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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554636
03/12/22 05:02 PM
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,048
P_102
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What is your optic/setup and what are you shooting off of?
Do not trifle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554637
03/12/22 05:03 PM
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 7,172
mikei
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Before you do any major tear-downs, slap a different scope on it, and while the scope is off, check all the mounting hardware for the proper torque settings. You may have a "dancing reticle" that bounces after the first shot or some scope mounting hardware that's either loose or not torqued evenly, causing the problem.
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554640
03/12/22 05:09 PM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 788
hermano W
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Mine shot pretty good for a few rounds after the cold bore being several inches different. If yours after the barrel warms up still shoots #1 round different, it’s a different problem from what I had…
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: P_102]
#8554641
03/12/22 05:09 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,916
GusWayne
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What is your optic/setup and what are you shooting off of? Cheap Burris, $149 job Bags
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554643
03/12/22 05:12 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,916
GusWayne
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Ok, I will swap scopes
I hate to do it because of the ammo price/shortage but I’ll give it a shot
I do want to tear it down the best I can, see if I can find anything then clean it again
If that don’t work, scope swap
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554646
03/12/22 05:15 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,916
GusWayne
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I’ve got an old VXI I can toss on there.
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554659
03/12/22 05:34 PM
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 4,236
68A
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Control your breathing. Were the good groups you fired at the same rate of fire? If not, slow the rate of fire and rule out barrel heat and breathing.
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554684
03/12/22 06:33 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 43,260
J.G.
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I would clean the bore and try again, the bore snake thing isn't going to do much.
Otherwise, I would pull off barrel and re torque. Might square up front of received before reinstalling the barrel and nut. A true 3/4" MOA average in a BCA AR in that caliber might be too much to expect.
Ok, will clean it up again I would have called it dirty last night but started this morning w a clean one And yes, for $460 I was surprised at the first 100 rounds and the groups it produced Since then, its terrible Id settle for 1.5'' for pigs and the price Agreed. You cleaning last night was really cleaning. When I clean it js two wet batches with Bore Tech, then nylon brush for 10 strokes, then patches until there is nothing on them. I have had barrels so bad, I never could get to white patches and I started all over. A rifle that used to shoot well, then all of a sudden does not, on the same ammo says the barrel needs to be cleaned in my opinion. And lot number might be on the inside flap of the box. Often lightly printed.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.precisionriflehunters.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/garvey.jpg) 800 Yard Steel Range Precision Rifle Instruction Memberships and Classes Available
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554694
03/12/22 06:54 PM
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Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,761
Jgraider
THF Trophy Hunter
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My bet is a scope/mounting issue.
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554695
03/12/22 06:55 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,916
GusWayne
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I figured it out and will post pics next
This was a mechanical failure that slipped me
If anybody from BCA reads this, this again wasn't they're fault
They do provide a good product at a great price point
Again, BCA was not to blame here
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554705
03/12/22 07:04 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,916
GusWayne
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This is a Burris mount, both the wings had gotten slightly lose I can't trust this mount, its gotta go How they’re supposed to lay ![[Linked Image]](https://texashuntingforum.com/forum/pics/userpics/2022/03/full-19291-340054-9355171e_0081_4a5e_9cde_33cf8f0da145.jpeg) This is a slight exaggeration but this is how I noticed them this morning, again they weren’t kicked up this bad ![[Linked Image]](https://texashuntingforum.com/forum/pics/userpics/2022/03/full-19291-340057-2c3c357f_c6d0_432f_bfc0_e0fcaf195ff0.jpeg) So I tossed this old mount and VXI on ![[Linked Image]](https://texashuntingforum.com/forum/pics/userpics/2022/03/full-19291-340060-87bc27aa_ae42_453d_b158_8097144ffc80.jpeg) 1st ZERO w new scope/mount When I saw it walking in, I knew I had it. Pretty pumped ![[Linked Image]](https://texashuntingforum.com/forum/pics/userpics/2022/03/full-19291-340063-1a2a145a_e190_4817_9f0a_f27c00634ea5.jpeg) 2nd ZERO😍 ![[Linked Image]](https://texashuntingforum.com/forum/pics/userpics/2022/03/full-19291-340065-cb2670e1_03f9_4b28_8d40_70aed2f58099.jpeg)
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554708
03/12/22 07:05 PM
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 17,201
603Country
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When groups open up gradually, it’s probably a fouled barrel (overly fouled). If groups open up suddenly, it’s probably something else that’s the problem. The suggestion to take the scope off and tighten everything and then try another scope is what I’d do. Of course, if the barrel is still overly fouled, do what Fireman said. But…if you do both things before retesting groups, you won’t know which one solved the problem.
Another complication is that you shoot factory loads, and you can’t be certain of the ammo consistency.
My money is on your having a bad scope, because I’ve had your problem more than once, and it was the scope. …….
Well, I was a few minutes late with my opinion, having just read that the problem is fixed. Glad it’s fixed.
Last edited by 603Country; 03/12/22 07:09 PM.
Not my monkeys, not my circus...
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554709
03/12/22 07:08 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,916
GusWayne
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I really do appreciate all the comments and help
This site is great about that
Thanks guys
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554740
03/12/22 07:56 PM
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,048
P_102
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A good, inexpensive lesson to stay away from QD or adjustable mounts.
Do not trifle in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554744
03/12/22 08:02 PM
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Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 4,233
Pig_Popper
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Never mind I see you solved the issues !
Last edited by Pig_Popper; 03/12/22 08:04 PM.
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: P_102]
#8554759
03/12/22 08:38 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,916
GusWayne
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A good, inexpensive lesson to stay away from QD or adjustable mounts. That was my first and last QD mount to ever have Im not saying they're all bad because I am sure somebody makes a really good one I think this one was $109, I could have bought a Warne fixed mount for that price and forever been done
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554792
03/12/22 09:50 PM
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Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,761
Jgraider
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Lot's of military guys use LaRue QD mounts, but they're very expensive.
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: Jgraider]
#8554811
03/12/22 10:18 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,916
GusWayne
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Lot's of military guys use LaRue QD mounts, but they're very expensive. I am sure but that mount would have cost almost as much as this cheap rifle did And I won't be swapping scopes
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554825
03/12/22 10:55 PM
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 788
hermano W
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I’m glad it was a fairly easily solved problem.
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554826
03/12/22 10:58 PM
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 13,492
jdk1985
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Glad it is solved. I'm still surprised that you had so many groups print the same pattern, in the same order (first close, then two high).
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: jdk1985]
#8554827
03/12/22 11:03 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,916
GusWayne
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Glad it is solved. I'm still surprised that you had so many groups print the same pattern, in the same order (first close, then two high). I know I cant figure that out either But because of that consistent, yet poor pattern I didn't think to check scope mount It was a very consistent one that held thru prob 10, 3 shot groups I would have figured the pattern would have been more of a birdshot pattern
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554831
03/12/22 11:13 PM
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Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 3,399
pertnear
"Demolition Man"
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"Demolition Man"
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Gee, now you've got me worried. I have the exact same QD mount on my AR. 
"I haven't shot a 1,000 deer, but I've sat around a 1,000 Texas camp fires. I'm a happy man." - pertnear
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: pertnear]
#8554843
03/12/22 11:37 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 11,916
GusWayne
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Gee, now you've got me worried. I have the exact same QD mount on my AR.  I think mine made it to around 120 rounds before loosening Is yours new? How many rounds? Idk, id like to think I got a lemon but I think the mount just sucks as a whole
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8554997
03/13/22 03:18 AM
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Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 3,399
pertnear
"Demolition Man"
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Gee, now you've got me worried. I have the exact same QD mount on my AR.  I think mine made it to around 120 rounds before loosening Is yours new? How many rounds? Idk, id like to think I got a lemon but I think the mount just sucks as a whole I bought the mount brand new. I shot it about 50 rounds sighting-in & plinking when I first got it. Then I detached the scope & put a Romeo5 in its place for a while. Then recently a friend called & wanted some help with a hog problem so I took the dot sight off & put the scope back on. I checked it at the range & the mount worked as advertised & I didn't lose my zero. Popped 2 pigs in the ear at about 100 yds. So it's only been maybe 15 shots since I last put the mount back on. I'll keep an eye on the scope/mount if I exercise the AR more. I'll keep you posted.
"I haven't shot a 1,000 deer, but I've sat around a 1,000 Texas camp fires. I'm a happy man." - pertnear
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Re: Anyone explain these groups?
[Re: GusWayne]
#8555064
03/13/22 04:42 AM
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 35,694
Brother in-law
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Good example of why not to cheap out on parts
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