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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6069249
12/06/15 03:47 PM
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charlesb
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A fellow here in town recently bought a Savage model 11 "Hog Hunter" in .308 that looks very nice. - I am not crazy about the Hogue rubberized stocks, but stocks are not as expensive and time-consuming to replace as they used to be.
One interesting thing about the Hog Hunter is that it is available in .338 Federal, a really excellent short-barrel cartridge choice. The barrel on the Hog Hunter is heavy, not a bull barrel but still pretty thick.
I've kind of had my run with Savages, but this one is tempting.
Last edited by charlesb; 12/06/15 03:49 PM.
Kind regards, charlesb
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6069251
12/06/15 03:49 PM
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MacDaddy21
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Except a running shot is one that can hardly be practiced at any gun range. How would you know with certainty that the animal would not suffer at all after you pulled the trigger?
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6069261
12/06/15 03:54 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,228
J.G.
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so a running shot is more "sportsmanlike" than a LR shot? Yes, by a wide margin. This just keeps getting better.
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: MacDaddy21]
#6069269
12/06/15 03:59 PM
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charlesb
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Except a running shot is one that can hardly be practiced at any gun range. How would you know with certainty that the animal would not suffer at all after you pulled the trigger? It is sad, but not surprising that the troll poster here has no knowledge of how to practice for running shots. He's a 'long range game shooter' as opposed to being a hunter, his idea of 'hunting' is to be so far away from the game animal that it cannot possibly detect him. You know - the type who wouldn't know sportsmanship if it slapped him upside the head. Looks like it's not much of a step from being a "long range game shooter" to being a pathetic troll with nothing intelligent or civil to contribute to the discussion. Good old JG is proving that, over and over.
Last edited by charlesb; 12/06/15 04:02 PM.
Kind regards, charlesb
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6069305
12/06/15 04:35 PM
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MacDaddy21
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Except a running shot is one that can hardly be practiced at any gun range. How would you know with certainty that the animal would not suffer at all after you pulled the trigger? It is sad, but not surprising that the troll poster here has no knowledge of how to practice for running shots. He's a 'long range game shooter' as opposed to being a hunter, his idea of 'hunting' is to be so far away from the game animal that it cannot possibly detect him. You know - the type who wouldn't know sportsmanship if it slapped him upside the head. Looks like it's not much of a step from being a "long range game shooter" to being a pathetic troll with nothing intelligent or civil to contribute to the discussion. Good old JG is proving that, over and over. Wow, Charles. I didn't know you knew more about my personal hunting than I did myself. That is truly impressive. I had no idea I was a "long range game shooter". Interesting you say that about me, as only 3 of the deer I have ever taken were taken with a rifle. The rest were taken with a bow. My custom rifle that I designed to shoot long range has only had the pleasure of shooting a few hogs at less than 50 yards, yet I routinely practice shooting at distances in excess of 500 yards. Keep on bashing people who ask you questions. Seems to be a good strategy.
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6069328
12/06/15 04:58 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,440
TFF Caribou
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so a running shot is more "sportsmanlike" than a LR shot? Yes, by a wide margin. Oh my god. Now I know you don't even believe what you are saying. .
The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference. -George Washington
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6069350
12/06/15 05:26 PM
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,228
J.G.
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Except a running shot is one that can hardly be practiced at any gun range. How would you know with certainty that the animal would not suffer at all after you pulled the trigger? It is sad, but not surprising that the troll poster here has no knowledge of how to practice for running shots. He's a 'long range game shooter' as opposed to being a hunter, his idea of 'hunting' is to be so far away from the game animal that it cannot possibly detect him. You know - the type who wouldn't know sportsmanship if it slapped him upside the head. Looks like it's not much of a step from being a "long range game shooter" to being a pathetic troll with nothing intelligent or civil to contribute to the discussion. Good old JG is proving that, over and over. From where do you get these alleged facts? You been spying on my hunting for the last twenty years? I'd love to see the evidence of these claims.
800 Yard Steel Range Precision Rifle Instruction Memberships and Classes Available
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6069377
12/06/15 05:57 PM
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 34,097
Buzzsaw
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need a refill
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6069570
12/06/15 09:04 PM
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charlesb
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I have been advised to ignore the troll posts for a while.
Anybody have anything relevant to the topic that does not involve a personal attack or harassment?
When trolls take over a discussion, it winds up being all about them, and readers who actually want to enjoy the forum are prevented from doing so.
Last edited by charlesb; 12/06/15 09:06 PM.
Kind regards, charlesb
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6069737
12/06/15 11:12 PM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,440
TFF Caribou
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Ok, relevant to the topic. Seems to me that if off hand, standing shots are the goal, you'd be far better off with a light contour barrel than a heavy barrel. Gunna be easier to hold an off hand shot steady with a lighter rifle.
The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference. -George Washington
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: TFF Caribou]
#6069760
12/06/15 11:26 PM
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bo3
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Ok, relevant to the topic. Seems to me that if off hand, standing shots are the goal, you'd be far better off with a light contour barrel than a heavy barrel. Gunna be easier to hold an off hand shot steady with a lighter rifle. I go back and forth on this. Sometimes it seems as if a little extra weight helps me get steady and slow the wobble. Other times I hold a lighter rifle steady for longer. I think its a balancing act. Long varmint barrels are too heavy and sported barrels are too lite. I've come to like a heavy sporter barrel if its a 26". I have been contemplating cutting my varmint barreled 243 from 26 to 16.
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: bo3]
#6069772
12/06/15 11:35 PM
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TFF Caribou
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Ok, relevant to the topic. Seems to me that if off hand, standing shots are the goal, you'd be far better off with a light contour barrel than a heavy barrel. Gunna be easier to hold an off hand shot steady with a lighter rifle. I go back and forth on this. Sometimes it seems as if a little extra weight helps me get steady and slow the wobble. Other times I hold a lighter rifle steady for longer. I think its a balancing act. Long varmint barrels are too heavy and sported barrels are too lite. I've come to like a heavy sporter barrel if its a 26". I have been contemplating cutting my varmint barreled 243 from 26 to 16. You may be dead on about balance. That's probably has just as much to do with it as anything.
The very atmosphere of firearms anywhere and everywhere restrains evil interference. -George Washington
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6069868
12/07/15 12:36 AM
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charlesb
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I keep thinking back to my old blackpowder Hawken rifle from way back when. That thing was really great for off-hand shooting.
Kind regards, charlesb
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6069886
12/07/15 12:45 AM
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Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 2,954
huntwest
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The FNAR's are nice, one of the very best but I am looking to use a bolt gun for this.
I already know what hardware I intend to start with, either a Howa barreled action, or a Weatherby Vanguard with the heavy barrel if I can find a used one that is priced right. The main difference between the two is that the Vanguard metal will be finished differently from the Howa, and the Vanguard will come with a plastic stock that I will proceed to remove and replace.
I am uncertain about the scope, I know that I want a 2-7 compact variable but have not decided between Leupold and Ziess.
Here I am asking for comments about the handling qualities of short bull barrels in the field, more than anything, and the kind of stock designs that seems to work out best with them. - I may step away from the thumb-hole stocks that I generally prefer, this time around.
One issue is that I will either have to do a good deal of whittling to lighten up a Varmint stock - or open up the barrel channel on a Sporter stock. I much prefer Varmint stocks for shooting at the range of course, but the same features that make a Varmint stock great for firing prone and from the bench would make one too heavy and ponderous for lugging around in the field. - I'm a fair chase hunter, so camping out in a blind in front of a feeder is not on the itinerary here. I have camped out in blinds in the past, and it's a good way to get the venison, but I find it more enjoyable these days to be on the hoof, moving around seeing the country in the sometimes forlorn hope of outwitting the game in its own element.
My theory, still untested is that a short bull barrel should be great for running shots and impromptu shots that often have to be taken without the benefit of a support or stick. As we all know though, reality does not always cooperate with theory. I'd like to hear experiences from hunters who have stalked either game or varmints with short bull barreled rifles.
How does it work out in the field? Wow, those shots you describe are ethical sportsman shots that don't increase the chance of wound and lost game? And all of a sudden 300 yard shots are OK? I can't believe you came back with a post like this. Are you bipolar?
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: TFF Caribou]
#6069913
12/07/15 12:59 AM
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,499
charlesb
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You may be dead on about balance. That's probably has just as much to do with it as anything.
Balance, and stock fit make a big difference. One reason that I tend to lean toward the thumb-hole stocks from Boyds is that they always seem to fit me pretty well.
Kind regards, charlesb
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: huntwest]
#6069921
12/07/15 01:02 AM
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Posts: 1,053
bo3
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The FNAR's are nice, one of the very best but I am looking to use a bolt gun for this.
I already know what hardware I intend to start with, either a Howa barreled action, or a Weatherby Vanguard with the heavy barrel if I can find a used one that is priced right. The main difference between the two is that the Vanguard metal will be finished differently from the Howa, and the Vanguard will come with a plastic stock that I will proceed to remove and replace.
I am uncertain about the scope, I know that I want a 2-7 compact variable but have not decided between Leupold and Ziess.
Here I am asking for comments about the handling qualities of short bull barrels in the field, more than anything, and the kind of stock designs that seems to work out best with them. - I may step away from the thumb-hole stocks that I generally prefer, this time around.
One issue is that I will either have to do a good deal of whittling to lighten up a Varmint stock - or open up the barrel channel on a Sporter stock. I much prefer Varmint stocks for shooting at the range of course, but the same features that make a Varmint stock great for firing prone and from the bench would make one too heavy and ponderous for lugging around in the field. - I'm a fair chase hunter, so camping out in a blind in front of a feeder is not on the itinerary here. I have camped out in blinds in the past, and it's a good way to get the venison, but I find it more enjoyable these days to be on the hoof, moving around seeing the country in the sometimes forlorn hope of outwitting the game in its own element.
My theory, still untested is that a short bull barrel should be great for running shots and impromptu shots that often have to be taken without the benefit of a support or stick. As we all know though, reality does not always cooperate with theory. I'd like to hear experiences from hunters who have stalked either game or varmints with short bull barreled rifles.
How does it work out in the field? Wow, those shots you describe are ethical sportsman shots that don't increase the chance of wound and lost game? And all of a sudden 300 yard shots are OK? I can't believe you came back with a post like this. Are you bipolar? Edited decided to be nice
Last edited by bo323; 12/07/15 01:50 AM.
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6069994
12/07/15 01:36 AM
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Joined: Oct 2015
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MClark
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You may be dead on about balance. That's probably has just as much to do with it as anything.
Balance, and stock fit make a big difference. One reason that I tend to lean toward the thumb-hole stocks from Boyds is that they always seem to fit me pretty well. Above is spot on. I have Contender rifles with 16" bull barrels and use a thumb hole stock fitted to me, long pull. It works well for offhand shots. Short barrels are great in the blind or walking in the forest. Sure there is a velocity loss but if I am going to need more range or knock down I will use a different gun, I doubt may on this forum have only one rifle. Cutting a normal sporter weight barrels to 16-18" can leave a pretty good diameter, cut the fore end also so it looks right, pull butt pad and drill out wood till it balances. Mark
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: MClark]
#6070021
12/07/15 01:49 AM
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,499
charlesb
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I have Contender rifles with 16" bull barrels and use a thumb hole stock fitted to me, long pull. It works well for offhand shots. Short barrels are great in the blind or walking in the forest. Sure there is a velocity loss but if I am going to need more range or knock down I will use a different gun, I doubt may on this forum have only one rifle. Cutting a normal sporter weight barrels to 16-18" can leave a pretty good diameter, cut the fore end also so it looks right, pull butt pad and drill out wood till it balances.
Mark
I know a gentleman who hunts extensively with a short barreled Contender in Europe. All of my TC experiences are with the pistol version, shooting NRA Hunters Pistol Silhouette, and this was some years ago. What I'm looking at now is an 18" bull barrel in .308 Winchester, for still-hunting whitetails.
Last edited by charlesb; 12/07/15 12:20 PM.
Kind regards, charlesb
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6070090
12/07/15 02:16 AM
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Posts: 799
MClark
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I work for a gun smith, we make a lot of Contender and Encore barrels, rifle and pistol We recently did an Encore rifle in 308 Win, 18" with just a slight taper (looks better). With a Leupold 1.5-5x it was sweet handling and looking. Would be perfect for still hunting. Compared to a bolt gun a single shot starts 5-6" shorter with same barrel length.
Mark
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: MClark]
#6070118
12/07/15 02:34 AM
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Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 15,587
TexFlip
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I work for a gun smith, we make a lot of Contender and Encore barrels, rifle and pistol We recently did an Encore rifle in 308 Win, 18" with just a slight taper (looks better). With a Leupold 1.5-5x it was sweet handling and looking. Would be perfect for still hunting. Compared to a bolt gun a single shot starts 5-6" shorter with same barrel length.
Mark My 16.5" Contender gets mistaken for an SBR from time to time.
Just to make sure that it is done thoroughly, I go both ways.
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: TFF Caribou]
#6070147
12/07/15 02:55 AM
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Posts: 2,101
Colt W. Knight
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Ok, relevant to the topic. Seems to me that if off hand, standing shots are the goal, you'd be far better off with a light contour barrel than a heavy barrel. Gunna be easier to hold an off hand shot steady with a lighter rifle. I disagree with this, lighter rifles are easier to pack around, but I find a heavier rifle is much easier to shoot off hand or on a bench for that matter.
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: TexFlip]
#6070148
12/07/15 02:55 AM
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,053
bo3
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I work for a gun smith, we make a lot of Contender and Encore barrels, rifle and pistol We recently did an Encore rifle in 308 Win, 18" with just a slight taper (looks better). With a Leupold 1.5-5x it was sweet handling and looking. Would be perfect for still hunting. Compared to a bolt gun a single shot starts 5-6" shorter with same barrel length.
Mark My 16.5" Contender gets mistaken for an SBR from time to time. Damn you. I need one of those now.
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6070155
12/07/15 03:00 AM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 12,660
Dustnsand
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I have been advised to ignore the troll posts for a while.
Anybody have anything relevant to the topic that does not involve a personal attack or harassment?
When trolls take over a discussion, it winds up being all about them, and readers who actually want to enjoy the forum are prevented from doing so.
Trolls he says
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6070158
12/07/15 03:03 AM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 9,528
RiverRider
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That's a rather serious looking little rifle. I bet the pigs don't like it one little bit.
"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty." -Augustus McRae
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Re: Short, Heavy 308
[Re: charlesb]
#6070213
12/07/15 03:49 AM
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Stratgolfer
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"I was called by the Yorkers a outlaw, and later by the english a rebel" Ethan Allen
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