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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: LuckyHunter]
#5524050
01/06/15 11:00 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Nogalus Prairie
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Some do some don't
IMO I want to go to Africa to shoot African species not hunt a ranch where a fallow or mouflon may walk out So what is the difference? I am sure they have none native game in Africa too. You can take Africa game here. Are the same animals that you take there in a HF different? Cost may also come into play. You shoot a Kudu, Impala, Blesbok, Waterbuck, Gemsbuck in Texas you will spend 35K +-. That will buy a great hunt in Africa. I have hunted HF in both areas. Just check references and you can find first class outfits in both Texas & Africa. Your right post a picture of a hunter with their Kudu and no one can tell if it was taken on HF, LF or NF. You're last sentence perfectly diagnoses the issue. Many only care about the picture-fewer and fewer actually care about the hunt anymore.
Last edited by Nogalus Prairie; 01/06/15 11:02 PM.
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524053
01/06/15 11:03 PM
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 323
Matt1023
Bird Dog
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Bird Dog
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Posts: 323 |
Ive hunted SA 3 times, all under high fence. I think the smallest acreage I was on is 4,000. I know to some any acreage under HF is a no-go, but 4000 acres is a lot of country. Most concessions are tens of thousands of acres. The high fence helps keep put predators,poachers,an obviously is keeping the animals in. Poachers are a HUGE problem, and in Tanzania we actually came across some poachers. It was a pretty scary event. Our side won though A high fence is not going to do much to deter poachers, but its better than nothing. Ive also hunted Tanzania which was LF. For the most part I saw basically the same amount and type of animals, except for the Leopard and Lesser Kudu I killed. Both countries are an amazing experience, but SA is much much cheaper. No one should ever let the fact that there is a fence surrounding a game farm keep them from going to Africa. High Fence or not, Africa is an amazing place, and an amazing experience.
www.1023media.com/outdoorsClick the link above to check out our hunting ranch / breeder promo videos. Would love to film your ranch next!
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524069
01/06/15 11:11 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Nogalus Prairie
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I don't have much of an opinion except to say that, for the most part, comparing the two is apples and oranges. Africa has a unique set of issues with which it must deal. And the concessions are generally very large (this is changing fast in SA however-which is fast becoming to Africa what Texas is to the U.S.).
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: Nogalus Prairie]
#5524087
01/06/15 11:19 PM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 44,461
rifleman
Sparkly Pants
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I don't have much of an opinion except to say that, for the most part, comparing the two is apples and oranges. Africa has a unique set of issues with which it must deal. And the concessions are generally very large (this is changing fast in SA however-which is fast becoming to Africa what Texas is to the U.S.). It's not really apples to oranges. The fences started here to keep ppl out, then mutated into a management tool to cover up years and years of mismanagement. Same concept applies over there regardless of which side of the argument a person is on.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524108
01/06/15 11:30 PM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 14,951
don k
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Africa makes the purest think that a HF is alright to hunt in. That way they can still bash the HF's in Texas.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: Nogalus Prairie]
#5524110
01/06/15 11:32 PM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,207
LuckyHunter
Veteran Tracker
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Some do some don't
IMO I want to go to Africa to shoot African species not hunt a ranch where a fallow or mouflon may walk out So what is the difference? I am sure they have none native game in Africa too. You can take Africa game here. Are the same animals that you take there in a HF different? Cost may also come into play. You shoot a Kudu, Impala, Blesbok, Waterbuck, Gemsbuck in Texas you will spend 35K +-. That will buy a great hunt in Africa. I have hunted HF in both areas. Just check references and you can find first class outfits in both Texas & Africa. Your right post a picture of a hunter with their Kudu and no one can tell if it was taken on HF, LF or NF. You're last sentence perfectly diagnoses the issue. Most only care about the picture-few care about the hunt anymore. I grew up caring only about the pursuit, the adventure, the quest. I've spent 15 days and never pulled the trigger on a Brown Bear "But I've hunted Brown Bear"... I've spent 14 days hunting Bighorn without pulling the trigger, "But I've hunted Bighorn"..... So how can I hunt a HF. I guess because it better provide the pursuit, the adventure, the quest, or I'm out of there. Yes there is good and yes there is bad in everything you pursue. I will not accept the bad. Then again maybe I'm the only person who's brain does not focus only on the height of a fence but more on the quality of pursuit. (and yes it can happen). Last year I spent 14 days on one large HF ranch chasing one mouflon ram and never connected. Then again sometimes on opening day in New Mexico that 17" pronghorn antelope just walks right up to you and bam it's over. Or the 10 days you spend Elk hunting in Colorado only to find no elk but a haven for monster mule deer... or the time... All God's country is beautiful no matter where I stand. HF.LF,NF. Then maybe I'm just out of touch because I've only hunted because the voices in my head tell me to. Stay tuned next year my handle will be cathunter... no deerhunter.... no exotichunter.....no bearhunter...
Lucky 7 Exotic Ranch located in Eden, Tx. Well managed self sustaining herds roaming our 3,000 acre ranch. First Class Lodging, Ranch style meals and qualified guides. 30+ species.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524217
01/07/15 12:30 AM
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 14,951
don k
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I too only enjoy the hunt. I guided for many years. Both HF and LF. To be truthful many times the HF was the harder of the hunts. I hunted for many years in both NM and CO. That was back when you bought the license over the counter. Most of the time I came home empty handed. Even so it was a good hunt. I shot one MD in probably 20 years of hunting that I thought was worth mounting. I never took an elk that I thought that of even though I saw and hunted some. IMO most that bash HF have maybe hunted in places like TT or the place in Mason. Most excluding the WT ear tag places are a real hunt. Hunting back when I guided was fun for a few years then I got burned out. I think it was not the hunting that did it but some of the hunters I guided. Most were good to be around but when you guide a few in a row that are PITA's it wears you down. Now I don't really guide. I put the hunters in a stand and let them take what they want. If they want to know what a typical deer here will score I don't let them come. I charge so much a point and unless you are a complete idiot you know when you pull the trigger what it is going to cost. Now if Africa was like CO. and they let you hunt on your own instead of baby sitting you it might be a good hunt. Some of the western States hunting MD or Elk or like NP did hunting Sheep is still a real hunt.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524229
01/07/15 12:36 AM
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 25,301
Creekrunner
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Now if Africa was like CO. and they let you hunt on your own instead of baby sitting you it might be a good hunt. There are a few DIY hunts in western Africa. When do you want to go?
...and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. Gen. 1:28
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524308
01/07/15 01:06 AM
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 2,216
kyle1974
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damn... now some people are going half way around the world to complain about high fence....
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524320
01/07/15 01:12 AM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 44,461
rifleman
Sparkly Pants
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There's stuff over there that scares the mess out of penicillin, I ain't going, LF, NF, HF... I've watched Outbreak & I'm not going to be the carrier monkey.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: rifleman]
#5524324
01/07/15 01:15 AM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Nogalus Prairie
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There's stuff over there that scares the mess out of penicillin, I ain't going, LF, NF, HF... I've watched Outbreak & I'm not going to be the carrier monkey. "Don't worry Bwana, my tongue is only blue because I've been eating berries." (Cough, cough.....)
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524326
01/07/15 01:16 AM
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 110,797
dogcatcher
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Combat Infantryman, the ultimate hunter where the prey shoots back. _____________"Illegitimus non carborundum est"_______________
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524346
01/07/15 01:23 AM
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 25,301
Creekrunner
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Current flu deaths in US At least 601 people in the U.S. died of influenza or pneumonia during the 52nd week of the year, down from 837 the previous week, according to data collected by the CDC’s 122 Cities Mortality Reporting System. The 601 deaths accounted for 6.8% of the 8,893 total deaths in the last full week of the year, just missing the 6.9% threshold to qualify as an epidemic. How many Ebola deaths in US from "carriers"? Perspective.
...and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. Gen. 1:28
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524361
01/07/15 01:28 AM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Nogalus Prairie
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Seriously, I would love to go to Africa one day. Would even love to take my my family. Sounds like fun-mostly because of the country and abundance of game. From what I have seen, it looks like most of the challenge (on non-dangerous game at least) is making a clean shots. Just a different type of hunting than in North America.
Heck, would probably enjoy a photo safari about as much as hunting.....
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524381
01/07/15 01:38 AM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,396
Pittstate
THF Trophy Hunter
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You either do all the work yourself by planting plots, supplemental feeding, mineral sites, scouting countless hours and finally putting the stand in the right spot at the right time to harvest that "buck of a lifetime"..........or you can pay someone else to do all the work but pull the trigger for you....I don't see where the height (if any) of the fence matters in the latter situation.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524441
01/07/15 01:58 AM
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 5,092
Elkhunter49
THF Trophy Hunter
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HF vs LF... Africa vs Texas... as usual with me it all boils down to what you like. Much like Don, I have spent many years (25+) hunting the Rockies in most western states except Nevada and Washington. As a much younger man I truly loved the physical challange of the hunt and considered the tougher the terrain the better the hunt. Many many times I came home with nothing but a smile and a contented feeling of accomplishment in a hunt done right!
Well I've got news for you guys. If your lucky most of you are going to get old some day and everything that you think you know about hunting and life may change. Maybe one day in your mid forties you will go to bed feeling as strong and confident as you always have and wake up the next day and just know something's not right but you go to work like always and spend the next few months telling yourself that you can work thru the pain. And then just maybe a few months later you finally go to the Dr. and he tells you what you had feared but didn't want to face. Then maybe you go to MD Anderson weighing 288lbs and 13 months later by the grace of God and some amazing doctors and nurses you get to drag your hull of a body home at 143lbs and start trying to recover. Maybe after returning to work you get the urge to shoot your rifle again and find out that extensive radiadion to your head will really compromise your already not so great eyesight. Maybe the months of chemo make walking difficult so then maybe your at a cross road as a hunter. Do you quit and walk away from something that you have loved all your life or do you try and find a way to stay in the game.
I thought about what I wanted and decided that I would really like to go to the Dark Continent for a safari. Someday I still hope to but for now I normally hunt about 2 times a year with my wife or some of my old hunting buddies. I normally hunt HF exotic ranches here in Texas. Does this make me less of a hunter? I know it's my age but my priorities have changed. For me getting to meet the landowner and the folks that work on the ranch is a huge deal. I used to get aggravated if I saw another hunter that wasn't in my group, now I just smile and look forward to making a new friend. I've had some fantastic hunts on HF ranches here in Texas that were every bit as challenging as some of the public land hunting I've done. No body can ever tell me any different. Folks I'm sorry for the long note I'm not to good at expressing myself but I hope you get this from my message. Before you start saying I'll never do this or I'm never going to hunt there just stop for a minute, take a deep breath and realize things in your life can change. God Blessed Texas and God has blessed this old Texan. Roland Baker
Last edited by Elkhunter49; 01/07/15 02:01 AM.
A true friend reaches for your hand but touches your heart.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: Elkhunter49]
#5524467
01/07/15 02:06 AM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,207
LuckyHunter
Veteran Tracker
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,207 |
HF vs LF... Africa vs Texas... as usual with me it all boils down to what you like. Much like Don, I have spent many years (25+) hunting the Rockies in most western states except Nevada and Washington. As a much younger man I truly loved the physical challange of the hunt and considered the tougher the terrain the better the hunt. Many many times I came home with nothing but a smile and a contented feeling of accomplishment in a hunt done right!
Well I've got news for you guys. If your lucky most of you are going to get old some day and everything that you think you know about hunting and life may change. Maybe one day in your mid forties you will go to bed feeling as strong and confident as you always have and wake up the next day and just know something's not right but you go to work like always and spend the next few months telling yourself that you can work thru the pain. And then just maybe a few months later you finally go to the Dr. and he tells you what you had feared but didn't want to face. Then maybe you go to MD Anderson weighing 288lbs and 13 months later by the grace of God and some amazing doctors and nurses you get to drag your hull of a body home at 143lbs and start trying to recover. Maybe after returning to work you get the urge to shoot your rifle again and find out that extensive radiadion to your head will really compromise your already not so great eyesight. Maybe the months of chemo make walking difficult so then maybe your at a cross road as a hunter. Do you quit and walk away from something that you have loved all your life or do you try and find a way to stay in the game.
I thought about what I wanted and decided that I would really like to go to the Dark Continent for a safari. Someday I still hope to but for now I normally hunt about 2 times a year with my wife or some of my old hunting buddies. I normally hunt HF exotic ranches here in Texas. Does this make me less of a hunter? I know it's my age but my priorities have changed. For me getting to meet the landowner and the folks that work on the ranch is a huge deal. I used to get aggravated if I saw another hunter that wasn't in my group, now I just smile and look forward to making a new friend. I've had some fantastic hunts on HF ranches here in Texas that were every bit as challenging as some of the public land hunting I've done. No body can ever tell me any different. Folks I'm sorry for the long note I'm not to good at expressing myself but I hope you get this from my message. Before you start saying I'll never do this or I'm never going to hunt there just stop for a minute, take a deep breath and realize things in your life can change. God Blessed Texas and God has blessed this old Texan. Roland Baker Nothing else needs to be said. God Bless you Sir.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524552
01/07/15 02:45 AM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 11,916
Simple Searcher
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Sheephunter, I love a good debate and I had a great rebuttal typed out for our disagreement, but then it hit me that I really don't need to do that, it could go on forever. I think you and I would agree on most hunting subjects if we didn't let silly details confuse thing. We are clearly passionate about hunting. God speed.
"Man is still a hunter, still a simple searcher after meat..." Robert C. Ruark
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5524565
01/07/15 02:49 AM
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 28,032
Navasot
Hollywood
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Hollywood
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 28,032 |
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: Simple Searcher]
#5524581
01/07/15 02:56 AM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,207
LuckyHunter
Veteran Tracker
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,207 |
Sheephunter, I love a good debate and I had a great rebuttal typed out for our disagreement, but then it hit me that I really don't need to do that, it could go on forever. I think you and I would agree on most hunting subjects if we didn't let silly details confuse thing. We are clearly passionate about hunting. God speed. maybe one day over a brew my treat.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: Creekrunner]
#5524604
01/07/15 03:05 AM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 44,461
rifleman
Sparkly Pants
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Sparkly Pants
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 44,461 |
Current flu deaths in US At least 601 people in the U.S. died of influenza or pneumonia during the 52nd week of the year, down from 837 the previous week, according to data collected by the CDC’s 122 Cities Mortality Reporting System. The 601 deaths accounted for 6.8% of the 8,893 total deaths in the last full week of the year, just missing the 6.9% threshold to qualify as an epidemic. How many Ebola deaths in US from "carriers"? Perspective. How many in Africa? How many diseases that we have/had immunized out over here? Perspective.
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: Elkhunter49]
#5524863
01/07/15 05:59 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,527
7ARanch
Pro Tracker
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Posts: 1,527 |
HF vs LF... Africa vs Texas... as usual with me it all boils down to what you like. Much like Don, I have spent many years (25+) hunting the Rockies in most western states except Nevada and Washington. As a much younger man I truly loved the physical challange of the hunt and considered the tougher the terrain the better the hunt. Many many times I came home with nothing but a smile and a contented feeling of accomplishment in a hunt done right!
Well I've got news for you guys. If your lucky most of you are going to get old some day and everything that you think you know about hunting and life may change. Maybe one day in your mid forties you will go to bed feeling as strong and confident as you always have and wake up the next day and just know something's not right but you go to work like always and spend the next few months telling yourself that you can work thru the pain. And then just maybe a few months later you finally go to the Dr. and he tells you what you had feared but didn't want to face. Then maybe you go to MD Anderson weighing 288lbs and 13 months later by the grace of God and some amazing doctors and nurses you get to drag your hull of a body home at 143lbs and start trying to recover. Maybe after returning to work you get the urge to shoot your rifle again and find out that extensive radiadion to your head will really compromise your already not so great eyesight. Maybe the months of chemo make walking difficult so then maybe your at a cross road as a hunter. Do you quit and walk away from something that you have loved all your life or do you try and find a way to stay in the game.
I thought about what I wanted and decided that I would really like to go to the Dark Continent for a safari. Someday I still hope to but for now I normally hunt about 2 times a year with my wife or some of my old hunting buddies. I normally hunt HF exotic ranches here in Texas. Does this make me less of a hunter? I know it's my age but my priorities have changed. For me getting to meet the landowner and the folks that work on the ranch is a huge deal. I used to get aggravated if I saw another hunter that wasn't in my group, now I just smile and look forward to making a new friend. I've had some fantastic hunts on HF ranches here in Texas that were every bit as challenging as some of the public land hunting I've done. No body can ever tell me any different. Folks I'm sorry for the long note I'm not to good at expressing myself but I hope you get this from my message. Before you start saying I'll never do this or I'm never going to hunt there just stop for a minute, take a deep breath and realize things in your life can change. God Blessed Texas and God has blessed this old Texan. Roland Baker Roland, glad you won the fight and your still amongst us enjoying the choices our country allows.
Destroyer 340; Easton Flatline; Grim Reapers Not as Mean Not as Lean but still a Marine
Billy Bob: My nose is dripping on my balls...
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5525049
01/07/15 01:41 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,757
Rob Lay
Pro Tracker
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Pro Tracker
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Posts: 1,757 |
we know most South Africa hunts are HF. We know many take a lion on their South Africa hunt. do these lions roam in the HF 24/7/365 possibly eating other valued game?
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: Rob Lay]
#5525202
01/07/15 02:53 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,486
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
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kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,486 |
we know most South Africa hunts are HF. We know many take a lion on their South Africa hunt. do these lions roam in the HF 24/7/365 possibly eating other valued game? Sometimes they out smart the hunters and live there longer then wanted, other times that don't make it long. But your own question awesers why the market is what it is and how they came to be " is what it is" for lions Remember TH giraffe...26 hunters tried to kill it...
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Re: HF in Texas Vs. HF in Africa
[Re: don k]
#5525247
01/07/15 03:15 PM
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Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 632
505ed
Tracker
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Tracker
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Posts: 632 |
I too have hunted both HF in Texas (2,300 ac)and once in Africa. We hunted 2 farms one that was a little over 6,000 ac and one that was 9,400 ac. I will tell you I did not feel any of those hunts were canned, on the African trip we worked very hard to get the Kudu,and Eland "in the salt". Guys any brush country over 1000 ac is a pretty big place. The smallest place in Africa I hunted was close to10 square miles. Most of the animals range is a lot less than that. Did I see fences...yes! Did I think the hunt was "canned"...No. I hunted on open consession too--around 200,000 ac. Where did we hunt? Well we hunted different areas, for different stuff. We hunted waterbuck on about 2,000 ac...why? Because that's where they liked to hang out. I can tell you there are many positives about hunting a HF ranch. Most limiting factor most of us have is time. We cannot book a hunt for 20 days, we have at most half that time. We also want to have a good chance at success...that's what we pay for...right? The animals are there. That does not mean we will take it. I had a friend go 2 trips to take a good kudu " over 50". He hunted 4 really good HF places. I know the Kudu were there...but he was not successful. Could you have baited them...yes. But it would not have been near as "sporting". I think the focus should be more on baiting and less on the HF...just my opinion.
Ed
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