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Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
#5573597
01/30/15 08:50 PM
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J.G.
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55 gr and 69 gr bullets
Loaded for precision on a 16" barrel, 10" suppressor.
Decided it was high time I brought the AR out of the back of the safe and build a load for it. I would normally go straight to Varget in a bolt action, but this isnt a bolt action.
So what say ye?
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5573680
01/30/15 09:53 PM
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kmon11
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Try your Varget with the 69gr bullets, will probably work well near max load with that bullet weight.
lf the saying "Liar, Liar your pants on fire" were true Mainstream news might be fun to watch
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5573691
01/30/15 10:00 PM
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Buzzsaw
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just got some AR Comp, will let you know with the 69gr...oops it will be my 20 bolt gun
So far Varget and RE-15
SPACE FOR RENT
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5573698
01/30/15 10:08 PM
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kmon11
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Mine has a 1:7 twist and never have loaded the 55gr for it, 69 and 75 gr so far. Next powder I am planning to try is CFE223
lf the saying "Liar, Liar your pants on fire" were true Mainstream news might be fun to watch
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: kmon11]
#5573812
01/30/15 11:09 PM
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J.G.
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Thanks fellas!
Dove into the Sierra manual on loading for the AR-15 and firmed up what I thought was true. Saw that Varget is listed as a .223 for AR-15 (Sierra seperates .223 bolt action and .223 AR-15, Greatness!) Then I read the barrel stamp 1-9. Not trusting that, I verified twist and that is correct. The 69 gr SGKs show 1:7-1:10 twist. So far it looks like I'm good to go. Now I need to fire five rounds (and catch the brass) so that I can set the FL die accordingly. Go from there.
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5574239
01/31/15 03:35 AM
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603Country
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I'm laughing at "catch the brass". Had a guy over here a while back, and he wanted to sight in his AR. He didn't have a lot of ammo, so by the time he had it dialed in, the ammo was about used up. I had just loaded up a couple hundred of my favorite load, so I said he could try these out. He ran about 10 rounds through it in a heartbeat and all the brass went on the dirt. Geez, my Lapua brass in the dirt. I honestly had forgotten that was gonna happen. I'm pretty picky about my brass.
Not my monkeys, not my circus...
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5575135
01/31/15 08:52 PM
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daniel1381
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so that I can set the FL die accordingly. Go from there. [/quote]
explain that for me pls!
"From my cold dead hands"
"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain - and most fools do."
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5575379
01/31/15 11:13 PM
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tenyearsgone
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5575386
01/31/15 11:15 PM
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jdk1985
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I've used H335 for everything from 55-75gr and it has worked flawlessly for me.
As for setting the FL die correctly - I don't worry about this with ARs. I make sure I completely cam over and size the brass the max amount. That makes sure that the base has been sized properly to avoid any chambering issues. 223 brass is so readily available that I don't mind the possibility that I might get one less firing on it by sizing more than the bare minimum.
All that to say, if you do not completely FL size, make sure to check the base to make sure it has been sized sufficiently to chamber reliably. I know I'm preaching to the choir.
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: jdk1985]
#5575499
02/01/15 12:20 AM
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DStroud
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I've used H335 for everything from 55-75gr and it has worked flawlessly for me.
As for setting the FL die correctly - I don't worry about this with ARs. I make sure I completely cam over and size the brass the max amount. That makes sure that the base has been sized properly to avoid any chambering issues. 223 brass is so readily available that I don't mind the possibility that I might get one less firing on it by sizing more than the bare minimum.
All that to say, if you do not completely FL size, make sure to check the base to make sure it has been sized sufficiently to chamber reliably. I know I'm preaching to the choir. I agree with this completely. Trying to size just enough to chamber is fine with bolt's but semi-auto just FL size because it's no fun getting that round that was sized to minimum and sprang back slightly and now has your action jammed.
"Anyone taking up handloading necessarily plays with unknown factors and takes chances. But so does anyone who drives a car,goes to a cocktail party,eats in a restaurant,or gets married."
Jack O'Connor 1963
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: daniel1381]
#5575586
02/01/15 01:17 AM
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J.G.
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so that I can set the FL die accordingly. Go from there. explain that for me pls! [/quote] Take brass fired in that chamber, and measure the length from case head to the middle of the shoulder using the Hornady headspace comparator attached the caliper. Get an avaerage over the five brass. Set the Full Lenght sizing die to bump the shoulders back .003". Brass flows forward .003" during the next firing and gets forced back .003" on the next sizing. Yes brass doesnt get over-worked, but that brass will yeild more velocity, on the same powder charge, as brass that had to flow .010" or more as some of it has done in the past. I do this for every rifle. Granted they are bolt actions, but as violent as an AR chambers and ejects I suspect it will work for it is well.
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5575744
02/01/15 02:37 AM
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DStroud
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I think your method will work "maybe" a couple of rounds of reloading. But just like in Bolt guns they will start to get sticky closing at some point and as you noted you are checking based off an average so some will be longer than others. You don't have the camming action of a Bolt to force them home so your jammed at that point. Now if you are willing to measure each round after loading and relegate the over-size rounds to use in Bolt guns then all is good... that is what I do. I am Fully sizing all and still get rounds due to fatigued brass or other reasons that won't fit. You could also anneal after every 2-3 loadings too but that's too much trouble in the volumes I load and besides I have 15,000 pieces of brass laying around. Just say'n from my personal experience but carry on.... some folks just have to pee on the electric fence
"Anyone taking up handloading necessarily plays with unknown factors and takes chances. But so does anyone who drives a car,goes to a cocktail party,eats in a restaurant,or gets married."
Jack O'Connor 1963
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: DStroud]
#5576076
02/01/15 01:05 PM
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J.G.
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Did you miss read?
The brass will be three thousandths shorter than what it flowed to in the chamber. Never in a bolt gun is there sticky closing. I FL size it every time to that length.
My Giraud annealer is slated to be delivered Feb 16.
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5576216
02/01/15 03:24 PM
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ChadTRG42
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Jason, I would say try your sizing method and see if it will work for you. AR's are a totally different animal than a bolt gun when it comes to sizing. They do not like a tight fit. You will also have to worry about the case web area when not fully FL sizing. The brass can hang up in the case web area (about 1/8" above the extractor groove on the case wall) and prevent it from chambering. I have seen this on 223 and 308 AR's. I'm not saying your method won't work. But you will definitely want to chamber check most of your rounds after sizing and after loading. I know I will not gain any benefit to a partial sizing for a gas gun. You will most likely have a round or two that will not chamber, and it will lock up the rifle during firing (and it's a PITA to unjam). And the gas gun chews up brass pretty bad, and you will get reduced loads from it. So partially FL sizing the brass for multiple reloads for a gas gun may not be worth it. Try it and see. I know I will not risk it and do a FL size on all my AR brass.
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5576235
02/01/15 03:38 PM
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jdk1985
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5576236
02/01/15 03:39 PM
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jdk1985
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Or, Synergistic wisdom at its finest.
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#5576260
02/01/15 03:59 PM
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J.G.
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So you're worried about the last little bit of brass down by the case head being expanded? Not a shoulder length problem. Am I reading you correctly?
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5576292
02/01/15 04:29 PM
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DStroud
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I have not found down by the case head to be an issue very often. It's the shoulder length. If you do your method I would measure each and every case with something like this before running thru the AR. http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloading-eq...-prod33476.aspxOf course my AR's are all reamed custom with a Match chamber so anything over .003 above SAMMI (zero on the above gauge) will potentially Jam the gun and as Chad mentioned it's a pain to clear. Jason you and I may be coming from a totally different direction and how we plan to use our ammo as well.... When I shoot this brass I may or may not get it back at a match so I want decent reliable stuff. I would never anneal or fret over prepping the brass that I probably never see again. As Chad mentioned your method is fine and I too use it on bolt guns to a degree but found out quickly its a different game when shooting AR's. By the way also found using a Small Base die did not help as it has little if no bearing on shoulder length and seemed to me to make it worse and made the case's stretch even more.
"Anyone taking up handloading necessarily plays with unknown factors and takes chances. But so does anyone who drives a car,goes to a cocktail party,eats in a restaurant,or gets married."
Jack O'Connor 1963
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: DStroud]
#5576319
02/01/15 04:52 PM
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J.G.
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I have no plan of getting into 3 gun. I am about to be testing out a scope for the AR, that Charles is sending me. Like you I may not get my brass back. On the range I can recover it doing optics testing, but the end goal is to get the AR in service and kill hogs with extreme prejudice. I know where they're staying right now and I may just walk right up into their lair and shoot as many as I possibly can. No way will I recover that brass unless I run a catcher. Back to the range duty, I am wanting to produce as high quality of ammo possible for the AR, same as I do for my bolt actions. But learning the exact chamber demensions of this rifle may be a futile effort since I may end up relegated to only ever using virgin brass due to the brass loss.
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5576346
02/01/15 05:04 PM
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DStroud
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Last edited by DStroud; 02/01/15 05:13 PM.
"Anyone taking up handloading necessarily plays with unknown factors and takes chances. But so does anyone who drives a car,goes to a cocktail party,eats in a restaurant,or gets married."
Jack O'Connor 1963
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: DStroud]
#5576402
02/01/15 05:42 PM
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J.G.
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A dead hog is a good hog. I have some 69 SMKs stashed, as well. Also have some 55 gr SGKs I wont use in anything else and need to shoot em up anyway.
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5576501
02/01/15 06:40 PM
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DStroud
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Varget is on the slow side for a .223 and it doesn't really start to shine until that 69gr range of bullet weight velocity wise.
With the 55's while it will be fine and good accuracy is certainly attainable you may look to Benchmark/XBR8208/XTerminator/AA2015 for a tad more velocity.
"Anyone taking up handloading necessarily plays with unknown factors and takes chances. But so does anyone who drives a car,goes to a cocktail party,eats in a restaurant,or gets married."
Jack O'Connor 1963
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: DStroud]
#5576661
02/01/15 08:26 PM
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J.G.
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I will look for those powders. Thank you.
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: J.G.]
#5576782
02/01/15 09:27 PM
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ChadTRG42
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Also, the Hornady 68 grain BTHP and 69 SMK are not very effective on big pigs. I shot a large boar from about 180 yards with the 68 BTHP. I shot him square in the head first shot, and he took off running. I dropped him with the next shot, but didn't kill him. He would get up and I'd double tap him and he'd go down again. We did the up and double tap 4 or 5 times, and we still had to finish him off with a 357. The 68 BTHP wasn't getting in to do any damage. If I head to the woods, I will take anything over a 68 bthp now.
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Re: Alright gas gunners. Favorite powder for AR-15 .223?
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#5576815
02/01/15 09:42 PM
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J.G.
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So what bullet for the .223 in an AR?
The point of knocking the dust off the AR is for rate of fire, and mag capacity. I hope to get midevil on the little bast*ards.
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