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Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Big Sam] #8781565 01/16/23 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Big Sam
Originally Posted by Wilson Combat
Originally Posted by Tweakd4
My next build was going to use a 11.3" pistol 300 HAM'R to complement my 18" rifle that I love. With the new Pistol brace restrictions coming down from the ATF, does WC have any plans to build 14.5" barrels?


We have models/prints for 14.7" which will become a legal 16" if you weld any of the WC brand muzzle devices on it. We used to stock these, but when we got super busy during the scamdemic we dropped them.



Bill... this may be too much but... If there is a sudden need for 14.7" barrels with WC brand muzzle devices, how nice it would be if WC welded and pinned the muzzle device on and installed the gas block. I know it would cost extra but likely much less than sending it to a gunsmith to have the same thing done. Just a thought.


We could do this, but unless you absolutely need a muzzle device, a 16" with a thread protector is the same length as a 14.7" with muzzle device. For hunting I prefer no muzzle device on non-suppressed guns to keep them as short as possible.

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Wilson Combat] #8782672 01/18/23 12:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Wilson Combat
We've spent quite a bit of time and I've done a LOT of accuracy and terminal performance testing of the new Lehigh Defense 115gr ME (Maximum Expansion) bullet specifically designed for the 300 HAM'R. We learned in order to optimize the terminal performance we had to have a design specific to 1-12/1-13 twist barrels and another one for 1-15 twist barrels due to the rotational speed of the bullet in flight.

SKU #s are:
01-308-115-SP12 (1-12/1-13 twist)
01-308-115-SP15 (1-15 twist)
Price will probably be the same as the current 125gr Control Chaos and I estimate availability in mid March.


Here's a photo of the performance of the final design.

[Linked Image]


That's impressive


Wilson Combat Pro Staff
Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: dlrz71] #8783064 01/18/23 05:44 PM
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At Lehigh Defense we've finalized the design of what I believe to be the deadliest bullet available for the HAM'R. I performs the same from point blank out to 250yds+ and does TREMENDOUS internal damage while still producing deep penetration. It always sheds 4 pedals weighing approx 11gr each that radiate out more than a Controlled Chaos with a 79-80gr base that has slight expansion to .330"-.340" with jagged edges. As you can see it performs pretty dramatic on hogs!

100yd groups from a 16" 1-15 Ranger barrel

SKU # is 17-308-125-XC $51.50 retail per box of 50, will be available late February

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
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[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Wilson Combat] #8783086 01/18/23 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Wilson Combat
At Lehigh Defense we've finalized the design of what I believe to be the deadliest bullet available for the HAM'R. I performs the same from point blank out to 250yds+ and does TREMENDOUS internal damage while still producing deep penetration. It always sheds 4 pedals weighing approx 11gr each that radiate out more than a Controlled Chaos with a 79-80gr base that has slight expansion to .330"-.340" with jagged edges. As you can see it performs pretty dramatic on hogs!

100yd groups from a 16" 1-15 Ranger barrel

SKU # is 17-308-125-XC $51.50 retail per box of 50, will be available late February

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]




Good grief! I am impressed to say the least. So are the hogs. Will you be providing loading data for us Bill?


"Group think" is not thinking. It is the lack of independent thought. It is a cancer of the mind.
Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Big Sam] #8783121 01/18/23 06:57 PM
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Big Sam, load data will be the same as the 125gr CC, I'm getting best accuracy with 26.2gr A1680 for 2450-2460fps from a 16"

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Wilson Combat] #8783198 01/18/23 08:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Wilson Combat
Big Sam, load data will be the same as the 125gr CC, I'm getting best accuracy with 26.2gr A1680 for 2450-2460fps from a 16"



Thank you Bill!


"Group think" is not thinking. It is the lack of independent thought. It is a cancer of the mind.
Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Wilson Combat] #8783206 01/18/23 08:46 PM
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Bill...how does the new Lehigh bullet do out of 1/13 twist barrel?

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: TxPigKiller] #8783306 01/18/23 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by TxPigKiller
Bill...how does the new Lehigh bullet do out of 1/13 twist barrel?


Performance is even more dramatic

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Wilson Combat] #8783480 01/19/23 03:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Wilson Combat
Originally Posted by TxPigKiller
Bill...how does the new Lehigh bullet do out of 1/13 twist barrel?


Performance is even more dramatic


How about the accuracy?

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: TxPigKiller] #8784669 01/20/23 08:55 PM
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Originally Posted by TxPigKiller
Originally Posted by Wilson Combat
Originally Posted by TxPigKiller
Bill...how does the new Lehigh bullet do out of 1/13 twist barrel?


Performance is even more dramatic


How about the accuracy?


Here's a group out of a 18" Tac Hunter 1-13

[Linked Image]

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: dlrz71] #8784793 01/21/23 12:30 AM
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Nice!

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: dlrz71] #8785766 01/22/23 08:37 PM
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Bill,

I'm sure it has been asked and answered somewhere on here already, but I was unable to find it. Could you please tell me how many grains of CFE BLK you are loading in the 130 GN Speer Hot COR factory rounds? They shoot very well in my rifle and figured it would save me from having to work up the load or pull apart a factory round to measure the powder. If I wasn't an hour drive to the range it wouldn't be a big deal but it very time consuming to work up and dial in the load if I can just duplicate what I already shoot.

Thanks!


Freedom, paid for by the blood of the fallen, taken by the ink of congress!
Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Liberty Arsenal LLC] #8785789 01/22/23 09:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Liberty Arsenal LLC
Bill,

I'm sure it has been asked and answered somewhere on here already, but I was unable to find it. Could you please tell me how many grains of CFE BLK you are loading in the 130 GN Speer Hot COR factory rounds? They shoot very well in my rifle and figured it would save me from having to work up the load or pull apart a factory round to measure the powder. If I wasn't an hour drive to the range it wouldn't be a big deal but it very time consuming to work up and dial in the load if I can just duplicate what I already shoot.

Thanks!


I am not Bill but in my gun, 28.0 is accurate and normally enters and exits on WT deer. You can go to Wilson Combat website and get loads for the Ham'r. I think 27.9 is max there.




Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Liberty Arsenal LLC] #8786166 01/23/23 03:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Liberty Arsenal LLC
Bill,

I'm sure it has been asked and answered somewhere on here already, but I was unable to find it. Could you please tell me how many grains of CFE BLK you are loading in the 130 GN Speer Hot COR factory rounds? They shoot very well in my rifle and figured it would save me from having to work up the load or pull apart a factory round to measure the powder. If I wasn't an hour drive to the range it wouldn't be a big deal but it very time consuming to work up and dial in the load if I can just duplicate what I already shoot.

Thanks!


I feel your pain. It's sometimes very frustrating to duplicate factory loads because a lot of the time they don't use the exact same powder that's available to handloaders. Unfortunately CFEBLK while an awesome powder does vary quite a bit from lot to lot so unless you are using the same lot as the factory loads you might not get the same results. I know it's a pain but the only way to insure the most accurate loads for your rifle is to do the load testing, preferably with a velocity measuring device and if you ever change powder lots you have to start over again unless you're lucky and get acceptable results from your old load.

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: dlrz71] #8786389 01/23/23 03:30 PM
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For what it is worth......
I've noticed that once you get a really good load that has the accuracy you are looking for you need to make note of its velocity. Then if you change lots of powder you want to find the load that matches that velocity.

The velocity is a result of the pressure as is the accuracy. It takes very little effort to match velocity from one lot of powder to the next IF YOU ARE USING THE SAME BULLET AND THE SAME BARREL. When I began playing with the 300 HAM'R, and the Speer 130 gr HC, that bullet gave me good results on game, but accuracy was only fair. In my playing I dropped the load down by just 0.3 grains and the results was highly noticeable. If I change powder lots I run a simple test to match velocity to the old load and I get the same accuracy results.
[Linked Image]

Not every group will match this one ( a hair over 1/2") but they will be MOA. The nice part of these results is that I now have a stash of the 130 HC (these bullets are rather inexpensive) loaded up and set aside, I can go on and play a bit with the new Lehigh Defense bullets Mr. Wilson is bringing out. When you spend hours in a deer stand waiting for the big one to step out of the brush, you want the best bullet you can get not the cheapest! grin


As a pat on the back to the guys working in the barrel department at Wilson Combat, I get the same results from one barrel to the next. The velocity will change depending on barrel length but the accuracy stays about the same. Those guys are consistent and their work is remarkable!
I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, but I can't help but to laugh when I see a thread on the forum where someone is trying to find the "best" cheap barrel. That is the same as asking, "How little do I have to pay to be disappointed?"

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Graycard] #8786428 01/23/23 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Graycard
For what it is worth......
I've noticed that once you get a really good load that has the accuracy you are looking for you need to make note of its velocity. Then if you change lots of powder you want to find the load that matches that velocity.

The velocity is a result of the pressure as is the accuracy. It takes very little effort to match velocity from one lot of powder to the next IF YOU ARE USING THE SAME BULLET AND THE SAME BARREL. When I began playing with the 300 HAM'R, and the Speer 130 gr HC, that bullet gave me good results on game, but accuracy was only fair. In my playing I dropped the load down by just 0.3 grains and the results was highly noticeable. If I change powder lots I run a simple test to match velocity to the old load and I get the same accuracy results.
[Linked Image]

Not every group will match this one ( a hair over 1/2") but they will be MOA. The nice part of these results is that I now have a stash of the 130 HC (these bullets are rather inexpensive) loaded up and set aside, I can go on and play a bit with the new Lehigh Defense bullets Mr. Wilson is bringing out. When you spend hours in a deer stand waiting for the big one to step out of the brush, you want the best bullet you can get not the cheapest! grin


As a pat on the back to the guys working in the barrel department at Wilson Combat, I get the same results from one barrel to the next. The velocity will change depending on barrel length but the accuracy stays about the same. Those guys are consistent and their work is remarkable!
I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, but I can't help but to laugh when I see a thread on the forum where someone is trying to find the "best" cheap barrel. That is the same as asking, "How little do I have to pay to be disappointed?"



Graycard... Thank you. I've never done what you are suggesting but it makes perfect sense. Seems like a quick and easy solution.


"Group think" is not thinking. It is the lack of independent thought. It is a cancer of the mind.
Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: dlrz71] #8786497 01/23/23 05:46 PM
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You're welcome sir. Going from one lot to the next of the same powder really isn't that hard. (If it was I would be lost!)
I wish they would come up with a good way to measure the pressures of various loads, but at least the velocity is a halfway decent method of matching the pressure from one lot to the next. The only time I drop the load several grains and slowly work my way back up is when I'm dealing with a sensitive powder like H110 or 296. The combination of CFE-BLK and the 300 HAM'R has always been somewhat safe to work with.
At least the prices for a good chronograph have dropped over the years.
Just remember, this is a method of working with lot variations of the SAME powder. Just because I can match velocities of the same powder doesn't mean it is safe to try and match the velocity of two different powders. 2500 fps of CFE-BLK with a 130 HC may be a safe load, but trying to get 2500 fps with a different powder may be a dangerous overload with another powder type. Another common mistake is believing that a load with one bullet is safe for another bullet of the same weight. Just look at the number of 125 grain 30 caliber bullets are on the market. Each one is a bit different and the pressure each will generate can very greatly.

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Graycard] #8786540 01/23/23 06:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Graycard
You're welcome sir. Going from one lot to the next of the same powder really isn't that hard. (If it was I would be lost!)
I wish they would come up with a good way to measure the pressures of various loads, but at least the velocity is a halfway decent method of matching the pressure from one lot to the next. The only time I drop the load several grains and slowly work my way back up is when I'm dealing with a sensitive powder like H110 or 296. The combination of CFE-BLK and the 300 HAM'R has always been somewhat safe to work with.
At least the prices for a good chronograph have dropped over the years.
Just remember, this is a method of working with lot variations of the SAME powder. Just because I can match velocities of the same powder doesn't mean it is safe to try and match the velocity of two different powders. 2500 fps of CFE-BLK with a 130 HC may be a safe load, but trying to get 2500 fps with a different powder may be a dangerous overload with another powder type. Another common mistake is believing that a load with one bullet is safe for another bullet of the same weight. Just look at the number of 125 grain 30 caliber bullets are on the market. Each one is a bit different and the pressure each will generate can very greatly.



I am with you on that part of reloading. I just need to shortcut the process due to living in Orlando. When I was in Georgia and could shoot in the back yard I enjoyed working up loads and shooting ladders. Now it is a 1-hour drive over to the range and 1 hour back, so any shortcuts I can gain are well-needed. Just to go shoot is at the very least a half day, which I do enjoy, just time prohibits it.


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Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: DLALLDER] #8787122 01/24/23 03:38 PM
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Thanks for the info. I guess I will load some ladders starting at 27.5 and work up to 28 and see where these guns like it.


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Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Liberty Arsenal LLC] #8787132 01/24/23 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Liberty Arsenal LLC
Thanks for the info. I guess I will load some ladders starting at 27.5 and work up to 28 and see where these guns like it.



I am guessing that most folks, like me, have gotten jammed up with shortcuts. My suggestions are to load more ammo. Shoot 4 sets of 5 round groups instead of one or two. Shoot longer. Shoot more rounds at each sitting. There is a great deal to be learned by simply shooting more in a day. And, as usual, document everything you do. I have often left the range with one impression but the documents told a greater truth after getting home and reviewing the day's results. Take pics of each group shot with each target. Let us know how it goes.


"Group think" is not thinking. It is the lack of independent thought. It is a cancer of the mind.
Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Big Sam] #8787471 01/25/23 12:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Big Sam
Originally Posted by Liberty Arsenal LLC
Thanks for the info. I guess I will load some ladders starting at 27.5 and work up to 28 and see where these guns like it.



I am guessing that most folks, like me, have gotten jammed up with shortcuts. My suggestions are to load more ammo. Shoot 4 sets of 5 round groups instead of one or two. Shoot longer. Shoot more rounds at each sitting. There is a great deal to be learned by simply shooting more in a day. And, as usual, document everything you do. I have often left the range with one impression but the documents told a greater truth after getting home and reviewing the day's results. Take pics of each group shot with each target. Let us know how it goes.


Good advice but I would add a couple things. I can't stress enough how getting velocity numbers will cut your load testing time...I'm kinda frugal so I use MagnetoSpeed which is not the most accurate but good enough and the price is right. The other thing at the risk of being labeled OCD is clean the barrel between groups. Even with a fully broken in barrel if you just keep shooting the accuracy will degrade. While there are some proponents of "fouling rounds" with the exception of some rimfire guns I have never seen any center fire (rifle or pistol) have better accuracy after a few shots and the more high powered the greater the loss of accuracy. The Ham'r is no exception and mine is capable of shooting 1/2 MOA or better 3 shot groups but after 5 rounds I'm lucky to keep it within 1 MOA.

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: dlrz71] #8788518 01/26/23 04:41 PM
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I have a question for those shooting a 13 inch barrel. I was curious what kind of velocities were seen with 115 to 130 grain bullets. Handloads or factory ammo? How was accuracy? Thanks

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: almc] #8789361 01/27/23 06:01 PM
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Originally Posted by almc
I have a question for those shooting a 13 inch barrel. I was curious what kind of velocities were seen with 115 to 130 grain bullets. Handloads or factory ammo? How was accuracy? Thanks


I don't have data for a 13", but here's what I have:

130gr HHC
16.2" 2474fps
11.3" 2322fps
8" 2164fps

150gr SST
16.2" 2296fps
11.3" 2163fps
8" 2013fps

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: Wilson Combat] #8789519 01/27/23 10:46 PM
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Thank you Bill. That helps me to decide if I want to shorten my barrel down from a 16 inch. Maybe not as much velocity loss as I expected. Thanks again!

Re: WILSON COMBAT 300 HAM'R [Re: dlrz71] #8790813 01/29/23 11:12 PM
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Just got back from the range and the loads that I reloaded with the nickel once-fired cases were dead on accurate at 27.6 grains of CFEBLK. That was with the Speer 130's Hot Cor. That will be the pig load for both Ham'R rifles. The 18" barrel shot a 5-shot group all touching but 1 and it was damn near, the 16" barrel was not touching but they were within a 1/2" group. Now for plinking and just to piss people off at the range I will be loading converted LC 5.56 brass. The guy next to us kept saying his 300 BLK could do groups that good but he stopped shooting it when we got there and never would shoot it again.

Now I am curious how much of a change I will get from the WC nickel once-fired cases to converted LC 5.56 cases. Not sure if the case capacity of the LC would matter enough or if I should drop back to 26.8 grains and work back up. Any thoughts? And I know I need a chrony and it is coming soon.


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