Replacing inland grizzlies with Kodiaks is an interesting idea. It's not necessary because inland grizzlies aren't extinct and they already occupy most of their remaining habitat. The reason I think it's relevant is because a similar idea has been proposed before. A few years ago, several groups lobbied for introducing grizzlies from the GYE into some of the remaining habitat of the extinct Mexican grizzly bear range in the Southwest.

If it were not for locals shooting all of them onsite, I think it would work. The Gila/Mogollon complex hasn't changed much in the last 70 since grizzlies lived there. I think it would still support a few grizzlies, I don't think it ever supported a high density of grizzlies.

The Mexican grizzlies were smaller and more adapted to dry climates than the GYE grizzlies. That was a point that was emphasized by opponents of the reintroduction. That is true but the same can be said of the elk in the area. That region was Merriam's elk territory until the 20th century. Merriam's elk were extinct in the early 20th century and Rocky Mountain elk from Yellowstone were reintroduced and they have thrived every since.

Of course! Obviously the first few million had nothing to do with it.

The whiteman didn�t single handly go out and kill all the buffalos as it has been stated on here, it was a joint effort.

That was well on it's way before the white man got involved, he just had better weapons. The Paleo Indians of the America's didn't disappear they're just distant relatives of today's tribes yet many of the species they hunted are long gone. Natives hunted for results and what ever got the best results seemed to be the method of choice. Were I to run 25 hunter across my place in a drive with hunters on the other end I could probably clean my place of deer in short order. Driving animals is a very efficient way of putting large amounts of meat on the table with little effort. When you consider the size of the tribes and the resources needed to keep them alive, it's easy to imagine more efficient methods of collection. As suggested in the link. Killing more than you could actually eat was probably a common reality. No refrigerators or food banks back then, take what you could consume and carry and leave the rest.

The problem with these threads is folks go off-topic so easily. The topic is who caused them to almost go extinct? The answer is: post Civil War slaughter of them by white men. That�s it.

The question is: �What caused them to almost go extinct?�

You saying that's it doesn't make it the last word, it just means you've convinced yourself it is. Kinda like saying we have two cows, you eat the first one and I eat the second then you claim I'm the reason we're out of cow. Yep your hands are clean in your mind.

It�s not impossible to sort out facts from speculation.

Manifest Destiny/westward expansion of white America almost wiped out the American Bison = Fact.
The final blows that wiped out tens of millions of them took place over a short 20 year period = Fact.

That Indians would have eventually wiped them out anyway because they had horses (introduced by outsiders and in widespread use for two centuries before the bison�s extirpation) = Useless, unsupported and almost certainly wrong. Pure speculation-the opposite of fact.

Without white men there would have been no guns, no railroads, no commercial markets, none of the huge upheavals/changes brought by European influx.

Talk about �romanticizing� to assuage guilt, deny reality, change the subject, whatever - that�s the very definition of it.

I have my moments, obviously I am not the only one. Gray wolves were the indigenous wolves of Yellowstone and that was what was captured and reintroduced from the same genus out of Canada, so what is your dense point?

As a matter of fact the reintroduction has helped balance the ecosystem!

Please share with all where you come up with a Hybrid that is 30% bigger??

Bison, red wolf, Mexican wolf, passenger pigeon, elk, pronghorn, deer, mountain sheep, wolves, grizzlies, mountain goat - in the Lower 48 these were extirpated, almost all brought to the brink of disappearance or, at the very least, greatly reduced in population by the turn of the 20th century or not long thereafter.

This was not done by Native Americans. No one even seriously argues the point.

In summary:

People really can screw up nature.

Yes, and it will get worse. 250 million and expanding.

I didn�t say hybrid I said the Canadian wolves used to populate Yellowstone where 30% larger, then what was once Native. We had three options Minnesota wolves or regrow Mexican greys or use wolves out of Canada. Jasper NP wolves where used,

Minnesota Wolves where closet in size, but apparently they didn�t know how to kill elk.

In the end to get ES and introduction approval they concluded that the Jasper wolves where same sub species and used Bergmann's rule to get it pushed through even though the Minnesota wolves where closer size Etc.

The prey/predator balance is a joke. Yellowstone is a terrible example of utopia. Wolves numbers are down in the park as they moved out to chase more elk, and bison numbers are closely getting to beyond carrying capacity. Park officials have to cull between 600 to 900 bison. Prey/predator balance...

Seriously you are dense, Almost gone is not gone but Gone is gone, My view didn�t mention eradicating a native species. You can�t bring back species once it�s gown. If you bring in a non native species from another continent or country you are playing with fire.

The original Yellowstone wolf is GONE, thus the introduction of a debatable sub species that 30% bigger that�s playing with fire(example-Hydatid Disease/Echinococcus granulosus )

The current wild burros and wild horses are non native sub species, they should be gone from the public landscape.

A sub species is not a hybrid, and I�m pretty sure he was calling Nog dense, not you, Stub.

Thanks Sneaky, like I said in the other comment, I have my moments
And I corrected myself on that statement, he mentioned Hydatid Disease and Hybrid jumped into my out of wack processor

I havent researched this much because I too was taught white man killed them all.

While I believe white man is responsible, I dont not believe it was intentional or that they were wiped out with firearms.

Last January I hunted with a friend in Wyoming. His dad is a retired Sargeant Major and big history buff. Ge has researched this for years.

Some of his points was the mat doesnt add up. He says the estimated buffalo killed doesnt come close to population estimates.

He also points out that the buffalo disappearnce across country coincided with cattle drives through those areas.

He mentions huge boneyards that have been searched, and no evidence of animals being shot.

From his research he believes it was the spread of tick fever from the cattle.

Was some pretty interesting discussions. Not.sure if he is 100% accurate, but he had references with numbers that bavked his claims.

No body has but many have stated they sure helped.

By 1880 Indians had assimilated into United States Of America Culture with many assimilating well before that.

Montana had a huntable population of Grizzlies the day they where placed on ESA protection in the 90�s.

last grizzly in CO was 1979 killed 10 miles from my old cabin...... southern Ute killed them off thier reservation well before that.

I can still remember seeing Mexican Wolves at Ghost ranch in NM in the 80�s, ironically I�m headed as I type to compete against thier descendants. Ironically not one reintroduced Mexican Wolf came from Reservation Land.

Stub= good people
NP= dense

Final pack run through before I hit trail head. You men be good.