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Re: Deer vitals-within a circle
[Re: freerange]
#9150064
12/07/24 08:09 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,491
Texas buckeye
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,491 |
Free, for pure broadside shots, the bottom yellow dots will not consistently kill a deer quickly and with a trail good enough to trail and put a second shot into. Move the dots to the left on your pic about 3 inches and you are hitting structures that will make it so a deer is much more likely to die, give a decent trail, and die quickly. I am not good with circles on pics, but in my opinion, your circle is too far forward and the dots border on a really bad shot to being a really bad shot (the lower ones).
Can anyone get lucky and have a bad shot end up lethal, absolutely. But i know most of us (i know you don’t) want to play that game.
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Re: Deer vitals-within a circle
[Re: freerange]
#9150103
12/07/24 09:46 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,177
ChrisB
Veteran Tracker
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Veteran Tracker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,177 |
Your top two yellow dots probably hit spine. The rest hit nothing.
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Re: Deer vitals-within a circle
[Re: freerange]
#9150105
12/07/24 09:49 PM
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 16,957
603Country
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 16,957 |
My normal target area is pretty much Smokey Bear’s green circle. As someone mentioned, quartering shots require an adjusted aim.
Not my monkeys, not my circus...
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Re: Deer vitals-within a circle
[Re: freerange]
#9150126
12/07/24 10:39 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 62,713
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
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kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 62,713 |
There are lots of way different anatomy charts out there so a bunch have to be inaccurate. Some obviously are. I’ve studied this a lot( that’s my normal) and the one I’ve found to be best is by Ryan Kirby. He’s an artist and bow hunter and y’all should look up his stuff. He’s starting to do short videos. Along the same lines of this whole thread about identifying vitals, tell me if you think his drawing is accurate. Feel free to draw a circle on it where all shots would be kill shots. Depicts a Beautiful oval 😇 Does the circle change with bullet type
Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, b/c they know not victory nor defeat"- #26 TR
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Re: Deer vitals-within a circle
[Re: Smokey Bear]
#9150219
12/08/24 12:53 AM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,491
Texas buckeye
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,491 |
Here you go Free. Vitals are bigger than this but not round. If you want a circle with a hold point with equidistant margin for error on all sides, hold on the pink dot. Put it in the crease at the back of the shoulder about 1/3 of the way up. If I’m making what I consider a long shot, this is where I go. There is an area between the lungs and the high shoulder shot that is void of vitals. Edit to add: on a mature buck that circle is almost the size of a paper plate. Agree with everything on here except the void area comment. The high shoulder shot is a lung and spine shot that shocks the nervous system due to the proximity to the spinal column. There is no void between this shot and a good double lung shot. There literally is nothing in that space to create a void, its either lungs or spinal column. I think where the idea of a void area comes from is the higher shoulder shot, above the spinal column and how that can be confused with the high shoulder shot. The good high shoulder shot is still more than a quarter to a third down into the body. A hit there will get spine and drop a deer. But, if you hit above that, then you are hitting backstrap and you may get lucky and have a spinous process twist and paralyze a deer, but a pure backstrap shot is not lethal. People hitting here will say they hit high shoulder, saying it went between the spine and the lung in the mythical void area, but really it hit above the spine above everything vital. Just my opinion based on anatomy, and don’t want to derail this thread off topic.
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Re: Deer vitals-within a circle
[Re: Texas buckeye]
#9150437
12/08/24 04:00 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 62,713
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
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kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 62,713 |
Here you go Free. Vitals are bigger than this but not round. If you want a circle with a hold point with equidistant margin for error on all sides, hold on the pink dot. Put it in the crease at the back of the shoulder about 1/3 of the way up. If I’m making what I consider a long shot, this is where I go. There is an area between the lungs and the high shoulder shot that is void of vitals. Edit to add: on a mature buck that circle is almost the size of a paper plate. Agree with everything on here except the void area comment. The high shoulder shot is a lung and spine shot that shocks the nervous system due to the proximity to the spinal column. There is no void between this shot and a good double lung shot. There literally is nothing in that space to create a void, its either lungs or spinal column. I think where the idea of a void area comes from is the higher shoulder shot, above the spinal column and how that can be confused with the high shoulder shot. The good high shoulder shot is still more than a quarter to a third down into the body. A hit there will get spine and drop a deer. But, if you hit above that, then you are hitting backstrap and you may get lucky and have a spinous process twist and paralyze a deer, but a pure backstrap shot is not lethal. People hitting here will say they hit high shoulder, saying it went between the spine and the lung in the mythical void area, but really it hit above the spine above everything vital. Just my opinion based on anatomy, and don’t want to derail this thread off topic. There is a void under spine but it’s not meaning full behind shoulder bone, the meaning full one is past(left, and clear) of the shoulder bone. It’s more of an arrow issue then typically a bullet wound channel This is why recommend bullets with a bigger wound channel. Increase the cone of damage increase the circle size. With that said I can only think of two animal in last 10 years I didn’t kill with some variation of HSS.
Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, b/c they know not victory nor defeat"- #26 TR
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Re: Deer vitals-within a circle
[Re: freerange]
#9150445
12/08/24 04:36 PM
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 9,698
freerange
OP
THF Trophy Hunter
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OP
THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 9,698 |
I’m working on a new thread. Similar but a little different from this one. I’m changing my circle some and changing my explanation some. Stay tuned.
At some point in life its time to quit chasing the pot of gold and just enjoy the rainbow. FR Keep your gratitude higher than your expectations. RWH
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Re: Deer vitals-within a circle
[Re: freerange]
#9150452
12/08/24 05:05 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 62,713
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
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kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 62,713 |
I’m working on a new thread. Similar but a little different from this one. I’m changing my circle some and changing my explanation some. Stay tuned. You need to tag out first
Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, b/c they know not victory nor defeat"- #26 TR
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Re: Deer vitals-within a circle
[Re: BOBO the Clown]
#9150601
12/08/24 11:16 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,491
Texas buckeye
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 11,491 |
Here you go Free. Vitals are bigger than this but not round. If you want a circle with a hold point with equidistant margin for error on all sides, hold on the pink dot. Put it in the crease at the back of the shoulder about 1/3 of the way up. If I’m making what I consider a long shot, this is where I go. There is an area between the lungs and the high shoulder shot that is void of vitals. Edit to add: on a mature buck that circle is almost the size of a paper plate. Agree with everything on here except the void area comment. The high shoulder shot is a lung and spine shot that shocks the nervous system due to the proximity to the spinal column. There is no void between this shot and a good double lung shot. There literally is nothing in that space to create a void, its either lungs or spinal column. I think where the idea of a void area comes from is the higher shoulder shot, above the spinal column and how that can be confused with the high shoulder shot. The good high shoulder shot is still more than a quarter to a third down into the body. A hit there will get spine and drop a deer. But, if you hit above that, then you are hitting backstrap and you may get lucky and have a spinous process twist and paralyze a deer, but a pure backstrap shot is not lethal. People hitting here will say they hit high shoulder, saying it went between the spine and the lung in the mythical void area, but really it hit above the spine above everything vital. Just my opinion based on anatomy, and don’t want to derail this thread off topic. There is a void under spine but it’s not meaning full behind shoulder bone, the meaning full one is past(left, and clear) of the shoulder bone. It’s more of an arrow issue then typically a bullet wound channel This is why recommend bullets with a bigger wound channel. Increase the cone of damage increase the circle size. With that said I can only think of two animal in last 10 years I didn’t kill with some variation of HSS. BOBO, i am not catching what you are throwing here…care to give a better explanation? Only doing this since Free checked out of this one and we can go off topic more.
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