Show me different.....

It is a component, but paying a lot of $ for the right to hunt where there are great deer doesn't guarantee success. You still need knowledge, competency with your rifle, commitment of time, etc.........
All about money, no. Partly about $, yes.

Only if your definition of success is rooted around inches and not experiences

Colt, is that you?

Well…kinda hangs on the definition of “success?” I like the majority of hunters on this site, am not loaded with cash, but am wealthy enough to hunt, have been out hundreds of times, not seen a thing, and viewed that day overwhelmingly Successful. But, I get your point, money will get a person loads of 200” bucks, 500”+ elk, rams, lions, zebras, models….and being a good shot or hunter is not necessary. I’m sure you’ve met the guy.

Hunted 14 years on the Medio Creek in between Beeville & Refugio. Would drive the Scramber down there and put it in 4WD when I came through the gate. There were 7 of us on 1,400 acres and I could barely afford it. Hunted outta tripod the 1st year. Then put together my own stands and did the best I could. Generator ran the lights in the spartan cabin, we hauled in our own water, the TV had no reception, the privy was moved every couple of years. The dd's were always welcome guests and they learned a lot about life there. I never was able to shoot a qualifying trophy and was penalized with no trophy opportunity for four of those 14 years.

Let's just say things have improved since then. I wouldn't trade my Beevllie experiences for anything.

Define success? Buck or Elk of a lifetime, probably

Envy is a horrible, self induced affliction.

First sin.

$$$$ certainly can provide lots and lots of opportunity that limited to no $$$ will not, but that applies mostly to everything, auto buying, home buying, wife shopping, retiring comfortably, vacationing, damn near everything. To me not the end all but many may view otherwise.....

One thing I realize is you better learn to be comfortable with that which you can afford or make it so you can afford more. Some get to afford more and then still find no satisfaction.

You don’t really need lots of money for that, just need effort and time afield. Every year a giant gets killed on public land via a OTC or easy draw tag

So much about my definition of a trophy has little to do with being admired by others. My largest WT is not my most treasured one. Where, how and other circumstances come into play.

Don’t point out facts Bobo. That’s not what this thread is about

Couple of my book animals aren’t even mounted, and none registered

I rank my year by days spent afield vs what I kill.

Wife shopping. Hahaha!

That is very true. I worked for a very rich family for quite a few years. They had 4 sons. 3 of them were the most miserable people you would ever want to be around. 2 died of drug overdoses. Money, especially an abundance of it doesn't bring you happiness.

Instant guaranteed success? Whatever that may be, then probably yes it takes money.

But if you do your homework, spend time in the woods, apply for points and permits, more time in the woods, make landowner contacts, more time in the woods. On the cheap you can have success killing game, provided the effort. My biggest Whitetail came from an Oklahoma WMA, Sambar from Powderhorn WMA, Aoudad from Caprock Canyons State Park, Ibex from Mason Mountain WMA, Several Alligators with one over 13ft from WMAs and a state park. Several deer, Turkey, and smaller animals from a number of other WMAs and other public land. I have had a hunting lease for several years in East Texas that costs me nothing but my time doing hog control and other work. I have also put the effort to accumulate points in other states for several years that I can start cashing in to hunt for the cost of a license and tag if I want to. I do have a paid hunting lease too, but most of my "hunting success" over the years has come from those other free or inexpensive hunts. Did I also say spend time in the woods.

Im sounding like a parrot at this point.. but... define success...

Im not a horn hunter.. Im a meat hunter and an experience seeker..

If I end up with a 160 class whitetail walking into one of my shooting lanes, sure Im going to take him and put him on the wall.. but finding a 160 class deer hasn't been my objective in almost 50 years of hunting..

between my wife and I we took 5 whitetail this year.. 3 doe and a couple of scrubby bucks that desperately needed to be removed from the herd.. and I think I had an extraordinarily successful year this year.. the freezer is full, and Im enjoying venison 1-2 times a week right now.. and all of that was done on a little 135 acre lease that I pay $311 a year for us to hunt on (I basically pay the taxes on a property that a buddy of mine owns and has been sitting on for 20 years doing nothing with it)..

It takes practically no money at all for me to be "successful"....

Feel that Op possibly mixed up success for opportunity, if that were the case I almost fully agree....More $$$$ in private hunting, much more opportunity presents itself.

Someone is simply frustrated.

I bought 30 acres from a family member at a great deal. I have deer and pork in the freezer harvested from said land. I pay about $300/year for taxes. = success

Bird watching is free.

I have access to a place outside of Huntsville and another 30 minutes from the house. I can get 1 or 2 doe a season (I'm a meat hunter not a horn hunter.)
My biggest expenses are gas, time, maybe a bag of corn, and a bottle of good whiskey.

There is something special about grinding it out on a regular old lease for a nice buck that feels quite a bit different than an outfitted hunt. But, even regular old leases can be expensive these days not even including the feed, feeders, blinds, etc.

I think that depends on how you define success...
Adios,
Gary

I can remember when actually seeing a deer was a success.

Money has nothing to do with success!!!! Knowledge is how success is achieved.

Lets just look at minimum costs to be able to hunt. Minimum requirements are a gun, ammo and the ability to hit your target by some minimal practice by several trips to the range. minimum is $400 rifle $200 scope $50 rings and $200 ammo plus $125 for range services. $30 for a hunting license and lets say a $45 APH permit for a place to hunt public land here in Texas. $30 for orange hat and vest. That will get you hunting here in Texas at a cost of aprox $1100.

From here knowledge is everything. You can be successful on just $1100 if you have the knowledge. But with no knowledge or experience you will not be successful at all.

Actually, as he has never clarified…I’m thinking he “means” RICH GUYS kill bigger animals, more birds, more fish…than poor guys. We’re off in the weeds on the definition of Success. And how HARD or much we hunt, how smart we are, what are land is like, etc. Simply money equals big trophies.

Which is pretty true.

Why we moved to Wyoming, cheap to hunt almost everything and those that are expensive tags now we have taken- mostly all on public land for free. Bison, moose, bighorn sheep, elk, WT and a few mule deer.
Just had to afford the resident tag fees.

Opportunity is what is needed for success.

There are many many things in life that money provides for those who have it and earned it versus those who do not. It is the way of our world and society like it or not.

Each person has the opportunity in this country to be who they want to be and earn as much money as they want to earn. Treating it as though there is something wrong with making and having money is a bad thing is just silly. My Mom and Dad always told me "we are all a result of our OWN decisions."

You can be on the most expensive lease there is and that does not mean you will see or harvest huge deer - it takes tons of effort and constraint to grow big deer under any circumstances.

And yes ...... deer leases are more expensive than they were some years back - but what isn't???

Not rich vs poor, it’s simply difference in priorities. Most rich guys probably started serious hunting much later as their focus was building wealth first not hunting, yet I have a friend that’s only shy of NA slam via a polar bear. He did it while active duty and never married, he hunts 100 plus days a year, and will probably work util he is dead, he doesn’t care about wealth accumulation.. Different priorities

There are exceptions. But I can take you to a many guys that are rich and have trophy rooms like cabelas and at the other end I can take you to a ton/greater number of common/not wealthy hunters ( who can shoot a gnat at 300 yards and stalk/ hunt like Daniel Boone….and they got… well that deer in their 10x10 bedroom.

I didn't define Success because I feel there are multiple definitions or scenarios that apply to this. If I had to say what success is for me, it would be achieving the best possible outcome for whatever the situation was. Stuff like seeing more game or going after the biggest possible buck are driving factors for me.

Let's say killing a trophy deer is your idea of success. What are the chances of killing let's say a160 inch deer on public land? I'd say very low less than 1%. Now give me $15,000 to spend on it and the chances are 100%.

I've hunted deer leases that there was a 100% chance of taking a buck over 130 every year. And you would see 15-25 bucks almost every hunt. IMO there's not any public land in Texas that comes close to that.

Ive hunted Colorado Public land elk several times. Most trips I didn't even see an elk. You could say I'm just not a good hunter, but my experience is the most common outcome. Did I have a good time? Absolutely! Would it have been better if I shot a 6 x 6 bull? Yes for sure!

I'm not trying to start something with the rich guy or the public hunter. I just thought this would be a good topic to put out there.
Maybe I shouldn't have said all about money. More like heavily influenced.

I don’t think I have anyone in my circle that doesn’t have a decent trophy room and they range from very wealthy, to lower middle class. One thing they all have in common, they prioritize hunting, over other spending and other forms or recreation.

The whole wealthy vs poor is a huge projection IMO.

Had bunches of good hunts on public waters for ducks and geese in eastern Kansas in my younger days. Only cost was our own equipment.

Sorry but this entire thread is stupid - to say if someone is a good or bad hunter is based off of their wealth is BS - a good hunter is a good hunter no matter what their net worth is - I hate threads like this because it makes all hunters look bad IMO -

I think this entire thread is nothing more than a trolling experience for the OP. The whole "show me different" nonsense is what gives it away. (And here I am engaging in the BS.)

This is a useless thread. Just my two cents.

Well duh. That would equate someone's idea of success in life is driving a Lambo. What are your chances of finding a new Lambo in a lot full of Chevys? Slim to None. Your going to have to go to the Lamborghini dealership and bring a lot of money. But someone with that kind of mindset would also believe if they don't have enough money to buy a Lambo, they will never be successful. Yes, stupid thread.

This is possibly. I feel that money provides opportunity which leads to success.

I can get anyone an opportunity for 200 typical at $12.5k on a legit place - anyone. I spend more than that, counting everything, and do not get a 160 every year. 2 in 18 years. Love my spot and would spend more. Going down with 120 bags and building a new pen tomorrow. Klappenbach will help me. Those 2 & 3/4 inch steel corner posts will be fun.

This thread is stupid and maybe I was trolling a little. But I didn't say that ^. I'm ok with people not liking my opinion. I got some pretty interesting responses.

There are low price leases available. There's also public hunting available. Anyone can be successful there. Now, if you define success as a b&c deer, yeah, lots of $ is gonna make that easier to achieve. My biggest deer is 136". I've got several in the 120-130" range. Fill the freezer every year with does and pigs to the point where I haven't bought ground beef in over a decade. Success.

It's not this colt.

tis thinking success, weather it be hunting, fishing, life in general
Tis a personal thing.

Or, just simply it’s constant hard work that provides opportunity.

Nothing wrong with you having an opinion, but you didn't do anyone the courtesy you wanted for yourself. YOU haven't shown where hunting is all about the money.

So, if an inexperienced/wannabe RICH person wants to fill his trophy room with a 500” elk or any other animal he wants on a weekend hunt; that can be done. While a dirt poor, inexperienced/wannabe doesn’t have a snowballs chance in ___, of doing that. Nothing wrong with that, just economics. There always will be have and have nots. Look at Cotton Mesa Ranch, money talks, Elk of a Lifetime is going to cost you $25,000+, 95% success. Billy Bob will never be able to do that.

I should clarify, if you want the B and C Club Elk, it’s $75,000 +. I’ve heard closer to $90.

There is no blanket answer here. Is it about the hunt or the trophy to you? Is putting in the work what you find satisfying or do you want someone else to do the work so you can hit the easy button? Instant gratification can be bought if you are willing to throw enough money at most endeavors. I see you have been a forum member here since 2010. Definitely old enough to know, not much in life is free…

Challenge accepted. I have taken 25 elk, 19 pronghorn, 3 black bear, bighorn sheep, mountain goat, 2 alligators and well over 100 deer (mulies, blacktails, whitetails) and a lot of hogs. I have never hired a guide or paid any huge fees other than licenses.

You just got proved wrong.

Money and health can provide opportunities. That’s been the case since day one on pretty much anything.


What these threads are usually about is someone who is dissatisfied with their achievements/accomplishments and are looking for an excuse as to why they were not able to meet goals/desires.

Try this. Tag was $800. Guide was $1400 for 2 days. Then DIY


https://texashuntingforum.com/forum...xico-public-land-elk-success#Post9126890

That's awesome buddy! Good for you. Let me ask you a few questions? How many years did you hunt doing all this? And do you think it could be done again if someone were to start today? Would it cost more? Are tags as easy to draw for as they were when you started? Could it be done fasted with more money spent?

That's not it for me. I've got plenty of heads on the wall. I own land. I'm not envious of what others have. I'm pretty happy and content with what I have.

So how did you come to the conclusion that hunting success is all about money?


The world is constantly evolving and the hunting world is no different.

The are barriers to entry that money can overcome in many instances but that does not mean there are not alternatives available if one does not have the financial means.

Buddy of mine drew a desert bighorn tag in Utah and he killed a book sheep. He did hire an outfitter who knew the area and was successful

One could circumnavigate that by spending $35-$50k and go to Mexico to kill one and do it in less time however ( time meaning as not having to wait years or decades to draw the tag)

Both opportunities exist for people however.


It’s hard to believe it because of the situation we have in Texas but there are plenty of quality public hunting opportunities in most states and trophy animals are taken every year by Joe Bluecollar.

This may change in the future, as mentioned before things are always changing and evolving

Thar be more trueth ta the tittle of thread than some will
admit.
And tis in the right section of Forum. Open Discussion.
In past, been lots of discussion about HF/LF, people hunting border fences,
Trophy deer, (often see pic's of bucks, with poster asking is it shootable).
& the give it another year.
Most of the rules, (13" & bigger) were set in motion by people with big buck$.
Place lived, went ta 13". Seen more bucks, but 13" rule stopped from taking them.
Racks just got thicker beams, taller, but very seldom the 13" & wider. The mature bucks would be bordering.
Fact lease hunters are the upper pay grade hunters. Seen many hunters loose thar lease cause some one had more money. They put time, effort & hard earned money into it.
People hunted on leases with were more about putting on the .
& the threads got locked down because some one got thar feelings hurt.
The prices of leases is a very good example.
Have seen people say, hunting HF tis more difficult than Open range. Yet the take pictures of these deer
& post on Photo section.
Several times have had (big rack) deer survive because they jumped fence.
Success tis an individual thing.

I stick to this early response of mine and partly backs Op's contention.

Actually a person can shoot a B&C elk on public land in Wyoming for the cost of the license, 500" no but that is not a free range elk anyway.

Once again, you are proven to be wrong.

Poor guy has same opportunity and can do the exact same thing… it’s simply where does his priorities lie, where will he spend his money. If cotton mesa is the experience that you want knock yourself out.

The only way you never hunt sheep is never apply, only way you never hunt B&C bulls is to never apply or buy an OTC tag . Only way you never hunt Pronghorn is to never apply or buy a tag.

Does money open doors yes, but every non rich hunter that has a huge trophy room , there is a rich guy that was working his [censored] into the ground not hunting so he could hunt later, why the other guy wasnt worried about wealth and was hunting, priorities are just different. End results similar


The “wannabe hunter RICH guy” statement is pretty telling of your perception, that’s like saying every non wealthy person is a slap [censored] that didnt work hard and blew all their money, on frivolous keeping up with jones spending, and failed out of school because they where to lazy to go…

Try this: Tag was about $450 and this was taken on a 1 day hunt on public ground in Southeastern CO. Drew the tag with a couple of points, drove up from Amarillo (2 hr drive) hunted the day and was back in Amarillo before suppertime.


Or this: This bear was taken on a $100 non-res tag (admittedly a limited draw tag) on public land in CO. Drove up from Amarillo, got the bear and was back in Amarillo before the sun set.


But hey, I guess that can't happen to the regular guy unless he spends lots of $$$ right? The total combined cost for both those hunts would not go above $800 including licenses and the fuel to get there and both hunts were done in the last 3 years!

The more I think about my response on page 1: "It is a component, but paying a lot of $ for the right to hunt where there are great deer doesn't guarantee success. You still need knowledge, competency with your rifle, commitment of time, etc.........
All about money, no. Partly about $, yes.", the more I believe it.

I do believe the more $ you spend, the better the odds for someone that is willing to do what I mention. I have a Polaris Ranger, couldn't hunt my place without it and it wasn't cheap. It costs $150.00 in fuel every trip there and back home. I'm talking to a few guys now that are candidates for my lease. I had one tell me that the investment in a vehicle, lodging if he wanted it and a stand was too much $. I lease hunted 50 years and at one time was paying $900.00 a year to share 1,000 acres with 7 others. All I could afford at the time long ago. I pay 6x that now and it's worth every dollar to have 16,000 acres shared by 8 of us. 1/2 of us killed good deer this year. We all worked very hard to do it.

txtrophy85,
Here's my thoughts on it.

Hunting- If I'm hunting for something let's say deer. I'd like to at least see what I'm hunting. And eventually harvesting one is part of it, otherwise you're just watching

Success- There's a range involved to Success for me. It starts with just being able to go hunting. It's better if I saw whatever I was after. And even better if I actually harvested what I was after.

Money- I can get a license, public land permit, safety vest, break barrel 12 gauge with some slugs and hunt the LBJ grasslands this year starting at around $500. I could just pick a place on a map and show up opening morning and hunt. I can increase my odds for success by going on scouting trips before season starts. Putting out a few cameras would help. Maybe a bolt action rifle? Scope? All cost money. Then you show up to hunt public and like so many cases there's already 4 trucks in the parking area at 4am. This lessens the success factor. LBJ has antler restrictions, and limited if any doe harvest. I can shoot two does on a private land day hunt for $500. Next thing you know I'm looking for a $3000 a year Deer Lease. My spot on the lease is better with a corn feeder and I can hunt longer and more comfortably in a blind. It goes on and on point is I'm seeing more deer now and harvesting more. The enjoyment of the experience is higher- more successful imo.

DQ, I agree with this

Would you give up hunting from 5-50 years old, to be a multimillionaire that just stated hunting at 50?

Poll each of those that have responded and ask if they currently pay a lease fee, have paid an outfitter within the last 3 years, paid a trophy fee based on score, bought their own land, inherited their own land or are currently looking for a lease that they will pay to be a part of. I think the point will be obvious and that is, $ isn't all that is required to be successful, but it does make it easier. Most of us, if not all that have responded will fit into one of the categories I mentioned.

I'm 50 and no I wouldn't. I've met some awesome people and had some great times hunting over the years.
Now if the question was at 50 would I give up hunting for the rest of my life to be a multimillionaire I would have to think really hard on it. I just don't have the same drive I did when I was younger. I somewhat feel I've accomplished almost everything I set out to.

I fit in 2. I do own some property but not for hunting and I'd like to find a local spot to hunt does on. The only time in my entire life that I have paid for a guide was when it was required by law. If you want to hunt Canada and Africa (and I did) then you are going to be required to pay for a guide in Canada and a PH in Africa. That is part of the game if you want to hunt there. Hell I even hunted bighorn sheep and mountain goat without a guide and I took both of them on solo backpacking hunts. It can be done if you are willing to make the effort to do it.

Far enough, I wouldnt take neither. But at same stand point I wouldn’t be a full time guide. I have friends that are guides so that they literally can hunt 300 plus a year. Now I would guide a few very specific hunts just because I want that specific adventure, and could careless about the being behind the trigger

In the past 5 years I’ve bought hunting property, paid for a lease, and bought outfitted hunts. In one instance it was a pay by the inch place.

I like to hunt and one of the arrows in the quiver is money. I will pay for access or to hunt a place I can’t get to via a more traditional avenue like drawing a tag ( hunting Canada or Argentina for instance). When I shot my mule deer I could have drawn a tag but it might take years, so I bought an outfitter tag so I could hunt the unit that year.

I still put in for tags for DIY hunts.

Money will factor in at some point regardless if you wanna break it down step by step. But is it required to be successful? No. Is it required to kill trophy animals? Not really, if you are putting in for hunts aside from basic license and travel costs. If you want to hunt where you can consistently kill trophy animals year in and year out without going thru a draw process or hunt other countries, then yes, it’s gonna be a factor.

I want to know what the OP is really trying to figure out or what he’s getting at?

Everything better than the next in life costs money….better food costs more, better vehicles cost more, better guns cost more, better clothes, etc.

Even fishing is the same way. I could go out in my John boat on the local lake with an Zebco 33 and it’s possible to catch a 10lb bass. I could also hitch up the bass boat with the lockers filled with shimano bait casters, trolling motor and live scope and head to Fork or Falcon and catch one. Does it up my odds? Yes it does. But it doesent mean there isn’t an alternative

Most of us started the john boat and zebco route and graduated up as we were able.

85..pretty well hit it, but you and bobo have to admit you’re not the norm. It is so hard to see/recognize because wealth is not something a person like to brag about. Many of us are blessed; but we’re not the norm. Going to Africa and shooting 15 animals, over 25 times , having an elephant, giraffe, zebra mount cost money. How they got the “money” makes little difference. You got it. The guy that takes off and gets all he posted is not the average; he’s a one in a bunch. But, overall you’re right.

I will repeat once again - we are ALL a result of our own decisions - if your decisions led you to living a financially successful life then good for you - if your decisions led you to have to be frugal then it is what it is - outside of inheriting $$ we are all a result of our own decisions period

And what a person chooses to do with whatever money they have then that is totally their decision and choice and should not have people attempting to shame them for how they choose to spend their money

Hunting NA is one of the few things that while money helps, but it isn’t a must. One just has to have a focus that prioritizes it. There are more than a few on this forum that can prove it.

I will admit, I am envious of a few Gov tag buyers, specially the ones you get a whole year to hunt for the one animal.

The NM RMBHS auction last year, I was very jealous. But not because of what he killed. It was because more importantly he got to hunt ALL year with no unit limits. ALL year ALL units

If I ever draw the raffle tag, it’s on, I will have the opportunity to literally work through 100’s of animals to find the one. I may not have any friends left from burning them out helping though.

For a 3rd, maybe 4th time, hunting success is not all $$$ driven, providing more/better kill opportunities on average, by having $$$$$, 100%, yes. Especially relating to private land hunting. I didn't personally feel offended or threatened by poster's comments, just don't agree with its entirety but some derivative of it. Lots of thin skinned folks on THF if overly offended by it, IMO.

Pretty sure Colt is emblematic of the incorrectness of the initial post in this thread.

I didn't read all of the comments on this thread but I'd assume the OP meant shooting record book animals is all about money. To that I'd say yes and no. Chuck Adams has shot a ton of record book animals (some are world records) and many if not most of them were shot on public land. However, he can also afford to spend most if not all of the season out there hunting whereas we Po Folk have limited vacation days to use. And of course, even with all of that free time, I know it takes a lot of skill to consistently put the animals on the ground that he does.

I grew up a hunter but actual hunting opportunities were sporadic. Dad loved to hunt but was mainly a bird hunter and his deer hunting was done on friends places or invites to a lease. Stepdad would hunt but he wasn’t really motivated or willing to go out of his way to learn or secure a spot, both places we eventually got on were offered to him, he didn’t hunt them down. He refused to go to the National Forest which was about 45 min from our house. Our lease was typical of East Texas at the time…4 or 5 guys hunting about 100 acres staying in an old construction trailer. We moved and I didn’t hunt much saved for one or two weekends a year for a few years. What hunting I did do was on public land for birds around San Antonio or New Braunfels.

Things worked in my favor and I got access to family property after the lease hunting was restructured but I was only allowed to shoot does and culls. I didn’t shoot a decent deer until I was 25. I had no knowledge of public hunting in western states and had I known, there is a high likelihood I would have traded some time in south Texas for western hunting. I didn’t become aware of that until I was almost 30 years old. At the time, as far as I understood it, going to another state to hunt was like preparing to go to the moon. First trip I took cost me about $1000…$650 for the tag then a split food and fuel.

I’m now fortunate to have some discretionary income ( they say the Lord gives you the desires of your heart, and man he sure did in my case) but it’s also my only passion so I am willing to take steps that a lot of folks are not willing to take. For what most of my western hunts cost, it’s cheaper than a decent deer lease here in Texas. The opportunity is out there for most any income, you just gotta be willing to grab it. We have a lot of public land in the eastern part of the state as well.

You look into the guys that can “afford” to hunt all the time and it’s because they are not married, don’t have children and live on shoestring budgets to be able to have the time and money to hunt like they do.

There is a definite sacrifice on their end, it’s not all play and no sacrifice.

Chuck Adams is not a rich guy. He has parlayed his talent into some awesome opportunities but it’s not due to his business success

Many business men barely have time to take a long lunch break

Yelp “priorities”

A very hard core poacher that was caught on our ranch drove a Honda Accord that he slept in and lived with his parents when not sleeping in his car. He didn't mind hiking miles at night, hunted during the day, hiked out at night. Pretty bare bones operation that a legal hunter could learn from. You see this guy going down the road and you'd think he was a video gamer/stoner. Everything he needed to hunt with was in a backpack in the trunk. Lesson is, we have a lot of "stuff" that isn't absolutely necessary that we spend a ton of coin on.

Eat`n Ain`t Cheap.

There is a show called “The hunting public” where these young 20 something guys go all over the Midwest hunting public land. They have killed some nice bucks and they are traveling around in beater cars, with minimal terminal gear and usually off the shelf bass pro package bows. Really doing it bare bones. Funny to see them ratchet strap a buck to the hood of a Kia sedan.

Great example of how you can hunt successfully with basic ( for today’s time ) equipment.

Of course, I don’t believe they had jobs and/or girlfriends and dang sure no kids, but you get the point.

Killed some great bulls also, keep hope one will draw a sheep tag. They put out a great product

Calf rope boys! I've been "shown different" I'm a big fan of The Hunting Public and Randy Newbergs shows.

Yessir, great channel. I've been watching them since their early days.

I haven't watched a "Hunting" show since I don't know when until I stumbled onto these guys. It's real, and real good. I remember how excited one of them was when he got a truck, kind of a bone stock F-150. Big step up from the small sedan he had been driving. They're humble, hard hunters.

I think of all the western ones they have produced only one of the elk hunts was a LE/high pp tag, and they where very upfront about it. Rest are all easy draw or OTC. Great content. Kind of like Born and Raised use to be back in the early days, when BRO were still loggers and hunting when ever they could. Hopefully THP stays true although I do hope the make some coin.

South African perspective:

We have relatively few public land opportunities and those that we have are not much cheaper than private land opportunities.

We have plenty of private land opportunities for various species at a broad range of prices.

Many South Africans can no longer afford to hunt on commercial farms due to the cost. Money certainly provides more opportunities to hunt to those that have disposable income and are willing to spend it on hunting. Same for most things you would buy with disposable income.

If a successful hunt is measured against how much venison you go home with or how many animals you shoot or how long the horns are then, again, money can buy that.

If a successful hunt is measured against the overall experience rather than the quantity of game or the length of the tape then money is only important to the extent that there will still be costs that need to be covered. But the mindset is that an animal or two/three/four is a great bonus in addition to various other factors such as the sunsets, the sunrises, the campfires, the solitude, the vistas, the beauty of the landscape, the sounds, the smells, the exhilaration of the stalks, the close calls, the humility of being outplayed by the quarry, etc etc. My own opinion is that the most successful and memorable hunts I have had were those where I worked the hardest and had great experiences and not necessarily those where I spent the most money.

Does money buy opportunity - yes. Is hunting all about money - no.

It all depends.

I own my own 133 acre place. Had it for over 40 years and I bought it dirt cheap even back then. Heavily wooded with deer tracks everywhere. According to cams, I’m butt in deer.

Kids bow hunted early season and killed a couple of whoppers.

Then regular rifle season came and the old guy saw one lousy doe in about a dozen hunts.

Either bad luck or clean living doesn’t pay off.

Much prefer the lease experience. Go any time I want. Hunt, fish, shoot, ride, chill, observe, tinker, etc. Better than a paid hunt & you're done.

could be a simple thing as a change in pattern.
Different time of season, food source.
Around here & in archery season starts earlier,
Once guns start going off, animals will change thar habits,
Go nocturnal, a lot more cautious.

In Texas…..money equals access.

Without access…..you cannot be successful.

I agree. Been on many guided and self guided hunts over the years but still prefer the lease. It is a year round place to go along with making great friendships.

I think most people (myself included) prefer the lease/ownership aspect of hunting when available.


But, its not possible for every species or area. I want to kill a Bear, I either have to draw a tag or pay for a hunt. Want to kill a Zebra or Kudu, got to pay for the hunt. Same goes for many other species.


Package-type outfitted Whitetail/Exotic hunts in Texas work well for people with limited time due to family/work constraints. I know alot of guys who pay for season leases that only get to come down 1 or 2 weekends a year. In that case they would be money ahead going on a 4 day package hunt.

I like doing it all, everything that will affect the outcome. I like fully owning the results. I'm scouting now, working on equipment now, looking at neighboring agricultural fields, shooting my rifles from my stand at steel targets all the way out to 500 yards...........hunt hogs and varmints all year long.

You know multiple 170 plus deer get killed on TX public every year right?

If get that, When I’m with my kids I prefer the lease, although this year my oldest daughter has a high probability of hunting something out west with me(pronghorn, elk, mule deer, aoudad, oryx.) if she doesn’t draw any then we are hunting bears for sure, on top of whitetails.

I prefer DIY , but no issue using semi-guided or guided to increase tag draw odds. With that said out off 80 plus days out west in last three year I think 10 have been guided and 4 semi guided. Not counting days I helped others. Whitetails I actually prefer close to home public.

You do know that 93% of Texas is privately owned….right?

That means private land….equals the most potential for success(depending on your definition)

So $$$$ means access which means success.

I can guarantee you if I had the spare change to afford a $20,000/yr lease that my “success” would increase slightly

You know there’s over a 1,000,000 acres of hunt able public land not counting tidal flats…

Options are just that options….. dependency on something is a choice.

That leaves about 170.9 million acres that are not public hunting lands.

But maybe blind stupidity of reality is not a choice.

Not sure on “many” true 170” …B&C deer being taken in Texas every year. Especially if you limit to a submitted deer from Public Land. At least I don’t see bunches/large numbers being submitted. I may be looking in the wrong place. Now if a person wants to shoot a 200+ in a high fence(which cannot be in B&C) we know we can load his truck up. $$

That leaves about 170.9 million acres that are not public hunting lands.

But maybe blind stupidity of reality is not a choice.[/

You spent some good money. What did it get you?

You got more excuses than a child.

Why do you even hunt then?

I never indicated that I was not successful. I do spend money on my lease but I am not stupid enough to think being able to spend money does not increase my odds of success.

You might want to loosen the shoe strings on your New Balance shoes. Might free up some blood for the few brain cells that remain.

I know of 10 170 gross in last 10 year taken within 45 miles of my house. You don’t submit public land deer or post them or your blow areas and draw odds up. There are tons of animals that don’t get entered into book for lots of reasons.

Hell a forum member and I chased same 180 NT for two months before we found out he was dead. I had him at 50 yards open weekend, and never got a clear shot. Lucky hunter that got him , killed a couple really good deer out of there.

Im about to get 3 texts and 2 pm to shut up so I will, but the opportunity is there, for those that choose to create it.

You are the only guy that I have ever seen run his mouth mocking guys about $$$ hunts and success rates only to cry when you booked a guided hunt for the thought of a guaranteed hunt, and when you only saw cow elk and no bulls you went ballistic. Apparently money equals success until it doesnt.

Stop being discouraging because you have excuses. Money creates opportunity, sure, just as it can buy reliable transportation but it’s not the end all be all, as all types of transportation. Some things take efforts. Lots of big animals get killed on public land by those putting in the effort. Not have money for lease is not a good excuse not to hunt with 1 million plus acres of land

not sure why you even started this thread? Hunting is no different than anything else in life - if you are blessed to make a good living then you will be able to spend your money on some things that others cannot afford - some folks can afford to buy an expensive car or home and some cannot - it is the way of the world - but to insinuate that the only way to get to take a nice deer or other animal depends on your wealth is really a silly debate - there are many people out there who started with nothing but made good decisions and busted their butts to get to be able to afford things - to make the assumption that they are not good hunters is ridiculous -

I am 71 years old - I have done many self guided hunts on public land in many states and have been very successful - had nothing to do with money. I have also been blessed to be able to hunt on some good leases because I could afford it - so your effort to make hunters feel bad about being on a good lease is again ........... silly

I looked and don’t see those numbers in their records? I don’t know many hunters, that would be hunting Public Land, and get a chance of a lifetime, that shoot a 170” Typical, that would not present it to be in the Book. Sounds to me like the guys who bench 400 in high school. But, maybe there’s thousands of them on public land. This forum has many numbers; I wonder how many have killed a 170 B&C on public land?

And that’s exactly why there will always be guys like you and red.

If it’s not posted or in a book it doesn’t exist

Oh and I know 2 that broke 400 in high school and 5 that broke 500 in college, I played with 4/5 in college, of the 5, 2 went to NFL, and one’s a NFL strength coach now….

For maybe the 4th or 5th time, more $$$$$ on private land usually provides more opportunity and chance at bigger, higher scoring animals; doesn't guarantee success but provides greater chance at successes on private land, without a shadow of a doubt.

Exactly!!!!!

No ifs ands or buts about it…..the reason leases and hunts cost more than others is for an increased chance of success.

I did a google search and found that in 2024 63,316 public lands permits were sold. At $48 each plus $25 for a hunting license it comes to $4,622,068. I'm not sure how much is made on draw hunts but I'm sure it's up there. There's no way to get a good estimate on what is harvested every year but I'm starting to think TPWD is making pretty good money for what they are providing.