed animals as they are held by the state in public trust. The only damages are the devaluation of his land value. Once he prevails in defense of his property rights the damages disappear. He can request reimbursement of legal costs. This would be up to the judge or jury depending on how that's handled in Wyoming. So technically, you could sue someone for waving their arm over your airspace and could likely prevail. But the only remedy would be to compel respondent to stop doing it.


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Re: Is it public land [Re: TurkeyHunter] #8754997 12/11/22 01:38 AM
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Originally Posted by TurkeyHunter
Serious question. What if you helicoptered in?


Perfectly legal & ethical.


[b][/b]
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