At the very least....it creates a situation whereby those consuming hogs would need to carefully 'check' each animal.

The risk of suffering an actual health issue from the handling or consumption of an animal IS probably small. A more likely scenario is someone will kill a hog with the intention of utilizing it only to find out...it is not viable (poisoned). An inconvenience at best. A loss of time, effort and money at worst.




Not possible with free ranging hogs on smaller properties (which is most of Texas). The nature of hogs to utilize a 'home range' of certain size and/or the attractiveness of a piece of property will likely dictate how far they would travel. Where I live most properties are 1K acres or less. We swap/share hogs with our neighbors regularly.




While I agree with the premise, State Law and Case Law does not currently support your position.

Unfortunately, Feral Hogs have been reclassified as 'Exotic Livestock'. Meaning they belong to whomever owns the property (and under which there is presumed control of the animals). This is the State's way of absolving itself of any responsibility for them. So...the hogs I own today, are YOURS tomorrow if they cross onto your property, irrespective their condition.

Until a case is successfully tried in court (Damages), there is no precedent set for 'damages' caused by sick/poisoned animals.

It is to be EXPECTED that some sick/dying hogs (possibly other animals) WILL travel off of the property where they were poisoned. Personally, I'd prefer not to find rotting hogs in my stock ponds, creeks and watersheds. I don't have time to survey/check my entire property each week in search of decaying carcasses.

I am fortunate in that Coyotes and Buzzards find (and clean up) most hogs. They find ALL of the ones that I place in select areas (bone yard). But I can imagine a sickly hog going to a cool spot in the creek (where it is thick with brush) and expiring there. If left to rot, it might create an unwanted situation with surface water or run off.

But this doesn't require condemnation based on my hypothetical's, the system has plenty of 'faults' all on its own.

It's just NOT the answer...on many levels.

Hopefully it'll show up in the fat. Because I never gut hogs, I never see the liver. I just take the leg quarters and backstraps.

I can see your point but unless people are told how would we know who is poisoning where? Would this be county by county or something else? I guess there would have to be a ban on eating wild hog state wide till we were notified differently.

I was about to post this. So I'll just bump it.

This poisoning idea sucks.

I don't realty see too much additional regulation outside of the applicators license.

I don't see any consumption ban on wild hog as they have stated it should be safe. I am speaking from a common sense perspective for not eating them. I don't eat the nasty bastards anyway so it really makes no difference to me but I know a lot of people do eat them so the concern is legit.

I don't see any way to know where exactly poisoning will take place but I can, however, see some sort of additional regulation to maybe place signage (probably to come along with the applicators license) around properties/locations where poisoning is occurring. Notifying your neighbors would just be the courteous thing to do.

Thanks Mickey. I added this to my collection which is growing by the day.

From the link 2 posts back....

... As for the hunters� objections, Miller said a blue dye will make poisoned hogs obvious long before they reach the oven...


Does anybody remember a story about a California pig that was blue color after being skinned? It is all connected now.

Below is my exchange with Sid Miller. Such an ill-conceived idea.

*********************

Thank you for your response. I beg to differ on all three of your points. I am happy to send you published scientific references on all of these points if you so wish. Further, you failed to address my additional points of economic impact, the reduction of feral hogs by hunters that will now not be present for fear of poisoned meat, and the poisoning of other animals.

1) You cite the concentration of warfarin within the product. However, it is not the concentration that is the relevant metric. Rather it is the total accumulation warfarin -- a poison that is quite stable. I dare say that a hog will eat much more than a rodent. You'd be fine drinking a tablespoon of ocean water, but not several gallons -- although the concentration is the same, it is the total amount that is of concern rather than the percent warfarin in the product.

2) Firstly, warfarin poisoning of feral pigs is prohibited in some sates in Australia. Secondly, when evaluating the Australian poison program for feral pigs, Massei et al. (2011) strongly recommended immediate bans on feral hog meat consumption following the poison baiting. Thirdly, Australian studies have also noted large numbers of other animals consuming and being poisoned by feral pig bait, including foxes, kangaroos, wallabies, and birds. Lapidge and Eason (2010) and Cowled et al. (2008) report poisoning of 28 marsupial species, 4 reptile species and 2 bird species.

3) If you've eaten feral hogs, you will have noticed that the muscle is lean but also somewhat marbled with lipid-dense tissue (that is, fat). Indeed, all vertebrates have fat in their skeletal muscles. You cannot eat muscle without eating some fat. In addition, the fat turns blue after a period of time following ingestion. If a feral hog had recently eaten warfarin and it was circulating in the blood system (that is how it gets into the fat tissues), then the hunter would not see the blue color even though warfarin is present in the animal.

Mr. Miller, I understand the issue of feral hogs and I've seen the incredible damage that they cause. I'm also aware of the pathogens that they can carry. I've shot and eaten dozens of feral hogs in Texas. Isn't there any way of promoting feral hog hunting instead of using poison? There are hundreds of thousands of hunters in the upper Midwest who would love to hunt feral hogs in Texas and consume the meat. But, living out of state, it's hard to figure out where these opportunities are in Texas. Publish the contact information for Texas farmers who want feral hogs hunted on their property. Have public land experts show hunters where they can hunt feral hogs. I'll personally go down to Texas and spend a month shooting as many feral hogs as I can.

Sincerely,
Steve


*************************


Your concerns are unfounded. Rat and mice warfarin is .025 active ingredient. Kuput bait is .005. No other animal or bird will be effected. This product
has been in use in Australia for years ,no problems. It turns the hog blue on the fat inside. Warfarin does not enter the muscle only the fat and liver. Hope this helps

Sid Miller
Texas Agriculture Commisioner


***********************************

To: Commissioner Miller

I am a professional biologist and hunter. The idea to use warfarin-containing bait to control feral hogs is absolutely poorly-conceived. This will

1) impact non-intended species such as birds of prey and pet dogs. Will you be delivering high-dose vitamin K for these animals to remediate the effects of warfarin?

2) reduce existing hunting pressure on the feral hog population as meat hunters will be reluctant to continue their activities.

3) reduce the economic activity surrounding feral hog hunting in Texas. I, for example, will discontinue my trips to Texas to hunt feral hogs for meat in which I spend thousands of dollars in the Texas economy. My trips will be to other states until your policy is changed.

and 4) you may kill people with uncontrollable bleeds who have ingested contaminated meat. Many people have genetic variants or vitamin K deficient diets that make them highly sensitive to small quantities of warfarin.

Please do not poison feral hogs in Texas.

It has been completely banned....for a long time.

Wow, his reply reads like something from someone that didn't graduate from high school. Unfortunately, I think we are fighting a losing battle here...

Maybe I missed it, but just because the dye doesn't show up in the meat doesn't mean that the Warfarin doesn't.

You know, for a lot of us, ingesting a little Warfarin meat might not do us much harm. For anybody on Warfarin, they likely know the problems with getting a balanced prescription that is both helping their blood situation without turning them into an effective hemophiliac. My father still has issues with this from time to time even after being on the Warfarin program for several years.

Huh?

Dear Mr. Miller,

Warfarin (or any other Toxin when ingested) can only 'travel' via the bloodstream or lymph systems.

Does the bloodstream not supply ALL tissues and organs?

I understand the toxin might concentrate in the liver (which slows and metabolizes toxins) and fat cells which readily store toxins. But only the misinformed or willfully ignorant...would think the toxin is not also in the muscle tissues.

To what degree....is the only question.

No one is more supportive of finding new means to reduce the Feral Hog population than I. But I don't think THIS is the answer. Both the bait and delivery system have serious flaws.

They want you to think that. Don't. There is a lot going on in the background.

X2

I just want to offer something here. I see a lot of bantering here about whether the meat will affect humans. That is fine...and I believe a legit concern. There are also concerns about an entire industry built around this. Hunters, trappers, hog doggers, helicopter hunters, landowners that make a living off hunts, outfitters, the meat buyers, the hunting accessory business, night vision retailers, night vision manufacturers and on and on... It is huge business in Texas that Commissioner Miller says this policy isn't for...something he is actually right about.

There is another concern that will take you farther than than whether the meat affects humans or causes collateral damage. Say what you will about hogs, love them or hate them, but the biggest hot key item that will bring support is the fact that it is such a downright inhumane way to do this. It is THE key reason that Australia started phasing it out in 2009 and subsequently banned it altogether. I have seen research that has shown hogs die from 1 - 31 days, but generally withing about a week. It is a slow agonizing, painful death. I believe this point will get us further than anything else. I know some folks want them all dead and that is fine, you can have your opinion. But the vast majority of us are here because we enjoy hunting them in whatever manner you choose. Anyway, shoot the messenger if you want, but I think this has not been considered enough.

Nobody cares about the slow agonizing death that the same poison gives rats and mice so why should they care about a hog? They are both vermin as far as I am concerned. It is an issue of visibility, oh, and most everyone has disliked mice and rats as a pest for millennia so who caaaares about a bunch of rats, right? An eradication campaign can have no qualms over the humanity of its methods.

Many, many, many more people want the feral hogs gone than all the hunters combined and their voices are far louder and stronger. Especially the voices from the agricultural industry. All the industry that has formed around hog hunting can die for all they care, and for all I care at that, because it was founded around a destructive invasive pest anyhow. And like I said earlier, just stop eating them if you get scared of the warfarin, easy as that.

Anyone have an idea of the cost of said poison? If it is costly there may be a lot of ranchers forgo this process.

I would rather them to have come up with a sterilization feed that would sterilize the boars for X amount of time. This could be used to control the herds done effectively.

I understand that a lot of folks like to hunt them. I get it, I do too. But most of the folks that hunt them are not the ones that have to deal with the reprocussions of an out of control hog population.

GETUM bye bye piggys

I don't know if poison is the answer but as a farmer, rancher and hunter I want every feral pig in Texas dead today. There will be plenty of animals to hunt with all the pigs gone. They are a non native invasive species and they need to be eradicated.

I'm all for killing as many as possible. I'm not for the potential downstream effects of a poison program.

Poisoning them WILL NOT get rid of them. IMO it will make the problem worse because all the hunters that shoot and eat them like myself will then stop shooting them and trapping them and there's no way your gonna poison them out of existence. Period

And to even buy into that it will is in of itself a little on the retarded side.

From the article that Micky Moose posted earlier.

"The poison was effective, granted. It proved as apocalyptic as Miller promises, taking just a few months to wipe out an estimated 99 percent of wild pigs in Sunny Corner State Forest during an experiment in 1987."

Don't need to poison them out of existence. Just knock them back...way back.

hi hip hooray i am all for it they have tore up my places for the last time, NOW i get to do all legal like.....once we got them cut back we saw way more deer this year it was like a new place..