Ok heres the story of what I got going on now with my dog. took here out yesterday and acted like we were hunting(calls,gun, blind and Birds) had her sit and got to calling and my buddy throws the bird. While the bird is in the air I say sit and fire my shotgun. Next thing I know shes gone to go get the duck. She does this several times, the E-collar does not work. I had it set at 65 and figured that would stop it. It doesn't bother her and I mean that when I say it.
Now I know I have to get her excitement under control. The punishment has to be higher than the desire to go get the bird. I went and bought a heeling stick today.
Did the same thing today and broke the training session down like this. First thru the decoy into the pond, she did great waited until I told her to go. Next I called and called on the duck call and my wife thru the duck, she wanted to break but didn't, Got her used to that and she did great. Now put it all together with the calling,shotgun and birds. She just will break everytime!!! Now when we put it all together and she broke, I took the heeling stick and whooped her a$$ and told her to sit. Now I whooped her hard and ain't going to say I didn't. You put the shotgun into the hunting and let it go off. She will break EVERYTIME no matter what the punishment is. She heels,sets and will fetch great. This is any controled envorinment!!! Just add the sotgun and she goes crazy wanting to go get the duck. If you trainers can help me I would appre. it, Thanks In advance Jason.

I am NOT a professional trainer...but I have spent alot of time at the kennels with my dogs, and this is what I have seen.

Put her on a short check-cord, about 6 ft. Tie it or put it under the leg of a dove chair (or whatever you're using). Once she takes off and hits the end of the cord her a$$ should pass her head. At that exact moment...issue a stearn NO and HERE command. After a couple of times, she'll get the picture. Now she may still stand when shooting, but that is usually pretty easy to fix. Just don't release her until she is sitting. She should learn that the only way she gets to "play" is to sit and wait for the command. Repetition is the key to training.

Some of the professionals should be along shortly.

Good Luck.

Yep!!! What fowlplayr said. Maybe even like a 10-15' lead so she gets good momentum before getting turned around. How old is she?

I used a check cord with my dog and fixed the problem in 3 sessions.

Work singles first. When she is steady on singles move to doubles. When she is steady on doubles use non-release words. Keep making it more tempting to break.

Do not allow the retrieve on a break. Have your helper pick up the bird.

I would be careful on the longer cord you could wind up hurting the pup. Good advise whoever said do not allow the retrieve. Have a kennel close and kennel the dog for an hour. Try it again with the short cord and if you get a break deny the retrieve and kennel again. Pup will learn real fast that breaking only ends the fun.

Fowldreams- She is a YLF that is 3 1/2 yrs old

we will run a dog that breaks from behind the truck and tie a check cord to the trailer ball. when your dog breaks, he/she goes straight to the kennel in the back of the truck. Try again after other dogs have run

Might also try just shooting w/out throwing anything. Get a helper to do the shooting and you hold the dog.

Teach it the same way as a sit on the whistle. when the shot is fired comand sit and sit the dog if needed. I like an 8 foot lead and a choke chain. Take your time and limit retrieves until the dog is staying seated on gunfire 100%. If the dog is a strong retriever this will not set you back one bit.

Once the dog is steady to just gunfire, repeat the process adding a retrieve. But you must continue to hold the lead and have a person shoot and another person throw. If you are shooting and working the dog it is harder to get the dog to sit if he tries to break.

I'm by no means a pro trainer but I have used this process on my own dog and 2 others that have had breaking problems.

Hope it helps,
Billy

Ok guys heres the training session for today. Took her out to the pond and tied a 6' piece of rope to the tree and her collar. Had my buddy throw the dummy duck into the pond and I let the shotgun sound off. She took off like a mad man until she reached the end of the rope. At which time she ended up on her back and yelping. Let her test the rope until she learned, I then took the rope off which I swear she knew when I did. Had my buddy throw again without the rope on and again she was gone. Let her test the rope and end up on her back side a few more times. Then she started to get the message. Then she would stop about 2' feet infront of me and at that time I would burn her butt with the Dogtra E-Collar. I would only let her go get the bumper 3 out of 10 times. I would make her set for minutes at a time and even got and we walked away. I guess after the rope and collar she is starting to get the message. Now she will whine when setting, wanting to go get the bumper. I would grab her muzzel and smack her nose and tell het quiet. But I figure with a few more training sessions like that she might get the message, what do ya'll think??? Jason

re-read my post about doing doubles after she is steady to singles, seriously.

TexasEd I will do that when I get her steady to singles...Thanks TexasEd I appre. it so much sir!!! Jason

at some point you might want to get someone with a very well trained doga and work her by making her sit while the other dog retreives ect. my .02

Didn't you just get her back from a trainer?

yeah Foosh I did....She was trained before and all the sudden when we were hunting last year she wouldn't go get a duck for nothing!!! I MEAN NOTHING... Called a bunch of friends of mine in the waterfowl industry and they all said this trainer was the guy!!! Carried her in May and picked her up a few weeks ago....He got her drive back and retrained her!!! Called him again yesterday and asked him what the deal was, cause when I picked her up we had her on live birds. We carried her to the pond and he was doing the same thing I was doing(acting like he was hunting) and she never broke for him. I keep replaying this over in my mind and starting to think I have done something wrong with her. I have done the same thing he was doing and the same thing I have always done even with my first dog maximus. Foosh pick your brain and see if I'm missing something cause I would sure like to know. She never broke when she was a pup and when she quit hunting it was like a light switch. She just quit, she wouldn't even play with a tennis ball. Sent her to him and he has done wonders with her, it's just this problem here. But we just got back from training and she is making headway. I think I can see a light at the end of the tunnel I just hope it ain't a train.

Dogs don't transfer the skills they know and use with their trainer to others without training and practice. They don't,,, that's how they are wired. So your dog working for your pro and not you is no big surprise. How often did you get to the kennel to train with your pro when your dog was there?

Also when she broke did she get the bird/bumper??

Angie

Angie B I never went up to train with the pro...I never was told to come up that way to do that. And YES she did get the bird the first time she broke. I really think that first session of training has what got me in this. Her breaking, but we are making alot of headway now. I think she will be ok it will take time and training with her.

I would take the pond out of the equation until she is steady on land. If she breaks on water and you can't get her back then she will get the bird everytime. At least on land you can have your training partner get the bird before she does. I've always been told to teach on land and then transfer to water.

Also, Angie makes a great point. Dogs will perform much better for their trainers than their owners. She knows her trainer won't let her get away with it. You've already shown her the first couple of times that you'll let her get away with it. You've got to enforce the same rules the trainer did.

Yeah, you have to transfer the work the pro did to applying to hunting with you when he isn't around.

Also, you have to keep refreshing the work or they lose it. They can and will regress without regular training to reinforce their skills.

I ran a hunt test last week and my dog did great on marks and obedience. This week she did great on marks but was sloppy on obedience (pretty heel and sit with bird) which I attribute to not doing enough obedience work with her this week for her to work through the new distractions she had at this test.

I would like to take the time to THANK EACH AND EVERYONE who wrote in this thread. I have taken the advice of eveyone here and used it to help my dog and myself. We are making alot of headway and getting better each day. Again THANK YOU from Jason

Sounds good... Keep doing what your doing. Give your pro a call for some suggestions too. He/she can walk you through this....

Angie

Arkansas I read this real late and I am going to be straight up. Not personal just read. Your pup is smart and has read you like a book. Your dog has tested you and you may not have seen the test coming. It happens to every dog owner. First she refused a retrieve/second she began to break/now she holds and whines. She is retrieving for herself, not for you. Her drive is for her pleasure not yours. Stop doing the rope today right now, i didn't realize all this was going on when I told you that earlier. All she is doing is learning when the rope is on or off. Your problem in a lot deaper than the dog knowing when to go or not. I sincerely believe you need to get back to the trainer. You the trainer and pup work together until you reprogram the dog to work for you not her own pleasure. Now I need to say there is nothing wrong with her, she is probably a retrieving machine, she just needs to get it into her head that she can only move when she is told. I can say this because I got a bitch doing the same thing right now, whining included. She is the pleasingest bitch I ever had. Works hard, works for me but put a feather in the air and she loses her mind. She will absolutely have a fit trying to get to that bird. It is my fault because I use my male mostly. He gets all the trigger time. I fully intend to rectify this this year.