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4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
#7160759
05/05/18 02:18 AM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,183
Mike Honcho
OP
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OP
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Posts: 6,183 |
I need an AR guru it's been to two smiths and Ive scratched my head and tried everything my brain can think of.
I have a Palmetto Ar-10 that is short stroking and it's driving me nuts. I swapped barrels from the mid length factory 308 to a wilson combat 6.5 Creedmoor rifle gas length. I have a tack driving single shot semiauto. At first I ran the buffer and spring that comes with a factory PSA pa-10 lower I was worried about over gassing. Wouldn't run. Then I tried both armalite and dpms rifle length tubes, no dice. Sent off to smith # 1 he said port was too small opened it up to .095" with no adjustable gas block (wide open) problem persists. Runs semi 1out of 15 times for 2-3 rounds at this point. Swapped to a lighter buffer and spring and still no dice. Sent to smith #2 said he thought it should be over gassed he's stumped. So I'm at my witts end, and need some help. don't want to send it back to wilson as it likes the same load as bolt gun and shoots easily sub moa.
Thanks.
“Two things that define an individual what you do when you have everything, and what you do when you have nothing."
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160770
05/05/18 02:26 AM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,410
Tye
Veteran Tracker
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Veteran Tracker
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Posts: 3,410 |
I built up a 16" 6.5 Creed using a Wilson barrel and my buddy built an 18" 6.5 creed using a Wilson barrel as well. Both guns have SLR gas blocks and both will not lock to the back with the gas block all the way open. They run fine suppressed. I'm guessing the port isn't big enough? We didn't drill them out. But I don't plan on shooting unsupressed....sorry...not much help. One thing in common is the Wilson barrels.
If you shoot a young deer because a neighbor will shoot it, you are that neighbor.
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Tye]
#7160788
05/05/18 02:48 AM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,185
Misfire
Pro Tracker
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Pro Tracker
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,185 |
I built up a 16" 6.5 Creed using a Wilson barrel and my buddy built an 18" 6.5 creed using a Wilson barrel as well. Both guns have SLR gas blocks and both will not lock to the back with the gas block all the way open. They run fine suppressed. I'm guessing the port isn't big enough? We didn't drill them out. But I don't plan on shooting unsupressed....sorry...not much help. One thing in common is the Wilson barrels. Tye, our rifles function, cycle and eject reliably..they just don’t lock back on an empty mag when running unsuppressed. I reached out to Wilson about the issue. I went back and forth with one of their techs and after realizing I’m running the exact gas block they recommend, they eventually said they thought it was the JP internals that was the problem. Wilson offered to look the rifle over and troubleshoot it if I wanted to mail it in. I declined since it works fine suppressd. Jorge, if you haven’t already, you might try a different/adjustable gas block. The gas block you are running could be an issue. Even if you drilled out the barrel the gas block could be too constrictive. Something else to check is to make absolutely sure that the gas holes line up. If they aren’t lining up properly you can be undergassed. Basic stuff but worth mentioning. I’m considering one of those expensive JP buffers that have the adjustable weights in an effort to “tune” the rifle. I haven’t played with mine much but my issues don’t sound as bad as yours.
"I wanna go fast" -Ricky Bobby
"Mind bottling isn't it?" -Chazz Michael Michaels
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160791
05/05/18 02:50 AM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,993
ImTheReasonDovesMourn
Snarky Mark
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Snarky Mark
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,993 |
I would've tried an adjustable gas block before I bought any other gas tubes or let someone drill on my barrel. If you're trying to adjust the gas flow, why not? That's why there's a market for adjustable gas blocks.
Haha yea I polished that thing for hours.
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160797
05/05/18 03:00 AM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,183
Mike Honcho
OP
THF Trophy Hunter
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OP
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,183 |
Sorry for not including I tried an adjustable gas block as well and no dice at any setting
“Two things that define an individual what you do when you have everything, and what you do when you have nothing."
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160801
05/05/18 03:04 AM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,183
Mike Honcho
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THF Trophy Hunter
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OP
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Posts: 6,183 |
Even its twin in 308 can get finicky depending on load but it's not close to the point this 6.5cm is. That and I'm Not tackling it till this 6.5 gets running right.
“Two things that define an individual what you do when you have everything, and what you do when you have nothing."
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160806
05/05/18 03:11 AM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,523
RiverRider
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,523 |
Your spring & buffer are too heavy still, or the ammo you're using just isn't driving that gas system with enough oomph. What else is there??
With a rifle length gas tube you're tapping off gas as the pressure is in steep decline, compared to mid-length or carbine-length gas systems.. I'd look into getting a lighter still buffer and spring first, and then I'd be looking at ammo. I'm thinking heavy bullets, which usually go with slower burning powder---and more of it, meaning more gas produced. Pressures can hold a little higher and longer down the bore when slower burning propellants are used.
Every bit of that is pure educated guess, though. Maybe someone at AR15.com has a better answer. That's where I'd take it.
"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty." -Augustus McRae
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160812
05/05/18 03:17 AM
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 489
HandgunHTR
Bird Dog
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Bird Dog
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 489 |
Ok, a couple of questions for you. I realize that you had a couple of smiths look at it, but I am still going to ask the basic questions.
1. Are you sure that the gas block (or gas port for that matter) is in the right location? It might make sense to measure where the gas port is and ensure that the port on the barrel and the port on the block are aligned.
2. Are you sure that you are short stroking and not so over-gassed that the bolt is slamming back and then forward so fast it doesn't pick up another round? Where is your brass ejecting at (clock position)? If you single load with a mag in, does the bolt lock back?
3. Have you tried different magazines? It could very well be a mag problem, not a gas problem.
Those are some things to look at.
#FighttheNoise
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160829
05/05/18 03:43 AM
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 29,608
Sneaky
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 29,608 |
Mine does this when it’s not lubed enough. I would imagine you’ve tried that, but it’s all I know of.
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: RiverRider]
#7160833
05/05/18 03:47 AM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,183
Mike Honcho
OP
THF Trophy Hunter
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OP
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Your spring & buffer are too heavy still, or the ammo you're using just isn't driving that gas system with enough oomph. What else is there??
With a rifle length gas tube you're tapping off gas as the pressure is in steep decline, compared to mid-length or carbine-length gas systems.. I'd look into getting a lighter still buffer and spring first, and then I'd be looking at ammo. I'm thinking heavy bullets, which usually go with slower burning powder---and more of it, meaning more gas produced. Pressures can hold a little higher and longer down the bore when slower burning propellants are used.
Every bit of that is pure educated guess, though. Maybe someone at AR15.com has a better answer. That's where I'd take it. It's puzzling and yesterday I shot it and it was discussed that there isn't enough pressure since it's a rifle length and 18" barrel. Thing is I'm using 40gr of H4350 which isnt anemic.
“Two things that define an individual what you do when you have everything, and what you do when you have nothing."
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: HandgunHTR]
#7160837
05/05/18 03:55 AM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,183
Mike Honcho
OP
THF Trophy Hunter
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OP
THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,183 |
Ok, a couple of questions for you. I realize that you had a couple of smiths look at it, but I am still going to ask the basic questions.
1. Are you sure that the gas block (or gas port for that matter) is in the right location? It might make sense to measure where the gas port is and ensure that the port on the barrel and the port on the block are aligned.
2. Are you sure that you are short stroking and not so over-gassed that the bolt is slamming back and then forward so fast it doesn't pick up another round? Where is your brass ejecting at (clock position)? If you single load with a mag in, does the bolt lock back?
3. Have you tried different magazines? It could very well be a mag problem, not a gas problem.
Those are some things to look at. 1. Myself and 4 other people have spent way too much time making sure it's aligned. I am fairly certain gas holes are right over each other BUT pulled the gas block off today and i had carbon build up significantly only on one side of the gas port Not concentric. So maybe not a true circle and have a bit of gas escaping. And I did mic distance and I'm +/- .025 misaligned. 2. According to shooting buddies it's short stroking but I've wondered if it's to fast. 3 o clock but yesterday it was throwing maybe 2 feet away. 3. Yep several types of mags
Last edited by jorge; 05/05/18 03:57 AM.
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160841
05/05/18 04:10 AM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,993
ImTheReasonDovesMourn
Snarky Mark
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Snarky Mark
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,993 |
Your spring & buffer are too heavy still, or the ammo you're using just isn't driving that gas system with enough oomph. What else is there??
With a rifle length gas tube you're tapping off gas as the pressure is in steep decline, compared to mid-length or carbine-length gas systems.. I'd look into getting a lighter still buffer and spring first, and then I'd be looking at ammo. I'm thinking heavy bullets, which usually go with slower burning powder---and more of it, meaning more gas produced. Pressures can hold a little higher and longer down the bore when slower burning propellants are used.
Every bit of that is pure educated guess, though. Maybe someone at AR15.com has a better answer. That's where I'd take it. It's puzzling and yesterday I shot it and it was discussed that there isn't enough pressure since it's a rifle length and 18" barrel. Thing is I'm using 40gr of H4350 which isnt anemic. I think that powder charge is definitely light. I'm using up to 3 grains more powder with 140s in my bolt rifles and up to 5 grains more with 129s, with no pressure signs.
Last edited by ImTheReasonDovesMourn; 05/05/18 04:12 AM.
Haha yea I polished that thing for hours.
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160867
05/05/18 05:34 AM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 6,183
Mike Honcho
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THF Trophy Hunter
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OP
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even factory 140 hornady blk and 129 superformance won't cycle. I'll load up a ladder and see how it goes and if I can find a faster node
Last edited by jorge; 05/05/18 05:35 AM.
“Two things that define an individual what you do when you have everything, and what you do when you have nothing."
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160871
05/05/18 09:36 AM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 2,049
HicksHunter
Veteran Tracker
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Did it give you the same issues with factory ammo?
I'm with Dove- 40.0gr H4350 is a pretty light load.
Last edited by HicksHunter; 05/05/18 09:37 AM.
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: HicksHunter]
#7160886
05/05/18 11:10 AM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,173
J.G.
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2008
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Did it give you the same issues with factory ammo?
I'm with Dove- 40.0gr H4350 is a pretty light load. Hodgdon's published max is what it is. It is too light though.
800 Yard Steel Range Precision Rifle Instruction Memberships and Classes Available
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160930
05/05/18 12:52 PM
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Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 3,809
Cleric
Extreme Tracker
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Extreme Tracker
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 3,809 |
My iPhone has a slo mode record mode and I have used that to film the bolt and see what’s going on
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160970
05/05/18 01:26 PM
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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 988
okie44
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Tracker
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 988 |
Check the buttstock bolt. If it’s too long it can limit bolt travel.
�The trouble ain't that there is too many fools, but that the lightning ain't distributed right.� Mark Twain
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7160989
05/05/18 01:42 PM
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Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 7,133
SR025
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Sep 2010
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: J.G.]
#7161083
05/05/18 03:06 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,523
RiverRider
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Posts: 9,523 |
Did it give you the same issues with factory ammo?
I'm with Dove- 40.0gr H4350 is a pretty light load. Hodgdon's published max is what it is. It is too light though. When slow burning powders are loaded with excessively light charges, sufficient pressure never builds to the point of promoting the burn to achieve 100% conversion to gas. So, not only are you starting with less powder (which is intended to convert to the gas you need to cycle your action...therefore, less potential gas volume), but you are also inhibiting the conversion of that light charge to gas. Ultimately, it means that being 10% light on the charge does not equate to ending up 10% light on the volume of gas generated. When running pressures that are too low to achieve complete burn there is no linearity there.
"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty." -Augustus McRae
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: okie44]
#7161086
05/05/18 03:14 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,523
RiverRider
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,523 |
Check the buttstock bolt. If it’s too long it can limit bolt travel. That's a good question right there. So, when the rifle was a .308, did everything work correctly? If you had a perfectly functional rifle, and all you did was rebarrel the upper, then that's one thing...but we don't know the history of the rifle. At least, not in this thread.
"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty." -Augustus McRae
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: RiverRider]
#7161091
05/05/18 03:31 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,173
J.G.
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,173 |
Did it give you the same issues with factory ammo?
I'm with Dove- 40.0gr H4350 is a pretty light load. Hodgdon's published max is what it is. It is too light though. When slow burning powders are loaded with excessively light charges, sufficient pressure never builds to the point of promoting the burn to achieve 100% conversion to gas. So, not only are you starting with less powder (which is intended to convert to the gas you need to cycle your action...therefore, less potential gas volume), but you are also inhibiting the conversion of that light charge to gas. Ultimately, it means that being 10% light on the charge does not equate to ending up 10% light on the volume of gas generated. When running pressures that are too low to achieve complete burn there is no linearity there. You telling me, or him? Telling me that, is preaching to the choir. Hodgdon lists 40.0 gr as max charge for a 140 gr bullet in the 6.5 Creedmoor. Everybody runs between 42.0 and 43.0. So they are too conservative. Chad and I dug into what would be the best powder for an AR chambered in 6.5 Creedmoor, back in February. H-Varget was the answer to get the best percentage of burn, so that's what my customer and I loaded with.
800 Yard Steel Range Precision Rifle Instruction Memberships and Classes Available
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7161108
05/05/18 04:02 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,523
RiverRider
THF Trophy Hunter
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Joined: Nov 2007
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That was primarily for Jorge, but I suppose anyone who cares to read it may do so. So, how did you and Chad make this determination?? What data and materials did you examine?
"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty." -Augustus McRae
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: RiverRider]
#7161137
05/05/18 04:35 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,173
J.G.
THF Celebrity
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One of your favorite tools, Quick Load. He plugged in multiple powders he and I thought would be appropriate, IMR-8208, IMR-4451, H-Varget. Quick Load gave H-Varget the highest percentage of burn, as well as best velocities.
800 Yard Steel Range Precision Rifle Instruction Memberships and Classes Available
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7161145
05/05/18 04:48 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,523
RiverRider
THF Trophy Hunter
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Cartridge : 6.5 Creedmoor Hornady
Bullet : .264, 140, Hornady ELD-M 26331 G7
Useable Case Capaci: 47.039 grain H2O = 3.054 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.800 inch = 71.12 mm
Barrel Length : 20.0 inch = 508.0 mm
Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 63000 psi, or 434 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 115 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !
Powder type Filling/Loading Ratio Charge Charge Vel. Prop.Burnt P max P muzz B_Time
% Grains Gramm fps % psi psi ms
--------------------------------- -----------------------------------------------------------------
Alliant Reloder-26 106.9 49.8 3.23 2866 100.0 63000 13917 1.049
Norma MRP 107.6 48.7 3.16 2833 99.1 63000 13905 1.050
Vihtavuori N560 109.3 48.4 3.14 2815 96.2 63000 14003 1.049
Accurate MAGPRO 109.6 50.5 3.27 2805 94.6 63000 14010 1.053
Alliant Reloder-22 109.6 48.0 3.11 2799 98.0 63000 13578 1.053
IMR 7828 SSC 107.5 47.9 3.10 2794 96.5 63000 13526 1.043
Alliant Reloder-17 96.6 43.9 2.85 2787 100.0 63000 12325 1.054
Ramshot Magnum 108.8 51.4 3.33 2774 98.4 63000 12985 1.045
Alliant Reloder-16 103.3 43.6 2.83 2764 100.0 63000 12179 1.064
Ramshot Hunter 101.3 45.4 2.94 2755 99.5 63000 12613 1.061
Alliant Reloder-19 105.9 45.9 2.98 2754 97.8 63000 12882 1.055
Winchester 760 95.7 43.9 2.84 2750 99.1 63000 12606 1.063
Hodgdon H414 95.7 43.9 2.84 2750 99.1 63000 12606 1.063
Norma URP 100.9 43.3 2.80 2737 100.0 63000 12114 1.068
Vihtavuori N550 98.0 43.4 2.81 2736 100.0 63000 12256 1.072
Accurate 4350 100.1 43.4 2.81 2734 100.0 63000 12096 1.083
Norma 204 100.3 44.9 2.91 2729 97.6 63000 12511 1.057
Hodgdon H4831 SC 106.9 46.8 3.04 2724 95.7 63000 12562 1.053
IMR 4831 105.8 43.9 2.85 2721 100.0 63000 11865 1.076
Accurate 3100 109.5 47.5 3.08 2715 99.5 63000 12111 1.084
Ramshot Big Game 91.2 42.1 2.73 2712 100.0 63000 11527 1.068
Hodgdon CFE223 86.1 41.6 2.70 2711 100.0 63000 11483 1.069
Winchester Supreme 780 104.2 47.6 3.09 2708 97.6 63000 12199 1.058
IMR 4895 90.8 39.4 2.55 2705 100.0 63000 11514 1.075
Hodgdon Hybrid 100V 103.5 43.4 2.81 2703 100.0 63000 11163 1.067
Alliant Reloder-15 91.7 39.8 2.58 2699 100.0 63000 11487 1.075
Norma 203B 92.1 39.9 2.59 2696 100.0 63000 11391 1.076
Lovex S070 100.3 43.0 2.79 2696 99.1 63000 11943 1.078
Hodgdon H4350 103.0 43.7 2.83 2695 98.6 63000 11878 1.063
IMR 4350 101.1 43.6 2.83 2694 98.6 63000 11858 1.063
Hodgdon H380 93.0 41.2 2.67 2694 99.9 63000 11653 1.078
Hodgdon BL-C2 86.6 41.0 2.66 2689 100.0 63000 11227 1.079
IMR 4955 Enduron 108.0 45.5 2.95 2689 96.0 63000 12159 1.059
Norma 203 old 93.4 40.9 2.65 2687 100.0 63000 11220 1.088
IMR 4320 93.7 39.9 2.59 2685 100.0 63000 11075 1.061
Ramshot Wild Boar 87.1 40.4 2.61 2684 100.0 63000 11222 1.071
Hodgdon H4895 88.5 38.4 2.49 2681 100.0 63000 11114 1.075
Winchester 748 84.2 39.3 2.55 2680 100.0 63000 10840 1.073
IMR 4451 Enduron 96.6 41.4 2.68 2676 98.9 63000 11624 1.062
Lovex S065 99.1 42.0 2.72 2676 99.7 63000 11521 1.079
IMR 4007 SSC 94.8 41.7 2.70 2673 98.6 63000 11680 1.073
Ramshot TAC 87.2 40.8 2.64 2671 99.7 63000 11397 1.069
Hodgdon VARGET 94.5 39.6 2.57 2668 100.0 63000 11079 1.065
IMR 4064 95.0 38.9 2.52 2660 100.0 63000 10868 1.070
Lovex D073.6 Match Rifle 88.5 39.6 2.56 2655 100.0 63000 10535 1.092
Accurate 2520 86.5 39.6 2.56 2655 100.0 63000 10535 1.092
Lovex S062 92.7 39.1 2.53 2654 100.0 63000 10692 1.084
Vihtavuori N530 85.5 37.3 2.42 2654 100.0 63000 10647 1.073
IMR 3031 91.0 36.9 2.39 2653 100.0 63000 10286 1.082
IMR 4166 Enduron 95.8 39.8 2.58 2653 99.0 63000 11249 1.066
IMR 8208 XBR 87.5 37.9 2.46 2648 100.0 63000 10554 1.072
Accurate 4064 92.9 39.4 2.55 2648 100.0 63000 10514 1.109
Norma 201 89.9 38.1 2.47 2645 100.0 63000 10632 1.086
Ramshot X-Terminator 85.1 39.4 2.55 2643 100.0 63000 10696 1.073
Vihtavuori N150 100.8 41.2 2.67 2641 100.0 63000 10474 1.081
Vihtavuori N540 91.5 40.1 2.60 2637 100.0 63000 10458 1.081
Hodgdon H335 80.6 38.1 2.47 2637 100.0 63000 10303 1.077
Norma 202 89.2 38.1 2.47 2634 100.0 63000 10280 1.083
Accurate 2230 82.9 38.9 2.52 2633 100.0 63000 10415 1.084
Accurate 2700 94.9 42.9 2.78 2630 98.4 63000 11031 1.076
Lovex D073.5 83.2 38.7 2.51 2629 100.0 63000 10289 1.094
Accurate 2460 83.0 38.7 2.51 2629 100.0 63000 10289 1.094
Lovex S060 89.6 37.8 2.45 2625 100.0 63000 10383 1.069
Hodgdon H322 85.3 35.9 2.33 2623 100.0 63000 9993 1.075
Accurate 2495 87.4 37.1 2.40 2621 100.0 63000 10096 1.116
Lovex D073.4 82.0 38.1 2.47 2621 100.0 63000 10144 1.089
Hodgdon Benchmark 86.9 37.1 2.40 2611 100.0 63000 10063 1.073
Vihtavuori N140 91.3 38.8 2.51 2610 100.0 63000 9906 1.082
Vihtavuori N135 97.0 38.1 2.47 2601 100.0 63000 9666 1.092
Accurate 2200 79.3 34.9 2.26 2600 100.0 63000 9806 1.072
"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty." -Augustus McRae
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Re: 4 months & 2 two trips to gunsmiths = 0 Progress
[Re: Mike Honcho]
#7161147
05/05/18 04:51 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,523
RiverRider
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,523 |
I see LOTS of very good candidates. Varget should burn well, but leaves about 100 fps on the table. Re16 is the first one I would try. But let's not turn this into a reloading discussion any more than we already have. Not fair to Jorge.
"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty." -Augustus McRae
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