So explain how AZ doesn't have a problem.

AZ has a lower meathead density.

The entire state of AZ had a 2013 census population of 6.6M. The DFW MSA had a 2013 census population of 6.8M.

Tenyearsgone, I'm not being sarcastic here. Direct me please to the data that indicates "Arizona doesn't have a problem....." As a result of their OC laws. (Or any of the other 43 states.....).
I live my life with a relatively low level of fear. Not that I'm some aggressive bully, but I just don't worry too much. I lock my doors at night, but I don't have an alarm system. My home defense gun is locked up in a quick access box in the next room. Get the picture? My opposition to OC isn't against the guy that wants a .45 on his hip as part of his daily costume ("look at me, I'm a cowboy, or a LEO wanna-be....), which would just cause me to chuckle. But rather I'm worried about the OC being the next phase for those that already enjoy intimidating the public with their freaky/scary/bizarre appearance and behavior in public. Ad a Glock to the hoodie, gothic, spiked, obscene tattooed, etc... Individual that's just daring the average Joe to look at him wrong, and we have escalated this class of people to a new threat level. I guess I see it as another regression is our society that will only decrease, not increase, public safety for those of us that are law-abiding, working class, contributing citizens of this country. You know, the TRUE minority.....
There's a fix. Require mandatory training for safe gun handling, and give a proficiency test. (Phased in like Hunters Ed was..). Put laws that require guns to be properly stored in order to prevent unauthorized use. Most of the school shootings were carried out with guns taken from relatives to which the shooters had easy access. If your gun is taken from your home, or car, and it was NOT under what I would call a "double layer" of access restriction, and the gun is used to commit a crime, then you should be held partially responsible for that crime. A law like that would cause an instant restriction on access to guns by a good many people that shouldn't have one. It's not a cure-all, but it would be a step in the right direction.
Let me explain "double layer" of gun security. A locked door is layer one. A locked gun safe, or a properly installed gun lock would be the second layer. Folks, when your gun is not in use, it needs to be well secured so as to prevent unauthorized use. If you keep a gun in the drawer next to your bed, that's fine WHILE YOU ARE IN THE BED, but when you go to work, it needs to be locked away.
Theres my $10 worth of two cents on the subject of gun control.

Lol your home defense gun isn't going to do you much good locked up in the next room..

Is there anything about this issue that warrants a chuckle? (I noticed you "laughed out loud")

I keep my pistols locked in a quick access lock box in the cabinet in my dressing room next to my bedroom. Yeah, I can't quick draw from under my pillow like you probably can/do, but then again I don't have to worry about my grandson or some other visitor to my home finding it and having to live with the consequences of the tragedy that could happen. I weigh the likelihood of me experiencing a home invasion, and in that case how likely would be that a pistol under my pillow, as opposed to 10' away, be the difference between life and death, Verses the likelihood of an accidental shooting resulting from an improperly stored firearm.
Read the news. How many stories are there where a home owner saved themselves with a gun verses how many tragedies resulting from unsupervised gun handling? The answer is not many verses a bunch. I'm just playing the odds. Not lol because it's a serious matter.

Lol you need to get off the MSM teet. There are tons upon tons of stories of homeowners and armed citizens using their firearms to save themselves and others. Just because it's not on msnbc or cnn doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Yea you hear tons of accidents on the news because that fits their agenda and the sensationlize it.

I don't have any kids nor grand kids for that matter that live in my house just myself and my wife. No one that comes over is in my bedroom where I keep my bedside gun, all the rest of my guns are stored in the spare room in a locked secure safe. Please don't preach to me about unsecured firearms. No I don't sleep with a gun under my pillow that is just ignorant.

You spew the same logic the antigun crowd does. That a gun owner is more likely to shoot themselves than an intruder. If you believe that why do you own guns? If you really believe that than it sounds like you don't have very much training with a firearm, if you feel that you're going to hurt yourself or someone else with it. If you don't use guns for protection and keep it locked in a different room why don't you just get rid of your guns and use a baseball bat or a brick.. That would be more useful to you and yours than a gun locked up in a different room.

LOL he said verses instead of versus. To which verse is he referring? Open carry, concealed carry whatever...It is a right as stated in the constitution, and should be legal. Any argument made regarding illegally obtaining or carrying a firearm is null and void. Why? Because it is ILLEGALLY obtained and has no place in an argument regarding LEGAL ownership, and LEGAL carry of a firearm. The discussion I believe is regarding LEGAL open carry. Some like it, and some don't. That is their individual right to voice their opinion. If however; open carry does pass then the people (Majority) have spoken and it at my discretion if I chose to conceal or carry openly. It is at the opposition's discretion to carry on as they wish, and the same goes if it does not pass. We will continue to do as law abiding citizens that legally own firearms and carry in the means concealed or unconcealed as permitted by law as duly recognized by the majority voice of we the people. I don't understand why people try and force their opinions or ideologies on others as if they are the only one with any opinion that matters. State your objections and move on.

Why is a stranger going to be looking under the pillow in anyone's bed? As far as children go, I would worry more about them taking my Mustang GT out for a joy ride but I don't keep the car up on blocks nor the keys in my safe box at the bank.

Some folk need to teach some manners and possibly educate family & friends to the rules you have set for your possessions.

I am not directing these statements to anyone specific...

Amen

I have been watching the posts on this thread for a while, my 2 cents worth is this....I do not have to worry about my kids or grandkids doing something stupid with my firearms, cause they were taught form the get go about such matters. Anybody that's so spooked about what some family member or some acquaintance might do with a firearm they might encounter in their home needs to do a better job with their family training, choice of friends .....or get rid of their guns, get a club and a big dog. I have been robbed, I have caught those that broke into my residence, and have dealt with them harshly before turning them over to the sheriff. I ain;t scared but I do not suffer fool's well. My family and friends know to knock and announce their presence. They know I am armed or have a weapon within a fairly close reach. The only time my safes are locked is when we are away from home. Sorry for the ramble...JMHO.

What they said ^^^^

anyone who supports laws to have u lock up guns, and classes to own them should move to new York or Calfornia, I still ask the question why is open carry accepted in so many states with easy can,t fathom it being this hard in texas, the other open carry states are not running red with blood, they said same thing when CHL passed here remember, us gun owners need to get togathier, and not work aganst each other

OK, who decides how much is enough training? I have extensive training (military, law enforcement and other), I'm also a military, NRA law enforcement and State of Texas certified firearms instructor. Should the owner of a firearm be required to have as much training as I have? I've had a CHL and I went to the CHL instructor course, I never intended to use my CHL instructor cirt but I was even more convinced not to offer open training because frankly, there is no damn way you can learn enough in one day for me to consider you safe with any firearm. I would feel much better if every yawho in Texas had to spend a few years in training to carry but that's not going to happen.

To me even though you have been around firearms all your life and have a CHL I would never consider you "trained" based on those minimum standards. That does not mean your not safe, just not trained. You are using common sense, your train of thought is reasonable, no doubt about it. It makes sense for someone to learn about their firearm before they try to use it but who am I to tell you how much training YOU need not knowing one thing about you. Heck, I've seen a bunch of cops that, in my opinion, were a danger to themselves and other with a firearm and they are required to carry one! I'm not a big supporter of open carry and would never do it myself but IMO the 2nd amendment does not allow the restriction of firearm ownership or one's ability to carry that weapon. That's my take on "shall not be infringed" but I recognize both side of the issue.

+1. Concealed carry is a wonderful thing. Open carry is for yahoos and wannabes.

First off what is stupid about it? There are times when it is best to open carry. And I guess you are insulting all the LEOS out there that are in patrol cars for being Yahoos and Wannabes. They open carry don't you know.

As far as open carry is concerned I'm for it. The opponents of open carry are the same ones that used to say there would be blood in the streets if the legislature passed The Concealed Carry law and we all know that didn't happen. Pass the open carry law and make it where you don't have to have a license to open carry. If a law abiding citizen wants to open carry that's fine with me. there are other states that have open carry and no problems because of it. Let each individual decide for themselves if they want to open carry. All those people that are of legal age to have a gun is quite capable of deciding for themselves if they want to open carry. Some times there is good cause to open carry.

I believe California, Illinois, New York, and District of Columbia joins ranks and hold hands with Texas as Proud Leaders against Open Carry. Does that seem rather odd????

How about open carry while wearing a ski mask outside a convenience store. If open carry passes both would be very legal even when combined, however it does not mean you should do it. Open carry really muddy's the water for L.E. when it comes to attempting to determine who is a bad guy and who is not. L.E. can't determine your intent without detaining and questioning thereby harming open carry proponents delicate sensibilities...open carry is a double edge sword. I agree as Americans we should have the right to carry but also with that right comes the individual's common sense, just because you can does not mean you should. Open carry will only desensitize L.E. to guns. L.E. protects the public in general even though there are those who dont like to believe it. When people begin to complain they got "jacked" for open carrying L.E. brass will hand down regulations that will turn L.E. into blind eye thereby creating more of an opportunity for armed criminals to victimize the common citizenry. This should be common sense...

[quote=wtjim] L.E. can't determine your intent without detaining and questioning thereby harming open carry proponents delicate sensibilities...open carry is a double edge sword. [quote]

wtjim

Really? The police won't be able to determines if a guy openly carrying a gun is a good guy or a bad guy?


I have been to states that have open carry and the cops in those states had no problem telling the good guys from the bad guys. In essence, you're saying that the cops are to damned stupid to be able to figure out the difference between a good guy and a bad guy. I've known a number of cops from the local police all the way up to the feds and they were all pretty damned smart and well educated, most with college degrees.

Oh I want to put this to you about being stopped by the cops, if open carry were legal in Texas and a person was legally carrying a handgun in a non threatening way (all of the people I've seen open carry are always carrying their guns in a holster), the cops shouldn't be stopping him and have no reason or business to stop him unless he was breaking the law. That is what is called real common sence.

I will never open carry, as I would rather not paint a target on my back.

I would rather carry concealed.

Mr Tumbleweeds,

Don't get so worked up bud, ask the Cops you know about open carry. I will bet most would disagree with open carry, not on the premise of constitutionality but rather muddying the waters in trying to determine lawful activity or not. You seem to make the assumption that since you are a conscientious, law abiding, soon to be, open carrying citizen everyone else shares your same morals and character. Can you psychically determine the mental status of someone by merely looking at them? Can you derermine someone's mindset/criminal culpability by merely looking at them? If you can I would like to be your agent and book your nationwide tour teaching these techniques to L.E. Further if open carry becomes legal and after time, common place, would L.E. detain/question an individual open carrying a rifle/handgun strapped or holstered going into a church, school or workplace? Absolutely not! Now it will be much easier for suspects with ill intent to carry out there violent plans under the cloak of open carry legality.

Seriously my .02 posts are to bring up points that may or may not have been thought out about open carry. You apparently are for open carry while I care to be a bit more discreet and conceal carry. We are on the same side friend, we just have 2 polar opposite points of view.

For your inference that you believe I think L.E. too stupid to determine differences in legal/illegal activity I find offensive. You don't know me and I don't know you please do not be personally negative in replying to others, especially me.

The above points are to show it is near impossible to determine criminal culpability, convicted felon/prohibited person status by mere observation. It proves the fact that without a detain/question scenario you can't determine if the open carry is legal/illegal. It further proves that L.E. will become desensitized to open carry and can most definitively stop L.E. from standing in the way of armed criminals intent on carrying out their activities on you, me and our families.

Mr. wtjim is correct. We are on the same side. We all, as gun enthusiasts, need to be on the same page. Pass open carry. Period. If you choose not to open carry then don't. If you don't think for ONE second the anti's are reading any and all of this, you are crazy. They will use these heated discussions against us. Please, if you don't agree with open carry, don't go blasting the ones who do and same goes for the ones pushing for open carry.

LEO's are a touchy subject with me. MOST of the ones I have met and interacted with have been top notch. Some, not so much. It isn't up to a LEO to determine what my rights are. If they have an issue with open carry, they can reach out to the same representatives I/we can, but to base a law on what the LEO's want is silly. These guys see good and bad people every single day and can professionally asses situations in front of them. It's their job, and a skill necessary to stay alive.

Short and simple of it, I would rather have a LEO stop me and ask for my ID while open carrying than forgo the right entirely.

EDIT- If it comes off i am anti-LEO, I AM NOT. They have a thankless job and are under the micro scope of every knuckle head out there. To any and all LEO's on the board, Thank you for your service.

^ What he said.