100% lies and hallucinations.

If .001% of the population who claims to have seen one or know someone has seen one actually killed one, we would have dozens of specimens to study.

But here we are in 2024 and we have exactly the same number of Sasquatch’s, Yetis, Loch Ness Monsters and Black Panthers to poke and prod at.

No, a handful are mistaken identity. And my initial reaction was i would not be surprised. I also would not be surprised if jaguars ranged through some part of the state every single year and never got spotted by anyone. That doesn’t make east texas sightings “true”.

There is also probably plenty of sightings in other parts of the state. It’s funny when you look at range and distribution of a species and it just ends at the rio grande. Jaguars literally drag crocs and caiman out of rivers to eat, the rio grande is not exactly a geographical barrier to them. Maybe if they finished building the wall.

So no, I would not be surprised if someone spotted a “rare melanated jaguar”anywhere in the southeast part of the state, although i find it highly unlikely.

I never singled you out, either. But since you quoted me i am gonna call you on it. You posted outright made-up false information and compared me to a cryptid nut job to quantify what you posted. It’s not even what i posted, it’s because I posted it. And it says a lot.

Seize an opportunity to tear me down to build yourself up. Some people never change

I'm not singling you out or comparing you to a cryptid nut job. Your arguing a point that was based at least in fact that black jaguars do exist.

My argument is that one has never been spotted in the U.S, that melanistic cats range much further south towards central america. As many people live in the state ( upwards of 25 million now ) all the highways and backroads and game cameras and hunting blinds set up all over the woods, someone would have concrete proof of a black cat by now. But we have none. Same as Big Foot.


Now is it POSSIBLE? yes, its possible, as black jaguars do in fact exist. Black Mountain Lions do not. But I'm not singling you out or picking on you because you brought logic in your argument as A. black jaguars do exist and B. jaguars have been spotted and killed in the United States, just not any black ones

Mybad. I guess i haven’t followed the thread very closely. I sort of dismissed it altogether when a couple fellers started pulling dates from their imagination and claiming it was the last one documented, last one killed, etc..

But i checked back in when one feller posted something about secretly teansporting black bears to Louisiana, and here we are.

I can agree that East Texas sightings are probably 99% lies and hallucinations. [/quote]

100% lies and hallucinations.

If .001% of the population who claims to have seen one or know someone has seen one actually killed one, we would have dozens of specimens to study.

But here we are in 2024 and we have exactly the same number of Sasquatch’s, Yetis, Loch Ness Monsters and Black Panthers to poke and prod at.



[/quote]

No, a handful are mistaken identity. And my initial reaction was i would not be surprised. I also would not be surprised if jaguars ranged through some part of the state every single year and never got spotted by anyone. That doesn’t make east texas sightings “true”.

There is also probably plenty of sightings in other parts of the state. It’s funny when you look at range and distribution of a species and it just ends at the rio grande. Jaguars literally drag crocs and caiman out of rivers to eat, the rio grande is not exactly a geographical barrier to them. Maybe if they finished building the wall.

So no, I would not be surprised if someone spotted a “rare melanated jaguar”anywhere in the southeast part of the state, although i find it highly unlikely.

I never singled you out, either. But since you quoted me i am gonna call you on it. You posted outright made-up false information and compared me to a cryptid nut job to quantify what you posted. It’s not even what i posted, it’s because I posted it. And it says a lot.

Seize an opportunity to tear me down to build yourself up. Some people never change[/quote]
Stating facts is not pulling dates from someone's imagination. The last documented jaguar in Texas was killed in the 1940's. That's not opinion. It's just a fact. If you can find proof otherwise then post it. It's also a fact the closest documented melanistic jaguar was in Belize. There were claims of one in the northern Mexico population but it was disproven. There has never been a documented picture or carcass of a large black cat anywhere in the US. It's your choice to believe they exist if you want. You just can't dismiss fact as someone's imagination

Actually, there has indeed been one melanistic jaguar documented. Warner Glenn- a mountain lion hunter that, as far as I know, started the whole Malpai border lands conservation effort- admits to having seen one on Clay Newcomb’s podcast. His is the only credible sighting that I know of. But even Warner Glenn is skeptical of everyone that claims to have seen one. He has dedicated a good portion of his life to protecting the Malpai birder lands and is not too enthusiastic about people coming to find them either.

But how cool is that? I would love to meet and talk to somebody like Warner Glenn. 86 year old man and a real cowboy, still living that lifestyle.

Check this out

https://youtu.be/jXcUdJhkR_M?feature=shared

That’s not a documentation. That’s anecdotal evidence.


Bob Gimlin was on tv and radio shows too as having seen Bigfoot. Didn’t make it real. But at least they did have a video…

That is a good point but do you really doubt a guy like Warner Glenn? Bigfoot does not exist, in real life, anywhere in the world.

I’m not saying I doubt him, but even authorities on subjects have been prone to embellishments and exaggerations. I remember the sighting as a kid but before the podcast had never heard of Warner Glenn, and neither had the vast majority of the hunting world. Bring on a podcast does not automatically ensure credibility.

I don’t doubt the findings of the Sierra madre findings as holding a breeding population of jaguars but they is a remote and sparsely populated area. Nothing like the eastern 3/4’s of Texas. If jaguars need little human interaction to make it, they are not going to find they in most areas of the state. Also, the habit of the Sierra madras is nothing like southern Arizona or anywhere in Texas.

I could maybe see a Jaguar sighting on the river area of the trans pecos/big bend area, but it would be a transient cat and still a very, very unlikely scenario at present time.

Also, the best question to ask would be if any of thr dozen cats killed by the Mexican ranchers were black?

I'm one of the "fellers that started pulling dates from their imagination and claiming it was the last documented, last one killed, etc,". If you did some research instead of spouting off fairy tales you might find out that it is a fact that the last jaguar was killed in Texas in 1948 and that is a FACT.

The last jaguar was killed in Texas in 1948?

That is sort of how it went with wolves.

“Wolves are extinct”

“Still in Canada”

“Well they were extirpated and do not exist in the US. No such thing as bigfoot either haha”

“A biologist tagged some wolves that range in Wisconsin”

Same think for 80-100 pound coyotes that are killed every year in Missouri. No such thing as a coyote that big and no such thing as a red wolf either.

There are no jaguars in Texas like there are no mountain lions in Missouri.

Melanated jags in East Texas- i doubt it but it would not surprise me

Mybad. I guess i haven’t followed the thread very closely. I sort of dismissed it altogether when a couple fellers started pulling dates from their imagination and claiming it was the last one documented, last one killed, etc..

But i checked back in when one feller posted something about secretly teansporting black bears to Louisiana, and here we are.

I can agree that East Texas sightings are probably 99% lies and hallucinations. [/quote]

I'm one of the "fellers that started pulling dates from their imagination and claiming it was the last documented, last one killed, etc,". If you did some research instead of spouting off fairy tales you might find out that it is a fact that the last jaguar was killed in Texas in 1948 and that is a FACT. [/quote]

We have seen plenty of his type in the other group. Facts don't matter. He is going to believe whatever he wants

My type? Facts don't mean much to you either apparently. At least i tried to be civil. I never should have checked back in to this thread, you can have it

Actually facts mean everything to me. I don't deal in what people say they saw. Post facts that any large melanistic felines are in the US.

IDK......I had a 1969 XKE Roadster when I was in college. But admittedly....it wasn't 'black' (Primrose Yellow).

Probably should have kept it.

If jaguars are the explanation for 'black panthers,' then there are a truck-ton of jaguars in Texas.