In our deer camp there is a discussion as to whether we should shoot fewer deer specifically does because of the low fawn survival rate (20%). One side of camp says we should let more does walk and the other side says to fill your tags. This is a low fence ranch with plenty of deer.

Any thoughts or discussion is appreciated.

Depends on your overall deer numbers. If you are constantly overpopulated then yes fill your tags. If you have your deer numbers in check then you may want to go a little easier on the doe killing this year. If you dont know whether you have high or low deer numbers for your property then it is nothing more than a guessing game on what you should shoot this year.

our tags didn't change much from last year, so it appears the biologist in the area sees little to no impact at this time

I've been thinking about this too. I have a bunch of yearling spikes and was thinking about taking a couple of them. I understand full well that yearling spikes are way too young to show their potential and nobody can tell you if they'll be huge one day, blah, blah, blah.

The point is that my property is in an area with really lousy deer overall anyway. Most of the bucks aren't anything whatsoever even if you let them get to maturity. The odds of removing a future stallion from the herd by taking any young buck are slim. Very slim.

So should I take a few of the smaller younger bucks, of which we have TONS? I'm not taking any does, as for some odd reason, I actually see way more bucks than does.

I just read a story in a hunting magizine that said we all need to fill our tags this year so Deer will have enough to eat in the winter and not die of starvation.

With this drought we had, it is making food for winter scarce.

Do some research, I would take a guess and say that no one on your lease is a wildlife biologist. The only way to get an answer is to know what your habitat will support, then adjust accordingly.

This is exactly what I have read. Also take them early to save some forage for the survivors.

Found this link on-line.
http://www.armadillotimes.com/2011/06/27/will-the-texas-hill-country-drought-impact-deer-hunting/

I was at my lease in Sutton County the first weekend of October Bowhunting and the deer looked horrible. Most of them were skin and bones. I thought that we would have a bad die-off this winter. I went back this past weekend and the deer that I saw looked much better. There was green stuff growing everywhere and I did not see any deer that looked bad. Maybe it will not be as bad as I thought since we got some rain a couple of weeks ago.

Fill your tags.

Another article on Texas Deer Assoc. web-site

Hunters Urged To Be Cautious:
Study Spike Conditions Before Shooting
By John Gill Special to the Standard-Times

SAN ANGELO, Texas � A leading West Texas wildlife management expert says that recent rainfall in the area has helped with the first step in range recovery, but he has some tips on how to manage an already severely damaged deer and turkey population.

With the Texas big game season only a few days away, Steve Nelle of the Natural Resources Conservation Service in San Angelo is urging hunters to be cautious in taking spiked horned deer this season.

When the season opens on Nov. 5, "hunters will definitely be seeing a big increase in spikes, but many of them will be immature bucks that haven't had the food needed for normal antler development," said the range management expert.

Nelle is almost through with his annual survey of game populations in Tom Green, Coke, Irion and Sterling counties, but he's already seen enough to say that deer numbers are below normal. "The hot and dry summer has taken a toll on both adult and young deer. Recent rains will help going forward, but they came too late to help with antler development and the survival of animals struggling to find water and forage," Nelle said.

"Many older bucks and doe perished during the summer. I estimate that total deer herds are down 10 to 30 percent. The population has been water deprived, prompting herds to move from one ranch to another. Deer will migrate as they search for water and browse. I've seen them concentrated around creeks during our surveys," Nelle said.

Nelle has noticed that many West Texas creeks and ranch stock tanks captured runoff from last week's rainfall, but only enough for a limited time. "We might have a 30- to 45-day supply, but much more is need to help wildlife through a tough year," he said.

Nelle urges hunters to study the body conditions of spikes before pulling the trigger. "Those nubbin spikes could be a 2-year-old buck that's been stunted because of terrible range conditions. On the other hand, a long pronged spike with normal body size is probably one that needs to be removed.

"I've seen plenty of undersized and stunted doe during the aerial surveys. These are females that will breed within a few months and having their young in June or July and I'm worried they aren't in condition to have fawns. I hope spring fawns survive.

"The normal fawn crop for West Texas is 60 fawns per 100 doe deer. For the past year the ratio has been 10 to 35 percent, much lower than what's needed to sustain healthy deer herds," Nelle said.

Nelle said areas hit by summer wildfires were showing initial signs of recovery. "Recent rains have given rise to some weeds and other growth, but these burn locations are completely void of deer. They may visit the area to feed on the weeds at night, but for the most part they don't live there anymore," he said.

"I've talked with some ranchers who have burned locations and for the most part they're shutting down hunting for the 2011-2012 season."

The 2011 turkey hatch across West Texas was almost nonexistent, and the next few months will determine if the trend is to continue, Nelle said. "We must see more moisture and the development of ground cover from now until spring. At stake is future quail and turkey hatches."

http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/publications/pwdpubs/media/pwd_rp_w7000_0827.pdf
A good read concerning antler growth/nutrition/spikes

this is why

if you want, you can drain your wallet and feed them outta a bag.


but a rifle cartridge is alot cheaper

As mentioned, depends on the area, your habitat, deer numbers, etc.

We hunt in W. Llano co. We've got an overly-high deer density and poor buck-to-doe ratio. In speaking with our Biologist, he said this year it will be critical to take out some older does and known culls, and control numbers. He would also prefer we not take any mature bucks this year, but if we must, try to limit it to 1 or 2 and make sure they are 5.5+. Above all else, he wants to young bucks to have plenty of nutrition for the coming winter.

The article implies that the food shortage wont be an issue because alot of the deer are already dead. His research says that the deer population is already down 10-30%. If we fill our tags then the population would be down even more. Maybe too low?

We have been managing our place for the past 4 years based on survey counts and everythign has been checking out good from year to year, and it appears we have been taking approximately the right number of deer. We are the only people feeding year round in our are, and are low fence. This year our population counts indicated a deer population anywhere from 3-5 times our carying capacity. I know that these deer are not resident and are simply coming for the groceries, but I say why not take advantage of it we are more than doubleing our harvest from past years.

matt

We have a lot fewer does and fawns this year than last. That being said we have a whole lot more bucks in the 1 to 2 year old range.

Will help to fill tags.Will be more food for rest of herd.

We're taking out does and making room at the dinner table.

Do some type of survey to get a ratio and number of deer. Then make a management plan. Shooting doe will not hurt you but it will leave more feed for the rest of the deer that survive. For example 50 doe raising 10 fawns this year and shooting 20 of those doe leaving you 30 doe after the season. Those 30 doe can raise you more fawns next year with less doe. If you do over shoot it only takes a yr to rebound with decent numbers of deer.

I would agree with that, our deer population rebounded from very low with few bucks back to capacity in just 2 years and with our harvest we are seeing as many bucks as does.

+2

I agree about shooting the does. But during a tough year I give the spikes a break. Just my opinion. Not trying to start the spike debate.

The way I have looked at culling is if you have more deer in a certain age class than you need and more deer on the property than your intended capacity then start shooting at the bottom and work your way up till you get the numbers where they are suposed to be.

^^ this... spot on...