Lol, it is that technical aspect that is the law.

Maybe, but shooting the dog's owners is a little tougher one to explain in court . . .

So, I'll have to ask forgiveness for shooting your dogs? Guess that's just the reality of it.


Previously, farmers asked us to shoot the dogs also due to chasing the livestock. Luckily, the dogs avoided us like the plague. Wasn't very keen on the idea anyway.

Whether it constitutes hunting or not, you still have to have the property owners permission to retrieve the animal.

It's not as much a matter "hunting" as one of "trespassing"........

Tis one thing i dont miss, the Dog wars... Road lived on people usedta drive out an let dogs loose, as stated we fed & chained up strays, they did get loose once in awhile... Dogs love ta run, so can see point of view of hog doggers... First got ta went with others on coon hunts... Not ta tear or mess with people stuff just ta hunt run dogs.. From what hear used ta use dogs for hunting deer... Were i grew up we had drivers an spotters, moved slowly & learned hunting lanes, No hunting accidents... Wife?s Dad uncles & her pa or papa all had coon dogs & beagles.. They even gave permission for others ta come out an hunt, even hog-dogers... Age of High-tech, got caught up in it meself, but tis more the Kentucky .45 & archery type... Old school hunter, no dogs, not scared ta go threw the thick stuff, usualy have a gun with me... Land owners complain bout hogs damaging, yet put down hunters... so tis why, Twas Blessed when WMA opened up down the road... Freedom ta hunt put some food on the Proud supporter of WMA... as pappy once said: WMA The final fronter were even low income can aford ta hunt ... i got cheap posts...

Colt, you never fail to crack me up.

Have the same effect on mirrors... As pappy once said: Tis not the purdest turd ta float down the creek ... Had ta go back in ta Edit... sitting in dark area not much light, be typing & look up an it started typing in different senctance plus me spelling tis not best realy did get D- in grammer... doing the best i can...
30 years ago used ta be big with dog hunting, coondogs, beagals for rabbits, never used dogs for hogs, & have been in some thick stuff, even after wounded hogs, day & at night back in me caveman days... Nick name had in school was pup, pupster, puppy, over the years i grew inta a mutt, reason gotta sneak up on them thar mirrors...

Sort of like speeding away from a bank robbery? It isn't so much a bank robbery anymore than it is speeding.

between getting charged for making a withdrawl, getting shot at, chased, & a speeding ticket... i'd pud in a plea for the lesser charge...

No, no, no, no, no....you legally shoot an animal on your property and it crosses over to another persons property you are trespassing if you retrieve it without permission.....shooting on another's property is poaching and trespassing. Doggers entering a property to "retrieve" their dogs are trespassing....

It's good to know your neighbors, have their # on your phone. A phone call or text after the hunt often goes a long way. It means a lot to some if you let them know that you stretched that fence going after your dog. Some neighbors will hate you, period. Some neighbors will get exited and want to go with you next time or say hell take my boys! Some will be OK with it and be grateful that you took another boar out, but they don't want any part of it. Know where you stand with your neighbors and adjust accordingly.

I shoot feral dogs. These are dogs that constantly get dumped down the road and they form packs. They then breed in the wild. They are almost always aggressive towards wildlife and people. They are often a problem, and are treated as such. For those of you on here that say you would shoot a trained, suited up pig dog with a GPS collar that screwed up and crossed a fence chasing a pig...all I have to say is good luck with that.

^^^^^^^ Correct. And one last thing that folks seem confused about: Dogs can not 'trespass' (per the law), nor does their presence on a property constitute trespass by the owner/handler. There are other laws that apply (depending upon circumstance) and the landowner/agent MIGHT have some type of legal recourse, but that 'recourse' is becoming increasingly vague with respect to the sport of hunting hogs with dogs.

In recent years...Feral Hogs have been re-defined as Exotic Livestock. So until we have Case Law established that comes down on the side of the landowner (dogs attacking, about to attack or have recently attacked) the landowners 'livestock'... then I think that shooting Hog Dogs on sight would be ill advised from a legal stand point.

Feral Hogs now belong to the landowner of the property on which they are. Technically, they are the landowners 'Exotic Livestock' per definition. So...conceivably, one could legally shoot a domestic dog under current law IF you could prove the need. This would avoid an Animal Cruelty charge by the dog owner.

So who wants to be the test case?

Again, I understand the inconvenience the dogs can create. That is part of what prompted my post, but if we are to be intellectually honest, then we must recognize...our argument is with the dog OWNER/handler, NOT with the animal itself.

So I am asking folks to please not shoot collared dogs or dogs that are clearly domestic (not feral). Make every attempt to find the owner and express your anger with THEM.

flintknapper:

With the next opportunity, capture the dog(s), remove all collars including GPS. Keep all collars with you for this next part. Promptly take the dog to animal control, game warden, etc (somewhere legal). No mention of collars, just turning in a stray causing a problem at your place. At this point the GPS collar will have "disappeared" from the hunter's point of view... he'll continue to drive around hoping for a signal. After passing the dog off return home and place the GPS in some random place on your property. Supposing the hunter is still in the area they can now hone in your place. Wait discretely watching for somebody to come knocking. If somebody comes but doesn't knock call the law for trespassing. If you desire, engage them while waiting for the law. Tell them you turned in a stray or don't but if you do you know nothing about any collars in that conversation.

When hog doggers trespass and they're armed, does this fact up the criminal charges that can be applied by LEOs?

I appreciate the thought...but you are suggesting I be Deceitful/Dishonest in my dealings and I will not do that.

IF I can catch any dogs (as with this last situation), you may be sure... I will contact the owner and issue a stern warning. But I don't want to do anything punitive to the Dog(s).

IF the warning goes unheeded, I will do my best to 'put the word out'. We live in a small community and bad news or unsavory acts....get around fast. IF it is appropriate to get Law Enforcement involved...then that's an option too.

But I want to be careful to separate those who habitually cross property lines from those who simply had their dogs stray one night.

Worst offenders at present...are two light colored 'Pits' (collared but not tracking collars) that come through at least twice a month. I've posted game cam pics of these two at our local Post Office, stating "If these are your dogs, keep them on YOUR property". We'll see if that does any good. I suspect they belong to someone nearby, but not to any of my close neighbors.

Yes

in the Texas Penal Code sec 30

Obviously this is a heated topic on both sides.
I feel for the hog doggers that do it right and respect others property. A couple of my cousins love to run dogs its getting harder to find places with the bad seeds pissing off everyone.

I have brought this topic up with multiple game wardens and Texas peace officers over the last week to get a good answer for the landowners who are being violated. Here is the basics and your options do not listen to these people who tell you you have no options the people trespassing want you to believe that is true.

1) The dogs can not trespass.

2) If you fear for your livestock, property, personal injury, and you shoot a dog you are covered. Example: This can be as simple as "I am afraid of dogs was attacked as a child." Its all how you word it. Of course the dogs need to be on your property not on the county road or the neighbors.

3) If you find dogs on your property and can catch them call the game warden to retrieve them.

4) If you catch dogs and the owners come onto your property without permission to retrieve them it is criminal trespass.

5) If you catch the hunters on your property while hunting with the dogs (retrieving a hog ect.) its Nongame: hunt without landowner consent (felony) Texas Parks & Wildlife Code 61.022

Every single game warden I spoke with said this was the biggest complaint they were getting lately and a big headache for the landowners and officers. Do not be surprised to see new legislation coming down the pipes giving landowners and officers more tools to deal with these disrespectful poachers.

As a side note for landowner protection. Note the agricultural land definition is suitable for not used for.


CIVIL PRACTICE AND REMEDIES CODE

TITLE 4. LIABILITY IN TORT

CHAPTER 75. LIMITATION OF LANDOWNERS' LIABILITY

Sec. 75.001. DEFINITIONS. In this chapter:
(1) "Agricultural land" means land that is located in this state and that is suitable for:
(A) use in production of plants and fruits grown for human or animal consumption, or plants grown for the production of fibers, floriculture, viticulture, horticulture, or planting seed;
(B) forestry and the growing of trees for the purpose of rendering those trees into lumber, fiber, or other items used for industrial, commercial, or personal consumption; or
(C) domestic or native farm or ranch animals kept for use or profit.
(2) "Premises" includes land, roads, water, watercourse, private ways, and buildings, structures, machinery, and equipment attached to or located on the land, road, water, watercourse, or private way.
(3) "Recreation" means an activity such as:
(A) hunting;
(B) fishing;
(C) swimming;
(D) boating;
(E) camping;
(F) picnicking;
(G) hiking;
(H) pleasure driving, including off-road motorcycling and off-road automobile driving and the use of all-terrain vehicles and recreational off-highway vehicles;
(I) nature study, including bird-watching;
(J) cave exploration;
(K) waterskiing and other water sports;
(L) any other activity associated with enjoying nature or the outdoors;
(M) bicycling and mountain biking;
(N) disc golf;
(O) on-leash and off-leash walking of dogs; or
(P) radio control flying and related activities.
(4) "Governmental unit" has the meaning assigned by Section 101.001.

LIABILITY LIMITED. (a) An owner, lessee, or occupant of agricultural land:
(1) does not owe a duty of care to a trespasser on the land; and
(2) is not liable for any injury to a trespasser on the land.

Definition of Agricultural land[/b]
(1) "Agricultural land" means land that is located in this state and that is [b]suitable for:
(A) use in production of plants and fruits grown for human or animal consumption, or plants grown for the production of fibers, floriculture, viticulture, horticulture, or planting seed;
(B) forestry and the growing of trees for the purpose of rendering those trees into lumber, fiber, or other items used for industrial, commercial, or personal consumption; or
(C) domestic or native farm or ranch animals kept for use or profit.
(2) "Premises" includes land, roads, water, watercourse, private ways, and buildings, structures, machinery, and equipment attached to or located on the land, road, water, watercourse, or private way.

It is not a dog problem, it is a people problem.

5) If you catch the hunters on your property while hunting with the dogs (retrieving a hog ect.) its Nongame: hunt without landowner consent (felony) Texas Parks & Wildlife Code 61.022

This is my concern. If dogs have a pig bayed up on property the dog's owners doesn't have permission to hunt, do the they retrieve the dogs and leave, or do they take the pig as well. I suspect there are many dog owners will take the pig as well.

I feel your pain buddy. I had to quit trapping coyotes on my property simply because I was catching too many " pets ". The kind that lay about the yard all day and pack up at night and roam all over. I always let them go if I could, but a couple tried to bite me, and...........

Had my share of hog dogs running around too, cameras stolen , probably because the owner's picture was on it. A couple times when cameras were stolen, I had hog dog pics on other cameras the same day. I don't know what the answer is, but something needs to be changed.

I put old cameras in view and new cameras are hidden.

You need to call the game warden and put pressure on him. He will do his job.

Remember the old saying. It's the squeaky wheel that gets the grease.

If you're in East Texas, no one is going to give a chit about any property lines.

Do ya'll have the same issue with folks running yotes? I know up north they run them with dogs(on GPS collars) and wait until after deer season (the one I know well). It doesn't seem like it has been an issue from what I hear.

Was curious as I don't hear of folks running them with dogs down here. I know where I hunt the terrain and I suspect the flora (CACTUS>>>) are hard on the dogs here. Thoughts?