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Re: black panther ?
[Re: RattlesnakeDan]
#8712161
10/18/22 09:27 PM
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 2,903
spacejunkie
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I am on a place now trapping and killing hogs and it is some nasty thicket mixed with deep dark ravines and a big river bottom structure with giant trees giving it little sunlight. Tall grasses and shorter thicket that is pretty much not navigable. ( I carry a pruning shears in my pocket to cut my way through some of it)The landowner is 83 years old and has asked me not to shoot the black panthers or any big cat because even a black panther can look light colored in the sun. Ok I said. He also told me not to shoot the Chupacabras' as he has had the discovery channel out a few times and says they are a coyote/wolf hybrid. Which does actually exist in Texas but now he says no coyotes as I may mistake it for one of his Chupa's. Ok I said. He also told me not to shoot his miniature Mexican deer as they have come up river and have been seen at his place. Ok I said. What can I say to the guy other than yes sir, you got it.
Pictures of hogs so we know this story is true.
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: spacejunkie]
#8712208
10/18/22 10:42 PM
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Joined: Dec 2017
Posts: 2,824
RattlesnakeDan
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I am on a place now trapping and killing hogs and it is some nasty thicket mixed with deep dark ravines and a big river bottom structure with giant trees giving it little sunlight. Tall grasses and shorter thicket that is pretty much not navigable. ( I carry a pruning shears in my pocket to cut my way through some of it)The landowner is 83 years old and has asked me not to shoot the black panthers or any big cat because even a black panther can look light colored in the sun. Ok I said. He also told me not to shoot the Chupacabras' as he has had the discovery channel out a few times and says they are a coyote/wolf hybrid. Which does actually exist in Texas but now he says no coyotes as I may mistake it for one of his Chupa's. Ok I said. He also told me not to shoot his miniature Mexican deer as they have come up river and have been seen at his place. Ok I said. What can I say to the guy other than yes sir, you got it.
Pictures of hogs so we know this story is true. Its true
Just like Jesus, sometimes you gotta kill some hogs. Lone Star Mesquite . com RattleSnake Dan's Shredding Service
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: Kevin Heath]
#8712287
10/19/22 12:25 AM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 5,657
flintknapper
THF Trophy Hunter
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There is a site I follow devoted to Texas Black Panther sightings and the people on that site who believe they have seen a black panther over look two things. First, Mountain lions do not even carry the gene for melanism or being black and there has never been a black one killed in the US or anywhere else. Secondly, black jaguars are only about 6% of the population of jaguars so where are all the spotted ones we would be seeing in Texas if people keep seeing black ones, especially in East Texas! There are black leopards in Asia and perhaps Africa but those are not native to our hemisphere. I've heard it all...circus train wrecks, drug smugglers escaped pets, canned hunt escapees, government releasing them to control hogs HAHA, etc. Where are the clear pictures or game camera pictures or road kill. Believers on that site constantly try to pass off pictures that are easily backtracked on the internet and were taken in India or somewhere like that. I am amazed by the people that I have met that claim to have seen black panthers. One guy, a friend of mine, has literally seen more black panthers than he has seen mountain lions (2:1). Apparently having seen one a second time just confirmed for him that his first sighting was valid. A couple of people I have met have never seen a mountain lion, but have seen black panthers (all singular sightings). And yeah, they all have rationalizations for why they have seen something unknown to science or the vast hunting community that has never killed one. What amazes me is the level of ignorance, shallow thinking or outright intellectual dishonesty. You can find literally hundreds of people in every State (California to Florida and everything in between) with claims of having seen a Black Panther. Now I know full well that some folks have actually seen 'something' black (house-cat, hog, whatever) and simply choose to assign its identification as a Black Panther....because that's what they want to believe (despite NO empirical evidence ever having been produced). So I'll be generous and say that 50% of those just made a 'mistake'. The others seem to genuinely believe in the existence of the animal and will argue to the bitter end they are right. So.....lets apply just a teeny, tiny bit of logic to the notion: 1. For THOUSANDS of people to have 'absolutely' seen one of these elusive devils, there MUST be quite a few Black Panthers around right? 2. For quite a few Black Panthers to be around there must quite a few breeding pairs around....correct? After all these claims have been made for at least a century. 3. OR....there are only a few Black Panther around but Damn....do they get around. Travelers on a scale like we've never seen. But SO secretive that no one has ever gotten one on a game camera, killed one or found one dead. Is it really too much to ask folks to live in a world of reality! NO black panthers, NO bigfoots. wow, I bet you are fun at parties. I don't go to parties to talk about imaginary Unicorns, Black Panthers, Sasquatch, Fairy Dust, Lost gold mines, etc.... I will leave that to the folks so pathetic that this is their only source of entertainment or conversation. So, yeah....I could suck all the fun right out that kind of room.
Spartans ask not...how many, but where!
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: vanguard]
#8712924
10/19/22 08:23 PM
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 8,395
Double Naught Spy
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Not a mountain lion, but Canada just had its first reported melanistic lynx. This came out in the journal Mammalia. https://www.researchgate.net/public..._melanism_in_Canada_lynx_Lynx_canadensisHere is an article showing video... https://phys.org/news/2022-10-black-canada-lynx.htmlBefore somebody says that if it can happen in lynx, it can happen in mountain lions, well maybe. However, it isn't like everyone and their cousin in Canada has seen or knows folks that have seen these things. There is no black lynx mythos in Canada like there is for black panthers here. So I still have to fall back on the side of logic. How come so many people claim to see these black panthers, including hunters, so they are apparently super duper common, and yet we don't have a single body either through hunting, trapping, roadkills, etc.?
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: Double Naught Spy]
#8712951
10/19/22 09:07 PM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 5,657
flintknapper
THF Trophy Hunter
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Not a mountain lion, but Canada just had its first reported melanistic lynx. This came out in the journal Mammalia. https://www.researchgate.net/public..._melanism_in_Canada_lynx_Lynx_canadensisHere is an article showing video... https://phys.org/news/2022-10-black-canada-lynx.htmlBefore somebody says that if it can happen in lynx, it can happen in mountain lions, well maybe. However, it isn't like everyone and their cousin in Canada has seen or knows folks that have seen these things. There is no black lynx mythos in Canada like there is for black panthers here. So I still have to fall back on the side of logic. How come so many people claim to see these black panthers, including hunters, so they are apparently super duper common, and yet we don't have a single body either through hunting, trapping, roadkills, etc.? No question about that one. Pretty dang cool!
Spartans ask not...how many, but where!
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: Kevin Heath]
#8713694
10/20/22 08:43 PM
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,591
garyrapp55
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wow, I bet you are fun at parties. Only black panther parties.
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: vanguard]
#8713721
10/20/22 09:11 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,532
jrs_39
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I've hunted and killed numerous bobcats, one mountain lion (in colorado) and dozens upon dozens of feral cats. One mid day in Coleman county, I had a long black cat ( 4 ft from snout to tip of tail) stop in the middle of the road about 20 yards from me. Had no idea what the hell it was. Short legs, long tail, strange head. Maybe a juvenile mountain lion?
Googled a picture of a jaguarundi. I could have taken the same picture. They are known to live along our southern border into mexico and south america.
Maybe they are more widespread than is currently understood. And could definitely lead to an incorrect report of a black panther.
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: jrs_39]
#8713749
10/20/22 09:47 PM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 5,657
flintknapper
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Googled a picture of a jaguarundi. I could have taken the same picture. They are known to live along our southern border into mexico and south america.
Maybe they are more widespread than is currently understood. And could definitely lead to an incorrect report of a black panther.
OK....lets run with that. Certainly Jaguarundi exist, they are known to be present in Deep South Texas. Some are even dark gray (almost charcoal) though that is not their most prominent color. But for arguments sake....lets say someone (Maybe even you) saw one...and saw one well outside their normal 'known' range. I can accept the idea of a 'few' Jaguarundi sightings and them being mistaken for a 'Black Panther'. But NOT thousands of sightings ALL over Texas let alone the rest of the lower 48. So how do you reconcile this? An animal even rarer than a Mountain Lion, one with the Black/Dark Gray color phase being seen by so many people. What are the chances? How many people have even seen an ordinary Mountain Lion in the wild (of which there are many more than Jaguarundi) and of which we KNOW have a huge range (from Canada down to South America). But we are to believe that somehow the dark Jaguarundi have secretively expanded their range and that this could be the answer to the Black Panthers. Its amazing to me that folks labor so....to keep this myth alive.
Spartans ask not...how many, but where!
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: flintknapper]
#8714193
10/21/22 02:25 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,532
jrs_39
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It will be a myth until one walks out in front of you. Hope you can keep it to yourself. Not fun being called a delusional liar.
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: vanguard]
#8714213
10/21/22 02:45 PM
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 8,395
Double Naught Spy
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No, it will still be a myth until somebody produces a body, just like with Bigfoot.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof and that just doesn't exist for either.
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: vanguard]
#8714253
10/21/22 04:04 PM
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,433
jeffbird
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: vanguard]
#8714255
10/21/22 04:08 PM
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 8,395
Double Naught Spy
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So you got a blob and two cat images in silhouette in the shade against a really bright background. The cat in the silhouette images could be green, pink, or purple and we would never know for certain, though the little bit of light on the cat's back would indicate it may be a lighter color.
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: vanguard]
#8714260
10/21/22 04:14 PM
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,433
jeffbird
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Not my video, but pretty amazing. Note how small the head is compared to the body. Mountain lions have very large heads.
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: Double Naught Spy]
#8714261
10/21/22 04:20 PM
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,433
jeffbird
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So you got a blob and two cat images in silhouette in the shade against a really bright background. The cat in the silhouette images could be green, pink, or purple and we would never know for certain, though the little bit of light on the cat's back would indicate it may be a lighter color. Your comments reveal your lack of knowledge on field i.d. Jaguarundis have very unique shape heads and bodies, as do bobcats, mountain lions, deer, and bears.
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: vanguard]
#8714290
10/21/22 05:06 PM
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Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 1,724
SherpaPhil
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This thread is really finding its legs now!
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: vanguard]
#8714292
10/21/22 05:11 PM
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 4,433
jeffbird
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I will add to this discussion that a couple of years ago a ranch owner contacted me about a ranch hand killing two jaguarundis. The ranch hand thought they were small mountain lions and brought them to the owner. He knew what they were and called me knowing my efforts to help the cats. Long story made short, we never could work out an agreement with the bureaucracy at USFWS to turn them over.
That event caused some internal shakeup and today I should be able to work out a transfer. Another ranch had a hunter who killed an ocelot thinking it was a bobcat. That information was turned over successfully for everyone.
But understand, there is a strong effort to refuse to accept new evidence of jaguarundis. There is a very organized effort underway by large companies doing business in South Texas to have jaguarundis, ocelots, and some other endangered species declared extinct or soon to be extinct and removed from federal protection so they can do their dirty deeds without consequence.
There is a very well developed and organized plan to turn Port Aransas to Corpus Christi into the next Houston Ship Channel for major industrial development. That plan will result in more condemnation of private lands for pipelines, power lines, roads, and other infrastructure.
The Space X operations at Boca Chica have run ocelots out of the Laguna Atascosa NWR where the population has declined by half in just a few years.
The politicians have USFWS and TPWD turn a blind eye.
As always, private landowners are the best stewards of land and wildlife in this state.
I am very fortunate to be able to see some incredibly beautiful ranches and help them protect their land, water, and animals.
There are some very rare plants and animals on some of these ranches with owners doing their best everyday to save them.
I sat at a table with a ranch owner who lived a modest life living in a mobile home on a beautiful property, which he knew had ocelots. A pipeline company offered him $5 million if he would drop his claim to have ocelots on his land. The man told them to keep their money and leave his cats alone.
That deep passion and fierce protection of land and God’s little creatures gives me hope. We live in a unique land with many very wild areas still remaining.
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: jeffbird]
#8714524
10/21/22 11:26 PM
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 8,395
Double Naught Spy
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So you got a blob and two cat images in silhouette in the shade against a really bright background. The cat in the silhouette images could be green, pink, or purple and we would never know for certain, though the little bit of light on the cat's back would indicate it may be a lighter color. Your comments reveal your lack of knowledge on field i.d. Jaguarundis have very unique shape heads and bodies, as do bobcats, mountain lions, deer, and bears. LOL, I am 1000% certain your 2nd image is of a cat which is all that I said and apparently the 3rd image is the second image with the cat's head hidden. The first image looks like a blob. And your positive identification of the two cats?
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: Double Naught Spy]
#8714532
10/21/22 11:38 PM
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 8,395
Double Naught Spy
THF Trophy Hunter
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So you got a blob and two cat images in silhouette in the shade against a really bright background. The cat in the silhouette images could be green, pink, or purple and we would never know for certain, though the little bit of light on the cat's back would indicate it may be a lighter color. Your comments reveal your lack of knowledge on field i.d. Jaguarundis have very unique shape heads and bodies, as do bobcats, mountain lions, deer, and bears. Field ID? What you have here is photographic interpretation, not field ID, LOL. LOL, I am 1000% certain your 2nd image is of a cat which is all that I said and apparently the 3rd image is the second image with the cat's head hidden. The first image looks like a blob. And your positive identification of the two cats?
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: Double Naught Spy]
#8714561
10/22/22 12:24 AM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 5,657
flintknapper
THF Trophy Hunter
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Field ID? What you have here is photographic interpretation, not field ID, LOL. The first image looks like a blob.
^^^^^^Hah....I thought the first pic was an Ink Blot Test...! Who sees the two black panthers in this one?
Spartans ask not...how many, but where!
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: flintknapper]
#8714914
10/22/22 03:26 PM
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 3,591
garyrapp55
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Who sees the two black panthers in this one? I see a tramp stamp.
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: vanguard]
#8715477
10/23/22 12:32 PM
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Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 15,470
Hudbone
THF Celebrity
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For all you skeptics out here, please see proof positive of the existence of back panthers. Both deer have alerted to it.
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: flintknapper]
#8715602
10/23/22 03:31 PM
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 14,956
ntxtrapper
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Field ID? What you have here is photographic interpretation, not field ID, LOL. The first image looks like a blob.
^^^^^^Hah....I thought the first pic was an Ink Blot Test...! Who sees the two black panthers in this one? I see a fleur-de-lis with a possum crawling up the left side and a raccoon crawling up the right side.
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: vanguard]
#8716260
10/24/22 05:53 AM
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Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 511
HS2
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Ah, the sweet arguments among hunters. Some defending panthers and some getting real upset about it. Great entertainment.
Podcast: Reasoning Through the Bible ReasoningThroughTheBible.com
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: ntxtrapper]
#8716395
10/24/22 01:07 PM
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Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 5,657
flintknapper
THF Trophy Hunter
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Field ID? What you have here is photographic interpretation, not field ID, LOL. The first image looks like a blob.
^^^^^^Hah....I thought the first pic was an Ink Blot Test...! Who sees the two black panthers in this one? I see a fleur-de-lis with a possum crawling up the left side and a raccoon crawling up the right side.
Spartans ask not...how many, but where!
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Re: black panther ?
[Re: vanguard]
#8725361
11/03/22 12:51 PM
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Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 15,470
Hudbone
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For all those skeptics out there, finally found a clear photo of a black panther. He looks tense and ready to pounce.
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