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Re: Long Range Shooting advise needed
[Re: GPS]
#7985029
09/23/20 12:08 PM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 12,721
wp75169
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 12,721 |
I would test with a bipod ASAP. Many stocks will not tolerate one and will shift poi significantly. I agree with others, a day with JG will go a long way toward reaching your goals.
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Re: Long Range Shooting advise needed
[Re: GPS]
#7985244
09/23/20 02:49 PM
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Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 4,215
Wytex
Extreme Tracker
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Extreme Tracker
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 4,215 |
He's getting ready for a hunt , not a long range shooting match. Mr Beez is more welcome to voice an opinion. Like I said I've seen accomplished long range shooters on a Wyoming hunt, not near like shooting in a match.
Many instances on game you do mot have time to check your dope sheet or dial a scope before getting set for a shot, I've seen it many times. This is not sitting in a blind, it's elk hunting. And a long range rifle that weighs 8-10 lbs will not be very comfortable in the mountains. Same with carrying shooting sticks or a tripod. A spotting scope takes the place of a 4-25x rifle scope, maybe just good binos, guide will have the spotter if needed.
FiremanJg I bet can help with techniques to control breathing and getting steady for that 1st shot, not a 5 shot group. I bet he would even improve your overall shooting at any distance.
An elk can take a few steps before that 1,000 yd shot gets there, your guide will get you closer for a good shot. All the guides I know, and it's quite a few that guide elk hunters, are not real keen to take out guys that insist on taking a long range shot. They want you close enough to make a good shot and a quick clean kill without a tracking job. Are you going to grizz country ? If so, I know guides will not want you throwing lead out at extreme distances and chance wounding game. If you want a guide like that I do know an outfitter that likes long range shooters but they will test you 1st before going out.
Lots of great long range shooters on here, heed their advice. I would also listen to those that years of experience elk hunting. Maybe Mr Beez has that experience, I don't know. I would just like to see you have a great hunt and harvest an elk, not come home dejected from a bad shot and no elk. Many long range techniques will greatly help your shooting ability on game but making 1,000 yd shots is not necessary, fun but not necessary.
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Re: Long Range Shooting advise needed
[Re: Wytex]
#7985388
09/23/20 04:47 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 42,777
J.G.
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 42,777 |
My program is square away the system first. Get the rifle/scope/ammo zeroed at 100 yards, all the while saying reminders on shooting technique, trigger control, follow-through, breathing. If the scope has an elevation turret we will dial elevation and hold wind. I'll tell you what I'm seeing creating the wind call I'm giving, trees, grass, mirage, here's what I using to give you the wind hold I'm giving. We will work out to 800 yards. Then we will put the scope back on 0 and make pure holds out to 800 yards, no dialing. Because in hunting there is not always time to dial, you have to hold elevation and wind when time is of the essence. Because of that I make sure everyone knows how.
Next thing is to get off prone and get into field positions. Seated, high kneeling, low kneeling, and even standing. And we will do that at 300 and 400 yards. I'm trying to educate the science, the body mechanics and boost confidence. My goal for everyone is to make 400 yards and less not such a big deal. I meet that goal every time. Pretty much everyone gives me the same answer by about 5 o'clock that afternoon. I'll ask "how does 400 yards feel to you now?" And the answer is "like a chip shot".
I've kiled 3 elk, unknown number of whitetail, unknown number of hogs and coyotes. I've probably dialed half those shots, and pure held half those shots. May of this year I hit a coyote at 520 yards, and I held it, no time to dial. You can't take a bench with you on a hunt, so I teach how to use whatcha got to get that rifle to he still. On the rare occasion I get to hunt with a buddy, and he can run the laser for me, life is much easier. I can hit it, I just have to know how far it is. A guide will do that for you as well.
Lots of THF members have booked hunts with Mulie Mike. He told them how far they need to be prepared to shoot. So lots of them contacted me before their hunt. Things went way better for them.
800 Yard Steel Range Precision Rifle Instruction Memberships and Classes Available
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Re: Long Range Shooting advise needed
[Re: GPS]
#7986623
09/24/20 02:09 PM
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Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 4,215
Wytex
Extreme Tracker
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Extreme Tracker
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 4,215 |
Sounds exactly like what he needs. Wish I was closer for a session.
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Re: Long Range Shooting advise needed
[Re: Wytex]
#7986937
09/24/20 07:08 PM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 4,000
Texan Til I Die
Extreme Tracker
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Extreme Tracker
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 4,000 |
An elk can take a few steps before that 1,000 yd shot gets there, your guide will get you closer for a good shot. All the guides I know, and it's quite a few that guide elk hunters, are not real keen to take out guys that insist on taking a long range shot. They want you close enough to make a good shot and a quick clean kill without a tracking job. Agreed. And just for giggles I ran the numbers on my pet 7 Rem Mag load. I'm shooting a 180 ELD out of a 26 inch 8 twist barrel at 2950 fps and at 8000 feet of elevation, 50 degree temp and 50% humidity there is 1.28 seconds of bullet flight time from muzzle to 1000 yards. Probably less than most people would guess, but still enough time for an animal to move a bit.
Silver spurs and gold tequila keep me hanging on. Pretty girls and old cantinas give me shelter from the storm.
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Re: Long Range Shooting advise needed
[Re: Judd]
#7987084
09/24/20 09:32 PM
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 9,833
Mickey Moose
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 9,833 |
Y’all need to call Jason Garvey (FiremanJG) on this forum and setup a day with him. I promise you’ll be a lot closer to ready to go after a day with him than you would be a year on your own. Pay him to shorten the learning curve...he knows his stuff and is a great teacher. I’ve never heard of anyone not being satisfied with a day on the range with Garvey. Not long ago I spent a day with him and Judd is right. FiremanJG will absolutely get you squared away. I had an equipment issue and had to finish much of the class with his rifle. Now that my issue is corrected I need to get back out there.
My botnet is bigger than yours.
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Re: Long Range Shooting advise needed
[Re: Texan Til I Die]
#7987175
09/24/20 11:25 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 33,094
kmon11
junior
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junior
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 33,094 |
An elk can take a few steps before that 1,000 yd shot gets there, your guide will get you closer for a good shot. All the guides I know, and it's quite a few that guide elk hunters, are not real keen to take out guys that insist on taking a long range shot. They want you close enough to make a good shot and a quick clean kill without a tracking job. Agreed. And just for giggles I ran the numbers on my pet 7 Rem Mag load. I'm shooting a 180 ELD out of a 26 inch 8 twist barrel at 2950 fps and at 8000 feet of elevation, 50 degree temp and 50% humidity there is 1.28 seconds of bullet flight time from muzzle to 1000 yards. Probably less than most people would guess, but still enough time for an animal to move a bit. Enough time to go from a great lung/heart shot to a gut shot. 509 yards on a pronghorn is my longest shot on game that was successful. The next day had a very nice mature 5X5 elk at what the guide said was 490 yards so I shot with the same basic hold on the elk, only problem that was off by 80 yards on the short side and the bull was actually 570 yards. THe last I saw of that bull he was at least 3/4 mile away running across a pasture and into woods on another ranch. There was a good bit of dark brown short hair on the snow and at the impact the bull turned to face me holing his left side leg out and shaking it, the frontal shot hit the snow about 6 inches to the right of his shoulder about mid body height after holding that shot higher, not enough wind call on the second shot. It was single digit temps with a full crosswind of 15 to 20mph. Qbout double the wind as on the pronghorn the day before and 60 yards further when standing where the bull was when I took the shot shooting the rangefinder back to the rouck outcropping I was setup prone with the bipod on. That was a about 2003 and scopes were not what they are today and the 7mm STW 160gr Partition load was leaving the barrel at just under 3200fps. I had over 300 rounds through that rifle with that scope in varying conditions before that trip shooting most of them from 300 to 600 yards prepping for the hunt. That shot still haunts me but the bull survived and was killed by a hunter 2 weeks later in the same general area and there was a scab across his brisket and through some muscle on the offside leg fro the slightly quartering shot. I would not attempt that shot these days as I do not shoot nearly as often as I did back then but a calm animal that is not moving much is what I look for and even then one step while the bullet is in the air at distance can mean the difference in a good hit or a bad deal all around. I have turned down shots at some great animals and do not regret any shots I have not taken one bit even on the only for sure B&C buck I have ever had in my sights. Respect the game that you are hunting, learn your limitations and stay within them, Through practice and good instruction you can certainly increase your range but weight in all you have learned and the conditions you are in before taking those long range shots is my motto. Jason and Chad are good marksmen and Jason has developed his class for hunters and is worth it for those that want to increase their abilities as many on here and others can attest to.
lf the saying "Liar, Liar your pants on fire" were true Mainstream news might be fun to watch
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Re: Long Range Shooting advise needed
[Re: kmon11]
#7987863
09/25/20 02:36 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 42,777
J.G.
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 42,777 |
Thank you Kevin.
My two long shots on cow elk were a minute apart. The situation was perfect to make them. My rig had been verified zero the day before, and walked out on steel to 1500 yards. I was prone on a bipod, Bill was a foot beside me calling range, very little wind, and two cows that had stopped and both were broadside. The back cow I vitals shot at 465 yards. She walked 30 yards and piled up. The second cow ran, but stopped looking around. Bill called it 510 yards. Wind went to zero. Her whole body was covered by a juniper. When she faced me, I hit her in the neck right below her chin, making a brainstem shot. Top of the line rifle, and one I have shot for years. Top of the line rifle scope, base, rings, and ammo I specifically tuned for that rifle. Ammo that has the capacity of effectively killing at +500 yards. Remove any one of those factors and may have passed on the shots, but I knew everything had lined up and I had been preparing for a situation like that for years. Lots and lots of practice with that rig, I knew what we could do.
The person that shoots less than 20 rounds per year, I don't encourage something like that. There are some guys that hunt every fall, and some of them are on my range shooting almost monthly before fall. They're probably fairly comfortable at making shots like that. Good range finders are absolutely paramount in making distant shots. Hitting foliage short of or beyond the animal can make things go south, just like Kevin's story.
Don't practice until you get it right, practice until you cannot get it wrong.
800 Yard Steel Range Precision Rifle Instruction Memberships and Classes Available
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Re: Long Range Shooting advise needed
[Re: GPS]
#7987868
09/25/20 02:42 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 62,478
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
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kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 62,478 |
If 1.28 seconds is too long of a flight time, archery should be outlawed
Bottom line, never trust a man whose uncle was eaten by cannibals.-Sen Joni Ernst
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