Could somebody tell me the difference between federal black clouds and Winchester Xperts? The flight stopper steel and xpert pellets are pretty much the same right? Jagged pellets and pellets with a stupid ring around it...just curious why one is $11 and the other is $25. Looking for a $14 difference here...somebody school me on this one.

My guess would be because Duck Commander shoots black cloud. So federal has marked up the price for those that "just gotta have it"

This makes sense. So all the newbies that got introduced by duck dynasty shoot black clouds?

Black cloud wad is a wad grabber designed to grab the chock and slow it down so it doesn't break the pellet pattern. Thus holding the pellets in a denser pattern further down range. Same thing as a patternmaster choke. Hence why black cloud can't be used with all chokes. Similar to what blindside did with its wad.

I've been hunting ducks since way before BlackCloud came out and I'll be around when it's gone...I shoot it because it patters well and kills ducks...same reason you shoot what you shoot

I love black cloud and I am not new to the sport. I have way less crippled ducks with bc than I do xpert which means I actually shoot less shells.

Rum that is the reason I shot BC. Shooting BC; with the correct set up, was actually saving me lots of money. My shotgun has a tendacy to go "BOOM" once and duck hits the water "DEAD". Also from reading on the BC website the "flightstopper" wad is a necessity to make the BC not scatter like folks are saying on here. I can't help but wonder what would happen if you put regular steel shot in one of these wads. I figure any shot under 20 yards with pretty much any choke you can use with this wad would be like shooting the birds with a slug. Also, stay tuned, we test Hevi Metal today. Will have results up this afternoon, with photos.

So what if I got a patternmaster choke and shot Xperts? Same effect or no?

Most of yall are talking about the wad...just trying to justify if this special "wad" is worth the coin.

I don't claim to be a gun expert nor will I ever. I have also never said it WAS the wad that gave me my good patterning don't know what it is, for my gun, it just likes the combo I feed it!!

I think expensive shells are over rated, I've shot 110 ducks this year with cheap cheap 2 3/4 inch shells and have had very few cripples. Less than probably 5

I can tell you this federal( which I usually love their products) has bad quality control and so does Winchester which is worse. Kents and hevi metal seem to have the best quality control.

Source: I sell these for a living.

Basically my combo best value: kents... Best shell: hevi metal... This is just from my personal experience after trying almost everything out there, and hearing complaints And praises from 1000s of people.

Yes a patternmaster choke not made for black cloud has the same effect. The choke is designed to slow the wad down.

H metal, kent and heavy shot.
Nothin else

Its all on confidence. Whatever helps you sleep at night. Personally I loved black cloud but when blindside came out I tried it and the difference on geese was vicious. Not all shells are created equal even though they all kill.

Pattern your gun and see what does best. I've read the biggest plus with pattern master is that it slows the wad this shortening the shot string.

For turkeys my best(most pellets in head target) came with Winchester xtended range hi velocity turkey loads from a Briley turkey choke. 50+ pellets in turkey head at 50 yds. Those shells are $40 ish/ 10 shells. Only gun I've seen outshot it was a 3" browning gold with a rhino choke and rhino custom triplex hevishot loads.

Luckily my benelli shoots best with briley improved mod with 3.5" expert 1550 fps 2s. I usually hunt 60-70 days a yr so I'm glad it likes the cheapos.

I love hevimetal and hevishot for the "crunch" factor and I shoot them when I goto AK but don't see the value in everyday hunting.

If u are shooting decoying birds try the Winchester steel target loads in 6s. I think you'd be shocked at the "crush" factor that comes from that swarm of angry little bees. I've been out woodie shooting 3x. 9 birds / 9 shots with 20 ga and 3/4 6s from a skeet choke. I think my patterns as big as a pickup truck at 20 yds.



And as a taxidermist I love that the 6s don't leave big gaping holes.

Yep those target loads will crush em close in

Went to test yestereday evening and the white lithium grease we needed to cover the test plate was missing. I have to run in to one of the local towns and get a tub. I'll have pics up in the next couple of days......