Forums46
Topics538,021
Posts9,731,919
Members87,055
|
Most Online25,604 Feb 12th, 2024
|
|
|
Possession Limit Question??
#7438456
02/19/19 03:45 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 428
PoppinPiggies
OP
Bird Dog
|
OP
Bird Dog
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 428 |
In the last few days I have had this discussion a few times with no clear answer. Do ducks that are cleaned and at home in your freezer count towards your possession limit? For example would it be legal for someone to have a couple hundred duck breasts in their freezer that were all obtained while legally sticking to the 6 duck per day limit?
Follow me on instagram @crosstexasoutdoors
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438462
02/19/19 03:56 PM
|
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 780
DonPablo
Tracker
|
Tracker
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 780 |
Good question. I would think ducks at home are included in the possession limit. I'd guess once you hit the limit it's time to do some eatin'. Of course I'm not a game warden nor a lawyer. Just my guess.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438466
02/19/19 03:59 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735
helomech
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735 |
I am almost positive that once it is packaged and in your freezer it is not considered game. Now different rules apply at locations away from your home, like at camp.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: helomech]
#7438484
02/19/19 04:22 PM
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,476
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
|
kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,476 |
I am almost positive that once it is packaged and in your freezer it is not considered game. Now different rules apply at locations away from your home, like at camp. Not in accordance to migratory bird laws. Use to be TX vs Fed law. Texas excluded home from possession and also had a processed clause and feds didn’t. 50 code of Federal regulations 20.33 It may of changed. Sniper John would know all laws state and federal on migratory though. Maybe he will chime in
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438492
02/19/19 04:27 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Nogalus Prairie
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091 |
Possession limits are to prevent overharvesting in the field. I cannot fathom that legally taken game at home in your freezer has anything to do with possession limits.
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: Nogalus Prairie]
#7438501
02/19/19 04:30 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,472
DQ Kid
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,472 |
Possession limits are to prevent overharvesting in the field. I cannot fathom that legally taken game at home in your freezer has anything to do with possession limits. Agree herr
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438502
02/19/19 04:30 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,472
DQ Kid
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 10,472 |
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: BOBO the Clown]
#7438503
02/19/19 04:31 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735
helomech
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735 |
I am almost positive that once it is packaged and in your freezer it is not considered game. Now different rules apply at locations away from your home, like at camp. Not in accordance to migratory bird laws. Use to be TX vs Fed law. Texas excluded home from procession definition feds didn’t 50 code of Federal regulations 20.33 It may of changed. Sniper John would know all laws state and federal on migratory though. Maybe he will chime in Not sure of migratory laws, but I don't see how you could ever be prosecuted for this. Not advocating breaking laws, but meat in your freezer could have come from anywhere. I just can't see how you could be prosecuted for meat that is in your freezer. I could see it in a tag along crime, like you get busted for having 500 doves in your truck and they get a warrant and find 1000 in your freezer, but other than that I just can't see getting in trouble for having last years ducks in your freezer.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438514
02/19/19 04:34 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 428
PoppinPiggies
OP
Bird Dog
|
OP
Bird Dog
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 428 |
Haha this is pretty much the same arguments I've been having! I've done a little research and saw some people talking about Federal & State Regulations being in opposition here but I haven't read the actual wording to check. I'm with Nogalus though...... during the season I kill ducks a lot faster than I eat them and I feel like a possession limit imposed on my freezer would just be trying to get me to stop hunting LEGALLY as much as I do.
Follow me on instagram @crosstexasoutdoors
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438519
02/19/19 04:36 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Nogalus Prairie
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091 |
So I can only kill 9 woodcock a year if I freeze them at home for later?
That’s nonsensical.
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438529
02/19/19 04:44 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,306
DLALLDER
THF Trophy Hunter
|
THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,306 |
Page 100 of the 2018-2019 Texas Outdoor Annual gives the definition of possession limits for Hunters & Anglers. These are Texas laws, not sure where the Feds would step in.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: helomech]
#7438532
02/19/19 04:46 PM
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,476
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
|
kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,476 |
I am almost positive that once it is packaged and in your freezer it is not considered game. Now different rules apply at locations away from your home, like at camp. Not in accordance to migratory bird laws. Use to be TX vs Fed law. Texas excluded home from procession definition feds didn’t 50 code of Federal regulations 20.33 It may of changed. Sniper John would know all laws state and federal on migratory though. Maybe he will chime in Not sure of migratory laws, but I don't see how you could ever be prosecuted for this. Not advocating breaking laws, but meat in your freezer could have come from anywhere. I just can't see how you could be prosecuted for meat that is in your freezer. I could see it in a tag along crime, like you get busted for having 500 doves in your truck and they get a warrant and find 1000 in your freezer, but other than that I just can't see getting in trouble for having last years ducks in your freezer. I edited my above statement, I just a remember a couple of old cases that have popped up here. The Fed law was very ambiguous compared to state, due to processed and possession definitions. With that said Fed defined “possession limit” and “field possession” differently also, now I have no idea with there have been updates or Amendments.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438538
02/19/19 04:48 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 39,549
redchevy
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 39,549 |
For the possession limit are you required to maintain proof of sex/breed etc.? I would be of the mind that in your freezer has reached its final destination place and is no longer counted in your possession limit.
It's hell eatin em live
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438542
02/19/19 04:51 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735
helomech
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735 |
I have a bunch of ducks in my freezer, I raise and harvest them. I have not duck hunted in over 20 years.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438546
02/19/19 04:53 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 6,287
scalebuster
THF Trophy Hunter
|
THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 6,287 |
They don’t count once they are at the final destination.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438550
02/19/19 04:55 PM
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,476
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
|
kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,476 |
Haha this is pretty much the same arguments I've been having! I've done a little research and saw some people talking about Federal & State Regulations being in opposition here but I haven't read the actual wording to check. I'm with Nogalus though...... during the season I kill ducks a lot faster than I eat them and I feel like a possession limit imposed on my freezer would just be trying to get me to stop hunting LEGALLY as much as I do. Don’t disagree, just going by what been argued/stated via Federal Wardens involvement. Maybe Sniper or one of our resident GW’s will chime in
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: helomech]
#7438554
02/19/19 05:02 PM
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,476
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
|
kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,476 |
I am almost positive that once it is packaged and in your freezer it is not considered game. Now different rules apply at locations away from your home, like at camp. Not in accordance to migratory bird laws. Use to be TX vs Fed law. Texas excluded home from procession definition feds didn’t 50 code of Federal regulations 20.33 It may of changed. Sniper John would know all laws state and federal on migratory though. Maybe he will chime in Not sure of migratory laws, but I don't see how you could ever be prosecuted for this. Not advocating breaking laws, but meat in your freezer could have come from anywhere. I just can't see how you could be prosecuted for meat that is in your freezer. I could see it in a tag along crime, like you get busted for having 500 doves in your truck and they get a warrant and find 1000 in your freezer, but other than that I just can't see getting in trouble for having last years ducks in your freezer. Like I said going by what I have seen play out here and other situations. Feds don’t have any say in species that aren’t under ES protections, that’s state management 100%,, but they do on migratory birds.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: BOBO the Clown]
#7438570
02/19/19 05:15 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735
helomech
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735 |
I am almost positive that once it is packaged and in your freezer it is not considered game. Now different rules apply at locations away from your home, like at camp. Not in accordance to migratory bird laws. Use to be TX vs Fed law. Texas excluded home from procession definition feds didn’t 50 code of Federal regulations 20.33 It may of changed. Sniper John would know all laws state and federal on migratory though. Maybe he will chime in Not sure of migratory laws, but I don't see how you could ever be prosecuted for this. Not advocating breaking laws, but meat in your freezer could have come from anywhere. I just can't see how you could be prosecuted for meat that is in your freezer. I could see it in a tag along crime, like you get busted for having 500 doves in your truck and they get a warrant and find 1000 in your freezer, but other than that I just can't see getting in trouble for having last years ducks in your freezer. Like I said going by what I have seen play out here and other situations. Feds don’t have any say in species that aren’t under ES protections, that’s state management 100%,, but they do on migratory birds. Lets assume the feds say you can't have more than a possession limit. How can they say that the cut up duck meat in your freezer is one duck or 5 ducks, or ducks I raised. Just seems way to far out to worry about. It isn't like they will just walk up to you and demand to see your freezer without lots of proof and warrants. Not arguing, and the law may say exactly what you say. Just saying not really something to worry about. I say just hunt legally and you should not have anything to worry about.
Last edited by helomech; 02/19/19 05:17 PM.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: scalebuster]
#7438584
02/19/19 05:26 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Nogalus Prairie
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091 |
They don’t count once they are at the final destination. It really is that simple.
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438596
02/19/19 05:38 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 11,657
colt45-90
Texas colt45
|
Texas colt45
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 11,657 |
just to be safe, let me know where to pick up and I can take your overage's
hold on Newt, we got a runaway
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438608
02/19/19 05:47 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 108
KingHunter17
Woodsman
|
Woodsman
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 108 |
[b]Unless it has changed, this is a response from USFWS a friend got a few years ago[/b]:
I received a similar question on this topic this morning so I already had a response typed out - it is shown below:
You raise a question that has been a topic of discussion between the Feds and the State in recent years.
Texas Parks and Wildlife has continued to publish both in their Outdoor Annual and Texas Waterfowl Digest that possession limits do not apply to wildlife once it reaches a permanent residence and is finally processed. While this statement may apply to fish, turkey, deer or other non migratory game animals, it is in direct conflict with Federal rules governing migratory birds.
As per federal law (50 Code of Federal Regulations 20.33) - "No person shall possess more migratory game birds taken in the United States than the possession limit or the aggregate possession limit, whichever applies." 20.33 has no clause which says once the birds reach the permanent residence and are finally processed they no longer count towards a possession limit.
However, each person residing at a permanent residence is entitled to a possession limit (regardless if they have a hunting license or not). So, this year for instance (with regards to ducks) if there are three people living at your permanent residence, then by Federal law you could legally possess three possession limits or 36 ducks.
There are provisions which state that State law may be more restrictive than Federal law when dealing with migratory birds. However, the State may not be less restrictive, which in this case they are. For this reason, Texas Parks and Wildlife is in error by saying migratory game birds finally processed and at a permanent residence do not count towards a possession limit - by Federal law they do.
I hope this clarifies your question - if you need further information, send me another email or give me a call.
thanks
Last edited by KingHunter17; 02/19/19 06:02 PM.
If the trigger is gold, the birds will fold.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438614
02/19/19 05:52 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735
helomech
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735 |
My question to this is. When I kill a deer and process it and put it in my freezer it is no longer considered a deer. It is just meat. When I process a migratory game bird, is it still considered a migratory game bird, or is it just considered meat, like my deer?
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: helomech]
#7438621
02/19/19 06:01 PM
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,476
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
|
kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,476 |
My question to this is. When I kill a deer and process it and put it in my freezer it is no longer considered a deer. It is just meat. When I process a migratory game bird, is it still considered a migratory game bird, or is it just considered meat, like my deer? Per law fed has no management of state wildlife with two exceptions ESA protections and Migratory waterfowl. Think Texas red snapper seaso/limitsn also I Know a guy that got his butt handed to him for bringing duck sausage into the US from a Canadian hunt.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: BOBO the Clown]
#7438626
02/19/19 06:10 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735
helomech
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 13,735 |
My question to this is. When I kill a deer and process it and put it in my freezer it is no longer considered a deer. It is just meat. When I process a migratory game bird, is it still considered a migratory game bird, or is it just considered meat, like my deer? Per law fed has no management of state wildlife with two exceptions ESA protections and Migratory waterfowl. Think Texas red snapper seaso/limitsn also I Know a guy that got his butt handed to him for bringing duck sausage into the US from a Canadian hunt. Yeah, there are some crazy laws about bringing stuff over the border. Was watching a show on it a while back. So many things can get you in hot water.
|
|
|
Re: Possession Limit Question??
[Re: PoppinPiggies]
#7438674
02/19/19 06:57 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 32,601
sig226fan (Rguns.com)
duck & cover
|
duck & cover
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 32,601 |
That federal law is also part of an international treaty as well. It rarely changes, and the Feds can't even change it.
|
|
|
Moderated by bigbob_ftw, CCBIRDDOGMAN, Chickenman, Derek, DeRico, Duck_Hunter, hetman, jeh7mmmag, JustWingem, kmon11, kry226, kwrhuntinglab, Payne, pertnear, rifleman, sig226fan (Rguns.com), Superduty, TreeBass, txcornhusker
|