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Coyotes and Fawn Losses #6793555 06/14/17 10:47 PM
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Ranch Dog Offline OP
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Friend of mine got this picture a couple of days ago here in DeWitt County.



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Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6793592 06/14/17 11:31 PM
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don k Offline
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They get more than most on here would care to admit. I have always heard the coyotes are good for the environment. They only take the sick or old. That is BS. Years ago when I had sheep and 1080 was still legal I had the collars that had 1080 in them and put them on old sheep. The coyotes never killed one of them just the young lambs. Oh, and I forgot to mention. I hate coyotes probably more than any other thing in the world.

Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6793623 06/15/17 12:00 AM
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Sad. Just sent this to my landowner. She loves ALL the wildlife that pops up on her cameras but I may get the green light for predator hunting soon. Lol

Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6793675 06/15/17 12:43 AM
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Side note: what is your friend tying to keep out of that pen. That thing has a lot of t-posts.

Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6793684 06/15/17 12:53 AM
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80% of the fawns that don't make it will die in the mouths of coyotes. All other reasons account for the remaining 20% of those that don't survive their first year.

They will also team up to run an adult deer to the point of exhaustion and then take it down. I have seen it happen.

I never give a coyote a pass and never hesitate to bust a hunt to kill one.


"Some people will never like you because your spirit irritates their demons."
Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6793685 06/15/17 12:53 AM
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Another one for the coyote haters


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"Man is still a hunter, still a simple searcher after meat..." Robert C. Ruark
Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Simple Searcher] #6793688 06/15/17 12:57 AM
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Originally Posted By: Simple Searcher
Another one for the coyote haters


Deer feeders create great opportunities for coyotes to sit and wait for doe to show up with fawns. They will sit and watch them just like you do.


"Some people will never like you because your spirit irritates their demons."
Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Texas Dan] #6793725 06/15/17 01:30 AM
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Originally Posted By: Texas Dan
Originally Posted By: Simple Searcher
Another one for the coyote haters


Deer feeders create great opportunities for coyotes to sit and wait for doe to show up with fawns. They will sit and watch them just like you do.


I believe that to be true also. I can't prove it with empirical evidence, but have seen them hang around feeders to kill coons/squirrels in the fall - mostly trail camera pics with some direct observation also. I never ran feeders in the spring anyway. Now I don't run them at all. That's not the main reason I quit, but do I believe not concentrating prey (and thus predators) is a great byproduct of not using feeders. Maybe more than I realize.


Originally Posted by Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: krmitchell] #6793789 06/15/17 02:30 AM
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Originally Posted By: rexmitchell
Side note: what is your friend tying to keep out of that pen. That thing has a lot of t-posts.


As tall as it looks, I think he's trying to keep all the deer out too.

Charlie

Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6793808 06/15/17 02:46 AM
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Here's a good read on the subject.

The research does suggest that anything that brings fawns into the open as routinely as feeders are a coyote's best friend.

Link


"Some people will never like you because your spirit irritates their demons."
Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6793840 06/15/17 03:30 AM
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Fawn deer are a coyotes favorite food. None get a pass from me anywhere.


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Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Texas Dan] #6793904 06/15/17 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted By: Texas Dan
Here's a good read on the subject.

The research does suggest that anything that brings fawns into the open as routinely as feeders are a coyote's best friend.

Link


Good article and yes I will bust a yote any time I can. As far as ruining a hunt I don't think it will unless the deer are there at the same time. I have shot a yote early and left him laying then had deer show afterwards. I'm a believer in shoot stay quite and watch. up

Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6793965 06/15/17 12:18 PM
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Rancher found a den on our place a few years ago and set up a camera on it and the mother coyote would score one fawn per day for about 10 days. Bad thing about deer and coyotes are the coyotes have their pups around the same time deer are dropping fawns.......easy pickings and alot of mouths to feed. And I shoot more coyotes than deer, thats how I try to balance.

Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6794193 06/15/17 03:42 PM
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In a perfect world we have more deer than we want on our property. We have a huge coyote population and many bobcats as well, if it weren't for the number of fawns they kill every year I don't want to know how many deer we would have.

Its an interesting thought but how many of the fawns that fall victim to coyotes would be killed by some other means before maturity? If they all lived they would starve to death.


It's hell eatin em live
Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6794431 06/15/17 07:43 PM
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Watched in person a coyote take down a fawn in my front yard a few years ago. Was in NW Arkansas (I had 23 acres bordered by several hundred acres of pasture land). Backed out of the garage and saw a fawn run through the corner of my yard, followed by a big yote. Caught and killed the fawn before I really even comprehended what I saw. I stared in disbelief as the yote carried the fawn back into the treeline. Mama doe came running down the hill just as then and spent several frantic minutes trying to find junior.

Just for reference, this was the first part of July...at 1:30 in the afternoon.

No yote gets a pass from me.

Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6794441 06/15/17 07:58 PM
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Maybe more deer hunters will start killing them if they could see how many fawns are being lost. That is interesting about the den cam. Good thread.

rifle


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Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: krmitchell] #6794456 06/15/17 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted By: rexmitchell
Side note: what is your friend tying to keep out of that pen. That thing has a lot of t-posts.


My bet is nothing, its a hog trap and he is trying to keep them in.


It's hell eatin em live
Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6794485 06/15/17 08:53 PM
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How long do you suppose yotes have been killing fawns? I agree shoot all you can.

Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: redchevy] #6794488 06/15/17 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted By: redchevy
In a perfect world we have more deer than we want on our property. We have a huge coyote population and many bobcats as well, if it weren't for the number of fawns they kill every year I don't want to know how many deer we would have.

Its an interesting thought but how many of the fawns that fall victim to coyotes would be killed by some other means before maturity? If they all lived they would starve to death.


Like so many things, I'm sure coyote and deer populations are like a pendulum that swings back and forth. Deer populations go up, which results in more coyotes that feed on them. Once deer numbers hit a low, coyote populations drop as well.

Perhaps as the ones who sit atop the food chain, we can help shorten the length of that swing in both directions.

The comments and photos shared seemed to have built a strong case for turning feeders off during those months when fawns start hitting the ground and begin learning how to survive. Better to encourage those does to stay back in the cover as much as possible.


"Some people will never like you because your spirit irritates their demons."
Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6795072 06/16/17 02:57 PM
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Do you think the feeders make the difference? The mommas bed the fawns and then leave them. I see it every day in my parents neighborhood, the fawns are dropped in the acreage subdivision mommas stick em somewhere and head off for hours at a time to eat and I assure you they are not going to feeders.

I'm not speaking out against shooting coyotes either we kill as many as would can, which isn't enough, but I do pose the question what would happen if there weren't any? We wouldn't have enough tags to remove a sufficient number of deer from our property.


It's hell eatin em live
Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6795240 06/16/17 05:24 PM
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I have a study done by a biologist for a large ranch in New Mexico(think trophy mule deer). His fawn recruitment rate was less than 25% annually when he took over management of the ranch. His first job was to start hammering the coyotes hard. Did everything legal to do including helicopter hunts and hosting team coyote calling events with nice prizes. In a couple years his fawn survival rate jumped to 75%. That should give you a good idea as to the effect coyotes have on deer populations. In rural places where deer are out of control, they ought to stock coyotes....


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Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: dkershen] #6795271 06/16/17 05:55 PM
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Originally Posted By: dkershen
I have a study done by a biologist for a large ranch in New Mexico(think trophy mule deer). His fawn recruitment rate was less than 25% annually when he took over management of the ranch. His first job was to start hammering the coyotes hard. Did everything legal to do including helicopter hunts and hosting team coyote calling events with nice prizes. In a couple years his fawn survival rate jumped to 75%. That should give you a good idea as to the effect coyotes have on deer populations. In rural places where deer are out of control, they ought to stock coyotes....


Did their harvest rates and/or densities go up 200%?

Last edited by redchevy; 06/16/17 05:55 PM.

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Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6795562 06/16/17 11:41 PM
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If i have too many deer I just get more hunters. It is easy. I kill coyotes for my Ibex. It is one of those jobs that never ends.

Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: don k] #6795588 06/17/17 12:02 AM
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Originally Posted By: don k
If i have too many deer I just get more hunters. It is easy. I kill coyotes for my Ibex. It is one of those jobs that never ends.


One of my biggest regrets not living at the farm is not being able to get a handle on them suckers. IDK if I ever could with thousands of acres of NF surrounding me that goes unhunted most of the year. One day: rifle


Originally Posted by Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Coyotes and Fawn Losses [Re: Ranch Dog] #6795646 06/17/17 12:48 AM
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None get to walk at my place.

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