Wetland Project

Thought some of you might be interested in this. I'll try to update the progress as we go. It's been a dream of mine to buy some land and develop a wetland after I watched a really good friend of mine do it. He wanted to build another one, so we decided to partner up and started looking for land 3 years ago. Closed on our property a year and a month ago.

During the process of looking, I learned a lot. It's not as simple as finding a piece of ground you can afford and jumping in feet first. There's a lot of leg work into looking at soil maps, topo maps, drainage/runoff basins, water rights, etc, etc. During the time we were looking the market on land was obscenely hot. Stuff was selling almost as soon as it hit the market, so doing any due diligence was almost impossible. The piece of ground we ended up buying had a contract on it within 3 days of getting listed. I won't go into the details, but the buyer got extremely frustrated with the seller. Having a good agent that knew what was going on gave us the time to do our homework before the property was ready to sell. We were able to shoot elevations to confirm the topo map as well as a few soil samples to verify clay content. We were still a little apprehensive about the soil going in, but decided to buy the property anyway since we were buying under market at the time. We felt like we could get back out of the property what we put in if the final analysis by the state came back negative.

So first step find a property that has primary recreational water rights, is flat, and has soils with a high enough clay content to hold water. Easy right? Only took us 3 years of looking.

Property:


Immediately after closing we filed the paper work thru the state for our water rights since this takes over a year. Next we got in line to have the state expert come out and run soil analysis for us to confirm our clay content. It was free and the guy has been doing this for 40 years. Once we triple checked out elevations for our pools, it was time to come up with the wetland design. Ultimately we decided on a two pool design. The East pool will have 18 acres of corn and be mostly open farm ground with a finger of timber in the pool to hide our blind. Approximately 22 acres total flooded. The west pool with have 5 acres of corn and approximately 15 acres total flooded. We decided to open up a hole in the timber between the two small fields of corn to build a blind.

Pool layouts:



These were our initial designs. I don't have the final. The pool layout for the West Pool is close, but the elevation of the East Pool will run further north to get more of the tillable ground in the pool and hopefully we can get the contractor to selectively borrow dirt from the east of the pool to lower the elevation to put more pool to the East of the tree line where we plan on building the blind.

To be continued..........

dont forget my she shed!!!

Super cool. A dream of mine as well, looking forward to seeing the progress on it. Did you buy in Tx or Ok?

Next up was trying to improve the land and get broke back into farm ground. Even though the satellite images show tillable farm ground it hadn't been planted in a couple of years. The farmer had been running cattle on it and turned it into grazing. We wanted to pull all the trees out of the 3 main fields you see in the first aerial photo as well as pull trees in the West pool to create two smaller fields for corn in the wetland. Simply amazed at what you can get done with a skidsteer.





Once we had the fields cleaned up the farmer came in sprayed to kill weeds/grass before we no tilled beans.



At this point we had about done as much as we could do without levee permits approved. The state had changed it rules on the permitting and wouldn't let us file the paperwork and plans. That make you go thru a licensed engineering firm that does all the levee plans as well as hydrology and 100 year flood studies. They also want all elevations in the plans tied to USGS geological data which means a licensed surveyor. These guys were both backed up for months. We went back and forth with them about doing the survey during the winter while the leaves were off the trees. All we got was the surveyor was backed up and couldn't get to us until the summer. This presented an issue with the tree canopy since our south level went thru a pretty significant track of timber. Rather than push project time line we went at risk of having the timber cleared with an excavator before our permits were approved.





While the contractor was in there we had him clear out out some bigger trees in the two fields of the West pool we couldn't pull with the skid-steers as well as some timber between the two pools.





To be continued........

Love these projects. On my 3rd one, which has been the best wetland yet. Hopefully you did your “flyway” research as well. If your not in a good area, doesn’t matter what you plant or do, your duck population will be skinny the majority of the hunting season.

Good luck

dont forget my she shed!!!

Looking forward to more updates. I would love to do something like this one day.

Anyone know how to report someone for trolling?



Ended up in KS. The land prices in TX for smaller tracts was more than I was wanting to spend. Plus I think the migration due to less and less agriculture in TX has moved North unless the weather is really nasty. However as soon as the weather weakens I've noticed more and more of reverse migration. I really wanted land in OK. Prices are very reasonable, but with the variables I mentioned above all the ground I found in OK to check those boxes were too sandy. It just wouldn't hold water and the places I did find with enough water I wasn't willing to pay the type of money needed to overcome the seepage in the wetland.



Something tells me we will be alright.

After the contractor was done clearing trees there were a lot of roots, limbs, etc to clean up as well holes left by the root balls. You can see that in the pictures I posted above. Lots of hours in the skid steers cleaning that up and trying to make it level for the surveyor to come in and do his work. Didn't get any pictures of the clean up work or the surveyor, but was interesting to see how he used his equipment. He said his elevations were accurate up to 1/32". He did a lot finer grid of the property, but our elevations ended up being within an inch of his data. No surprises which was good. Now to wait on the engineering firm to do the levee design and flood studies to submit to the state.

Aerial view of the wetland after the trees were removed and before we burned the brush piles. Can finally see it taking shape.




By this point we were in the middle of hunting season. We picked a weekend after some rain to burn the majority of the brush piles.





Most of the piles burned down pretty well. We only got the piles on the West pool burnt. Going out this weekend to burn the piles on the east pool and sift thru the piles we already burnt to add un-burnt wood to the east piles and remove the ash from the West Pool field for planting this spring. Definitely never a lack of something to do when developing or maintaining a wetland.

Cool project and yes you are correct; skidsteers are handy as a pocket on a shirt. How long of a commute is it from the metromess?

I'll just put this out there, you will want more than corn. Get you a buffet.
If you run straight corn, there's a strong possibility that birds will feed in it at night, and go elsewhere to hang out in the day.
Just something to consider before you plant for the year.

Looks great - agree on variety. Look at all big duck clubs, the most successful ones have some hot crops and moist soil. Keep more birds throughout the season

Barney get yo pen out.

Why is that? Is corn a mallard mid-night snack and something else (say millet) a more mallard breakfast type meal?

smartweed, no maintenance needed and it will bring in birds.

corn is a pig magnet, we did 2 areas on 2 of our lakes, didn't go as planned.

planted milo and millet on 2 other lakes but it didn't head out in time, was planted late.

going back to mostly smartweed, works best imo

He needs to class that place up with a chessie though.

No, those mallards will just feed all night, then go to more open water about 10 minutes before shooting light. Or they might not ever leave the corn since it also provides thermal cover.
Any manager that knows what's up will always take moist soil over hot crop.

Raise your hand if you shot your first duck during the trump administration

Maybe don't run so much corn, just enough so they run out by sun down.

What does that comment have to do with this post? You just trying to be your typical bully self?


Also Guy, I got a good chuckle from your last comment.

So how many wetland properties have you built in KS?

this is Barney’s third in 12 years, the others he helped and hunts, this one is his.

Look back at the pictures he had posted over the years.

All the bullies got banned about a decade ago, you wouldn’t have liked them at all. I was just pointing out that maybe sometimes it’s best to sit back and listen rather than try and tell an experienced waterfowler what you heard on a podcast

When I grow up I want to be Barneywho. I’m glad I was never kwood.

Ramball you big ole bully biscuit neck.

I've been a member longer than you you fool.

Bobo, haven't built any in Kansas, but I've done a few of them in Texas. But hey, what do I know, apparently my wildlife degree and experience don't mean anything.

Texas has same freeze line as KS? who knew.

same wildlife degree that told me prairie dogs eat minimal grass, and are beneficial to farming…. but what do I know, my bushel and grass tonnage sky rocketed after I killed them out.

when someone flexes their knowledge on a subject based on a degree its time to exit the conversation, not worth it when a man already knows everything. Next thing you know he'll start trying to tell you silver labs and GHG decoys are top notch.

You’re getting there.

So do the haters disagree with KWood? I'm just trying to learn something.

I swore I wasn’t going to reply to this, but I can’t help myself.




So that education and experience taught you that only one certain food makes ducks nocturnal? If I plant anything other than corn, they won’t eat at night? Sky blasting, hunting all day…….aka pressure isn’t what makes them nocturnal? It’s the corn? Guess I learn something everyday.

Appreciate the advice, but I’ll stick with my experience and what has been working for us the last 15 years.


More pics and progress to come…..

I have the degree as a base, I have the years of experience after that to back it up, lol.

No, there's many variables, but corn is a very influential food. I have no clue who barneywho is, was just giving him facts on wetland projects that he can do with as he wishes.

I still have that research paper, and I actually came across and read it the other day. What you said isn't what the paper was about at all, good try to be a criticizer though. The research was about how they are good for the ecosystem as a whole, and if they should be put on the endangered species list, etc. That paper is full of research facts, and I can send it to you if you'd like, now that I know where it's at.

No, it taught me many other things. Like I said, any person that manages for ducks, and actually knows anything, knows that a buffet is better than straight hot crop. Hot crops absolutely have their place though. I don't know who you are, nor do I care, I answered the question like you were a beginner to help your success since most people are beginners and run straight to hot crop and then wonder why they can't kill ducks in their plot. They've never actually managed for ducks, so they try what they've seen on Instagram and wonder why it doesn't work.
If you have something that works for you, awesome, but I bet you manage pressure, have other plots have thermal cover, have a refuge, and more. I had no idea this wasn't your first rodeo.

Also look at my wording, I didn't say guarantee, I said possible. Ducks go nocturnal quick, but the research proven facts, plus anecdotal evidence, shows that corn makes them do it much quicker since it provides food, thermal cover, and protection from predatory birds.

I'll admit, there's a lot I don't know, but I'm far from ignorant like these clowns like to think.

I have seen them feed at night on public, because of hunting pressure…acorns, smart weed. The past season 1 week they are coming in on a string, the next week I can hear them all night long camping then gone by morning, nothing but mud boats.

thats why location and pressure are so relative. Freeze line and types of open water are way different

those years of experience landed you on Sitka and Boss shells? keep paddling kid, you'll get there one day

This is an interesting article on duck behavior
Full link - https://www.themeateater.com/hunt/waterfowl/why-do-you-see-so-many-ducks-after-the-season

Two recent telemetry studies in Arkansas and Tennessee (the latter is still ongoing) show that mallards become programmed to avoid hunting pressure and human disturbance once the season is underway. The birds stick to sanctuaries devoid of shotgun blasts and boats racing through the marsh. There have also been telemetry studies conducted on gadwall and pintails that reveal similar habits.

Both studies provide a detailed look at mallard movements in wintering areas. What they discovered is quite illuminating. Once the duck season begins, mallards quickly adapt to survive, spending their nights feeding on private, flooded agriculture and flying back to the refuge before shooting light in the morning. They spend the remainder of the day on these sanctuaries and do not fly out to feed until after sunset. The mallards remain on this strict regiment for the entirety of the season unless a substantial weather event forces them to move.

Dittmer’s mallards hardly spent any time at all on public hunting areas—day or night—until duck season ended. Once it did, the birds began to frequent public hunting acres and moved away from using spatial sanctuaries during daylight hours.

“When hunting season was on those mallards were either on the sanctuary or private agriculture, normally flooded rice,” Dittmer said. “But about two weeks after hunting season ended, during the daytime, they preferred public hunt areas over spatial sanctuaries (mostly flooded timber) and private lands. It was really clear that once hunting season ended, mallards started using these formerly risky areas. Presumably, they somehow knew it was safe.”


“What intrigued me most about these mallards, other than how smart they were, is that most of them stayed within the vicinity of White River NWR,” he said. “Out of 105 birds, only two moved farther south than Arkansas.”

Dittmer’s mallards acted much the same. He tracked their peak flying times, which, not surprisingly, were in the minutes before legal shooting light and after sunset. The only times his birds were killed—only 10 were shot during the study—was if they flew off the night roost a little too late or left the safety of the sanctuary too early. And of the 10 mallards harvested, only two were shot on White River NWR, where they were deployed.

Them mallards are smart, probably reading this forum.

They are quite smart.
We see it here in the panhandle all season while goose hunting about them flying to safety.
When we're out scouting, you'll see them making their way to a field around sunset, then when we're setting up in the morning you'll see thousands of them heading back to water. They feed all night, sit on water all day. It's crazy to watch tens of thousands of ducks hitting the water at first light.

So I ended up getting the best gear, and you're implying that that is stupid? You're really showing your ignorance and hate here. Keep hating though, jealousy is an ugly thing.

I wont resort to name calling, but I will say life is a long game, and I have seen the "best" change a few times over. Some people grow and learn about marketing and some just jump from fad to fad.

what would really blow your mind is that I really don't even wear camo, all the new patterns are made to catch the hunters eye on the sales rack. Keep your face down and be still...game over

It's not about the camo, it's about the warmth without bulk. We mainly lay in whites, so camo isn't much needed.

camo was more of a side note really, every latest and greatest "best" is about warmth without bulk. You're going to need to come out with something more ground breaking than regurgitating a marketing statement.

If corn did not work, people would not be spending 800-1200 dollars an acre to plant it every year... I have hammered ducks over flooded corn in the middle of the day for days on end and when the hole was not pressured for a few days you could go back and restart the process (public land flooded corn from when a river got out of its banks) ... I have watched ducks land on ice and peck the corn off the cob when five foot deep water froze over.... in the middle of the day... to say ducks will only use corn at night as asinine... I remember when the manager on the Barker Ranch (Eastern Washington, private club, pretty good hunting) said he was going to plant corn all the KWood_TSU know it all members said the same crap... "they are only going to use it at night and go back to the river the next day"... they all shut up when they killed more mallards that year than ever before. Yes, that property also had a buffet of food... but corn helped, especially when it was cold... the kind of cold Kansas gets pretty much every year....

Are you saying they sit in dry fields all night feeding? 😅😅😅

Not saying that’s never happened before but it’s definitely not the norm.

I don't think it's possible for me to care less about what another man wears or ammo he shoots. But I gotta admit if you tell me you need Sitka to hunt in TX and Boss shells to kill dux, talk from the perspective of your college degree(s) and not from your experience, Imma be a bit of a skeptic. Especially when it comes to how I manage my land that I'm putting so much time and effort into developing.

Clearly Barney know WTF he's doin and wasn't asking for any suggestions, but if he's listening... the she shed is a definite must!

Congrats Barney, looks like you got a good thing goin there!

y'all ninjaed this up so much, I'm not even sure where I was in the process.

back on topic..........The engineering firm finally got to the project, reviewed our design, overlaid the survey data on the aerial to verify elevations, and sent us the drawings. Once the drawings were finalized and all the drainage reports were done, the engineering firm filed the paperwork with the state at the first of this year. Now we, wait. The plans are sent to 7 different agencies for approval. I'm sure there will be some back and forth, but once the plans are approved we can move dirt. Hopefully by April or May to give us time to seed the levees to get enough growth to protect from erosion as well as a crop to make the ducks nocturnal we won't be able to hunt.

Final design:


Drawing overlaid with aerial. The firm didn't have the drone shot with trees removed:


Dike profile drawing:

Does anyone want to comment on the survey? Do we have any guys with minors in civil engineering that have found flaws in the plan?

Wow, that looks really complicated. I was gonna make a post to show how smart I am but KWood and Barney are out of my league. Plus no one listens to me any more.

think that might be more PhD level in hydrology. Over my head

Barney have you thought about stocking this wetland with baitfish? I've read some articles and the more varieties of fish you put in this water the better off you'll be. If your pond only has catfish the mallards will get wind of this pretty quick and avoid the area.

I never said only, I didn't even say they would go nocturnal. Reading comprehension is your friend. You also can't compare west coast mallards to Central and Mississippi mallards. A lot of different variables, including hunting pressure.

That they do. They might go get a drink during the night, but they're in the fields all night long. Now a strong cold front does change that a little.

this is why we reacted the way we have. You just dont get it. They have literally killed over 800 birds in three weeks with 99% being straight green heads. I cant tell you how many 6-10 man 8:30 am limits of straight drakes BWho has trolled his friends and this forum with over the past 10 years. Straight private wetlands, with friends and Family only, no guiding. Do the math on what it takes and hunts for 800 straight drakes in three weeks.

Just maybe…. take a step back and asks question on why they are so successful since its contrary to every thing you think you know. Actually dont this is more entertaining.

What state are you building this project in?

I think you are confused. I've extensively hunted the panhandle for 15 years now and have never seen that. I've seen them feed super early in the fields and head back to water before LST. Then feed after LST in the evening and back to water at night. Yes when it gets cold their feeding patterns change. Big cold fronts are typically accompanied with overcast/sometimes snow so they have reduced visibility (can't fly as well at dark), they need more food so they feed longer in the morning and evening. When it gets very cold they will just bounce water to food almost all day to keep their water open. Those are all reasons you see them fly better during daylight when it gets cold.

Definitely not confused lol.
We literally watch them go to field in the evening. Then when we're setting up in the morning, they go back to water right before shooting light. They just swap places with the geese.

Kwood do you think there’s a conspiracy against you everywhere you go with your knowledge or do you think maybe you come off a certain way to attract this kind of reaction

Can we get to the important stuff, like where is the hot tub going?

Haven’t decided, but all I know is the wire isn’t going to be cheap!!!

cheaper then a 12v cummins diesel motor for the pump

Kwoody almost made me want to put on my trolling cap, but its just not as fun as it use to be

Guy, I listen to you

I still wondering about the geese feeding at night in panhandle. They damn sure dont do it in Dec. At my place they are either in town on water treatment center or Feedlot back pits. Only aerated/semi open water for 50 miles. if they leave at night not sure it wouldn't freeze up.

With that said he probably has never hunted around my ranch and considers panhandle, Lubbock

careful, he has a degree, you might be over your head bobo

I never said geese, I said ducks.

how rude

Are you just driving into these fields at 5:30 in the morning and clouds of ducks are getting up in your headlights?

No mention of the effect of the moon phase on night feeding during all this tool measuring?

this reminds me of correcting a pre-teen

"hey don't write on the wall with that black pen"

"its not black, its a dark purple"

whatever it takes to be right, at all costs

You need to shoot a limit of mallards, out of a hot tub, with a 410. That would set a new world record!

Odd way to ask him if he pee’d in his waders this year.

I was actually not asking about him pee'n in his waders, but I think to your point we need to get the full story here... garrett might need to chime in here and take control.

Did some more work a couple of weekends ago. Finished burning the brush piles in the East Pool, cleaned up the ash piles in the West Pool, picked up a ton of sticks and debris where the farmer could work the ground, trimmed the tree line on the dividing levee to allow the contractor to get the toe of the levee as close to the tree line as possible, and meet with a contractor to get a quote on the dirt work. Contractor didn't seemed too surprised with any of the dirt work, but a little concerned with the pump site with the steepness of the bank. Guess we will see when his bid comes back. Starting to take shape.





Just 3 guys wasting time to make ducks nocturnal..........

View looking Northeast from the potential blind site in the East Pool:


View looking North:


Views looking Northwest:



Pano view:

Didn't take any pics from the blind site in the West Pool, but did take a pano view from the very NW corner of the wetland looking South:



already got issues with beavers. I'm sure this will be an ongoing battle once the wetland is finished:

Super cool.

Trapping? Sell pelts (or hides or furs or whatever it's called)? Lease to trappers? I think this place is out of state, yes? If so, I don't know the laws. Hell, I don't them for trapping in Texas for that matter, heh.

Nope, usually when walking back to the spread after getting set up you'll see them, the ducks, flying from the field we're in to water, or from different fields to water. You'll see clouds of them around the same time before legal shooting flying to water. Then about 20 minutes later, the geese get up. The ducks never leave water while we're hunting. Then right after sunset you'll see the ducks flying back to the fields. In the evening, it's not all at once, it's 500 here, 100, there, etc.

Like I said, it's crazy to see, I'm sure our playa lakes region has a lot to do with it too. About the only time we can field hunt ducks is if a really nasty cold front comes in, or it's snowing. Around the cold fronts it's usually new birds though.

GD you are clueless

I hope you didn't use diesel fuel only when burning those brush piles, the only way to get them to burn clean is to use a variety or a buffet if you will of different accelerants.

I'm starting to think it's master level trolling. Where's garrett for his input?

I have questions. Never considered embarking on a task like this, so excuse my ignorance and I certainly am not well versed on Kansas law/requirements.

Is there a tax advantage for building wetlands?

Sure seems like a crapton of government regulations and redtape to just go out and flood a field (intentionally oversimplified statement). I get the surveying for elevations and drainage and flow/hydrology, but why does the gubmint need to stick their nose in your bidness on what you do on YOUR land? Did you have to get all this cleared through the State of Kansas prior to moving dirt? I assume you are you flooding with a well and that is why? Or are you banking on rain water catch?

I think it stays off-radar in Texas if less than 200 acre feet are impounded?

Clearly after a 3-year hunt for the 'right' property, you've demonstrated patience, BUT will that push to 5-years of 'missed' hunting when this place is ready to drop the first bird?

This looks like a fun and worthy project. Keep the updates rolling.

that was smooth

The only one that can out troll Garrett. True OG

Kwoody is the real king troll, no way someone is really that dense, not even someone from Tarleton

These made me laugh out loud.

All we need now is the captain

beetle juice, beetle juice, beetle juice

Really, you want to explain?
You think birds are flying to the field at 530 in the morning, then going to water?
Look at delta, look at any data on radiomarked mallards or pintails. It shows that they feed at night in a lot of places, it's just extremely prolific in the northern panhandle.

You don't have to believe it, I don't care if you do, but it just shows your ignorance. We know what we see, but if you have another explanation, please let's hear it. I literally have our own observations, and science that supports what I'm seeing and saying.

Ok I’ll bite. Let’s see your science that backs your claim up that ducks are dry feeding at night all across the world.

I never said 5:30 in the morning. I promise you I’ve hunted way more than you ever will in the panhandle, still do. I have seen ducks 100’s of times come about about 20-30 minutes before LST, grab a quick bite to eat because they don’t need a ton when it’s 40 degrees as a low, and head back to water about 10 minutes later. That is what I think you’re seeing. Until you drive into a field at 5:30 in the morning and see them get up in your head lights I will never believe you. I’m not saying a duck has never sat in a dry field all night but it damn sure isn’t happening very often. The only way I could ever see it happening is under a full moon.

https://www.realtree.com/the-duck-blog/full-moon-fever-when-ducks-and-geese-go-nocturnal There are some on here that have seen shooting at midnight in Louisiana and Mexico under a full moon on feeding ducks. In the UK and Scotland they can legally do it. I hunt with 2 retired feds that chased duck hunters in Louisiana back in the day a lot at night. When we ran hunt tests in Louisiana, the old timers down there bragged about it and how not just anybody could shoot well at night. lolRealtree

this is kansas winters not louisiana or Mexico

you can shoot ducks feeding at night when its 10 degrees, sure but who is keeping the water open on the river? Location is everything. Ice eaters work in flooded corn. Regardless 10 years worth of history on a wetland that has many back to back to back hunts says a percentage of ducks that do feed at night dont matter

or the other way around, you are making a mountain out of a mole hill. historical reference taken over the past last 10 years via a property right down the road shows its doesnt matter to any degree if a percentage do or dont feed at night. In colder areas they are going back to roosting water to keep it open.

my ranch in panhandle in places is 5 miles from Kansas. In 40 plus year I nor my family have seen duck and/or geese in any quantity feed at night during the mid to late winter season. They stay on roost water to keep it open. just the nature of the freeze line. Location is every thing

Bottom line is when you get the project done, it is going to be great and you will kill ducks on it. But there were some saying the feeding at night wasn't happening. On full moon nights on a lease we used to have that had flooded soybeans, we did poorly at first light, but did well midday and early afternoon.

bottom line is this in Kansas and this is their third project in 10 years all with in 20 miles of each other. With 10 years worth of harvest history, maybe just maybe they know what they are doing.

I'm not going do the research for you, do your own. If I do the research you'll be just like a liberal crying that it's fake news. I promise you that you don't hunt where we do, or we'd run into each other.
What's funny is we know what we're seeing, and you're trying to tell me your opinion on what we SEE!
I do not care if you believe me, but if you want to remain ignorant and close minded, that's up to you.

Also, how have you seen ducks do this 100s of times, in the dark...
Are you a roost buster?

Hey bobo, you can get off of your knees now.

lets talk in person,

Ohio is north of Kansas, or is Kansas unique? "Winous Point Marsh Conservancy research biologist Brendan Shirkey conducted a similar study in northwest Ohio. The ducks in his study moved even less, an average of just 500 to 1,000 yards. That didn’t change throughout hunting season. The study area had a large amount of flooded corn impoundments constructed almost entirely for hunting purposes. Ducks flocked to that corn, but mostly at night. https://www.wildfowlmag.com/editorial/are-mallard-ducks-becoming-nocturnal/374937

I have no reason to want to meet you. By all definition, you're a bully, anti- everything I say, no matter how much science and data I have on my side. So thanks, but no thanks.

yes if it’s got less wetlands, less pressure and less open water. Again 10 years worth of harvest history tells a different tale, even if they feeding in corn at night(frozen, open or dry land) the percentage isnt and hasnt been high enough to effect the outcome.

That's good info, but they won't believe it, they'll find a way to explain it away.
Thanks for the link though.

figured

No, Im not anti every thing, i'm only anti-absolutes. You speak in absolutes as a blank statement, you had no history in the area he is building, nor did you even ask. Same thing you have always done. First thing you did was tell him he was doing it wrong. Thats always been your MO, from ranching/farming to Wetlands.

I have science on my side


What science


Screw you man find it yourself!!!!

I never said he was doing it wrong, lol.
I said you might want to consider adding something more than corn, and I gave the reason why, with science to back it up. And I've said multiple times, if corn works for him, that's great, but don't be surprised if the birds go nocturnal. It's not that hard to comprehend.

And right on cue, you reasoned around the science.

And you figured what, I don't want to fight like you're implying? Why would I do that, I am not a 12 year old boy, or a drunk in a bar room. If you weren't a jerk, I'd love to meet and hang out, but you're always rude, so I'll pass.

I didn't know i needed to give references.
People will also be more liable to believe what they find versus someone doing the work for themselves as well. I'm too busy building a lake right now anyways to go find resources that anyone can find with a quick Google search.

Yet you have plenty of time to come chit all over this thread?

lol, you running your mouth pushing to illicit a response and now act as if you are bullied. You wouldn't of said that in person,

I didnt reason around the science. Your science is a perception based on many factors, with very few that are relevant to his location. Even hailheah link isnt valid for area. That science link is based around WMA’s and large amounts of flooded corn and large wetlands. This area will have just 3 flooded fields in very large dry land farming area. Its not traditional wetland area nor does it have same surrounding pressure. It is a very good fly way though. Like I said you are arguing against their historical records of over a decade of success. What more proof do you need? Are they lying.

Yes great info that proves my point even more that ducks don’t roost on dry land 😂😂😂.

silver labs are better than any other color, its science, prove me wrong

Follow the science comrades.

Man, I still don't know who is right or wrong about where a duck lays its head at night. However, I am glad this thread revealed that I am not the only one who has shook my head at things KWood has said in past threads. The off season on this forum has had a good kickoff!

these young know it all's ran all us old hands off, they make it hard to even post anymore.

Silver labs?!! Everyone knows it's spotted labs now. Silvers were last year.

thats pretty funny

WHY OH WHY HAS NO ONE MENTIONED THAT INDIAN CORN WILL KEEP THEM FROM GOING NOCTURNAL?!?!?!?!

Everyone knows you kill more game with indian corn!

Its their chief preference because it makes them brave.

Old saying about having an alligator mouth backed up with an iguana [censored] comes to mind. “Bully” ahh I’m a victim. Typical of your generation.

you're gonna have to translate that for him

I think he's related to beaverwipe... or whatever that Dutchie's name was.

Alls I know is I'm NEVER buying BOSS SHELLS AGAIN! I bought 1 case for this most recent duck season and they performed worse than my cheap federal and Kents did.

Sir Ivan?

dutch royalty if I recall

Yeah that's him. I have no problem with somebody that only hunts his lease and with guides on private land, but don't come on here and start telling experienced public hunters what they need to do. Seems cut of the same cloth.

Well…

That was an entertaining read.

Looking forward to see how this project turns out. My guess is that they kill a duck or two on flooded corn in Kansas but it’s just a guess.

Sorry. With all the azzhatery in this thread, I missed someone who actually had legitimate questions.



I'm not CPA, so I'm not sure how to answer this for you. Yes there can be tax advantages. Everyone's situation is different, and this depends on a various different situations. If the land has income from farming then the improvements can be deducted from the income. If the improvements exceed the income, the improvements can be depreciated and carried over year to year until the property is sold. In that situation the carry over would directly decrease your capital gains. There's also various federal programs you can enroll the property in. Some stay with the property in perpetuity, so it decreases the land value and appeal to someone wanting to buy a turn key property. Some are 10, 15, 20 year programs but dependent on a history of farm income as well as other requirements to register with those programs. Hopefully that answers your question.



Sure you can do what you want on your own property if that's the risk you are willing to take. By the time this project is over, the development will be well over six figures. Not having the proper paper work for water rights and levees was not a risk I was willing to take. Water rights and diverting water is controlled by the feds. All it would take is one person to complain to the right people about our use of water or a levee breaking to no only make us liable for the damages the levee breaking would cause but fines and tearing down of levees. I've had countless friends tell me I don't need permits to do this, but I don't see any of them risking six figures or dropping a pump into any of the major waterways around here flooding fields either. Yes, we will have a wet well and pump each pool. I'd love it if we could just catch the water from run off each year. Save a lot in electricity for pumping.



Not based on my research.



Hindsight is always 20/20. I wish rather than maxing out my 401K every year since I started working year 1 I would have just done match up to my company, taken the delta, and invested the money myself to buy land with. Instead, I've got the huge number on a computer sitting in accounts that I can't use until I retire and will never use all of granted there's not a major medical event for my wife and I. Anyway, off my soap box, but I wish I had done this 10-15 years ago. Would have cost 1/4 to 1/2 of what this project will cost, but yes after you get the property bought you get to deal with the slow wills of the government on permitting. If we are lucky, we will get to flood and hunt the property this year which will be just a year after owning it, but realistically you have to go in with the mindset it's going to take 2 years to get the property developed. Then it's going to be another 2-3 years before the birds really imprint on the property, and the hunting is as good as you want it to be. I was lucky that my buddy I'm partnered with has another wetland developed we've been hunting the last 5 years.

Thanks. Trying to get final bids from contractors now as well as pipe and electrical wiring purchased. Should be a busy spring and summer!

Wanna trade some hunts for a finished retriever once we are up and going? My chocolate meat head should be just about retirement age by then.

It's good to see a little liveliness around here again.

Cool project.
Not sure on the feeding at night only thing for corn but, I would plant some variety just in case you have a corn issue.
More than one species might be good if your corn doesn't make for a reason.
Millet, milo etc seeded in along the edges maybe or interspersed.
Get some grains that might be staggered in there harvest times so grains on the ground are throughout your season.

Hit up some farmers or coops right now, we saw piles of grain driving down through Kansas , Colorado and Texas first of the month.
Have you looked into a solar pump?

How many turkeys do you have on your place?

This is the type of crap you have to deal with when permitting a wetland. SMDH!!

^^SMH

My 1st attempt at a wetland. NRCS designed it and i built it. Only 6 acres but add a nice feature to my ranch. Has average of 18 inch deep water, Installed small core under levee. Has drain pipe with concrete seep collar. Built little over a year ago. Lots of Woodducks use it. Took 38 hrs to push up levee with dozer.

Very cool project! Wish I knew where to even start! Please continue to post updates

Thanks Blu. Definitely a lot too it and processes to go thru if you want to dot all the “i’s” and cross all the “t’s” to cover your investment.

Got good news today. Our structure permit has been approved. Next step is to get the water right approval before dirt can be moved. The state says it’s in the final steps and expects approval in a couple of weeks. Now to finalize bids with contractors, so we can hopefully have a duck season this year. Fingers crossed!

Seems like the prices of everything has close to doubled in a year since the last wetland was built. Feel lucky to have found our 8” inlet pipe for $1/ft vs the $60+/ft at the current rates. Wish I could find a deal on electrical direct bury wire and pumps.



I’ll try to setup a Timelapse camera once we start moving dirt to document the process.

water rights permit came in the mail last Saturday, so we are good to start moving dirt. Working on a possibly grant that would pay dollar for dollar for every improvement made for a wetland. If the application is approved, we can't move dirt until after July 1st. Fingers crossed we qualify!

Meet with another contractor last Sunday for a third bid. Waiting on that estimate and working with the other two contractors on updating bids for things they missed.

Meeting with the engineers that work with the grant to address some questions they have with our application the first of May as well as the power company to set a pole and meter needed for our pump.

Things are progressing. We should have levees and water to hunt this season.

let me see what kind of top secret corn seed I can find you

Will trade hunts for top secret corn seed!!!

don't plant corn, mallards will feed at night only in it and you wont shoot anything

I would plant millet. You have the best luck when you start planting it in November and continue planting it incrementally through the end of January.

Yeah, just throw bags of in the shallow once a week.

Just a question, but why are you using companies that bid a job, versus hourly?
Do you know exactly how much dirt needs to be moved?

Yea Barney why aren’t you just hiring the first dude that answers the phone and paying him hourly

That wouldn't be very smart.

We have tons of annual Lambs Thumb smartweed this year. Big soil disturbance last Feb. plant grasses on late drawdown this year. Easy peasy.

Be careful...he has a Chessie and what they don't bite I hear they piss on

That is not a very nice thing to say Judd.

elder just had pups, I tried to talk the big purple people eater into it… But I think he got scared

Great looking project, definitely doing it right. Have done some projects myself, and it is a very fun and rewarding thing to do. Looked farther north before and need to go that way, just currently at a point in life where I wouldn’t have the free time to utilize it. Great looking project again, keep us updated!

Thanks. Nothing too exiting going on other than getting our ducks in a row (pun intended). Meeting for our grant went great. Finally got all the requested information for that pulled together. Application will be filed on July 1st and crossing fingers it's approved. We can't move dirt until after July 1st for all expenses to qualify for the grant. Contractor we selected can't start until August any way. Going to cut it close to have a season, but we are moving in that direction.

In the mean time, we've been going back and fort on our wet well design, inlet pipe size, and pump for best efficiency. As well as a NEMA 4 or NEMA 1 rated VFD with and without an environmentally controlled box. Lots and lots and lots of decisions to be made to go along with the work.

We decided to use a rail system in our wet well to make installation as well as service of the pump simple:


Pump efficiency chart used during wet well design :


One iteration of our wet well:


NRCS stipulates one of their approved meters has to be used to meet the qualification of our water rights. Meter should be accessible at any time for them to verify the information we submit each year on gallons pumped. Originally we were going to put the pump above ground, but we found a meter with an elevated analog display to eliminate all the flanges and 90's making the construction and cost cheaper.

Lots to do, but I can see a glimmer of light at the end of the tunnel.

Does KWood approve all this? Might need his input, check the math and stuff..make sure this will not drive night only mallard feeding and stuff like that…

I have no input on pumps, haven't had to mess with anything like that, so it's something I'm ignorant on. It'd be neat to learn about if I need to though as I do like numbers.

I'll still stand by my statement though, straight corn has a chance of turning mallards nocturnal, as research supports.

no, large and wide swaths of pressure has the chance of turning mallards nocturnal per your own links. Again you are making a blanket statement in a post without knowing any other parameters.

With that said Ive never seen a below river grade pump system myself, pretty cool Barney, although looks like a giant snake pit in summer time.

So has a chance means blanket statement. Man, you're hard to please.
And yes, we all agreed it was multiple factors, as research shows, but straight corn has a higher probability, as research shows, that you reject.

whats to argue? Their historical harvest rates, limit times, WRP or conservation program payments, Seed costs, expenses…

what do you want to argue? This is third development in a 50 miles radius in 15 years…. You are implying theory to their 15 years of real data.

You are something else. It's a general statement, for the whole US, not just his place. I made a general statement, and you're too dense to realize it.

From the outside looking at this objectively... the one that appears dense is the one that makes a general theoretical statement/argument on a guy's thread that clearly knows what he's doing. Then doesn't understand why he got dragged.

Well you're wrong, it's not theoretical, it's scientifically proven.
So barney is the exception, not the rule, good for him.

follow the science, always follow the science, did 2020 not teach you people anything?

every link posted on this thread is a macro overview of habit’s tied to pressure.

You have only told them they are doing wrong, with out any other context or even mitigation type questions. I get it, as you already told us you are the proclaimed academically astute professional, you dont need or want context or historical reference for perspective.

If I was going to build a wetland with flood able crops Id interview tons of people before I started giving out advice based solely on what I’ve read or hunted in a limited capacity on.

I like how the OP doesn’t care about the two middle school boys arguing. He’s just over there hand rolling 410s getting ready for November to swing on back around.

He is hurting today. We where in OKC for soccer turny this weekend. LONG weekend!!! Girls rocked so it was cool.

youth soccer games are better then closing time at the bar… so many special idiots out there

but ya those light loaded TSS 410 are crazy quiet.

That made me laugh really hard. I've actually got 1000 wads and Fiocchi .410 hulls I need to load.

Rich folks stuff traveling out of country to play futbol with 10 year olds.

Well, all I know is that if you ain't killin' gadwall at 25 yards in 50 degree weather wearing Sitka waders and shooting Boss shells... you're doing it wrong. It's science dammit!

Well if you want to be informed, science can't lie. Science is fact based info, but the scientists on the other hand can lie. So yes, extrapolate the data and follow the science.

this thread is the largest gathering of TSU scientists ever assembled.

let me get my Big Chief tablet and #2 pencil out for note taking, I plan on learning today

Excrapalate

I just extrapolated a bunch of free nocturnal seed!!

fancy corn….

I see you found your way into the Indian Corn.

Beware as it will attract aggressive deer that will make your ducks go nocturnal.

I'm getting the midnight munchy's just looking at it.

John Redcorn

Update: Contractor moved his equipment this past weekend.





Things are starting to get real. Started moving dirt yesterday. I think everything has been bought, ordered, and delivered except for the VFD for our pump.








I planned on going up every other weekend to check on the progress and help where needed. Contractor told me he’d let me run a scrapper. Thought it would be cool to have contributed to some part of the dirt process, but as with all things life I’ve had a family issue come up that will prevent this. Also wanted to do time lapse photos with a game cam of the process, but I didn’t get that done when I delivered all the pipe. Hopefully he will send pics along the way of the progress or my partner will take some. I’ll update this thread as best I can. God willing we will have water to hunt come November.

For as little rain as that region has gotten all the corn at each property looks really good.







Even the timber hole we planted in July is looking good.

Sweet !!
Flooded timber hunting is a blast, nothing like ducks raining down on top of you.

My absolute favorite. I'll give up a few to get a few coming into the trees.

Inlet pipe, wet well, pump, rail system, and discharge pipe going in today…..

I hear that is Darin Bezos. Jeff’s richer younger brother.

Assuming a shallow water table that allows this pump setup?


Sweet project! Very envious of both your tenacity to complete the project and availability to get up there so often!




As a TSU alum that has shot quite a few waterfowl over the years, I look forward to seeing you give it hell and shoot ducks in the face, day or night. Lot of equity in this project, so bravo sir. Very impressed. It beats my half acre Falls co water hole by a long shot!

Thanks. It’s definitely a labor of love and hopefully something my family and I can enjoy for years.

Pump setup is to pump from a creek.

Like all things the contractor ram into solid bedrock which shocked all of us about 4’ above where the bottom of the pit needed to sit. His hoe wouldn’t break the rock, so he had to rent a bigger hoe with a breaker. Got the 12” inlet pipe set with the base of the wetwell late on Saturday. Hopefully that’s the only snafu we run in to.

Concrete company built one of the man hole sections wrong, or the wet well would be done.






Pump and wiring next. We will probably wait to install pump until all the wiring and VFD are installed.

i see whats wrong with it… aint got no top on itttttt

Love watching this and hope to do this one day myself. Not duck related but, all that feed out there, seeing any good whitetail? Best of both worlds.

Oh yeah. That's the best part of creating a wetland in KS. If you are on a creek in KS with farm ground around it, you are going to have big whitetails. The first property developed were by two of my friends born and raised in KS. They HATE deer. They want every deer dead. Anyway, they leased the deer rights to me on the original property. The first pic I ever opened on a game camera from that place had 190"+ whitetail on it standing on a levee they had just built. The deer was so big I thought they were playing a trick on me. They weren't. I ended up killing a typical 10 over 150" that year. Had lots of pictures of the big deer, but I never saw him in person. The next season he was on camera again and about to the same size. I had an older 8 point and another 10 I was after as well. I never did see the big deer in person again that season nor the really old 10. I arrowed a really big 8 point during the rut, but I never found him. I ended up finding the old 8 I was hoping to have a shot at after the season dead in the creek. He measured 151". The third year the neighbor who owned the CRP field the big deer and most of the deer bed on ended up killing him. I think he went 197". He was 190"+. I wish I had saved the pictures from my old phone. A friend who owned the land just South of where I hunted killed 178" deer that season as well that no of us had on film. Deer just showed up during the rut. He has since sold that property to my two friends with the wetland.

The new property we are developing now with all the pictures in this thread has much of the same in the way of deer. I haven't hunted it yet because my 9 year old is flat eat up with hunting. Every opportunity I have to hunt I take him. I haven't taken him to KS because I don't want to set the bar at 160 or 170" whitetail. My buddy killed a really nice 135-140" young 8 off the place last year. The deer didn't need to be shot, but he got excited during the rut and shot him. His first deer with a bow, so I couldn't be too upset. The agent that found us the property is an outfitter in KS as well. He told me after we closed on the property that he personally leased this ground to deer hunt himself before we bought it. He said he killed two deer over 170" off it. The place also has great turkey hunting too.

If the servers will ever stop being so dang slow, I'll try to upload some more progress photos.

Corn and millet are looking good.

Wet well is mostly done except for setting pump, wiring, and putting the top on. Meter installed and stubbed for PVC attachment.

Starting in the low water crossing. Plan is concrete to build a low water dame to add more height over the inlet pipe with more head pressure which means more flow to the pump under normal water conditions than I pump can deliver to wetland so we are never starving the pump of water.

Pump with bracket installed to center on base and slide up and down rail system for maintenance




Now aerial views of borrowing and moving dirt. Good news is clay is right where soil analysis and soil scientist predicted as well as enough content to build levees and hold water. Hopefully no more surprises.

Geez, knowing his dad I can't imagine where that comes from

Looking good buddy !
Congrats !

Pump and lid installed on pit, poles set for power meter and disconnect. On the books for electrician to set the meter and power company to drop transformer to connect power. Once that is done it’s a matter of trenching the power to wet well and setting VFD.

Contractor cut grade with dozer until he found clay and started scraping to build levees. Shouldn’t be too much longer now.

We will have to poor man hunt it a couple of years from skid blinds until we see how the birds use the property and are comfortable building permanent hard sided blinds. Got one of the skid blinds raised so the floor is 6” above the very top of the highest elevation of our pool. Just need to get in and level it with some skidsteer work before we brush it.



Despite the unseasonably dry summer for this area this year, we have made plenty of nocturnal duck food it seems.





Last pic with truck in corn field is the original wetland we normally hunt and not the new property we are developing.

“Poor boy hunt”

We have different definitions ole son.

Blind leveled and brushed.




Drain pipes installed:

Main levee on East Pool built and levee in West pool started:

Borrow area in the East field to put pool in the wetland and more water to the East of our blind location:


Cleaned out around natural rock formation in the creek to add concrete for low water crossing. Concrete should have went in today.

Low water crossing poured:






Hopefully the front brought some rain. Clay has gotten too dry to build levees, and we don’t want to haul in water.

Got the other skid blind in the West pool and brushed. Steps and dog ramps added to both blinds.

Contractor wasn’t able to do much dirt work in August due to the high temps and dry conditions. Then other obligations bleed over into our job. Had some equipment break downs as well, but he’s back on it and thinks he should have everything done by the end of the month. We realistically think the middle of October. Would be nice if he’s done by the end of September where we could seed levees and hopefully get some growth before big rains and losing some of the dirt work due to erosion. Also, got all but 2 of our poles set for junction boxes for power to the blinds and VFD for the pump set.

That is wild that you have a wet well. Did you decide to use the wet well because of where you are pumping water from? Also, the creek looks dry. Does it always fill up? Cool plan for sure. I gave corn my best shot this year, pigs murdered it in East Texas. Can't have anything nice around these parts...

Yes wet well was used because of the size of the creek and type of pump used. Depending on the amount of flow in the creek the pump could starve for water at full rate, so it needs a variable frequency controller (VFD) with a float to monitor amount of water in the pit as well as shut off to not over heat the pump. If we were on a major river where amount of water wasn't an issue, we would use an entirely different set up. That comes with it's own set of challenges and problems as well. Your greatest asset is also your greatest liability aka water! Also, if you don't currently have a well drilled into the aquifer and are grandfathered in you aren't going to drill one without big fines from the state. Even then it's regulated for agricultural purposes only again unless you are grandfathered in to a certain acre feet of water rights and want to apply to use the rights levied against agriculture to recreational rights. We applied for and received primary recreational water rights on this creek. Meaning no one else can pump from the creek until we have pumped our entire allotment of water rights.

Cofferdam was constructed to put in the wet well and low water crossing, but this region is currently experiencing a record drought. There is water in the creek, but not enough to turn on the pump and run it. The farmer we use grew up and lives less than 5 miles from this property. He said this is the first time in his life he's ever not seen water flowing in this creek. He's in his 70s.

Thankfully we don't have to deal with pigs.

Electrician got the two disconnects (don’t ask ) and meter set on our electrical pole per the specs of the power company to provide service. That’s had it’s own set of headaches as there’s only one company that provides power in the area and have some pretty ridiculous requirements if you want service to power anything larger than a normal house. We needed 480V service for our pump. Anyway, hopefully that hurdle is behind us. Power company should set transformer and connect service to our meter next week.

Balancing reservoir is the answer, not sure you’re permitted or have the room. But that would solve the low water problems.

Both. Would take one helluva reservoir to hold as much water as well need to pump. We are sorta doing something on a much smaller scale with our low water crossing. It adds 18" of pool over normal elevation just down stream of our pump. Under normal conditions this gives 2X-3X that amount of head pressure to keep our wet well full with the pump running at full capacity.

Cool stuff, good luck. I can tell this has been a well thought out project. I work for a similar entity, with more focus on water quality rather than duck food. A lot of similarities, though.

Kansas guy here. Duck season 1 month away. 2.63 inches in South KC last week. You guys get any rain? Great project, appreciate you documenting it as it's been fun to follow.

Still not see’n the hot tub, guess that’s going in later.

Thanks. Very little. Right at an inch of rain total in the last 3 weeks. Historic drought in our area. It's bad. The dust is so bad from working the ground it's the consistency of chalk. We were seeding the levees that are finished yesterday. I had on tennis shoes with socks. The dust went thru my shoes and socks it's ground so fine.

We did get some work done though. The South levee for the East and West pools are done with the exception of a little work on the spillway and where the dividing levee ties into the south levee. The top soil for the dividing levee has been removed with the core down to clay. All the power lines are in the ground, run the the blinds/pump, and back-filled. We just need to set two more poles and electrical boxes once the contractor is done with the levee to tie everything together. Got the flap gates installed on all the drain pipes and caulked. Installed all of the critter guards except for one we were missing. Fertilized and seeded all of the levees that were completed. About 2/3rds are done. Can finally see the light at the end of the tunnel. Hopefully we get some of this forecasted rain this week on the seeding to start growing some grass to control erosion. Contractor has the dividing levee to complete, two WCS's to install, and some grading work to complete where the clay was borrowed. Everything should be done within the next two weeks if there are no more major breakdowns on his end. I'll go back up when he's done to finish all the electrical work and seed the rest of the levees. At that point all we can do is sit around and hope mother nature provides us some water.

Looks like we are going to end up with one heck of a deep pond on the North end of the West pool from where the contractor borrowed the clay. Will be around 18’ deep. I’m sure our kids will hate having a place to fish as well.




View from inside our skid blind in the West pool.





Wiring in power to the West pool blind.




Power for the pump VFD

Looks great. Do you have issues with the pigs destroying the corn? I cant wait to see the pictures of when it all fills up...

Thankfully no. No pigs in our area. We have a hard enough time keeping the deer and coons from destroying the corn. I bet pigs would come in and totally decimate it. I have a friend that just build some wetlands in NE Texas. He planted corn and milo. I think the pigs have found his corn.

I can't wait to see if full of water either!

Man, looks like a fun time when the ducks get down there. Like the deeper end for fishing too. Well done.

Barney I grew up in Grapevine, how long have you been in Colleyville?

I built a new lake this year but it took awhile because of the rain in our area. Then it was to late for corn. Next year we will do corn but we are in the Pig Capital of Texas. We will have to put of hog panels and a electric fence......

For safeties sake you should have your contractor make the slopes more gentle. You don't want someone wading off into the pond to take an extra step and have water go over there head.

I know how much it’s gonna cost to run 480 to my shop in town, I don’t want to know what it cost to run it to bfe kansas

Bought a house here in 2019, but my wife was born and raised here. She went to the same middle school (CMS in 1992) that my daughter attends now. She graduated from GCISD.




OUCH! I did a quick calculation and just the panels would cost us $15K to put around our corn.



As much as we’ve paid the contractor to move dirt, I’m not paying him a dime more to shape slopes on a borrow pit. Will have to be the school of hard knocks around here if someone steps off the side.



Not too bad when DU pays 1/2!

GHS 1981 so a little before her time, I also went to CMS when it was brand new.

Nice project, looking forward to some water pics !!

Contractor finished up a week ago with the dividing levee and the brush guards around the drain pipes. Power company set the new pole with transformer and provided service. We went out last weekend, connected the service from the power company to our panel, set two more poles with panels, finished setting piles for our deer blind/duck viewing platform, and seeded the rest of the levees. Except for the electrician coming out to install the VFD and program it, we are completely done.

Power to meter and graveled a parking lot.




Dividing levee finished:


Setting pole at center of dividing levee for panel to run power to our East pool blind. Little pucker factor using augur around buried #4 wire that services our VFD and provides power to the pump:


Pole set and view of dividing levee North:


View looking South from pole in center of dividing levee:


Pano shot standing at the intersection of the dividing levee and South levee looking Northeast into the East pool:

Brush guards around the drain pipes:





Didn’t get any pictures of the brush guards around the East pool drain pipes. Also forgot to mention the contractor put in the WCS last week as well. This is the one in the dividing levee. I didn’t get a picture of the one in our East Pool.



If you look North of the inlet pipe here you can see the WCS in the dividing levee. We decided to put a WCS here in case of years with little water we could flood the smaller pool (West pool) first and if the ducks ate all the corn out we could pull the birds to flood the East pool and hopefully have water later in the season to completely flood it in dryer years.


This is a series of pictures of putting in the telephone poles for our deer blind/duck viewing platform form. One of the legs holds the junction box to provide power to the deer blind and service to the VFD for the pump.

Contractor did quite a lot of work to reshape the borrow in the East pool help with drainage, build up in front of the blind so it was more shallow for the kids to wade/help put out decoys, and bring in top soil to plant corn. Very happy with the work he did here. We will end up having 100-120 yards of water to the East of our blind where we originally were thinking 60-70 yards at most when we were shooting elevations during our planning stages. Hard to really show this in pictures.



Also had the contractor come back in and reshape the drainage on the south side of our low water crossing and [censored] some rock. I like the way it turned out.

Some aerials of the completed work:





Hopefully this will give a little perspective. Red lines are our levees and the dots show the current locations of our skid blinds. The East pool blind will pretty much at where it’s at. The West pool blind spot would change after we hunt it a couple of seasons to see how the ducks use that area in different winds.



If you haven’t noticed by now the levee in the East pool doesn’t run all the way to the tree line and leaves 3-5 acres of open field to the South of the levee. We decided to do this due to the depth needed to get to clay to build the wetland and the amount of additional crop it would give us bs the amount of money to build the levee further South. It just wasn’t worth the cost to us. So, that area will become a late season food plot for deer. That’s the area in blue. The green dot is where the deer/duck blind will be. Right now the plan is 16’X8’ enclosed blind at 15’ with a platform underneath at 8-10’ for viewing ducks when the weather is nice. Still spit balling the final plans on that which will be built next year. Should be able to come in from the South thru the low water crossing and slide into the blind to watch the duck in the afternoon and deer hunt without disturbing anything.

Cool. I either missed it or forgot since you started, where will you get your water? Is there a river nearby?

Creek when we aren’t going thru a historic drought!



Hopefully we get some much needed rain this week! (Fingers crossed)

Just curious Barney. With the money you guys are spending. Why not just put a well in and run off electric? Or did I miss that? I’d think over time, the creek irrigation will silt in that pipe. But could be wrong.
Love what you guys are doing though. I built mine several years back and it just keeps getting better. We are thinking of expanding and adding more area and another well. But don’t really want to change anything since it’s working.

But watching your post makes me want to levy more more land. Lol.

3.1" over last 2 days here in South KC. I come here often hoping for water pics. Hope you're getting some.

You did miss it. Water is a premium for agricultural water rights. If you don't currently have a well dug into the aquifer and grandfathered in, you aren't getting granted permission to dig one much less for recreational water rights is my understanding. We are running our pump off electric. Costly in the front end, but will more than pay for itself over the long haul vs a diesel pump and having to babysit it every day or other day. Our wet well is version 2.0 with my partner and his first wetland. A lot of thought and lessons learned went into this design. Our pump can handle 3" solids. The holes in the pipe are 2", so it will eat anything that gets inside our well hopefully. The pipe is 24" off the bottom of the creek and has a fall of 18" from the creek to the inside of our wet well. When the pump is running at max RPM it will clear any silt that gathers in the pipe. Only time will tell is all our planning and lessons learned were correct or not. You only know what you know right? Also, we went in to this knowing on dry years we might not have enough water to pump to hunt. Based off historical records that would be every 1 out of 10 years. On the flip side, if we were on a major river then you are going to get your crops flooded out ever 1 out of 10 years or more and not having anything to hunt. Not to mention all the levee repair from the flooding. As my buddy says, your greatest asset is your greatest liability as well. This is property #3 my partner is involved in. One of the 3 is on a major river that should always have water. The other two are on creeks that won't have water during dry years, but hopefully won't flood during wet years. Between the 3 the thought is all the owners can be generous enough to always have quality hunting.



I'm hoping I can be involved in one more project about this size. Been a great experience. Always nice to see your sweat equity pay off and hopefully leave something valuable your kids/grand kids can enjoy for years.

Seems all the rain has gone to the North of this property. Only 1.5" so far, but hopefully we get some of the runoff in the basin to our North.

My partner has another property not far from KC they are putting a pump in on the Marais Des Cygnes River. That 3.1" will hopefully help them get enough flow in the river to pump since they only have Junior Water rights.

A few pics of that pump system:





We got the blind moved and setup on that property a couple of weekends ago. They have a great stand of corn. Should have a good season there.

Month or so ago we knew we had missed the window of the native grass seed germinating and growing, so we over seeded the levees with winter wheat. Nice to see some growth with the trace amounts of precipitation we were getting.




Finally got some rain and run off this week. Good to see the creek flowing again and water starting to accumulate in our wetland!






With the severe drought we were going thru we made the decision to not have the electrician come out and install the VFD since there wasn’t enough water supply to set all the parameters. We knew we’d have to pay them to come back out and program it when the Creek had enough flow to run the pump at full speed. With the creek flowing, the electrician is set to come out Thursday to install and program the VFD. Fingers crossed we are pumping water by the end of next week!

I'd probably already had a spread out in that water you backed up in the woods.

Looks awesome.

Maybe you will get some snows on there, they love that winter wheat.

AwesomeJob you guys have done. which County are is this in if you don't mind my asking

Thanks. Woodson

This is beyond impressive. The attention to detail and foresight is quite commendable. That first greenhead is going to be such a sweet feeling all said and done.

Several questions:

What have the financials of this scale of a project looked like? Don't want to pry too much of your personal dollar and cent investment but more along the lines of "property was x% of total investment and improvements made up y%."

Are yall planting and maintaining the corn yourself? Or do you have an agreement with a local farmer? This may have already been discussed but I found myself having to skip over most mention of "corn" to actually follow the property development aspect...

Appreciate that and yes several of us are very much looking forward to the first time we can get in the blind and kills some ducks. My son especially.



Well, I can tell you it hasn't been cheap. I haven't really thought of it in terms of overall percentages, but sitting her roughly going over numbers. All in turn key the price of the land was roughly 66% of the final cost with the development we did being 34%. Had our grant been funded those percentages would have drastically changed as we would have been refunded dollar for dollar on our development. We are in round 2 applying for a different ground with $0.50 on the dollar being funded. Also looking into an endowment. There are options out there to reduce the cost.



The previous owner is a farmer. Due to personal circumstances with him needing money, he had to sell the farm. So it ended up being a good deal for him as we aren't farmers. He still gets to run his cattle on the land in the winter and cash rent the farm ground from us. In trade, he plants and maintains the corn in our wetland for us. Works out for both parties in the end.

Update: The last piece to this puzzle was the VFD. We had ordered the VFD back in August with specific requirements on what we wanted. Come to find out the electrician over promised and under delivered. They were quite as familiar with the programming as they made us believe. It really wasn’t too big of a deal as we had no water to pump anyway until we finally got a big rain right before Christmas. We lost the potential to pump several acre feet of water; but they finally installed the VFD so we could run the pump. I can’t tell you how satisfying it was to see water finally discharging into our wetland.







At max speed, we can pump 850-900 gallons/min as long as we have that much or more flow in the creek.



At the time of install, there wasn’t enough flow in the creek to run at max frequency, but we did verify our inlet design and low water crossing. If the creek is flowing at any rather under 900 gallons/minute, once programmed correctly our pump won’t let on drop of water by which is a major win. Lots of planning and lessons learned went into this. Was nice to confirm the design worked.



The bummer was we couldn’t leave the pump on and in standby mode waiting for another rain as we weren’t confident the parameters in the pump were programmed correctly to keep from damaging the pump. Our suspicions ended up being correct, and I’m glad we turned the pump off.

Finally the week before Christmas, we got some good soaking rains in the area that saturated the ground and gave us good run off into the creek. The problem was the pump was on and in standby so it could immediately start pumping when it sensed water in the creek, so we lost a day of pumping until my partner could get out to the pump to turn it on.

Water over the low water crossing at this level is around 2000 gallons/min or more, so we can run wide open without a problem.



After 3 days of pumping, the wetland was starting to look like a wetland!



Since we weren’t convinced the programming was correct, we keep going back each day to check the level of the creek. I think this was day 3 of pumping, but you can see the water has come down. Still enough flow to run wide open.

By day 4 running at max speed, we had pumped 11 acre feet of water which is around half of what we need to fill our smaller “west pool”, but at 11 acre feet it puts enough water in front of our blind to hunt and floods corn!





By the 4th day, the creek flow had slowed down to around 450 gallons/min. The good news was the pump had slowed to match the flow of the creek. It’s hard to tell here, but if you look at the right hand side of the pic you can see the water running in, but you can obviously tell by the inlet pipe being visible the pump isn’t letting any water by our low water crossing.



At this point we checked some parameters on the VFD and confirmed our suspicions that the pump wouldn’t operate correctly if the flow of the creek slowed below the lower limit of our pump. In stead of going into standby the pump would just cycle off and on as the pit would fill with water which is not what we want. So, at this point we weren’t comfortable leaving the pump on and again lost some water that night as it was trickling over the low water crossing by the time we returned the next day. This time we had someone with us familiar with VFDs that helped us figure out which parameters were set wrong and how to change them. We finally got to a point where we feel comfortable leaving the pump on to come out of standby mode when there is enough water to pump and going back into standby when it’s pumped all the available water. We were able to confirm this by putting a camera in the discharge pipe. You can tell even though there’s no water coming out of the pipe at some point the pump has cycled on and off.




Still some more things to work out with the VFD, but at least at this point we won’t lose any more water down stream when we get a rain. Now all we need are ducks and more water!

awesome, congratulations

This thread is beyond Great! Such a fabulous project. Congrats to y'all.

The pump setup is awesome...very impressive.

think its cool now!!! Just wIt until the 55 gal drum of Bubble bath I just ordered shows up!

Venmo sent for 1/2

55 Gal. Heck, let's double it..

looking for a cheaper option

Howdy fellas, been a while.

BarneyWho- Awesome project and very enjoyable thread. Thanks for taking the time to document it so well. Please keep the updates coming and best of luck with your "home made honey hole!"

Very impressive, sir. This is awesome!

Looks freaking awesome!!!! Thanks for sharing the progress!