Was out doing maintenance on some deer stands and trimming lanes for the coming season in the area I guide in and as I was about to leave I heard a gun shot. Where I was at is pretty close to private property so I decided to drive down the road a little ways to see if I heard another shot but as I come around a sharp bend in the road there is a white F250 taking up the whole road. I stopped and realized there was a woman standing in front of the truck and thought she might need help so I got out to ask if she was alright and then this guy comes walking out of the woods with a rifle to my right. He says hey man I just shot a coyote and I just said oh cool but do you realize this area is closed and off limits for hunting due to troops being in the area training? He tried to play dumb and said he didn't know he was on Ft Hood property and the coyote was after his dog and blah blah blah. I just said ok and went to my truck where I wrote down his license plate as he left. I waited a few minutes and then went to look in the woods where I found a dead coyote pup so I got the grid coordinates along with the grid coordinates where his truck was parked. Called the GW to report him and he took all the info then said I may get suspended from hunting for 7 days for approaching the guy after he does his report and his boss reads it. I said I didn't intentionally approach the guy but that he came out of the woods right next to me. Either way if I had just called and reported hearing a shot without knowing if it was even on FT Hood property they would have just blew me off and thats why I went to check first. I figured if I seen a truck parked off the road I could just get the license plate and drive by then call the GW so they could get him in the act but it didn't work out like that. The rules he broke were having a weapon on Ft Hood, being in a closed area, no area access pass, poaching, hunting with a rifle in a limited range area (Bow, shotgun and blackpowder) and hunting from a public road. Hopefully the GW can track him down with the info I gathered and hopefully they understand the incident and don't get suspended and possibly lose my guide privileges. I guess for now on ill just call the GW and not try to investigate at all on my own.

Sorry, not understanding. Why would you be suspended for approaching? This is a new one to me.

Apparently its a Ft Hood rule they don't want anyone approaching poachers or anyone doing anything wrong in the training areas I guess. Best I can figure is its just a safety thing they don't want any altercations or incidents bc of someone approaching someone.

Thanks - I understand now.

I feel like as long as I get to tell my side of the story I shouldn't be suspended, I mean its not like I drove up and tried to apprehend him or something. I didn't ever even intend to make contact with the guy but when I seen the woman in front of the truck I figured I should ask if she needed anything.

....keep us updated please sir...

FWIW I'd suggest you look up a guy with a handle on TFF & THF of "SallySue" who is now or has guided on Fort property in the past. Lives very near Temple Lake Park...and get him to help 'splain what's going on with the the GW's attitude....and anything else about this incident that'd be helpful to you. The guy in the Ford truck sounds like you describd him "a poacher" and mebbe the GW's thinking is that you are some how mixed up in those going's on.
Ron

I don't think he thinks I had anything to do with it. I have made reports with this GW before when I caught people dumping on FT Hood property in my area. I think he is just pissed I approached him bc he thinks he would have been able to catch him in the act if I hadn't. I have my areas chief guide and the chief guide of guides who will have my back. I was kind of in the wrong technically for making contact with the guy but once I got out of the truck to check on the woman it was out of my hands and he approached me. I played it cool so he wouldn't know I was gonna report him bc I didn't know his history or how he would act if he thought I was gonna turn him in. I think I have a solid defense for the most part since I didn't go looking for trouble.

I think I'm going to go talk to the chief GW tomorrow just to be proactive about it.

That sounds pretty dumb. Only issue would be looking for the game. Hopefully nothing comes of it.

Knowing nothing of the access there, how do they get on the place in the first place?

Well that would suck...try to do something right and end up getting punished. I hope it works out for you.

No good deed...





This. Is there a back gate that's not monitored, or a fenceless boundary of some sort?

Dang, I hope it turn out ok. The truck was in the middle of the road..period

yes there is a road leading into the training areas that is not monitored. You can't get into the garrison part of Ft Hood without going through a gate or checkpoint but there are multiple roads into the training areas that aren't monitored.

Having a sitdown with the GW Spvr IMO is a great idea...might even take your Guide program Spvr too... or even another "credible witness" kinda person....especially if that GW you've gotten some "feedback" from is also gonna be there.

Lake Belton area was the 1st place we looked at in depth to buy a house almost 5 years ago now. Just couldn't get mine at Texoma sold in a timely manner to make it happen...and the then the ante with the DinL's more pressing needs changed everything. Anyway always thought the Ft Hood guides program was a neat deal to get involved with, after talking with SallySue several times...so I have more than a passing interest in how this works out for you.

IMO the Lake Belton area still fits our needs better than any other area else we looked at now that the DinL's needs are no longer an issue again, and I need to get closer to Temples facilities...and might still be possible if I get tired enough of fixin' on this old house in Palestine....or having to commute to Olin Teague or BS&W or Waco more regularly than I am now.
Ron

"yes there is a road leading into the training areas that is not monitored. You can't get into the garrison part of Ft Hood without going through a gate or checkpoint but there are multiple roads into the training areas that aren't monitored."

I've hunted on Camp Bullis and there is no way you can get onto the property without going through a check point. All perimeter access roads have locked gates.
Makes no sense to leave access to the public during these times post 911 especially.
I'd say the poaching problem is on them....No excuse!
And they want to suspend you?..

Seriously?? Sounds like a recipe for disaster....

Ft Hood was taken from civilians these same people off spring are still using the land for their cattle operations. There are prob 5 or more main roads into the training areas so the ranchers can avoid the Garrison and so people recreating can avoid driving through the garrison as well. Its always been like that.

Gotcha. Was just surprised the access to the land is that easy.

I kinda feel the same way but some of these access points are 45 minute drives from the garrison part of Ft Hood where the soldiers work daily. Also Belton Lake Outdoor Recreation Area is right across the street from my area and its open to the public. Poaching and stealing of equipment like feeders and game cams has been a major problem in the past and still is. We had a 4x6 deer stand stolen from our area a few months ago. Its a shame and I wish they would either man that entrance or atlas occasionally man it just to catch violators.

If people can get into a property with little fear of being caught they will press their luck.
Only locked gates will slightly deter them.
Ft Hood would do well, and even the cattle guy if they would get together and put a combination lock on the gates to slow the traffic, but sounds like too many people have free access to the property so it is what it is, a poachers paradise.
Good luck with the suspension since it's called CYA in the military.

locks only keep honest people out...

You didnt approach him!! You said it yourself. He blocked the road so what could you do but stop. Then he came out of the woods.

Update???????

I wonder if they will suspend that guys license for approaching you from the woods. You could have been a poacher just as well as him, how are you supposed to know?
And you are correct, the GW probably would not have investigated. We had a guy shoot a deer from the road on my brothers place. He tried to catch up to him but the shooter had a big head start. We had a dead deer and found two others, also near the road. The GW said there was nothing he do if we couldn't identify the vehicle, he wouldn't even come out. So I suppose we are going to have to approach a poacher close enough to identify him/vehicle, a Catch 22.

I didn't go up there bc I was busy today. I may go tomorrow or I may just wait and see what happens. I truly think he only said I could be suspended so that I won't end up in that situation again. I was thinking what I could have done different but there isn't much I could have done different except maybe turn around or back out when I seen the truck and then call the GW but at that point I didn't know the shot I heard came from that truck. This rule kind of puts the guy doing the right thing in a tough spot if he wants to trim someone in. I mean what good can you do if you just report a shot but have no vehicle description, license plate, description of occupants?

Probably a false imprisonment concern thing; If I suspect poaching or poacher I'm backing out to safe distance and making a phone call to authrities. If someone is willing to poach who says they are not willing to shoot someone. That would be my approach on/off my property.

Its not like I took him to the ground and zip tied him lmao. If I could have been certain the shot came from the training area and not private property then I certainly would have just called the GW and just told him where I heard it and then maybe drove into the woods a little ways and tried to get a vehicle description when and if they drove by.

Sapper I believe the legal definition of false imprisonment is far less than detaining or restraining someone if I recall Business Law accurately. Not saying I agree or disagree with the approach you took.

I know I was kidding. I think its just more of a safety thing and they want to catch the guys in the act so someone making contact with them is likely to scare them off the property before the GW can get to the location.

Pics of the poachers license plates that had some sort of idenifying feature in the frame tree /rock/ vista / beer can or other unique to the location item IMO would go a long way to proving who was where and when...and allow you not to have to approach or interact with the guy.

Also any pics of blood on the ground at impact site/ gut pile / shell casing/ unique tire tracks/ beer cans etc with fingerprints is what made a difference to an incident my chest thumping BinL took too far with a poaching neighbor one time that wound up in court. That was a bad deal all around but got worse in court when everybody's but the BinL was interrelated or long term voters in that small population County. Here anyway you are the designated or authorized person for any hunting activities on that piece of Federal ground. Take care with who's toes get stepped on would be my only other advice...but then you already know that.
Ron

I think it was the gubermint that coined CYA, and "it runs down hill!"

I have pics of the kill and exact grid coordinates but the GW didn't want either of them. He acted like he wasn't interested in catching the guy if he could catch him in the act.

I'm not surprised at the GW's disinterest, since he was not personally involved, from what has been said about the Open Gate policy on that access point and public's apparent abuse use of the area.

My experience at Texoma with Texas GW's was very mixed...a couple of them were great guys and open & welcoming to civilan reports...but there was a couple who you knew were going to be a problem anytime they approached you.

One of them used to jog thru my neighborhood from the GW building & boat launch around the corner from my house in the back of the Little Mineral Marina, and I always greeted him by name to make him look at me as he ran to establish a "I am a Local an Live Here" identity, and continued that everytime I saw him anytime he was in uniform anywhere, even with his wife when they were shopping garage sales and still in uniform....hard to know when they are On & Off duty when in uniform & armed.

Just Sayin' I'd definitely follow up with the Fort's Guide Program Spvr, but keep on being as attentive in your assigned area as instructed by your guy.

The road network in the pic sure looks familiar...but I'd have to see it's realtionship to the water to be sure. We looked at the area off Waterworks Rd and further back east too toward Hanks....
Ron

I may have told this story before but we use to own and live on a 600 acre ranch about half a mile from Ft Hood. One evening right at dark I was down on my property and heard a helicopter overhead. Next thing I know it drops down maybe 200 feet above my truck and hit me with blinding lights. I kept driving and they followed me to my barn. I pulled in under the barn and they dropped down to about 20 feet off the ground trying to shine their spotlight on me - it was a Blackhawk - they then turned their lights off and went back up around 100 feet and hovered. So I started driving towards my house which sat up on a hill. They immediately followed me again with their light on.

As I pulled into my house a truck was coming down my driveway - it was the game warden and he jumped out and started waiving the Blackhawk to leave. I asked him what the hell was going on and he said they thought they were over Ft Hood property and that I was a poacher. Talk about mad - I called the base the next day and spoke to some commander to file a complaint. It was ridiculous. He promised me he would discipline the two pilots.

Fact of life--what one person considers important does not matter to others. over 90% of posts about coyotes and hogs are the same on this forum--kill them all. So someone shoots a coyote and now he is an evil person?? I'm confused.

This thread is more about where it was killed, not that it was killed.

exactly. In a closed area where troops were training and it's also a no rifle area. Only reason I was allowed in there is bc I was doing maintenance on existing equipment which is allowed. Also if he is will to illegally hunt and shoot a coyote chances are he would do the same to a deer if he seen it.

What is confusing about this whole deal to me, is if it is Government land or is it leased by the Government?
I hunted on Camp Bullis near San Antonio, and it is all Government land.
I knew of an incident where a guy was caught on the post where he wasn't suppossed to be, and he was kicked off the property and then had the FBI show up at his door the next day.
No matter the circumstances, just letting poachers come and go as they please is a bit laughable.

Ft Hood is way bigger than Bullis there is no way to control everyone who comes and goes and there is also a lot of lake access on Ft Hood from Belton lake. Poachers will find a way to poach that's what they do. We have reported people in the past and they were caught. Usually it's soldiers who are poaching and usually from a vehicle in a non rifle area with a rifle. The guy I encountered was a solder could tell by his haircut, the way he talked and the fact he had his patrol cap on the dash.