TPWD Drawn Hunts Survey

Who received a TPWD drawn hunts system satisfaction survey? It did have some questions about the "cubing" of points. I know that there are positives and negatives about the system this past season. What did you think about the cubed points?

I wonder whatever happened to that one attorney who was typing his manifesto about how the cubing of points is illegal or whatever, I can't remember all his reasons.

Cubing is certainly a a good and bad thing. If you have a bunch of points in a category it’s a good thing. If you have low points and/or just drew a hunt it’s a bad thing. I really wish they left it alone.

He publicly denounced his membership and changed his screen name to “Delete this account”
Yes I think there was something wrong with him.

I am the same. I wish that they would have just left it alone.

Ahh I didn't catch that.

I got one of the surveys this morning, and appreciated the fact they send them out, so I immediately filled it out. Here's my comments for what its worth, as I am one of those "evil non-residents"!

1. I like the fact they offer quite a few hunts, and over all, my satisfaction is fairly high. I have met some new friends thru them, and lots of great TPWD employees at the WMA's
2. I'd like like to see some more opportunity for youth, and wish they would schedule a little better so they could go on a weekend, instead of during the week
3. I believe they should do away, or at least relax the antler restriction on youth only hunts. When there is zero harvest on that hunt for kids, it sucks!!
4 Go back to only applying for only one hunt per category, and people with dedication to one particular area would see some increased success in drawing again.
5 Talking with the Director of the Public Hunt Program, NR's still only make up about 3% of the applicants, so I didn't believe they needed a NR cap on permits yet
5 I don't believe we NR's should have to buy a license, but I did suggest/ask them to increase application fees by 3X (to $10), and double the permit costs ($160/#260) for NR's. This would bring it in line with other Western states

I have to buy a non-refundable license in every state I apply in. it’s absolutely crazy texas doesn’t require it. Since we also do NOT have a NR TAG ALLOCATION LIMIT, we damn sure should make them have at least a small game license to apply.

Also input no more than two choices per species categories. 2 exotics, 2 mule deer, 2 WT, etc will slow point creep

[quote=BOBO the Clown]I have to buy a non-refundable license in every state I apply in. it’s absolutely crazy texas doesn’t require it. Since we also do NOT have a NR TAG ALLOCATION LIMIT, we damn sure should make them have at least a small game license to apply.

Also input no more than two choices per species categories. 2 exotics, 2 mule deer, 2 WT, etc will slow point creep

[/quote

I agree. Everyone should have to have a license to apply. It would be revenue positive for TPWD.

No argument from me here fellas. I’ll gladly buy a license for a reasonable cost, but including a bunch of tags I can’t use anywhere goes against the grain! Make it a small game or 5-day one to apply, and I’m all over it. At least the other states have open public land and OTC tags you can actually use.

So does Texas, lots of public if you look. With that said most states required hunting licenses is a small game. tag is separate. technically it's same here but a cheap permit/use fee.

Completed mine last night.

Interesting only 3% NR are applying. Some folks on another Texas hunting forum are all up in arms over the Wyoming fee increases proposed and reduction in some tags to 10%.
I would agree with have to buy some type of license to apply or higher app fee for NR.

BoBo no license required in Wyoming to apply for tags.

Just completed the survey. Had the following comments:

All applicants (Except youth hunts and youths) should have a current hunting license at the time of the application.

Limit the number of times you can apply in a hunt category

Expand the properties involved in the draw system. They could certainly do this with the private lands hunts.

Stop cubing points and go back to the old system or just square. Cubing makes the odds so slim for low point holders that there is no reason to apply.

Make a point only choice for each category.

How did y’all receive your survey?

TPWD sent an email yesterday.

Same here.

I just mentioned that I didn't like the cubing system. I don't have a lot of points because I put in for dang near everything. I just like to hunt and visit new places. I just pointed out who is more loyal. The guy putting in for the same 15 hunts over 15 years or me who puts in for $300 worth of hunts every year for the last 5. I didn't care when you got a loyalty point a year. A guy with 15 loyalty points doesn't have a much better chance at getting picked than a guy with 5 points.

I took it. No complaints from me....besides why are dogs not allowed during the big bend ranch sp quail hunt? Kinda odd.

I told them I understand why they want to reward the guys with 20 points trying to draw the Chap, but I have used it for the last several years as a way to see new areas and fill the freezer. I usually spend $300+ on applications and have come to expect to draw 2-5 hunts. Usually nothing too exciting, but a lot of doe/management hunts in places I would otherwise not visit. As a result, I never build many points. If they keep with the cubing points, I will quit applying and plan two out of state trips every year instead of one. I think if they want to reward the guys who have been applying for the trophy hunts for decades, they should split them off in a separate category and cube the points for those hunts, and leave the "less desirable" hunts the way they were.

I absolutely understand the desire to reward the folks who have kept it up for many years. However, it comes at the cost of guys like me who will quit applying if we don't draw but one hunt every few years.

When you have more demand for hunts than you have supply, you need to find a way to ration them. Texas has so little public land that I do not support increasing fees, as that burden would be paid by the folks who already don't have options. Effort is another way to limit requests, but TPWD removed that obstacle when everything went online. I guess time is the only element that they have left to control. I think it is unfortunate as it will decrease revenue in applications and will severely discourage new hunters from applying. I used to tell new Texas hunters to spend the $300 and they would get to hunt that fall. Now, I think I would tell them to look at other states if they don't want to pay for a lease.

But why do they want to reward them anyway? What has someone that has applied 20 years to the same place really offered anyway? A couple hundred bucks over 2 decades?

People were complaining about putting in for 20 years and being upset they didn't get drawn for a single hunt. Last year the chap had almost 5,000 applicants and 26 permits. You don't even have a great chance with the cubed points at those odds if 200 other people have 15-20 points. People were just whining because they didn't get what they wanted. This system was made so people that can't get a lease in a state with little public land could have the opportunity to hunt. These people deserve the same chance at the good hunts as the management hunts. True trophy hunts are already broken out into a separate category with the Big Time Texas Hunts.

As it stands now, I can keep applying to the chap for general deer and nothing else if I ever want to actually hunt there. I would hate for a hunt at Gus Engeling SP to take my points and ruin my chances of drawing chap. I suspect all of the hunters applying to a small handful of places and building points for years already had another place to hunt. If my suspicion is correct, and the draw hunts where intended to give people without access places to hunt, then cubing points kind of broke the system in favor of people that already have land access. The can hold a monopoly on the more sought after hunts. A guy that just wants to go hunting has to settle for the lesser lower success rate hunts.

I'm not complaining just because it screwed me. I like to travel and camp. I also like the challenge of some of these places and being able to get deep into the woods. That's why I love these draw hunts. I live 20 minutes south of Sam Houston and 1 hour southwest of my family owned 1200 acre ranch. I have places to hunt and if I never win another draw hunt I'll still be fine. But we need more hunter access in Texas and I think cubing the points hurts the problem more than helps it.

I don't necessarily disagree with anything noted above. I completed the survey as well and appreciate TPWD sending it out.

I'm also someone who applies for 20 to 30 or so hunts a year (I actually drew Elephant Mountain Archery MD my first time ever applying a couple of years ago), so cubing points does not help me out; however, I never really look at drawing any of these hunts as something that's going to happen anyways so my level of disappointment with the change last year was minimal. I do know that with cubing, at some point in the future (if I still live in TX and am applying), I will probably draw - it just may be in 2035.

As previously stated, access is a big problem in Texas whether it be through the lack of public land or the simple fact of how expensive leases are. I would like to see TPWD expand private land draws and public access, but there are probably forces working against that.

It's all about that $$$ both private and public. It seems half of the guys on this forum are property owners that lease their land and want that $$$. Can't blame em, it's their right but they some greedy bass turds.

I filled mine out as well and have a little different opinion than most on here. The only recommendation I had was to go back to the old system of only allowing you to apply in one hunt per category. Since it is a revenue thing, I would be okay with them raising their price of the entry to make up for lost revenue.

On a scale of 1-50 from the state with the greatest amount of public land to least amount of public land, Texas is number 45 on that scale......... Texas does not have a lot of public land. From what I've read from a lot of different forums; most public lands in Texas are very high pressured.

They need to give three choices(regardless of weapon) only per species, with exotic being one species.

Texas has the longest seasons and most species choices of any state.

That's actually incorrect. We are #17 in total federal acres with almost 3 million.

You are looking at percentage of. Big difference.

Over half of our public land is ran by the National Park Service, whom is not hunter friendly

I like the cubing system. Now, I can finally get my alligator and pronghorn.

So, we have a good amount of public but most of them don't allow hunting? Is that what you're saying? I'm only counting public land that is huntable. I should've made that clear. I don't think Texas has the most variety of species to hunt unless you're counting invasive species or "exotics". I don't count non-native species because they shouldn't be here. From where I'm at I have to drive an hour or two to get to a public land to hunt whitetail, most other states dont require you to drive that long to find public hunting land, and even after those 2 hour drives the public land in Texas is pressured, unlike other states.

Don't get me wrong, I like hunting a hog or a axis deer or whatever cool non-native there is (as long as it's NOT on a high fenced property) I just don't think an invasive/non-native/exotic should be counted in the list of huntable game species because I don't think we should value them as much as native species.

Same here. Now maybe I at least have a chance to draw pronghorn and one of the better exotic hunts, since I am well into double digit points on those.

It took me 27 points cubed or 19683 points to draw Powderhorn GDE last season. Realize it probably took 35-40 years to get to those 27 points because I did not apply every year for various reasons. Before points were cubed I fully expected to die with never drawing a hunt in GDE because it got to a point I was never going to give up those points for anything other than a once in a lifetime type hunt. Before cubing I probably had better odds of drawing some state's coveted governor's tag. But know it is still not a given, I was unsuccessful on the previous year GDE draw with 26 points or cubed 17576 points.

My take if you apply for several hunts in a category every year and want to draw several hunts over your lifetime, the cubing gives you great if not guaranteed odds of doing so. Yet you do still have a chance of drawing one of the primo hunts. You will not likely ever get to double digits on points and the double digit point holders that know about the cubed points are not applying for most of those hunts now.

If your main goal is to only draw one of the more coveted hunts like the Chap GDE, though you could still draw it with one point, with cubing you will at least have a decent chance of of eventually drawing that hunt once or twice in your lifetime. But IMHO you would need to avoid applying for most hunts in that category to get there. Otherwise you will likely draw a hunt or two long before you ever get into the high cubed points needed to have a good chance at drawing one of those once in a lifetime type hunts.

Becareful with your invasive ideology, Mountain Goats are invasive in most their range now, same with turkeys. Rocky Mountain elk in NM and AZ aren’t exactly a native genetic subspecies to that land, and there is said to be only one pure Native genetic WT herd in the US, the King.

Just because you have a large percentage of Public land doesn’t mean much of anything if you cant draw a tag, not to mention even drawing a tag can mean very limited time in the field. Not only does TX traditionally have highest license numbers that actually hunt, we are the top of the country in time a field hunting.

I hunt a lot out west on public in multiple states it’s not always as blessed as it’s made out to be. There are pluses and minuses to both systems.

Texas has one of the most affordable public hunting and longest season dates in the country. I can’t think of a cheaper NR application state also

The animals that are native to the continent but invasive to a certain area shouldn't be compared to animals from an entirely different continent. The animals that are already in the continent but are just now moving into a specific area are either introduced by humans (which is fine in my opinion), or they're effectively filling a role in the ecosystem that was filled by another animal not too long ago. Take coyotes as an example, coyotes used to not be so abundant and widespread across the US but the wolves were extirpated from most of their native range so the coyote effectively filled the role that the wolf played in the ecosystems. Also, the animals from another continent brought over to the US don't have any natural predators in the US. A mountain goat introduced to a new area in the US is most likely gonna have similar natural predators if not the same natural predators in the area that it was introduced to compared to its original range, same with the turkeys, and elk. The turkeys, mountain goats, and elk are going to be interacting with similar if not the same organisms in the area they're introduced to compared to their original range, and the rocky mountain elk subspecies not being native to New Mexico or Arizona doesn't change anything ecologically if the states/areas they were introduced to previously had a population of elk. A species from Africa or Europe however has no natural predators in the US, the ecosystem isn't made to support them, they can compete with native species, etc. Do you understand what I am saying? I hope this helps you understand my thought process.

Most states with a lot of public lands have over-the-counter tags for certain areas/units with good amounts of public land. You don't have to draw. Just because you have long seasons doesn't mean much of anything if you have no property to hunt on. I'm 16, so I can't drive far to hunt on Texas's over-pressured public land, I have no private property to hunt whitetail on, and with the youth hunting program there are a lot of high fenced hunts which I don't want to participate in because high fences take away habitat from native animals and it's proven that high fenced deer spread disease to native deer. I'm not excluding myself from the youth hunt program entirely because it's a good opportunity to take advantage of. I just don't want to participate in high-fenced hunts for wildlife conservation reasons.