I think, just like veterinarians, vaccines and big pharmaceuticals, it is first and foremost a business. A very large, bureaurocrat and largely PROFITABLE business. The organizations behind much of the testing are self-perpetuating and make big bucks in the name of 'safeguarding' the breeding industry. One should not lose sight of that. They gain power and ultimately more money, by making themselves "essential" or "required." The pathway is this: 1) be a 'good idea'; then 2) be the 'preferred method'; then 3) become the common denominator - businesses affected 'do or die' by their servics and are therefore forced to 'voluntarily' commit; and finally 4) become required.

Right now, they are at the 'common denominator' point. Breeders who don't buy into the program fall to the wayside, believed to be unethical, irresponsible and the like. By driving market demand they can then push to become REQUIRED... and once they reach that level, they will begin to demand repeat tests, methods of 'proving' dogs have been tested, methods of penalizing for lack of testing and of course, the goal of every bureaucratic monopoly... MONEY. More fees, higher fees and the like. That is the cold hard truth about the business side of health clearances. If there were no money in it, large pharma would never have gotten behind it.

Now, all that said... making sure you are doing everything you can to produce healthy, sound pups for your clientele is the only ethical way for a breeder to do business. MOST health clearances aid in this.

There has been a poster on here who for years has harranged me, trying to get me to say whether or not I test and to state my stance on it. Because the query always came on the heels of an unwarranted attack against my program, I declined to respond. Not because I am ashamed of my answer or have anything to hide. On the contrary. I declined to answer because I refuse to 'explain' or 'justify' myself. I operate well within a firm set of ethical boundaries, I don't need to explain myself.

But in my response to you above, I finally did answer that question. And my answer explains why my dogs are not listed on the big testing organization's websites. It's because I know it is 'big business' and because I refuse to aid in the transition toward helping them become 'essential.' I refuse to have standards dictated to me and I don't believe they should be dictated to anyone. Ethics are void when mandates are present. I will do the ethical thing NOT because some large bureaucracy mandated it, but because, very simply, it is the right thing to do. And since I can trust myself to do the right thing, I don't need to plaster my dogs up on large pharma controlled websites to prove that I do. The only opinion I care about when it comes to my dogs, is that of the people who choose to purchase them. THOSE PEOPLE, my clients, I will do everything possible to make happy.

That's nice... Another line of BS why you don't do health clearances..

Since I don't know you, or your dogs and you want me to believe your ethical and straightforward. A good start would be to get health clearances. It cost the breeder a whopping $1000-$2000 per bitch or stud dog. Big deal. It's not feeding, "da Man".. It's doing the ethical thing.

When I think of you Ironspike I immediately think of one of my favorite quotes..

*The irresistible pull of self-delusion is almost overwhelming*

Angie

That wasn't my pup and that's great if he tried, I appreciate it. The thing is everyone ASSUMED my post was aimed at him when it wasn't. Again I didn't even know who he was. InONLYnfound out bcause I was getting pms from people saying if u want to see a puppy mill or someone who just pumps out pups for money look at the said persons website. Again, I NEVER knew who he was.
So it was in no way aimed at him.

breed a dogjust about every heat cycle and will be breeding them when they are 10 years old too just for that money, even though they may take geat care of them.

i have know several breeders who dont make squat on a litter of pups bcause they are breeding to the top males in the country which cost alot and there females have all of there health clearances plus the money they have put into training to get there female at a top level , so no, they in reality dont make money on those pups.

labdaddy, are you part of a retriever club? when my friend came out to look at one of your pups he said your male would just take off and you couldnt get him to come unless you had a collar on him and he even made u fall flat on your face. a retriever club may be able to help you with some obedience so you dont always HAVE to have a ecollar on him to control him. he did say you had some very nice health pups and mom and dad were good looking too.

Gengo, I would NEVER say ANYTHiNG behind a computer I wouldn't say to someone's face. Just sayn

Nope just an old duck hunter who is happy with my dog just as he is. He don't need hand signals or whistle stops or big air just needs to fetch ducks and like it

i have and i stand by my beliefs, and i will drop it also.