... or is it?

Sounds settled to me!

^ i made your sig line. thats tight.

Lol, I couldn't pass it up

Is that a good thing?

If you think that one is vague, as a licensed collector I can show you some federal gun law regulations that are worse. But like it or not that is what they pull it from.

5000!

Nothing special to write other than I'm going to bed for a few hours so I can try to kill some more limits in the am

Federal game wardens had a guy this weekend on Ft Hood that had a deer measure out at 12 15/16" and they still took his deer, wrote him a ticket and suspended his on post hunting privileges. I have had several run ins with them myself and they have always been just downright RUDE!!

Wow, had to change my reply after reading allllll the other posts.

Do to the fact we are hunting a federally protected migratory bird, it's already messed up. Too many people with a hand in it.

I've had many encounters with state and fed. wardens and the majority were not pleasant, even if perfectly legal. Most i've been approached by seem to always have a negative attitude. Hey, they chose that career path, right!!

The possesion (pile) law is probably there to stay, but will be enforced based on what kinda mood the warden is in. Like it or not, I have to deal with it or quit. I don't have enough money to fight it and i'm not quiting.

I read the regs as you cannot pile them. You must prove possession by separating them. Some of you are looking for specific wording that you cannot "co-mingle" or pile them, but laws aren't written like that. They have to be written semi-vague in order to blanket every situation. Regulations would get miles longer if you had to write out every situation specifically. I completely agree with SniperJohn if you think this is vague then good luck if you have to dig deeper into different regulations (especially environmental).

If they are piled all together in your buddy's truck then they are NOT in your possession, they are specifically in his since it is his vehicle. Yes, you can claim them, but you are not specifically possessing them at that time. If they are on your strap then you are possessing them. If they are specifically in your pile next to your shells (say while you are out retrieving a downed duck) then you have a better shot at proving to the GW that you are keeping them in your sole possession.

Please don't bring up the "innocent until proven guilty" thing anymore either. You must ALWAYS prove to the GW that you are on the up and up. You must prove you have your plug in, you must prove you are not using toxic shot, you must prove you didn't shoot over your limit, and you must prove which birds you are in possession of. In COURT you are innocent until proven guilty, not in the field.


This thread would only be 7 pages long if not for the stupid one liners y'all shoot back and forth. It was really a good conversation before all the rif-raf.

Oh ok

It all depends on which version of "possession" is used. If I have a pile of birds at my feet or on a strap that I am holding, occupying or have under my control wouldn't that not matter how many other people there are in the boat because they are in my control?

Bring your own strap. Keep your birds on your strap.

Don't pile them when you clean them,

So if I had 7 they could consider that criminal possession.

You can pile em all you want when cleaning them. Just need to have the tags.

Actual Possession

"Actual possession is what most of us think of as possession—that is, having physical custody or control of an object" (United States v. Nenadich, 689 F.Supp. 285 [S.D. N.Y. 1988]). Actual possession, also sometimes called possession in fact, is used to describe immediate physical contact. For example, a person wearing a watch has actual possession of the watch. Likewise, if you have your wallet in your jacket pocket, you have actual possession of your wallet. This type of possession, however, is by necessity very limited. Frequently, a set of facts clearly indicate that an individual has possession of an object but that he or she has no physical contact with it. To properly deal with these situations, courts have broadened the scope of possession beyond actual possession.

It is MI, it is dove, but it says "keep separate" Is it verbatim from MI regs? I don't have a clue. I wouldn't be surprised if the regulations there and here are written about the same implying a similar leap in logic. Can you dismiss a citation in court? Probably. Would I want to go through the process? I have better uses of my time. Also does TPWD have a similar FAQ doc?

"...Each hunter must keep his/her birds separate from those of other hunters in the field..."

http://www.mdwfp.com/media/64279/dove_field_prep_and_regs.pdf

let's keep the one liners to a minimum. This thread reeks of inside jokes.

I just think it is ashame that if this is the law you must come to the Texas Hunting Forum to learn about it. What about those that pick up the Texas Waterfowl Digest or Read on the Federal Website. The only thing that is mentioned is to keep them in your possession.

I just don't understand how 2 piles of birds separated by 4-6" of space are in two hunters possession, but pushing them together suddenly places them in only 1 hunters possession. Its hogwash. If its truely a regulation it would be extremely easy to state it explicitly.

I've always kept mine separate from the group, but only because I usually keep a journal of exactly what I shot by species and by sex.

Hunted for 15 years in Louisiana, been checked hundreds of times with our ducks almost always in one big pile and its never been a problem.

Have been checked a handful of times in Oklahoma, each time with more than a limit on the same strap. Each time was never even asked who shot what even when there were two pintails on the same strap during a 1 pintail/person season. Guess those Wardens used common sense and realized 12 ducks, 2 pintails, two hunters, sounds like each hunter got a limit with 1 pintail each.

Like I said before its impossible to go around the law and put birds in other hunters piles to prevent one from going over species limits. That just can't happen. Separate piles fixes everything.

Here is my thought, if someone wants to be a lawyer...knock yourself out....

Me I'm going to eliminate as much interpretation as possible, I don't have the time nor do I want to pay to have to defend my thoughts on what I think is common sense vs the governing body wether state or federal.

I get checked a lot KS, Oklahoma, and all over tx including the coast. Never meet IMO a bad state or fed GW, but I also don't leave much for them to have to interpret.

If yall want to agrue with a GW over regulations and laws knock yourself out its a free country.

wow this thread is still going?

I know my wardens for the most part. All my places I hunt are in the same three counties. Until we get new wardens I will not have to worry about it. I have never been told not to pile my birds. So pile on boys! and stop all these one liners lol

I cant believe this thread is still going. .. How much debate is there? I can post the numbers of 2 different Kleberg County GW's , y'all can call if you are that worried about it.....

Talked to a GW whom I have never met. He said you can not pile them. I asked what was the specific law. He skirted the question. I asked again. He said it is against the law. Third time I asked which law. Finally he admitted to not knowing the law. His final answer was you just can't do it. I am not totally sure but I think I heard the sound of the BS button being pushed. "You just can't" does not cut it.