This is the first year im hunting with the VPA Omega 150 gr with bleeders and we are off to a great start smoked a red stag at 45yrds on a slight quarter. My total setup is right at 600gr and I was alittle disappointed that I did not get a pass through on the bull until I pull the hide off and now could not be happier.The broadhead punched through the center of a rib on the entrance and squared up through a rib and the shoulder blade on the exit. The broadhead was was buried in the dirt still few inches of shaft inside the shoulder. The single bevel preformed exactly as I hoped broke bone on both ends and it is still shaving sharp. I pulled the head off washed it well and tried to have my hunting buddies pick it out of my other 6 head and no one could tell which one had been through an animal. The broadheads are easy to tune and built like a tank. The only real downside I can mention is the cost at $100 per 3 count I will be certain not to send to many Hail Mary shots with them but otherwise I HIGHLY recommend.












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Nice write up. I am going with a heavier arrow and a single bevel set up this year. Looking forward to seeing what the performance is over the light arrow and mechanical I was using. I hope it is as good as yours.

Please don't drink the heavy arrow/single bevel ranch fairy kool aid.

I will say that the RF has influenced the decision. Started down the rabbit hole this spring and have ditched my previous set up. All I can say at this point is that I am shooting great and I look forward to seeing what the results are. For background I have been attempting to Bow hunt for several years and I have a few kills and a few never founds. None of the kills have been pretty which is my fault due to shot placement, but on the deer I have shot and not found penetration was part of the problem. Not sure if I have the answer yet but I have learned about my bow and how to test things better than I did before, so if I need to change course I can.

What are you main complaints with a heavier setup and single bevel?
Everyone has their opinion and experiences that formed it so I dont intend this as an attack I am just genuinely curious your reason. I am by no means a fan of RF or what he preaches which I have not looked into him much beyond a brief trip down a rabbit hole today.
I have hunted and killed with both a lite fast setup with 100 gr mech and now with the heavy single and honestly I will never go back. I used to believe that flat trajectory and speed is what mattered more and anything. I used to practice out to 100 yrds because just in case but having seen way too many animals stuck in the mountains at longer distances and never recovered I will never take a shot past 60 again because if I cant close that gap it is not meant to be. The other factor is the margin for error with lite arrow builds is much smaller. I used to dread hitting the shoulder blade or leg bone and have lost animals to a mistimed step because I hit a leg. With the 600gr build on any midsized animal I have no fear to punch through those bones and for elk/stag/nilgai sized animals at least I have a fighting chance to punch through to the other side. When hunting with a rifle I use heavy rounds and handload so that I have the greatest chance to boom flop the animal possible for the very reason I changed my arrow setup this year. I want the greatest chance to be successful in a suboptimal shot situation.

The issue I have with it is they have sold it as a heavy/single bevel set up as an infallible set up.

I am in favor of a medium weight set up, depending on your draw lengths. For truly big game ( Buffalo, etc,) it makes sense. But for anything else you’re giving up trajectory and speed that you may want.

My set up is 433 grain arrow with a 100,grin reaper @ 290 fps and I’ve had no issues killing animals. I do not get the blood trails or internal damage from a single bevel like I do a mechanical. A single bevel may get thru a shoulder (sometimes, sometimes they don’t) but if your shot is further back, you may have a long track job or an unrecoverable animal.

For whitetail I prefer a mechanical bar none.

I’ve shot pigs, exotics, red stag, pronghorn, bear and 250 lb whitetail with my set up and had no issues.

I killed a buffalo with it a few years ago and used a 100 grain single bevel but did not change arrow weight and got two complete pass thrus.

If you listen to the ranch fairy, he would have said these arrows would have bounced off

couple questions....

What was your previous set up? Arrow Weight, Broadhead and Arrow Speed? On the issues where penetration was an issue, where did the Arrows hit?

I appreciate the response. I hunted with almost that exact setup for most of my childhood/teenage years and had good success with it. I have also had a few failures that caused me to rethink my approach; hence the change this year. I switched last year to a 125 gr montec with a heavier FMJ for total setup weight of roughly 500 gr and had good result as far as penetration and lethality on whitetail and hogs from known close distances. My main complaint was when trying to hunt nilgai and oryx I had some lack luster penetration and broadhead failures. I generally try for one setup that can be effective (not perfect) for anything from pronghorn to nilgai. Which is in itself maybe an impossible task. Having watched a few more of the RF videos since my last post I can say with confidence I am no fan of him and think he has many flaws in his logic. My setup was gear more toward a light heavyweight setup. The difference in drop for my 40 yrd pin between 600 and 500gr setup was minimal enough that I felt the increase to weight was justified if the penetration was increased proportionally. Based on a sample size of one stag (haha) I think the setup shows promise. I have not had the opportunity to crono my new setup yet so can say for certain what was lost from a velocity stand point. I hope that my initial review and all of this thread was not take by you or anyone as an change to my setup no matter what or how you are hunting. In my specific case this worked well for me and the broadhead did exactly what I asked it to do and more. I love talking through peoples thought process or experiences on stuff like this because i believe it makes me a better hunter than just listening to an echo chamber or blindly following some youtube personality because they said anything under 1000 gr is hunting with a spit ball or using a 275gr going 500fps is the only way to hunt. I think the single greatest hunter I know has killed most of the Orvis slam and all of the North American slam has used a 25-06 ack improved to kill the vast majority of those animals all around the world. The first time he told me that I assumed he was either lying or exaggerating till I watched him one tap a bull tule elk at 375 yrds with said 25-06.

You mean this guy doesn't instill confidence in you ?

I would love to see the difference in penetration between a modern compound say 65 pounds or so 28” with a 650 grain 11 factor arrow compared to my 80 pound speed bow at 30” with my 480 grain arrow and single bevel slick trick.

I don’t know about heavy bone but my bow will sling a 454 grain arrow tipped with the 100 grain Exodus right through a brand new bone collector target “crossbow rated 350 fps”. Unless i shatter that arrow on the humerus it is going straight through a deer, period. And maybe even still.

Another issue I have, to shoot 650 grain from MY bow, I pretty much have to step up to a 150 spine shaft to tune out with my setup. Then I still gotta load it up to maybe 800 grains, now I might as well shoot a 60 pound bow and 650 grain arrow for the same trajectory.

Maybe if I have enough fletching and enough distance to the target, a lighter spine loaded up might still straighten out by the time it gets there, but then I give up accuracy.

I’d rather shoot my bow. But it was a good review and that does look like a good head. If it comes in deepsix i could still probably shoot it without going up another spine.

instills the concept that you should not drink when pregnant haha

I would love to know side my side as well i may shoot my old 500 gr montecs build and my new 600 gr vpa build side by side into the target this weekend and measure difference in penetration into the block at 40 yrds. the hardest thing about measuring the broadhead effects for me is that so few shots are identical for angle, distance and what is hit on the body (rib,legs,etc) it makes it really hard to get a real world side by side. I need to head pop does and hogs with the rifle and test some arrows builds side by side. Otherwise it becomes anecdotal and it hard to use anything as hard facts.

The thing about the heavy arrow argument is that it won’t - not work. But there is trade offs in everything. In archery it’s speed/trajectory. On a moose speed doesent really matter but on something like a whitetail or pronghorn you have to consider it. Another thing I haven’t seen is a heavy arrow/mechanical combo. Everyone is touting single bevel heads now but that’s not a new design. I’m a fan of a three blade anything over a two blade. And if your arrow is going 4’ past the deer it’s just wasted energy, so the penetration argument is null.

I had no issue shooting thru deer with a 390 grain arrow going 275 fps but I like a little heavier set up.

I think the Exodus head will smash through anything

I would be very curious on the heavy mech setup as well. I assume you would have to use a heavy half out/collar to get the weight up front. Reapers were the only mech i tried and liked in the past. I wonder how they would hold up to the addition weight behind them? What do you think the tipping point for fps is where you are handicapped or hurting your chances at a clean hit? Makes me wonder just how much velocity is actually lost between at the bow and at hunting ranges. It may be worth trying to set the garmin up at 40 yrds just to see what the difference between my 2 setups are.

I have always used 3 blades as well because it just made sense to have a greater chance to cut something that mattered. The 2 blade with bleeder seemed like a decent design to try.

That big grim reaper whitetail special, I think those blades would bend and flex quite a bit and the ferrule would just smash right through. It’s a good head and the blades are set at a good angle when it opens up. I shot about a 6 month old fawn with one last year and it sliced the edge of the scapula right off.

But this year I am shooting Exodus, Slick Trick SB, and the old NAP Killzone. That killzone is a very forgiving and accurate long range head and it does not come open in flight. It does not get a fair shake in reviews. I might still put a Grim Reaper in there. I have so many different freaking heads, I guess I should stop buying heads until I tear em all up.

I started bow hunting when my buddy sold me his used bow when we shared a lease. I took it to the shop, had it tuned, and then bought the arrows they recommended. my buddy shot a rage 2 blade mechanical so that is what I used. it was not optimal for my draw length, and it was a RH bow that I had to shoot LH due to my right eye is not good. The arrow was a 400 spine but had no clue about weight, FOC, or anything. The bow was set up around 65-70 lbs. Hit 2 deer behind the crease at around 15-20 yards that the arrow went in about an inch or 2, drew blood, and was not able to recover after following specs of blood over 400 yds before it stopped. In 2021 i bought a new LH bow, set up for my specs from a reputable shop in Dallas. Bought new arrows that they recommended (400 spine) and put my mechanical on them. Shot a few deer including a doe that moved, and I shot her in the rear ham going forward and got decent penetration and severed the femoral artery. She died within 20 yds. Last year missed right on a buck and hit in the liver/guts and after reviewing my phone video, got about 6-8 inches of penetration. Waited 5 hours and after about 50 yards the blood petered out. For this one I should have got a dog to track. Lesson learned.

For this year I was determined to try to learn from my mistakes. Yes, I did find the RF videos and started reviewing them. I took my bow to a bow shop in Canton, got it tuned, and finally learned that I was shooting a 382 gr, 400 spine arrows. at 282 fps. This was the first time i knew these numbers. Went through the test process and I now have 250 spine arrows, and they are around 600 grains each. I am shooting them very well and side by side with the old arrows is night and day.

During this process I have learned a lot and now feel confident that I can tinker with the arrow setups and see what works. Before for whatever reason I just used what the shop suggested and went from there. Maybe I don't need the heavy arrow setup, and I can use a lighter 400-500 grain arrow but that is something I can tinker with in the future to see what will work.

The next few weeks should give me to opportunity to test them out and see!

I use a 52 grain half-out behind my mechanicals, so its really like shooting a 150 grain head. Reapers are a good design, I like WASP jackhammers as well. The 3 blade rages are ok, I've had some luck with them but the Reapers are my favorite.

Tipping point for velocity? If you have pins, anyone can hit a stationary target with any speed arrow as long as they are dialed. Its been my experience that Whitetail deer ( and we are gonna argue about this one with alot of folks ) cannot get out of the way of the arrow if they are alert at 20 yards past about 280 fps. I've shot deer at 20 yards with my bow at 284 fps that were fully alert looking at me and they can react, but can't move enough to cause the arrow to go awry. at 30 yards its a different story. I like my bows to be in the mid 280 fps range and up. If you hunt out west and tend to have to take longer shots, then a slower bow comes becomes a factor. My old bow shooting 270 fps is night and day different than my new bow shooting 284fps at 60 or 70 yards.

interesting.

One thing to note, an underspined arrow flexes more than a stiffer one, which can reduce penetration. But no reason you shouldn't have gotten a full passthru on a gun shot deer, even at that arrow weight. I shot 390 grains @270ish fps for a few seasons and blew thru every deer I shot, even a pronghorn at 82 yards with a big 2" 3 blade rocket sidewinder mechanical. Didn't mention your draw length but 400 spine sounds about right.

The sweet spot imo for most NA game is 450ish grains give or take 20 unless you just have a long draw and by default will have a heavier arrow.

Your set up isn't "wrong" and will certainly kill game, and the broadhead design is more important than the arrow weight at that point. Your just giving up speed for penetration that you probably won't need. I would guess with 600 grain arrows your probably shooting 250ish fps. Chrono graphing the rig would help.


My issue with RF is multifaceted: First, he is one of those guys that thinks he is the smartest guy in the room and has figured it all out himself and everyone else is wrong. You can tell this in 30 seconds by listening to him, but what has he really killed? Not much except a bunch of hogs. I'll compare trophy rooms with him any day. He has however, been able to convince many inexperienced archers and those truly looking for help that his way is the only way and everyone else is stupid.

He is trying to sell a product; arrows and broadheads. His "use adult arrows" is the stupidest thing I've every heard. I ran a "child's arrow" straight thru an American buffalo....go kiss my arse with that bullshyte. If we were limited to slow bows like we had in the 80's and early 90's, sure, heavy makes sense. But at todays velocities you can have your cake and eat it too with a medium weight arrow.


If your shooting a single bevel, I would strongly suggest you go get some mechanicals or at least some 3 or 4 blade fixed heads like a Montec or Slick Trick. The single bevels just don't leave great blood trails oftentimes. Thats why designs have changed.....nothing new or cutting edge about a single bevel design. They twist slightly, but so does a standard fixed head with helical fletching.

Big African game....sure, shoot a heavy arrow with a single bevel. But for NA game here it can be counter productive

Appreciate the feedback. I can say I have learned more about my setup and all the different variables of archery this year then all of the other years put together. Like I said above, i don't know if this is the optimal setup or the sweet spot is somewhere in the middle, but I am confident that I can finally feel comfortable tinkering with arrows, points, etc. Good luck this afternoon/season. My season doesn't start till Wednesday morning. The wind is playing havoc with my stand locations.

just don't get too far off into the weeds on the search for answers.

The guys that kill the most animals hardly talk about their setups, broadheads, etc. The guys that nerd out on gear but are never really successful in the field are the ones that do that. Find a good "do-all" setup and once that is dialed in, leave it alone.

Right not heavy arrows and shovel spade broadheads are all the rage, and its hard to ignore it, but all one has to do is look at the tens of thousands of deer, elk and bear killed with run of the mill set up's to reassure you .

it is funny for my rifle i have shot the same load for 11 years and as long as I have the components I will never change. For archery i feel like I need to chase some mythic perfection that I will never find. It is strange to fight to build a arrow build that is flawless when the obvious weakest link in my archery game is myself haha

Same

Heavy arrows have their place. If you're shooting short to moderate distances on slower game then heavier arrows have benefits. On hogs, I've liked the heavier arrows as they conserve momentum through that tough hide. I used to be turned off on mechanicals. I got some less than stellar penetration on hogs. But the mechanicals, at least the better ones built now, appear to hold up better than what I was using even 15 years ago.

I don't hunt a heavy arrow in the Arizona desert. It's 492 grains which includes a a 100 grain broadhead. If I'm hunting bigger game at closer ranges, I'll go heavy. It is a tradeoff. Longer distances or flightier game, lighter arrows. Shorter distances or heavier game, heavier arrows.

For the record, and I don't ascribe to everything he says, RF said any setup will work on a well placed shot. But he does have a point on heavier setups and terminal ballistics. Those heavier arrows will conserve energy better inside the animal Sometimes you need it, sometimes you don't. If I'm shooting a desert mule deer at 60 yards, I need a lighter setup. The range estimation error becomes critical at that distance. A flatter arrow will perform better at longer distances...until you get to terminal ballistics. Then it will not perform as well. Depending on the game, that probably is a moot point. Most things we can kill with a lighter, well placed arrow. Having said that, I have moved to heavier setups. I'm not shooting 405 grain setups anymore. And if range estimation isn't a critical component, I'll go to low to mid 500s.

You can improve your trajectory two ways. Lighter arrows or faster bows.

One thing on which I do agree with him, your blades need to be as sharp as you can get them whether they are mechanical or fixed. I think, and in my case I know, that many of us buy mechanicals and don't check the blade sharpness. I know I didn't in the past. I will in the future.

Remember that Ashby tested using african game, mostly dangerous game, in order to prove to PHs that bow hunting dangerous game was feasible. I don't question his research. But it is not totally germain to hunting in the United States. Having said that, where feasible heavier setups will add a level of redundancy to a shot. IF the shot is a reasonable distance based on the bow setup and your draw weight and length. I'm not convinced that the speed difference using a heavy arrow on a moving deer at 20 yards is significant. I think that arrow will be within 2-3 inches of a faster arrow, which may be offset by trajectory depending on range estimation. I think at 40 yards it is a significant issue as well as the range estimation error.