Forums46
Topics538,030
Posts9,732,142
Members87,055
|
Most Online25,604 Feb 12th, 2024
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6552269
11/21/16 02:57 AM
|
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 59
zbot
Outdoorsman
|
Outdoorsman
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 59 |
I like copper due to the lack of massive damage I have seen with other bullets. I might shoot a blackbuck doe one week and shoot a cow elk in the mountains the next week. BB doe died quick, after a bad shot and I didn't lose half the meat like I would have with other bullets. Some WT deer, with other bullets like the SST, I lose both shoulders. Really ruins the hunt for me when I'm throwing two shoulders away.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6552301
11/21/16 03:19 AM
|
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 680
fmrmbmlm
Tracker
|
Tracker
Joined: Sep 2016
Posts: 680 |
Haven't hunted in almost 20 yrs. due to health problems, but never had a problem with full penetration and minimal meat damage using Sierra Pro Hunter spt 150 gr in a 30-06. Used 46.5gr. IMR 4062, only on whitetail.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6552303
11/21/16 03:20 AM
|
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 4,070
Pig_Popper
Extreme Tracker
|
Extreme Tracker
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 4,070 |
This discussion is interesting - good opinions and some valid points throughout .
I'm surprised the subject of specialty rounds hasn't been brought up.
Wouldn't this really be the optimal solution for those who want penetration and expansion , I'm specially talking about those projectiles that the front half separates from the base.
Seems like neck shooters who want to save meat and eradication teams that want to inflict mass trauma would all be served dependent on shot placement.
Oh yeah and if you want to practice find a cheap plinking projectile and tune your charge rate to match the pricey bullets point of impact - also if shooting a semi load the top two rounds with pricey stuff and plinking rounds for the low percentage running shots .
This space is For Sale - inquire within ...
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6552624
11/21/16 02:29 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 705
Age N Score ?
Tracker
|
Tracker
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 705 |
I Feed Indian Corn. The deer love it and all the colors make them stay at the feeder longer.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6553225
11/21/16 09:29 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 5,922
Jgraider
THF Trophy Hunter
|
THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 5,922 |
As long as Accubond's and partitions are accurate in my hunting rifles, which they definitely are, I have zero need for anything else.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6553383
11/21/16 10:52 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 31,955
txtrophy85
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 31,955 |
I've seen a lot of game shot with 150 grain Barnes bullets from 7mms and .300 mags
From my experience, unless you hit a shoulder bone, it's straight in and out.
If I'm shooting a deer for meat, it's neck or head, and it really don't matter at that point.
If it's a trophy, I want the bullet to cause massive internal damage and in my experience a Barnes bullet in the 3000 fps range doesent cause it
For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: txtrophy85]
#6553635
11/22/16 01:45 AM
|
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Nogalus Prairie
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091 |
I've seen a lot of game shot with 150 grain Barnes bullets from 7mms and .300 mags
From my experience, unless you hit a shoulder bone, it's straight in and out.
If I'm shooting a deer for meat, it's neck or head, and it really don't matter at that point.
If it's a trophy, I want the bullet to cause massive internal damage and in my experience a Barnes bullet in the 3000 fps range doesent cause it That's true. But the TSX does more internal damage than meets the eye (see ballistic gel tests). Have shot one ram and one buck with them (buck was simply because using same rifle later in same year). Ram went 10 yards and collapsed and deer went maybe 40 yards with a great blood trail. That said, I do not prefer them for deer-sized game and won't use them again for deer unless the caliber is small. Even then, I would probably go with an AB or NP or something similar. Monometals are designed to achieve penetration - every time. So their real sweet spot is really for larger, tougher animals.
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6556294
11/23/16 10:45 PM
|
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 22,716
BigPig
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 22,716 |
Chad, what's your take on the new ELDX? I shot a bobcat and a yote this weekend and it ripped them open, massive damage. This was the 178gr 30-06 version. Curious as to what results to expect on a deer or pig?
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6556398
11/24/16 12:07 AM
|
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 5,167
flintknapper
THF Trophy Hunter
|
THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 5,167 |
Curious as to what results to expect on a deer or pig? Can't speak for the 30 cal, but I was present when my Brother shot a Buck and a Hog with his 6.5 Creedmoor (143 gr. ELDX). Both animals ran about 40 yards and expired. Internal organs damaged to about the degree I have seen with other bullets.
Spartans ask not...how many, but where!
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6557702
11/25/16 01:19 AM
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,738
passthru
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,738 |
Give me a Federal Fusion.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6557719
11/25/16 01:37 AM
|
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 11,913
Simple Searcher
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 11,913 |
The adverting hype behind bullets beats anything that candidates can put out in an election. There are more acronyms for bullets than I have time to mention. Just get an old soft-point or a hollow-point and put it where it counts. The deer will die. I think the hunting community has become obsessed with the latest-greatest craze.
"Man is still a hunter, still a simple searcher after meat..." Robert C. Ruark
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6557745
11/25/16 02:02 AM
|
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 3,469
vanguard
Veteran Tracker
|
Veteran Tracker
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 3,469 |
shoot deer at 100 yds with 308 and sp bullet nice exit good blood dead deer, now comes deer hunter with 300 mag same deer 100 yds and problems occur, no exit bullet comes apart dead deer but hunter want exit wound, buys bonded bullets shoots deer nice exit recovers deer, hes right back where we started with 308 and sp bullets. my advice use cartridge with sp bullets at ranges cartridges were designed for.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: vanguard]
#6557758
11/25/16 02:12 AM
|
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 31,955
txtrophy85
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 31,955 |
shoot deer at 100 yds with 308 and sp bullet nice exit good blood dead deer, now comes deer hunter with 300 mag same deer 100 yds and problems occur, no exit bullet comes apart dead deer but hunter want exit wound, buys bonded bullets shoots deer nice exit recovers deer, hes right back where we started with 308 and sp bullets. my advice use cartridge with sp bullets at ranges cartridges were designed for. Yep pretty much. I've been killing deer with cup and core bullets for 20 years only shot a few with "premium" bullets. Never lost one with interlocks or core-lokts
For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6558034
11/25/16 01:27 PM
|
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 1,091
Wacm
Pro Tracker
|
Pro Tracker
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 1,091 |
Berger works well if you want copper. I like the high ballistic c. I found accubonds to be close enough. I shot many many animals to prove. I always got good penetration and good retention vs expansion. My favorite example is this hog shot at 930 y. He never took a step. Bullet still made it through him. There was a huge pool of blood where he fell. Honestly is was a marginal shot. Hit him maybe at the tail end of his lungs. Definitely liver.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6558043
11/25/16 01:32 PM
|
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 1,091
Wacm
Pro Tracker
|
Pro Tracker
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 1,091 |
Hog is a tad under 300lb. Exit hole was about an inch in dia. I think that's sufficient on such a thick skinned heavy animal.
Another great thing about accubonds is it's much easier to clean my barrel. Dang vlds required copper solvent soak. My barrel showed a huge decline in long range accuracy after a dozen shots or so
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6558058
11/25/16 01:39 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 11,913
Simple Searcher
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 11,913 |
"Man is still a hunter, still a simple searcher after meat..." Robert C. Ruark
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6558063
11/25/16 01:43 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 21,271
SniperRAB
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 21,271 |
The Berger 130gr VLD's have done me well in the .264 Can't base a bullet off of 2 animals killed 10 years apart Most modern ammunition performs well if you know how to place it. I like the Bergers and the Swift Scirocco II, they both feed well and perform well.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: Simple Searcher]
#6558165
11/25/16 02:57 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,173
J.G.
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 41,173 |
How'd you do that?
800 Yard Steel Range Precision Rifle Instruction Memberships and Classes Available
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: Pig_Popper]
#6560521
11/27/16 04:40 PM
|
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 31,055
HWY_MAN
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 31,055 |
This discussion is interesting - good opinions and some valid points throughout .
I'm surprised the subject of specialty rounds hasn't been brought up.
Wouldn't this really be the optimal solution for those who want penetration and expansion , I'm specially talking about those projectiles that the front half separates from the base.
Seems like neck shooters who want to save meat and eradication teams that want to inflict mass trauma would all be served dependent on shot placement.
Oh yeah and if you want to practice find a cheap plinking projectile and tune your charge rate to match the pricey bullets point of impact - also if shooting a semi load the top two rounds with pricey stuff and plinking rounds for the low percentage running shots .
And this is the reason I shoot Nosler Partitions, while it's not the best of both worlds it does give me the ability to take either a heart lung or a shoulder shot with confidence.
Yes! A Weatherby does kill them deader.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6563908
11/29/16 05:23 PM
|
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,344
Ag Hunter 78
Pro Tracker
|
Pro Tracker
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,344 |
Chevy: I had thought about that also. I tried the Barnes TTSX initially with my 270 and was 2 for 2 on deer that season, both DRT with neck shots. The next year I batted 1000 with my 7mm 08. My buddy also dropped a Utah elk with one shot at 200 yards with 165 grain TTSX with my 300 wsm. Chad did some custom reloads using 120 grain TTSX for my 6.5x284 and I dropped 2 bucks last year with lower neck shots. All my rifles shoot consistently and accurately with the Barnes bullets. That's critical because on a neck shot I have to be sure to hit the vertebrae. Maybe my results aren't typical, but so far so good and it makes sense to stick with what works (for me anyway).
No prayer in school....What's next, no thinking in church? It's not just about pie in the sky when you die. It's also about steak on your plate while you wait!
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: HWY_MAN]
#6564697
11/30/16 01:18 AM
|
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 5,922
Jgraider
THF Trophy Hunter
|
THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 5,922 |
And this is the reason I shoot Nosler Partitions, while it's not the best of both worlds it does give me the ability to take either a heart lung or a shoulder shot with confidence.
Best hunting bullet ever made IMO.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#6564716
11/30/16 01:22 AM
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,263
A.B.
Obi-Wan Kenobi
|
Obi-Wan Kenobi
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,263 |
I shot nothing but Barnes X from 95 to 09 out my 270 and 300. I was a big believer in what goes in must come out. Starting in 2010 I started back where I started shooting my 243 with 100gr. Partitions. I never lost a deer with the Barnes, but dang few dropped in their tracks. With the 243 they tend to drop where they stand. Lot smaller bullet with a lot less energy, but the greater transfer of energy makes a difference.
Talent is a gift, character is a decision.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: Nogalus Prairie]
#6564729
11/30/16 01:26 AM
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,263
A.B.
Obi-Wan Kenobi
|
Obi-Wan Kenobi
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 12,263 |
I've seen a lot of game shot with 150 grain Barnes bullets from 7mms and .300 mags
From my experience, unless you hit a shoulder bone, it's straight in and out.
If I'm shooting a deer for meat, it's neck or head, and it really don't matter at that point.
If it's a trophy, I want the bullet to cause massive internal damage and in my experience a Barnes bullet in the 3000 fps range doesent cause it That's true. But the TSX does more internal damage than meets the eye (see ballistic gel tests). Have shot one ram and one buck with them (buck was simply because using same rifle later in same year). Ram went 10 yards and collapsed and deer went maybe 40 yards with a great blood trail. That said, I do not prefer them for deer-sized game and won't use them again for deer unless the caliber is small. Even then, I would probably go with an AB or NP or something similar. Monometals are designed to achieve penetration - every time. So their real sweet spot is really for larger, tougher animals. Can't go wrong with either AB or NP......
Talent is a gift, character is a decision.
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: A.B.]
#6565074
11/30/16 04:29 AM
|
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 21,271
SniperRAB
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 21,271 |
I've seen a lot of game shot with 150 grain Barnes bullets from 7mms and .300 mags
From my experience, unless you hit a shoulder bone, it's straight in and out.
If I'm shooting a deer for meat, it's neck or head, and it really don't matter at that point.
If it's a trophy, I want the bullet to cause massive internal damage and in my experience a Barnes bullet in the 3000 fps range doesent cause it That's true. But the TSX does more internal damage than meets the eye (see ballistic gel tests). Have shot one ram and one buck with them (buck was simply because using same rifle later in same year). Ram went 10 yards and collapsed and deer went maybe 40 yards with a great blood trail. That said, I do not prefer them for deer-sized game and won't use them again for deer unless the caliber is small. Even then, I would probably go with an AB or NP or something similar. Monometals are designed to achieve penetration - every time. So their real sweet spot is really for larger, tougher animals. Can't go wrong with either AB or NP......
|
|
|
Re: Why I prefer lead bullets over solid copper for hunting
[Re: SniperRAB]
#6565537
11/30/16 03:57 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 39,549
redchevy
THF Celebrity
|
THF Celebrity
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 39,549 |
I like messing with bullets and that just looks plain mean!
It's hell eatin em live
|
|
|
Moderated by bigbob_ftw, CCBIRDDOGMAN, Chickenman, Derek, DeRico, Duck_Hunter, hetman, jeh7mmmag, JustWingem, kmon11, kry226, kwrhuntinglab, Payne, pertnear, rifleman, sig226fan (Rguns.com), Superduty, TreeBass, txcornhusker
|