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Nightforce issues #8945083 10/28/23 05:02 PM
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Didnt think this would ever happen but I think I have a problem with my Nightforce NX8 1-8

I got a new AR scope mount and I am installing it now. I usually just line up the vertical crosshairs on a door and get it straight that way. So I had it all lined up and when I take a look at the top the turret is way off. So I grab my level and level up the top and here is how bad it is off. [Linked Image]

Has anybody experienced this before?? I guess I need to send it back to Nightforce. I have a few hog hunts coming up over the next 2 weeks so I would really like to use it.

I am hoping it doesnt migrate more while shooting. I was at the range yesterday and it was dead on and I didnt notice anything but I am definitely curious as to what might have happened.

Any clue anyone??

thanks
Big


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Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8945592 10/29/23 04:17 PM
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lots of variables to address before sending that back-- Id recheck that mount and everything else-- I also dont ever level anything up off the scope caps.

There are some good systems to level up using the scope body underneath the dials.

If it does go back let us know- I have that exact same scope on an AR upper right now and zero issues thus far.

Re: Nightforce issues [Re: duckhunter175] #8945987 10/30/23 03:22 AM
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Originally Posted by duckhunter175
lots of variables to address before sending that back-- Id recheck that mount and everything else-- I also dont ever level anything up off the scope caps.

There are some good systems to level up using the scope body underneath the dials.

If it does go back let us know- I have that exact same scope on an AR upper right now and zero issues thus far.

If it doesn't level based on the scope caps and you dial for elevation, it will pull you sideways when you dial.

I did some calculations on this for a high-end scope manufacturer one time proving that their scope was going a full half mil sideways at 1000 yards because of a very minor misalignment (much more subtle than this). Then verified with a test. They sent me a new one.

Re: Nightforce issues [Re: duckhunter175] #8946141 10/30/23 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by duckhunter175
lots of variables to address before sending that back-- Id recheck that mount and everything else-- I also dont ever level anything up off the scope caps.

There are some good systems to level up using the scope body underneath the dials.

If it does go back let us know- I have that exact same scope on an AR upper right now and zero issues thus far.


What? You think a scope could have the turrets mounted THAT crooked in relation to the reticle? It shouldn’t be off, at all. The turrets should be at 0 and 90 degrees, even if they aren’t perfectly level. What is shown in the photo is clearly a problem.

Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8946152 10/30/23 02:08 PM
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Nothing you can do with a canted reticle except send it back for another one. In spite of all the Nightforce love around here, they do make mistakes and have problems and they have a customer service department because of it. They screwed up, make 'em fix it.

Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8946245 10/30/23 04:02 PM
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I couldnt believe what I was seeing, I will call nightforce today and send it back after my hunts next week.

Thanks guys


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Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Sneaky] #8946676 10/31/23 02:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Sneaky
Originally Posted by duckhunter175
lots of variables to address before sending that back-- Id recheck that mount and everything else-- I also dont ever level anything up off the scope caps.

There are some good systems to level up using the scope body underneath the dials.

If it does go back let us know- I have that exact same scope on an AR upper right now and zero issues thus far.


What? You think a scope could have the turrets mounted THAT crooked in relation to the reticle? It shouldn’t be off, at all. The turrets should be at 0 and 90 degrees, even if they aren’t perfectly level. What is shown in the photo is clearly a problem.


Lets try reading what I wrote- scope CAPS are not an end all be all for leveling off a rifle scope-- they aren't a machined part of the scope body-- and the pic doesn't show the relationship of the turrets to the reticle.

The point I was making is that using a line of door isn't the same as a plumb bob and not necessarily leveling the system where the scope sits are variables that weren't accounted for. My recommendation was level the bottom of the turret area (machined part of the scope body) with the rail (as it is set to level) to get the best true level, then check the reticle, then check turret orientation.

No one was arguing if the pic showed the turret at straight up and the reticle was canted that there was a problem. Just offering things to check before mailing a scope off.

Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8946735 10/31/23 10:22 AM
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I put a small level on to of the rail underneath the scope or a flat top machined part of the receiver. I then put a small level on the top turret cap. I’ve never had the reticle be anything other than perfect. If it’s not I would call the manufacturer for a RA number.

Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Sneaky] #8946822 10/31/23 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Sneaky
Originally Posted by duckhunter175
lots of variables to address before sending that back-- Id recheck that mount and everything else-- I also dont ever level anything up off the scope caps.

There are some good systems to level up using the scope body underneath the dials.

If it does go back let us know- I have that exact same scope on an AR upper right now and zero issues thus far.


What? You think a scope could have the turrets mounted THAT crooked in relation to the reticle? It shouldn’t be off, at all. The turrets should be at 0 and 90 degrees, even if they aren’t perfectly level. What is shown in the photo is clearly a problem.


I level reticle via plum line and Level on scope mounts or receiver. With that said if its that canted, id send it back


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Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8946825 10/31/23 01:29 PM
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Hmm there are a couple posters I’m surprised haven’t turned up on this post


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Re: Nightforce issues [Re: BOBO the Clown] #8946828 10/31/23 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown


I level reticle via plum line and Level on scope mounts or receiver. With that said if its that canted, id send it back

Never had this issue but like you I always level the gun then use a plumb line to set the scope. If the turrets are canted but the reticle is plum/level will it still not dial correctly? I had assumed it would as long as reticle was true.


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Re: Nightforce issues [Re: redchevy] #8946873 10/31/23 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by redchevy
Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown


I level reticle via plum line and Level on scope mounts or receiver. With that said if its that canted, id send it back

Never had this issue but like you I always level the gun then use a plumb line to set the scope. If the turrets are canted but the reticle is plum/level will it still not dial correctly? I had assumed it would as long as reticle was true.



I would think this would cause the reticle to dial diagonally which would be significant at longer ranges.

Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8946896 10/31/23 02:55 PM
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You've got to get the reticle aligned with the bore of your rifle. I'm not a huge fan of bubble levels but they probably get it close enough. The Reticle-Tru is foolproof and quick.

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Re: Nightforce issues [Re: redchevy] #8946903 10/31/23 03:13 PM
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Originally Posted by redchevy
Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown


I level reticle via plum line and Level on scope mounts or receiver. With that said if its that canted, id send it back

Never had this issue but like you I always level the gun then use a plumb line to set the scope. If the turrets are canted but the reticle is plum/level will it still not dial correctly? I had assumed it would as long as reticle was true.


in theory POI would track up and down and right to left correctly but you couldnt use the reticle holds. you dont know until you test it. End of the day even if it tracks level, you dont pay 2k for a canted reticle


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Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8946906 10/31/23 03:17 PM
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Yeah... that was quite a rabbit trail I went down a couple years ago. I assumed that leveling the scope off the turrent cap was correct and logical. Well, it is logical but not necessarily correct. If you get the crosshairs level by eye and if your vertical adjustment moves the bullet straight up and if the horizontal adjustment moves the bullet impact only left or right (with no upwards or downwards tendency) then nothing is wrong. It took me a few months to figure this out. My issue was with a Burris scope BTW.


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Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8946908 10/31/23 03:18 PM
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Yeah for sure I’d gripe about less for what I was buying.


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Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8946982 10/31/23 05:35 PM
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There are so many variables and flags at work here, the scope reticle being that severely canted due to a manufacturing mistake that was not caught before shipping seems pretty far down the list of likely issues, at least from the info presented.

“… new scope mount….”

Were you using this scope before in a different mount?

If the scope is new, was it purchased from a NF dealer or a secondary source?

Please post a side view. Are you using rings or a unimount? What brand and type?

First, please try starting over from the starting point.

Hang a string with a weight to have a true vertical line. Poor quality door framing unfortunately is more common than it should be and not always a reliable gauge.

Remove the upper so you can look through the barrel.

The ability to look through the bore is critical for proper alignment. Secure the upper. I use a bipod that locks with solid rear bags when mounting a scope.

Lightly tighten the rings leaving the ability to rotate the scope. Having the string relatively close about five to ten feet away makes seeing it easier and more precise.

Align the center of the rifle bore and center of reticle on the string.

Then rotate the scope to align the vertical axis of the reticle along the string.

Gently tighten the rings a little at a time while constantly checking the bore and reticle alignment.

Check, recheck, and check again to make sure the center of the bore and reticle are remaining aligned while tightening.

Then once tightened to the scope manufacturer specs with a real torque wrench, run the scope way up and way down to check alignment while tracking. Adjust as needed. Do not worry about whether the top of the scope cap is level, the reticle and tracking are what matters.

I can mount and have a scope done and checked in ten minutes using a Spuhr unimount, other times tightening rings can really be a challenge and fight me and take awhile. Use a torque wrench. A Wheeler Fat Wrench is better than “feel,” and a calibrated torque wrench like Seekonk or Wiha is even better.

Give it one more try with my method to see if it helps. It is slow, but has “fixed” problem scopes and rifles that would not shoot before.

Good luck.




Re: Nightforce issues [Re: redchevy] #8947180 10/31/23 09:53 PM
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Originally Posted by redchevy
Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown


I level reticle via plum line and Level on scope mounts or receiver. With that said if its that canted, id send it back

Never had this issue but like you I always level the gun then use a plumb line to set the scope. If the turrets are canted but the reticle is plum/level will it still not dial correctly? I had assumed it would as long as reticle was true.

It will not dial correctly if the reticle and the turrets aren't aligned.

At longer ranges (500+ yards with a normal short action centerfire round), this becomes extremely significant.

Last edited by patriot07; 10/31/23 09:53 PM.
Re: Nightforce issues [Re: patriot07] #8947204 10/31/23 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by patriot07
Originally Posted by redchevy
Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown


I level reticle via plum line and Level on scope mounts or receiver. With that said if its that canted, id send it back

Never had this issue but like you I always level the gun then use a plumb line to set the scope. If the turrets are canted but the reticle is plum/level will it still not dial correctly? I had assumed it would as long as reticle was true.

It will not dial correctly if the reticle and the turrets aren't aligned.

At longer ranges (500+ yards with a normal short action centerfire round), this becomes extremely significant.


the center of the reticle is still the center. It will still adjust with turret. Now the reticle holds/marks/ etc will be useless , but reticle center is still a singular center point.


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Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8947215 10/31/23 10:36 PM
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If the erector tube is turned in the main tube it will adjust diagonally if the main tube is not square. Vertically if the main tube is square and reticle is not.

Re: Nightforce issues [Re: duckhunter175] #8947216 10/31/23 10:36 PM
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Originally Posted by duckhunter175
Originally Posted by Sneaky
Originally Posted by duckhunter175
lots of variables to address before sending that back-- Id recheck that mount and everything else-- I also dont ever level anything up off the scope caps.

There are some good systems to level up using the scope body underneath the dials.

If it does go back let us know- I have that exact same scope on an AR upper right now and zero issues thus far.


What? You think a scope could have the turrets mounted THAT crooked in relation to the reticle? It shouldn’t be off, at all. The turrets should be at 0 and 90 degrees, even if they aren’t perfectly level. What is shown in the photo is clearly a problem.


Lets try reading what I wrote- scope CAPS are not an end all be all for leveling off a rifle scope-- they aren't a machined part of the scope body-- and the pic doesn't show the relationship of the turrets to the reticle.

The point I was making is that using a line of door isn't the same as a plumb bob and not necessarily leveling the system where the scope sits are variables that weren't accounted for. My recommendation was level the bottom of the turret area (machined part of the scope body) with the rail (as it is set to level) to get the best true level, then check the reticle, then check turret orientation.

No one was arguing if the pic showed the turret at straight up and the reticle was canted that there was a problem. Just offering things to check before mailing a scope off.


Right. Maybe the scope caps are in a different place than the turrets. Okay.

Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8947745 11/01/23 06:41 PM
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This is a 5 to 6 year old scope. So this just happened somehow. The door or walls vertical surface does just fine lining it up. Most people like myself can tell if it is straight or not just looking at it. I use a vertical wall line just to make sure. It is easy try it sometime trust me it works. No extra materials needed. This is not a long range scope. I had it on a Burris pepr since I bought it. Didnt notice it at the range a few days ago but I wasnt looking for it either. It was dead on. My buddy gave me his Wilson Combat mount since he isnt using it. I stuck it on there and it was way off as you can see. [Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

I called Nightforce and sent them some pics and they gave me an RMA @ and I will send it back next week after my hunts. They quoted me 6 weeks. AArghh! I will take it to the range again to make sure it isnt moving around now that it is remounted. If it is moving around I will put my old 1-6 vortex on. Maybe my wraith mini but that doesnt seem to me like a good stalking scope. This is on my pig gun so when stalking in the woods I rarely shoot over 80 yards so I wont need to make any adjustments. It is definitely way off. Just weird that after 6 years boom there it is.

Last edited by Bigfoot; 11/01/23 06:49 PM.

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Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8947748 11/01/23 06:50 PM
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Wow, that is crazy. The photo is helpful. Doubtless they will have it like new when it comes back.

Good hunting. up

Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Bigfoot] #8947749 11/01/23 06:52 PM
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Just proves that contrary to what some think, or read on the internet, NF customer service has plenty of business or it wouldn't take 6 weeks. I'm sure they'll take care of you nevertheless. Keep us posted if you don't mind.

Re: Nightforce issues [Re: Sneaky] #8947999 11/02/23 01:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Sneaky
Originally Posted by duckhunter175
Originally Posted by Sneaky
Originally Posted by duckhunter175
lots of variables to address before sending that back-- Id recheck that mount and everything else-- I also dont ever level anything up off the scope caps.

There are some good systems to level up using the scope body underneath the dials.

If it does go back let us know- I have that exact same scope on an AR upper right now and zero issues thus far.


What? You think a scope could have the turrets mounted THAT crooked in relation to the reticle? It shouldn’t be off, at all. The turrets should be at 0 and 90 degrees, even if they aren’t perfectly level. What is shown in the photo is clearly a problem.


Lets try reading what I wrote- scope CAPS are not an end all be all for leveling off a rifle scope-- they aren't a machined part of the scope body-- and the pic doesn't show the relationship of the turrets to the reticle.

The point I was making is that using a line of door isn't the same as a plumb bob and not necessarily leveling the system where the scope sits are variables that weren't accounted for. My recommendation was level the bottom of the turret area (machined part of the scope body) with the rail (as it is set to level) to get the best true level, then check the reticle, then check turret orientation.

No one was arguing if the pic showed the turret at straight up and the reticle was canted that there was a problem. Just offering things to check before mailing a scope off.


Right. Maybe the scope caps are in a different place than the turrets. Okay.


I see the discussion and understanding of a cap being a separate part of the main tube and potentially not machined to the same tolerances has just totally escaped you. Sure a turret cap can work to level… until it doesnt work. Again- the point of my post was to reduce variables and introduce a more precise way to level. Carry on.

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