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Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
#5609956
02/20/15 05:37 PM
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KRoyal
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Smart Marines Although I figured they would carry the 21 not the 17/19. FOX LINK The Marine Corps has authorized MARSOC operators to carry Glock pistols, since most of the elite outfit's members prefer the popular 9mm over the custom .45 pistols the service bought them in 2012.
The Corps issued a Feb. 2 Marine Administrative Message, or MARADMIN, that green-lighted Marine Corps Forces Special Operations Command, or MARSOC, units to use the Glock 19, a proven design used by many units in U.S. Special Operations Command.
The reliable, easy-to-maintain 9mm features a polymer frame and a 17-round magazine.
The Marine Corps just completed an exhaustive search for a new MARSOC pistol in 2012. The service awarded a $22.5 million contract to Colt Defense LLC., for up to 10,000 Close Quarter Battle Pistols.
The custom, 1911 design replaced the fleet of worn-out MARSOC M45 pistols. It features a rail for mounting lights, a custom trigger, a manual safety, improved ergonomics and glowing Tritium sights for low-light conditions.
As nice as the new .45s are, MARSOC troops prefer to carry Glock 19s instead, sources said.
The 1911 was a ground-breaking design that served the U.S. military before World War I until the mid-1980s. The design is still popular, but it's also heavy, prone to malfunction and limited to seven or eight-round magazines, pistols experts have said.
The Corps began issuing custom 1911 .45 pistols to its elite Force Reconnaissance units in the 1990s. Gunsmiths at the Quantico Weapons Training Battalion Precision Weapons Section hand built them from old 1911s that had been replaced by the M9 9mm pistol in the mid-1980s.
The creation of the first MARSOC units in 2006 caused the requirement to grow from 400 pistols to 4,000 pistols. Finding enough surplus 1911s for the Precision Weapons Section's custom rebuilds became impractical.
The Marines chose to stick with the 1911 design for MARSOC. Marine testers placed a high priority on accuracy. The winner of the 2012 contract had to be capable of putting five-shot groups on target that "didn't exceed four inches by four inches at 25 yards" from an unsupported firing position, Marine officials maintain.
But military pistol experts maintain that the 1911 design, while extremely accurate, requires more training and care than other modern tactical pistols.
Young operators have had trouble with the 1911's beavertail grip safety, according to one former Marine weapons instructor who trained MARSOC members.
Many shooters wearing gloves tend to grip the 1911 too high and do not properly disengage the beavertail grip safety, so the pistol won't fire, he said. A lot of professional shooters who run custom 1911s will disable that beavertail grip safety to avoid this problem, he added.
The 1911 design is also known for feed-way stoppages, a malfunction caused when a round gets stuck feeding into the chamber, experts said. Horizontal and vertical stovepipes – types of malfunctions that occur when an empty shell casing gets caught in the ejection port – are also a problem with the 1911 design.
The Feb. 2 MARADMIN, is an annual message that lays out guidelines for authorized individual weapons, optics and accessories for Marine Corps rifle and pistol training.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610032
02/20/15 06:19 PM
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Scary Poppins
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I don't know why anyone would choose a glock over that Colt, but I guess it's nice to have options at least. Maybe they'll try out the PMR 30 next?
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610104
02/20/15 07:04 PM
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Well considering the Colt M1070CQBP 1911 M45A1 Close Quarter Battle Pistol is $1750 on sale, I'd take 3 Glocks and 1K+ of ammo any day of the week and twice on Sunday. I know if I were an Operator and needed my gun to go bang every single time I'd choose Glock over any 1911 especially if I were fighting in bad conditions (rain, snow, sandy, muddy).
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610126
02/20/15 07:16 PM
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MacDaddy21
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Not to mention 7+1 in the Colt vs 19+1 in the glock...I'd much rather get to shoot 20 times instead of 8 before having to reload.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610134
02/20/15 07:20 PM
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blackcoal
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The Greatest Enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge.--Stephen Hawking
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610139
02/20/15 07:23 PM
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rentzington
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how could you have problems with the grip safety, your hand goes on the grip it presses in the safety.
for accuracy i'd rather have the 1911, but having more than double the rounds in 9mm is a difference maker.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610152
02/20/15 07:30 PM
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Varget 7-08
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If it had to be a Glock, I'd like a 21 Gen 4
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: blackcoal]
#5610155
02/20/15 07:32 PM
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LOL You know me and my Glocks..
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: MacDaddy21]
#5610158
02/20/15 07:33 PM
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clandr1
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Hopefully they allow the Glock 17 as well - bigger guys might have issues with the slightly compact grip on the G19. The article says the Glock 19 has a 17 round mag - wrong, it's 15 rounds. Not to mention 7+1 in the Colt vs 19+1 in the glock...I'd much rather get to shoot 20 times instead of 8 before having to reload. Glock does not make a gun that fits 19+1 rounds from the factory.
Last edited by clandr1; 02/20/15 07:34 PM.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: clandr1]
#5610164
02/20/15 07:36 PM
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The article says the Glock 19 has a 17 round mag - wrong, it's 15 rounds.
I caught that too. That's is why I put 17/19 in my first post, because I wasn't sure which they were talking about. Seems like for a combat gun they'd go with the full size over the compact for better accuracy. Then they commented about the 17 round mag I figured maybe they didn't know what they were talking about.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610167
02/20/15 07:38 PM
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patriot07
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I'm not a Glock guy at all. As a civilian, I much prefer most any other polymer pistol. But if I was in battle, that's probably what I'd want to have.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610273
02/20/15 08:38 PM
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Bullfrog
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LOL You know me and my Glocks.. I bet you lit up like a Christmas tree when you read this article. Lol. Boy loves him some Glocks! Hey I'm a fan too. Just love 1911's too for what they are. But a $1750 over $550 gun that just won't quit, it's a pretty easy argument. Or I'll go to $600 on a bad day.
Man if I knew what Oxner knows I could throw away what I know
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: Bullfrog]
#5610276
02/20/15 08:41 PM
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LOL You know me and my Glocks.. I bet you lit up like a Christmas tree when you read this article. Lol. Boy loves him some Glocks! Hey I'm a fan too. Just love 1911's too for what they are. But a $1750 over $550 gun that just won't quit, it's a pretty easy argument. Or I'll go to $600 on a bad day. Haha yea it made my day reading that article. I've said it before in other 1911 threads, I love the way they look and I like the thought of carrying cocked and locked I did it when I first got my CHL, but I just can't get a danged 1911 to run for me. They're too picky on ammo for my taste.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610289
02/20/15 08:52 PM
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rentzington
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LOL You know me and my Glocks.. I bet you lit up like a Christmas tree when you read this article. Lol. Boy loves him some Glocks! Hey I'm a fan too. Just love 1911's too for what they are. But a $1750 over $550 gun that just won't quit, it's a pretty easy argument. Or I'll go to $600 on a bad day. Haha yea it made my day reading that article. I've said it before in other 1911 threads, I love the way they look and I like the thought of carrying cocked and locked I did it when I first got my CHL, but I just can't get a danged 1911 to run for me. They're too picky on ammo for my taste. weird i always hear this and ive never had 1 issue with one feeding hollowpoints I just wouldnt carry one because they tend to be on the heavy side.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610299
02/20/15 08:59 PM
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Joined: Dec 2014
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clandr1
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The article says the Glock 19 has a 17 round mag - wrong, it's 15 rounds.
I caught that too. That's is why I put 17/19 in my first post, because I wasn't sure which they were talking about. Seems like for a combat gun they'd go with the full size over the compact for better accuracy. Then they commented about the 17 round mag I figured maybe they didn't know what they were talking about. I don't know why they would approve a 19, but not a 17, but we ARE talking about the government here, so who knows Either way, glad they are giving the guys choices. As long as it's NATO ammo, they should be able to run whatever sidearm they want, in my opinion. Maybe have a requirement that they carry spare parts on deployment, or something like that. I can't imagine too many times when I'd run a handgun if I had a rifle at my disposal anyhow...
Last edited by clandr1; 02/20/15 08:59 PM.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610572
02/20/15 11:58 PM
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Tactical Cowboy
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I still want to see all of these 1911s that don't work. However, a lighter pistol that holds more BBs would probably be a good thing for combat.
The secret to a long life is to try not to shorten it.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610578
02/20/15 11:59 PM
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68A
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Was talking to with a friend about this last week. They have a few options but he chooses the glock as well.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: Tactical Cowboy]
#5610642
02/21/15 12:37 AM
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RiverRider
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I still want to see all of these 1911s that don't work. However, a lighter pistol that holds more BBs would probably be a good thing for combat. One thing the "experts" said that made sense is that the 1911 requires more training. It undoubtedly does. But all this "prone to malfunction" talk is a load of horse manure. I have owned several 1911s that NEVER malfunctioned in in way, shape, or form. Two of them happened to be a pair of Norincos I paid $212 apiece for back in '93.
"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty." -Augustus McRae
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610649
02/21/15 12:41 AM
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chalet
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LOL You know me and my Glocks.. I bet you lit up like a Christmas tree when you read this article. Lol. Boy loves him some Glocks! Hey I'm a fan too. Just love 1911's too for what they are. But a $1750 over $550 gun that just won't quit, it's a pretty easy argument. Or I'll go to $600 on a bad day. Haha yea it made my day reading that article. I've said it before in other 1911 threads, I love the way they look and I like the thought of carrying cocked and locked I did it when I first got my CHL, but I just can't get a danged 1911 to run for me. They're too picky on ammo for my taste. Just curious. Who the heck are you shooting at that 230 ball ammo won't put a hurt on?
Shoot. Eat. Repeat.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610654
02/21/15 12:46 AM
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As of right now no one, but paper and the occasional hog. That's not the point though, I want my guns to go bang every single time regardless of the ammo I put in it. Say if something were to happen and you had to scavenge ammo from somewhere. You have a 1911 and all you find are some 180gr HP and then your pistol jams everytime you pull the trigger. That's no bueno to me. If I have a glock I can scavenge any ammo made in that caliber and never have to worry about it not going bang. I don't want to be held to only 230gr round nose ball ammo just so I can shoot a 1911.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610746
02/21/15 01:36 AM
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RiverRider
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That's why they build reloading presses, my friend. No need to compromise on the quality of your pistol.
"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty." -Augustus McRae
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610769
02/21/15 01:49 AM
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Lol I wouldn't say a Glock is a comprimise in quality.
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: KRoyal]
#5610788
02/21/15 01:59 AM
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RiverRider
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That's okay, you don't have to say it. I understand.
"Arguing with you always makes me thirsty." -Augustus McRae
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45s
[Re: RiverRider]
#5610798
02/21/15 02:04 AM
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SR025
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Re: Marines Allow Operators to Choose Glocks over MARSOC .45
[Re: RiverRider]
#5610807
02/21/15 02:09 AM
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That's okay, you don't have to say it. I understand. SMH fanboys will be fanboys... Pretty bad when you have to reload to make your "quality" gun run.
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