What do you think? I personally have no use for them. From the times I have been around union folks, they were the ones who were the most unproductive guys in the station.

I believe the original idea was good. Employees were being treated pretty awful many years ago. Power can corrupt.

Illegal immigration is the best union buster ever invented, and the union leaders support it.

I've only had two, in-person interactions with any unions. One was a couple of IBEW office pukes that made some threats when they were on my property watching a non-union contractor train his linemen on our training field. I told them to leave, in language that I believe they were accustomed to hearing. They complied. 'Never heard another word from 'em. All they accomplished was reinforcing my opinions of unions. 'Saw a guy a few weeks ago in an IBEW tshirt. As usual, he looked pretty PWT. If that's what you're most proud of, there's something wrong with you.

Second was when a couple of young white boys that we'd just hired couldn't understand why they weren't getting raises and put ahead of Hispanic men that'd been with us for, some, 20+ years. They went and riled up the UAW and we had to have a vote. 'Only time in our company's history. My grandfather had already ingrained in us to just chain the doors and shut the business down if a union came in, and we were prepared to do so. We got a lawyer. We lined the main hallway with blown-up pictures of the Lone Star Brewery closed and chained locked when they unionized. (It is closed and pitiful to this day, even though the city has announced grand plans, 2 or 3 times in the past few decades. So far, nuthin'.) Thankfully, the men voted "No" by an overwhelming majority. A few months later the same two kids were caught stealing tools and I had the great pleasure of telling them to get the hell off the property.

There was a time and place for unions, IMO, and it was long ago. I don't think they do much for Joe Public today except cause us to pay a lot more for the same good or service we could get cheaper from a non-union (if that was an option).

Overall i support them. Always pros and cons. Here is a big issue why i support them. Lets say you hired in and for years you did your job very well. Now you want to move onto bigger and better training cause your bored with what you have been doing and need a challenge. The non union company doesnt want to lose you with what your doing cause you do it so well so they hire someone new with no experience to train for the more advanced job you are wanting. The way the company sees it why move you to a new position and have to train you in addition to having to train another new hire who needs to take your old job. So bypass the proven productive worker and keep him locked in. A union will say no its based on senority as long as the individual can pass the test.

This isnt some made up scenario it happens all the time

We moved people from hydraulic mechanic, to supervisor, to manager all the time. I've watched some mechanics actually move into sales and do very well. All of our branch managers were formerly mechanics. Now, I have had a couple of "Peter Principle" experiences with some folks, but we had some great successes too.

Let's see. As a kid, Dad's aquintence was car bombed, asked dad to take his place. Nope. I paid dues for a summer job, never looked back. One company was half union, locked out. Worked with lots of union peoples, they never were very good. Their bosses always want the Ds in.

The non union company side does the actual hiring. They are the ones who decide we need to hire more women, blacks, muslim and make the final decision not the union. If non qualiffied people join the union cause the company hired them it isnt the unions fault. The non union company also decides who gets fired not the union

Organized labor.
Organized crime.

The letters line up perfectly.

I have never seen a "Live better, work union" bumper sticker on anything other than a POS vehicle, that's literally, and figuratively blowing smoke.

Leaders from six of the largest labor unions in the U.S. were part of the group of speakers kicking off the Democratic National Convention.

My only experience with Unions was when I was in the grocery business. I worked for Winn Dixie who was not union. Safeway was big union and a major player back in the 70`s and 80`s until they closed all of their Texas stores. WD paid slightly lower than them and had similar benefits until Safeway left Texas. As soon as Safeway closed all locations, we lost time and half for working Sundays and holidays. Lost 2 or 3 personal days off with pay and no pay raises for 5-6 years. So, I guess you can say that I benefited from Safeway being union until they left. I think the Safeway employees lost their jobs due to the union contracts that forced Safeway to pay wages high enough that their stores weren`t profitable in a very competitive market.

And that’s ^^^^^^ everything you need to know about unions. I have no use for them like all democraps….

So you are for basing promotions on seniority, not ability?

They want the rubes that the major domos at the union office approve for promotion to get promoted. It's a racket in every sense of the word.

No i also said provided they pass the test

Well, they ain't gonna be no English grammar teacher.

That's where the free market works. The worker knows he is ready to move up his station in life so if he is passed over he beats feet to a new employer(he is not locked in). The original company gets to hire two new people and all three will get more at current market rates.

I suppose it is all relevant to what industry you are in,I am a union member and have been paying dues for 30+ years,I am sure that without the union I would not have made near as much money as I have with them,that being said,I would happily take my skills and work a non union job if it payed anywhere near what I make as a union member,but alas that will never happen.
I am in the airline industry and seniority and years of service are directly related to pay and days off and shift worked,with out the union the company could require me to work graves with week days off,and at a bid location of their choosing,with 29 plus years seniority I can pretty much work where I want when I want.
The down side is that a guy/girl who has the same seniority can get the same pay and benefits for doing 1/4 of the work with 1/2 or less of the job skills and training/certifations that I hold,it isn’t fair but I don’t hold any hard feelings toward those people.
I am very happy in my job and could retire at any time if I chose to,most of the guys on my crew are multi millionaires and still working because they enjoy it,I know I am in the minority of union workers in that we are “skilled labor” and are heavily regulated by the FAA ,but I don’t think I would work in the airline industry with out a union.
I have almost 30 years at my current employer and have seen good times and bad times with the union/company relationship,but our company was for the most part always ranked in the top 100 companies in the US to work for,and we are one of the most heavily union Airlines in the world .
BTW we are heavily conservative in our union and parted ways with the Teamsters 15 years ago because of a lot of their policies concerning who they supported with our dues.

What happens if you chose not to be a part of the union? Is it a requirement to get hired? I have never been a part of a union in my line of work but I wouldn't want my dues going to a group that support different political views than me. I think seniority would bother me too. I should be rewarded for my hard work, how well I do it, the investments I made and initiative I have shown to get licenses and certifications. Seniority does mean something but to me it's lower on the list.

College graduates despise unions when their skilled labor members make more than they do. Others despise them simply because they make more and get better benefits. The relationship between labor/unions and management is a pendulum that swings back and forth. One gets the upper hand on the other and the pendulum begins to swing back the other way. There are many industries where labor and management have worked successfully for decades. The paper industry is a good example. Can you ever remember not being able to wipe your butt because of a strike at a paper mill? I was able to pay for a lot of my college by working at a paper mill during the summer. Thirty years later I found myself being a "scab" and temporary replacement for skilled workers in the Telecommunications industry. I see the relationship between the two as nothing personal but how business is done.

The kind of people unions were meant to compensate for always have ended up running the sonsabitches from time immemorial.

Well said.

I have never been involved with a union and never will.
The few people I’ve known that are/been union workers, were underachievers, they would hit the beer joints after work, they were lazy, and thought someone owed them something.
Most of them that I knew cheated on their wives all the time, and would support democrats no matter what.
I could never understand how a union could brainwash people as conservative as I am.

This topic reminds me of a story I heard.

We were in Boston a couple of years ago and talked to a tour guide about the Big Dig Project there.
He said his son got a job driving a dump truck and on the first day, he hauled his first load and went back for a second when his Union boss stopped him and told him not to return for another load until the end of the day. He and his coworkers did this for years...they got part-time jobs to work between loads. The project was originally projected to last 7 years but ended up going 16 years. Cost overruns were 190% by the time it was completed. Not all of this was because of the unions but they did their part.