texashuntingforum.com logo
Main Menu
Advertisement
Affiliates
Advertisement
Newest Members
jrperkins, Vsherrod, Tootabi Valley Safaris, dquick1, Coco2266
72157 Registered Users
Top Posters(All Time)
dogcatcher 110,817
bill oxner 91,416
SnakeWrangler 65,604
stxranchman 60,296
Gravytrain 46,950
RKHarm24 44,585
rifleman 44,461
Stub 44,221
Forum Statistics
Forums46
Topics539,322
Posts9,748,282
Members87,157
Most Online25,604
Feb 12th, 2024
Print Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? #3418379 07/28/12 04:03 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 8
S
Skeletor Offline OP
Green Horn
OP Offline
Green Horn
S
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 8
Does shooting coyotes really make a difference in a deer heard?


Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: Skeletor] #3418396 07/28/12 04:14 PM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,258
A
AmoCuernos Offline
Pro Tracker
Offline
Pro Tracker
A
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,258
yes, but not as much as snaring them.


Last edited by AmoCuernos; 07/28/12 04:14 PM.
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: AmoCuernos] #3418414 07/28/12 04:24 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 367
T
TimOub007 Offline
Bird Dog
Offline
Bird Dog
T
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 367
Dead is dead. Kill them anyway you can. Shooting them is more fun.


Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: TimOub007] #3418448 07/28/12 04:44 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 60,296
S
stxranchman Offline
Obie Juan Kenobi
Offline
Obie Juan Kenobi
S
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 60,296
Yes they eat a bunch in a year like last year. Had a guy tell me about a 900 acre HF in Webb county that they were only getting 10% avg. fawn crops for years. They started snaring and in a 3yr period caught a couple of hundred coyotes and bobcats. By 3rd yr fawn crops hit 80%. Had to shoot to many deer so they quit snaring.



Are idiots multiplying faster than normal people?[Linked Image]
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: stxranchman] #3418508 07/28/12 05:17 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 15,904
6
603Country Online Content
THF Celebrity
Online Content
THF Celebrity
6
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 15,904
I've read (Tx Parks and Wildlife data) that 70% of a fawn crop born in the Spring will be dead by the Fall, with most of them killed by Coyotes. When I read that, I started hunting coyotes seriously. That was a couple of years ago, and now we do have quite a few more deer on the place. It's your guess and mine as to whether or not I had major impact on the coyote population, but I shot a lot of em. I really don't hear all the howling that I once did.



Not my monkeys, not my circus...
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: 603Country] #3418523 07/28/12 05:24 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,947
Curtis Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 7,947
Coyotes and bobcats and do some unbelievable damage to the deer herd if left unchecked.



Double Arrow Bow Hunting
www.doublearrowbowhunting.com
Bow hunters welcome!
Whitetail-Axis-Blackbuck-Fallow-Barasingha-Scimitar Oryx
Located in Gonzales County.
Visit our Facebook page for current updates!

Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: Curtis] #3418595 07/28/12 06:12 PM
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 8,386
N
nsmike Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
N
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 8,386
The worst situation is when you have a mamma coyote denning with a litter of pups. When you take a coyote out in the summer and fall you have a good chance of other coyotes moving in. They start setting up territories in late Jan. If you don't keep pressure on them year around, put as much pressure on them Jan. to Apr. that you can, it'll pay off.



for every stereotype there's a prototype don't be the prototype
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: nsmike] #3418697 07/28/12 07:01 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 8
S
Skeletor Offline OP
Green Horn
OP Offline
Green Horn
S
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 8
603 where can I find that info?


Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: Skeletor] #3418771 07/28/12 07:44 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 15,904
6
603Country Online Content
THF Celebrity
Online Content
THF Celebrity
6
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 15,904
Displayname, it was a few years back when I read that and I just don't remember where I got it. Might have googled it up or maybe I got it from one of the predator magazines. What struck me as interesting back then was that I also read that South Carolina published almost the exact same percentage of fawns lost to coyotes. I had no idea that the coyotes could do that kind of damage, and it was all I needed to get me off the couch and back in the blinds. I do enjoy hunting them and you get all the excitement of the hunt with nothing to field dress and skin.

I just went to google and input "fawn loss to coyote predation" and found all the info right on top. Very interesting.


Last edited by 603Country; 07/28/12 07:48 PM.

Not my monkeys, not my circus...
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: 603Country] #3418827 07/28/12 08:17 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 259
T
Trash Fish and Cull Bucks Offline
Bird Dog
Offline
Bird Dog
T
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 259
Answer to the first question is yes, coyotes eat many fawns, especially in areas where fawning cover is limited (drought, overgrazing, etc.). It's fairly common to see in utero fawn crops around 175%. Immediately preceeding parturition, the fawn crop is still high, say 150%. Many die the first few weeks after parturition (from a variety of factors including predators and coyotes), dropping the fawn crop down to 30%-100% depending on range conditions, herd health, livestock management, mowing practices, and availability of fawning cover.

Answer to the second question is probably not, but if so, only short-term. Coyotes are a classic example of a compensatory reproducer, meaning that the more you remove, the higher the reproductive rates and success are, and you just end up with the same number of coyotes as before. A coyote-removal study was done on UT land back in the 90's where they sent a helicopter up every 4 months and killed every coyote they could find for 2 years. If I remember correctly, by the end of the study, they were able to change the age structure of the 'yotes (many pups), but no real discerable difference in coyote density. The deer desnity to was too low to be able to judge any response. But, coyotes play a way more important role in the ecosystem than just eating fawns. Plus, coyotes are an advantage in areas with high deer densities, helping to keep deer densities under control. Nothing wrong with hunting them (calling in coyotes is a blast), just don't get too worked up about the idea of 'controlling' them.



The recreational value of game is inverse to the artificiality of its origin - Aldo Leopold
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: Curtis] #3418928 07/28/12 09:08 PM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 22,299
T
Texas Dan Online Content
THF Celebrity
Online Content
THF Celebrity
T
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 22,299
Originally Posted By: Curtis
Coyotes and bobcats and do some unbelievable damage to the deer herd if left unchecked.


Every study that I have seen put much more blame on coyotes than bobcats for fawn mortality. When their numbers are unchecked, coyotes will get 70-80 percent of the fawns. And their impact on adult deer is significant as well. They will run an adult deer to the point of exhaustion and then take it down.

As some have indicated, whenever efforts are made to control the coyote population, fawn survival soars.



"Some people will never like you because your spirit irritates their demons."
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: Texas Dan] #3418948 07/28/12 09:14 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 810
B
Bittercreek Offline
Tracker
Offline
Tracker
B
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 810
Yes. They have a significant impact.


Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: Bittercreek] #3418955 07/28/12 09:18 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 60,296
S
stxranchman Offline
Obie Juan Kenobi
Offline
Obie Juan Kenobi
S
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 60,296
I guess all those sheep and goat ranchers were messing in the wind trying to control coyotes years ago. From what I can tell they took their numbers down to nothing over large areas. If there is nothing to breed they can not reproduce very well. Coyotes are not real selective in their choice of which deer to eat other than can they catch it.



Are idiots multiplying faster than normal people?[Linked Image]
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: stxranchman] #3419116 07/28/12 10:23 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 14,963
D
don k Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
D
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 14,963
And don't believe this crap about coyotes only taking sick and otherwise inferior animals. Years ago when 1080 was still allowed we put some of the collars that had pouches of the poison on some old ewes. The coyotes never took any of them and just killed the better sheep.


Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: don k] #3420126 07/29/12 08:43 AM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 234
J
jphillips Offline
Woodsman
Offline
Woodsman
J
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 234
The point made about coyotes reproducing more if thinned out is 100% correct. One of our best hunting spots a few years back we were killing about a hundred or so a year. We never hurt the population in a bit. The more we killed the more they reproduced. Now like was said, we did lower the age expectancy of them, but never lowered numbers.


Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: Trash Fish and Cull Bucks] #3420128 07/29/12 08:48 AM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 31,058
HWY_MAN Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 31,058
Originally Posted By: Trash Fish and Cull Bucks
Answer to the first question is yes, coyotes eat many fawns, especially in areas where fawning cover is limited (drought, overgrazing, etc.). It's fairly common to see in utero fawn crops around 175%. Immediately preceeding parturition, the fawn crop is still high, say 150%. Many die the first few weeks after parturition (from a variety of factors including predators and coyotes), dropping the fawn crop down to 30%-100% depending on range conditions, herd health, livestock management, mowing practices, and availability of fawning cover.

Answer to the second question is probably not, but if so, only short-term. Coyotes are a classic example of a compensatory reproducer, meaning that the more you remove, the higher the reproductive rates and success are, and you just end up with the same number of coyotes as before. A coyote-removal study was done on UT land back in the 90's where they sent a helicopter up every 4 months and killed every coyote they could find for 2 years. If I remember correctly, by the end of the study, they were able to change the age structure of the 'yotes (many pups), but no real discerable difference in coyote density. The deer desnity to was too low to be able to judge any response. But, coyotes play a way more important role in the ecosystem than just eating fawns. Plus, coyotes are an advantage in areas with high deer densities, helping to keep deer densities under control. Nothing wrong with hunting them (calling in coyotes is a blast), just don't get too worked up about the idea of 'controlling' them.


Interesting.

In the last 4 years I'm still averaging close to 50 yotes a year on the big ranch. I do not call them but I do shoot every one of them I see. As soon as it starts to cool down I'm fixing to start calling hard on my place and see if I can't drop the population a little, I'm even got to take a few cats off. Normally I don't allow cats to be taken.



Yes! A Weatherby does kill them deader.
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: HWY_MAN] #3420173 07/29/12 11:51 AM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 14,963
D
don k Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
D
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 14,963
Around here the more I trap and snare the less I see. Every time I see any sign of a coyote- tracks, scat or whatever I concentrate on especially that area. When I take care of that one it is usually some time before another shows up. If I did nothing we would be overrun with them. If all ranches did their share I believe you could someday semi keep them at a manageable population. But that will never happen because like around here a lot of the area is too grown up with cedar, the fences between places are bad, the owners are not interested in killing them, the owners won't let people in to try to kill them,and about the only time the owners see the place is during the season and wonder why the deer or exotic population is way down.


Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: don k] #3420764 07/29/12 04:41 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 130
T
TNDeer Offline
Woodsman
Offline
Woodsman
T
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 130
Yep.



U.S. Air Force Retired (1993-2014)
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: TNDeer] #3421935 07/29/12 11:29 PM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,306
D
DLALLDER Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
Offline
THF Trophy Hunter
D
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,306
To add to the fawn kill, some of the experts claim that yotes take out a lot of the dominant bucks in an area every year. The dominant bucks are so weaken by the rut that it doesn't take much to bring one down by 2-3 yotes.






Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: DLALLDER] #3421965 07/29/12 11:37 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,741
P
passthru Offline
THF Celebrity
Offline
THF Celebrity
P
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,741
Saw a study once that showed on average like 52% of the fawn crop in Texas is lost to them.



I work hard, drink a little and hunt when I can.
NRA Life Member
https://sofalasafaris.com/
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: passthru] #3422027 07/29/12 11:50 PM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 524
C
ch1966 Offline
Tracker
Offline
Tracker
C
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 524
A study done 35 years ago in the Wichita Mountains Wildlife Refuge here in SW Oklahoma showed significant fawn predation in the summer months.

Keep in mind, the deer herd there was not hunted at the time. Controlled hunts occur annually now.

The refuge has elk, bison, and wild longhorn herds.

Here's the report.

It makes for an interesting read.




Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: ch1966] #3422719 07/30/12 02:28 AM
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 33
N
Ned Raw Sr Offline
Light Foot
Offline
Light Foot
N
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 33
This is a very interesting and informative topic. I too, try to do my part through calling and use of snares targeting coyotes, knowing that it will improve fawn survival rates. Through these control efforts, I have left the rabbit population alone. As a young man, I and others would entertain ourselves by shooting dozens of rabbits and just let em lay. I no longer do that (unless I see a fat cottontail for eating). I would prefer leaving that food source for the coyotes, hoping that if they can get a belly full of rabbit... then maybe they'll leave the deer and livestock alone, or at least take some pressure off.
Don't get me started on porcupines...


Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: Ned Raw Sr] #3422776 07/30/12 02:39 AM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 22,299
T
Texas Dan Online Content
THF Celebrity
Online Content
THF Celebrity
T
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 22,299
Originally Posted By: Ned Raw
This is a very interesting and informative topic. I too, try to do my part through calling and use of snares targeting coyotes, knowing that it will improve fawn survival rates. Through these control efforts, I have left the rabbit population alone. As a young man, I and others would entertain ourselves by shooting dozens of rabbits and just let em lay. I no longer do that (unless I see a fat cottontail for eating). I would prefer leaving that food source for the coyotes, hoping that if they can get a belly full of rabbit... then maybe they'll leave the deer and livestock alone, or at least take some pressure off.
Don't get me started on porcupines...


I've taken the same approach with feral hogs and always leave everything but young shoats for the coyotes to feast on.



"Some people will never like you because your spirit irritates their demons."
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: Texas Dan] #3423796 07/30/12 02:29 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 331
R
RogueSamurai Offline
Bird Dog
Offline
Bird Dog
R
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 331
Kill every coyote you see, snare them, trap them or any other way you can kill them.



I didn't learn this by seeing it on TV, I learned it by doing it.
Re: Do coytoes really eat that many fawns? [Re: RogueSamurai] #3424269 07/30/12 05:24 PM
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 15,904
6
603Country Online Content
THF Celebrity
Online Content
THF Celebrity
6
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 15,904
What Ned Raw said reminded me that we now have a lot more rabbits than we used to have. That, and we have more deer and more fawns. The only difference between now and 5 years ago is that I'm actively hunting and shooting coyotes. All I can think is that I must be making a difference. I just wish that it would cool off a bit so that I can get back after the coyotes. Too darn hot right now.



Not my monkeys, not my circus...
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread

© 2004-2024 OUTDOOR SITES NETWORK all rights reserved USA and Worldwide
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.3