I know what the CDS is. It's a dumbed down 1/4 MOA, with different labels.

Here's the trouble with it. In order to get dials perfect, MV and BC has to be exact. What chronograph did you use to report to Leupold? Is it accurate?

What BC did did you report? Did the bullet manufacturer give accurate data?

What environmental conditions did you set the turret up for? Is that the only environmental conditions you will ever shoot it? If it is not, then the dials will be wrong, beyond 500 yards, very often.

With a Mil or MOA based turret the end user can adjust as needed, based on the environmental conditions at the time of the shot.

And by the way, gravity is the easy part, wind is the trick. That's where the proper reticle comes into play, and for wind holds, Mil is far and away easier to deal with.

I got behind David Tubb kowa at a match and wasn't overly blown away. Keep in mind he runs like a fixed 27x long eye relief eye piece. Swaro spotters and slc binos best pretty much anything I've been behind. The army amu nikon image stabilization binos were pretty nice but my understanding was not overly available but I've not looked.

Rifle scopes are something completely different and the euro dominte still if you get behind them. Some jap scopes are there too but a majority aren't. I'll agree schott isn't end all be all but theres a good chance it'll be tough to find problems if in a quality product.

You obviously have to shoot and verify before making the dial. Same goes with verifying a mil/mil setup.

I'm well aware of verification of Mil or MOA. And often something does not line up. That's where adjustments can be made and the end user can get dialed in perfect. I wouldn't bet on Leupold being able to do the same, especially beyond 500 yards.

In my case, over the past 3 years, you'd be wrong.

So what's night force's glass in all three lines.

Evidently it is my imagination that elevation needs adjustment based on environtment. I have no idea how I hit those pieces of steel out to a mile. Must have been God that willed them in.

I will watch for Leupold CDS turrets to show up in PRS. They are clearly the right way. And we have been doing it the wrong way.

[quote=dee]I got behind David Tubb kowa at a match and wasn't overly blown away. Keep in mind he runs like a fixed 27x long eye relief eye piece. Swaro spotters and slc binos best pretty much anything I've been behind. The army amu nikon image stabilization binos were pretty nice but my understanding was not overly available but I've not looked.

Rifle scopes are something completely different and the euro dominte still if you get behind them. Some jap scopes are there too but a majority aren't. I'll agree schott isn't end all be all but theres a good chance it'll be tough to find problems if in a quality product.

So what's night force's glass in all three lines.

Hunting scopes, competition scopes, doesn't matter. Distance is distance.

In fact, keeping a bullet in the vitals of anything smaller than an elk at 600+ is more difficult that hitting a 1 1/2 MOA, or 2 MOA piece of steel at 600+.

I only mentioned it in response to waiting for them to show up in PRS. Very limited options with them and MOA only. Quite a few people have excellent luck with them anyway

That was a jab from me. He's just going to disagree with me every chance he gets. Doesn't matter if he means it or not.

My point was, it is simple fact that adjustments HAVE to be made, based on environment, beyond 500 yards. This happens on my range, throughout the year. Cold air is thick air, bullets drop more. Hot air is thin air, bullets drop less.

Then get in the truck and drive 250 miles NW, and it's a whole new ballgame. Higher elevation, and thinner air.

Last month I got there at 5 pm, checked zero at 100, and consulted the ballistic calculator for 1000 yards. First round hit, same at 1100 yards, and 1350 yards. Had I performed the exact same exercise at 6 am, the next morning there would have been a different set of corrections, no doubt about it.

Oh ok didn't know that haha

I definitely agree with needing a turret you can make changes with. If I ever got a vx6 for a hunting rifle it would be a plain MOA turret and not "custom"

Hopefully once my 6.5saum is done I'll get to come shoot and pick your brain.

CDS are hunting scopes. They also will make a straight MOA turret instead of load specific if you want

Oh ok didn't know that haha

I definitely agree with needing a turret you can make changes with. If I ever got a vx6 for a hunting rifle it would be a plain MOA turret and not "custom"

Evidently that went over the fireman's head. He obviously missed the posts where I've repeatedly said that for constant twisting of turrets, NF is the deal.

Also, to say I disagree with FJG's posts just for the sake of disagreeing is erroneous, as you have to give a schittt what someone says to do so, and in his case I don't.

I missed nothing.

You claim yours has worked every time beyond 500. I call Unless you shoot the exact same location, in the exact same conditions every single shot. Physics are physics, no matter what you want to believe otherwise. And by the way, I watch bullets go down range 52 weeks a year and record data from it. So just because you want to disagree, doesnt mean you are right. At least not here in the real world.

To PRS guys, its about the sponsor.