I don't believe I said I approve an EO. I said I believe everyone that buys a gun should have a background check. Why would requiring a background check be an issue? It's only an issue to the criminals that can't pass it. And as far guilty until proven innocent, if your background check shows youve been convicted of a crime it's because you had due process and we're found guilty.

.

I wonder if that will affect some people on here that openly admit to using drugs, I assume they aren't lying on the their Form 4473's. So they must be buying their guns second hand, right?

Question 11(e)

The way I read it, is you have to provide the photos/finger prints for every NFA item regardless of how you buy it. Trust, individual, LLC and so on. There is no way of getting around it now. Also if you transferred the NFA item to a trust everyone on the trust (excluding beneficiaries) would then have to go through the process basically you'll be back at square one, might as well have used the trust in the first place.

What about current items on the trust and trustees? Lets just say I wont purchase anything else and put it on my trust, are the trustees on my current trust required to send in fingerprints/photo still?

I have no clue on that one. Wonder if we as trust owners have to send in finger prints and photos for all our previous purchases.

The feeling is that you would not have to. Only if you did another form

Kind of what I'm wondering also. I put too many people on my trust, but figured at some point in time in the future one of them might be using my can or even possibly transporting the can...so I added them as to not get them in trouble. If it comes down to it, I'll just pull them off the trust to keep from having to get 4 extra people to go through fingerprinting/sending a photo in. I get where they are coming from, but jumping through hoops is just that.

It's not...buyer and seller will have to go through an FFL to complete the transfer and BG check.

That is an effect. No more parkinglot purchases. No more mailing a rifle from one man to another within the state.

Yet criminals will continue to get their hands on what ever they want. Short barreled shotgun, all you need is a saw. SBR, all you need is a lathe. Full auto rifles, just basic tools. Suppressors can be made from household items.

This EO will do zero to curb crime, yet make life more of a PITA for law abiding citizens, same as most other gun laws.

This is just the reality of what our government is doing these days, taking something so common sense and mandating it but in the same time doing nothing to solve the problem they are going after. Simply making life worse for everyone else involved.

Another example is the grand medical scheme we call Obamacare. Took a problem (expressed at the time as rising costs of health care and uninsured people) and mandated everyone must have insurance and in a single swipe of the pen made medical care cost more money and didn't do a dang thing to decrease the number of uninsured. Common sense told you that was going to happen.

Just like common sense tells us these new rules will do nothing to curb criminals from doing what they do...

THIS!!!!!^^^^^^^^^

The MAIN thing most of YOU are missing. Todays bullsht is only the FIRST STEP. Yawls' reaction is exactly what the gungrabbers want. We can't cave ONE BIT!!!!!!! Once they get a "common sense" regulation passed, it opens the door for the next, and the next and the next. Soon it will be what we all fear.


God please let a Republican get elected President and Immediately kill this crap. The longer this stays, the sooner it will snowball into more and more laws!!!

If Hillary is elected God help the 2nd Amendment and America. Ya'll better like golf!!!!!

In regards to the fingerprints and photo each time. I think they will be good for 2 years. So, if you were to buy an item within two years of the first you don't need updated info.

What I'm curious about though is what about items currently in possession?

So exactly how are they going to even begin to enforce a face to face sale between two private individuals?

Total goat F*ck!

I believe they will be "grandfathered"

That is exactly what I was wondering. I don't see anyway possible to stop this.

Big Brother is always watching

I will be interested to see how this progresses. As I understand if you are not in the business of selling firearms you wouldn't have to do a background. But there is no clear delineation of what constitutes being in the business. The eo itself says there is no quantity requirement but there are other factors that impact determination. I think there are certain extremes on both ends that we could clearly identify as in or not in the business. But there is a big grey area in the middle

http://blog.princelaw.com/2016/01/05/411-on-the-final-rule-in-relation-to-atf-41p/

Interesting read

I see a lot of future stings being set up on Facebook gun trading pages and forums.

Well that was his objective! Hopefully in November his silliness will end!

The real issue here is the malicious intent of these laws. In spite of the Democratic rhetoric, the long term intent of the party is very clear: virtually total firearm confiscation. The party, as defined by the urban masses, hates hunting as a sport and views firearms as weapons, not as sporting goods. These new laws were created out of their sense of frustration with Congress and are intended as active legal instruments of harassment, since it's clear they will have **no** effect on crime. They are designed to harass ordinary gun owners.

Consider 41p. How many legally registered Class 3 items are used in crimes? Virtually none. Tightening up the requirements of Class 3 ownership can have **no** effect on major crime statistics. It is intended to harass Class 3 owners, virtually all of whom comprise a group of the most law abiding citizens in America. If your sole intent was to protect the American public, why on Earth would you tighten regulation where it was demonstrably unneeded and could have no effect?

Make no mistake, the intent of these laws is to harass and ultimately destroy. They are a demonstration of malicious intent by an administration that's politically impotent and wants to lash out at its adversaries.

Step 2 is a nationwide gun registry....pay attention...it's coming.

I will say as I read the reg this would not effect private sellers selling to each other...only guys who are "dealers" selling used guns. Now, define "dealers"...that is the grey area here.

TXG308 - I don't read the reg to effect two THF'ers selling a gun to have to go to an FFL to do the deal. Just if you sell a used gun (stupid, stupid, stupid...but that is how I read it). Or I'm miss-interpreting the reg (which wouldn't be a first, I'm a software guy not a lawyer )