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Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. #8999556 02/04/24 03:17 AM
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What we gonna do about this. I love America and I prefer things made in USA. But modern scopes for modern guns, potentially for a casual competitor, what am I gonna do?

I have a few scopes and have bought and sold many, most were probably Chinese. Almost everything is Chinese or at least partly so. My preference is for quality goods either made in USA or imports made in the free world i.e. not China. Asian stuff is fine, I don’t need to tell ya’ll Japanese is awesome. Phillipines too perhaps on a tighter budget.

What we got out there in the similar, hopefully $300 to more like $600 budgetary constraints, as my ideal Elmer Fudd scope? Similarly priced but not a Fudd gun scope. I might like a high magnification Leupold EFR with a fine crosshair. A bit Fuddy. Might not be ideal for a .308 hunting rifle and maybe a competition of some sort once or twice a year.

The SWFA might be an option for me. Also U.S. Optics. At least we are keeping it under $1,000.

$1,000… that is almost a whole set of good tires on my pickup. Man that is hard to let go of. Making all these big plans here, reloading, custom rifle, scopes. Plus I obviously have a impulse control issue when find a gun I have only read and dreamed about, and i have enough spending money to take it home. Especially when I don’f have a .308.

Everybody should have a good .308. Even if it is the only rifle in the safe. Can you blame me for taking it home?

But all my big plans!

Help me get the right scope for the right price, without giving my spending money to enemies of the United States of America.

Last edited by Bryan C. Heimann; 02/04/24 03:18 AM.

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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999570 02/04/24 03:48 AM
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Burris XTR II 5-25 or Vortex PST II 5-25 both can be had for under $700.

Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999598 02/04/24 04:59 AM
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What 308 did you take home (or are planningto)? What are you going to hunt with it? And what kind of competitions are you going planning to shoot?

Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999602 02/04/24 05:15 AM
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I snatched up a Ruger American Gen II. It’s a good accurate gun. Not a competition rifle by any means but I plan to get my feet wet and why not? I am a 3x9 scope, set it and forget it kind of hunter but I kind of want to see what this gun will do. And I always wanted to do a shoot, i can tell ya’ll have a good time with it. Might even learn to dial and shoot and kill stuff a long ways off.

I would love love love to bust coyotes from as far out as I could hit them. And pigs too.

I am averse to heavy scopes, I really hate to put something on there heavier than 20 ounces or so. But i know it has to be a tradeoff.

I think that SWFA might be the deal.

Last edited by Bryan C. Heimann; 02/04/24 05:16 AM.

1 Thessalonians 4:11-14
Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999605 02/04/24 05:20 AM
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This kind of splits the difference. It does not say if the reticle sub tensions are correct at what magnification. So maybe this, or maybe the fixed 10x that Scott showed me

https://swfa.com/swfa-3-9x42-ss-hd-mil-quad-reticle-30mm-tube-1-mil-clicks-ffp/


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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999610 02/04/24 05:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Bryan C. Heimann
This kind of splits the difference. It does not say if the reticle sub tensions are correct at what magnification. So maybe this, or maybe the fixed 10x that Scott showed me

https://swfa.com/swfa-3-9x42-ss-hd-mil-quad-reticle-30mm-tube-1-mil-clicks-ffp/

That is a FFP scope, so the substentions will be accurate at any zoom. The 9x will hamstring you in any competition, but it's got everything else that you need. I'd use that as a hunting scope any day. The only gripe I have with SWFA is a lack of a zero stop.

If you can wait, watch the website every week. They tend to have a sale every other month.

Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: unclebubba] #8999615 02/04/24 05:34 AM
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Originally Posted by unclebubba
Originally Posted by Bryan C. Heimann
This kind of splits the difference. It does not say if the reticle sub tensions are correct at what magnification. So maybe this, or maybe the fixed 10x that Scott showed me

https://swfa.com/swfa-3-9x42-ss-hd-mil-quad-reticle-30mm-tube-1-mil-clicks-ffp/

That is a FFP scope, so the substentions will be accurate at any zoom. The 9x will hamstring you in any competition, but it's got everything else that you need. I'd use that as a hunting scope any day. The only gripe I have with SWFA is a lack of a zero stop.

If you can wait, watch the website every week. They tend to have a sale every other month.


Thanks that is good to know


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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999616 02/04/24 05:39 AM
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BTW, if you do go with this scope, you'll definitely want to toss the zero 2" high at 100 thinking out the window. FFP and mils is what got me to abandon that thinking.

Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: unclebubba] #8999618 02/04/24 05:48 AM
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Originally Posted by unclebubba
BTW, if you do go with this scope, you'll definitely want to toss the zero 2" high at 100 thinking out the window. FFP and mils is what got me to abandon that thinking.


Well if the scope lives up to the reputation then it should track good enough to record my adjustments for different loads and use the data to dial in with them. I can sight in with Gold Medal Match and reset my turrets to “0”, and keep a data book for scope adjustments and different loads.

Last edited by Bryan C. Heimann; 02/04/24 05:48 AM.

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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999619 02/04/24 05:56 AM
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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: unclebubba] #8999621 02/04/24 06:12 AM
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Originally Posted by unclebubba
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Because you already said that or because you think I should verify after making adjustments? I understand the importance of verifying your scope. I might not have killed a pile of deer but leaning on experience I have sighted in and or helped to sight in and train probably over a thousand 18-20 year olds on how to shoot… even with old damaged ACOGS that tracked so poorly you had to slap them after every adjustment. I don’t normally like to post about stuff like that but the facepalm… ok i have to tell you something about myself.

With that and a crappy worn out M4 that shoots about 4 MOA I hit man size targets to 300 yards every time I qualified. At 300 yards that is a 12” group… if uou have consistent velocity and no wind. Military ammo and any wind at all on the range leaves little to no room for error at 300 with a 14” 5.56 carbine. And this is all with rifle sighted in at 25 yards and straight to rifle qual. So i do have a clue.

I am at least competent enough to bore sight by eyeball at 50 and sight in a scope in 2 shots. Eyeball adjustment. So there is that.

If the scope tracking is going to be an issue with the SWFA then we go back to set it and forget it, only use loads that are close. Or pick one and run with it.

but at a minimum I am shooting federal gold medal match and also one other load with a hunting bullet.

Last edited by Bryan C. Heimann; 02/04/24 06:32 AM.

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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999624 02/04/24 06:25 AM
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Yeah i know i look like a total douche posting that. Not trying to pound my chest… but I am not a pup looking for advice on sighting in my scope. I need help selecting a scope…. Edit… and anecdotal data on this 180 grain federal bullet.


Last edited by Bryan C. Heimann; 02/04/24 06:28 AM.

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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999629 02/04/24 08:52 AM
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Ok new plan. This is my zero compromise rifle scope and what will go on my .308. For “$999”, not today or tomorrow. But maybe in a year. Or maybe sooner if I catch a deal on a similar leupold, MK3HD Tactical or etc. In the mean time I am just gonna leave the Athlon on there and work within the limitations that presents. It is serviceable to hunt with.

If the leupy don’t track, i guess i will find out.

https://www.leupold.com/mark-4hd-2-5-10x42-m5c3-ffp-tmr#detailed-reticle-information


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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999688 02/04/24 02:16 PM
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If you are going to spend a $1,000 on a new unproven model from Leupold, I’d recommend going with something proven for the same price.

Nightforce SHV.

https://cameralandny.com/shop/night...0137-3be7-00163ecd2826?variation=1940868



Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999732 02/04/24 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Bryan C. Heimann
Originally Posted by unclebubba
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Because you already said that or because you think I should verify after making adjustments? I understand the importance of verifying your scope. I might not have killed a pile of deer but leaning on experience I have sighted in and or helped to sight in and train probably over a thousand 18-20 year olds on how to shoot… even with old damaged ACOGS that tracked so poorly you had to slap them after every adjustment. I don’t normally like to post about stuff like that but the facepalm… ok i have to tell you something about myself.

With that and a crappy worn out M4 that shoots about 4 MOA I hit man size targets to 300 yards every time I qualified. At 300 yards that is a 12” group… if uou have consistent velocity and no wind. Military ammo and any wind at all on the range leaves little to no room for error at 300 with a 14” 5.56 carbine. And this is all with rifle sighted in at 25 yards and straight to rifle qual. So i do have a clue.

I am at least competent enough to bore sight by eyeball at 50 and sight in a scope in 2 shots. Eyeball adjustment. So there is that.

If the scope tracking is going to be an issue with the SWFA then we go back to set it and forget it, only use loads that are close. Or pick one and run with it.

but at a minimum I am shooting federal gold medal match and also one other load with a hunting bullet.

What exactly is your experience as a hunter using an optic to make ethical shots on game? How many kills, ranges, results of your shots (DRT vs. tracking a kill), etc.? There are options and methods out there, knowing where you're at could target responses to save you some time and $.


An unethical shot is one you take, that you know you shouldn't.
Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999747 02/04/24 03:54 PM
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I have a 3x15 LHT for sale. Made in Japan

Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: scottfromdallas] #8999772 02/04/24 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by scottfromdallas
If you are going to spend a $1,000 on a new unproven model from Leupold, I’d recommend going with something proven for the same price.

Nightforce SHV.

https://cameralandny.com/shop/night...0137-3be7-00163ecd2826?variation=1940868


Dang Scott. Don’t ask me why i never thought of that one. Thank you for this idea, this is what i will probably do. I thought Nightforce cost more.


onlysmithandwesson- bud out. I *fully* understand what my poi will look like at range based on what it looks like at 100. Longer distances i will need to shoot the gun at range to verify. 200 yards i will be o.k. Past that, sure, only with a gun that is zeroed specifically for that ammo and with verified data.

Last edited by Bryan C. Heimann; 02/04/24 04:42 PM.

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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: Brother in-law] #8999796 02/04/24 05:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Brother in-law
I have a 3x15 LHT for sale. Made in Japan


I will have a look


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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999851 02/04/24 07:04 PM
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Don't ever buy U.S. Optics

Burris XTR II is always a great budget scope. I'm pretty scope snobby and I have one in service.

Everything gets zeroed at 100 yards. Even my .300 Norma Mag that has made hits at 1.25 Mile (2180 yards) is zeroed at 100 yards.

For $1K that NF SHV is a good buy. I've used several of them that were on customer's rifles. When I was getting DOPE for them, they tracked like Night Force is supposed to track.

EGW or Night Force pic rail. And Night Force Ultralite rings are my darlings. Made in USA, great machining, and they hold up.


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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: J.G.] #8999854 02/04/24 07:09 PM
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Originally Posted by J.G.
Don't ever buy U.S. Optics

Burris XTR II is always a great budget scope. I'm pretty scope snobby and I have one in service.

Everything gets zeroed at 100 yards. Even my .300 Norma Mag that has made hits at 1.25 Mile (2180 yards) is zeroed at 100 yards.

For $1K that NF SHV is a good buy. I've used several of them that were on customer's rifles. When I was getting DOPE for them, they tracked like Night Force is supposed to track.

EGW or Night Force pic rail. And Night Force Ultralite rings are my darlings. Made in USA, great machining, and they hold up.


That sounds perfect. A price point scope that is of quality, not priced cheep but made affordable, made in America. That is the scope that my rifle deserves.


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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999935 02/04/24 09:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Bryan C. Heimann
Originally Posted by J.G.
Don't ever buy U.S. Optics

Burris XTR II is always a great budget scope. I'm pretty scope snobby and I have one in service.

Everything gets zeroed at 100 yards. Even my .300 Norma Mag that has made hits at 1.25 Mile (2180 yards) is zeroed at 100 yards.

For $1K that NF SHV is a good buy. I've used several of them that were on customer's rifles. When I was getting DOPE for them, they tracked like Night Force is supposed to track.

EGW or Night Force pic rail. And Night Force Ultralite rings are my darlings. Made in USA, great machining, and they hold up.


That sounds perfect. A price point scope that is of quality, not priced cheep but made affordable, made in America. That is the scope that my rifle deserves.



Well no. It’s made in Japan from a quality manufacturer. LOW I believe. And well worth the money. I’ve heard people complain about the turrets and the glass quality but they’re trying to compare it to far more expensive glass.

Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999984 02/04/24 11:02 PM
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So I am looking for a unicorn. Is there anything at least assembled in USA, decent glass, tracks well, about $1000?


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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #8999992 02/04/24 11:12 PM
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Burris XTRII Assembled in Greely, CO. There’s my scope


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Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: 10 Gauge] #9000015 02/04/24 11:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Bryan C. Heimann
Burris XTRII Assembled in Greely, CO. There’s my scope


Mine says made in the Philippines.



Re: Ok, what about the opposite of the fudd scope, on a budget. [Re: wp75169] #9000022 02/05/24 12:02 AM
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Originally Posted by wp75169
Originally Posted by Bryan C. Heimann
Originally Posted by J.G.
Don't ever buy U.S. Optics

Burris XTR II is always a great budget scope. I'm pretty scope snobby and I have one in service.

Everything gets zeroed at 100 yards. Even my .300 Norma Mag that has made hits at 1.25 Mile (2180 yards) is zeroed at 100 yards.

For $1K that NF SHV is a good buy. I've used several of them that were on customer's rifles. When I was getting DOPE for them, they tracked like Night Force is supposed to track.

EGW or Night Force pic rail. And Night Force Ultralite rings are my darlings. Made in USA, great machining, and they hold up.


That sounds perfect. A price point scope that is of quality, not priced cheep but made affordable, made in America. That is the scope that my rifle deserves.



Well no. It’s made in Japan from a quality manufacturer. LOW I believe. And well worth the money. I’ve heard people complain about the turrets and the glass quality but they’re trying to compare it to far more expensive glass.



Tight eye box and meh glass but around that $1000 range they are in the leaderboard with some others that can be found on sale. XTR reticle sucks for hunting

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