Total lease cost $$$

I hunt in Cooke county and recently was given an opportunity to take over an additional 900acres. Land owner wants $14,000 for the pasture. I put it in the "land and leases" portion on this site. Recently received some "hate" mail about the cost. But I shrugged it off due to My theory below.
Am I way off base here trying to justify what I pay to hunt? Do you guys see what I see? Or what other variables should be considered?

Deer lease in Brownwood: $1500
Miles from DFW: 165 one way/ 330 round trip(per mapquest).
Your truck gets 20mpg = 16.5gal fuel burn @ (Tx avg) $3.52/gal= $58.08
Drive time:2hrs 55min one way/ 5hrs 50min
Avg income in Tx according to Forbes $58,431 per year or $30.43/hr X 5hrs 50min= $182.59 value of your time.
(not including wear and tear on vehicle.

Total cost per trip to Brownwood,Tx deer lease $240.67

Deer lease in Gainesville $3500
Miles from DFW: 70 one way/ 140 round trip
Your truck gets 20mpg = 7gal fuel burn @3.52/gal = $24.64
Drive time: 1hr 10min one way or 2hr 20min $30.43/hr X 2.3hrs =$69.99 value of your time

Total cost per trip to Gainesville, Tx $94.63

A difference of $146.04 per weekend

Basically it takes 13.69 trips to break even. That might seem like a lot. BUT consider you go fill protein feeders maybe 3 times in the summer. Then hunt a couple weekends in Oct., 3 weekends in Nov, maybe 2 in Dec. throw in a few weekends of hog and turkey hunting and shazaam you are even money.

Thoughts?

Thank you,

You're stretching it IMO. I don't consider my personal entertainment time as $ unless its unpaid leave. However I do consider the time it takes to drive and gas. I say if its ok with you then its all good. Its for our own personal enjoyment so enjoy. Good luck this season.

Maybe it is a stretch! But driving to your deer lease is not productive in any way, shape, or form is it?

Just curious never figured a deer lease this way. So how much is a pound of deer meet in Brownwood worth and one in cooke county worth?

Same! However, a mature deer in Cook county will yield more pounds than one in Brown County... Most likely

I don't see that by your figures. Leases are usually figured by the acre or by the hunter. Ex large parcels of land 5-8 dollars an acre, mid size is 8-12 an acre and small tracks by the gun. Brokers have run the price of leases up to 15 dollars and more an acre. I had two brokers tell me, "look at the money these guys make and they drive 60,000 dollar trucks bring in 3000 dollar blinds 1000 dollar feeders and 10-20,000 dollar atvs why shouldn't they pay 2500-5000 for the lease. If they won't, but they will, tell them to stay home. Its becoming a rich man sport." Great attitude isn't it. Its all on supply and demand. I feel your price should be based on what is being offered on the 900 acres? Does it have water and elect does it have a cabin or house. Tanks to fish, is it year round or seasonal free access? Lots of variables to look at. Can you get 14000, yes you can. Is it the money or is it the group you want? (NOT ALL) But the more your leasers pay the more they tend to feel they can treat it how ever they want. I base mine off of; can I afford what I believe its going to cost me for the year and am I willing to pay it? I've never paid more than 10 an acre. I have always tried to leave the place better than it was when I leased it. I use a deer lease for a deer lease not a try to impress Joe Lease. Good luck on leasing it and getting a good group you enjoy having.

I have no idea what you're going on about, but what does it matter? If people don't like the price, tell them to bug off. They can go elsewhere.

Just a friendly conversation Sneaky.

Dang who crawler up your but this morning lol
The thing to remember is that you hunt for a reason and that to 95% of the people here is to have the good times with there family and to me you can't put a price on that .......IE
When I was younger my parents would have rather have put all the money towards a lease than a vac that would have lasted a week and back then we paid about 2500 for the whole 500 acr with no one telling us what to shoot and no one saying you can't bring the familey ! Also I know the times have changed for the worse and this is what bugs me the most on what land owners want for a lease it has just got way out if hand for the average hard working man to the point where the high fence place have taken hold and offer what we used to pay for a year reduced to a week.
I just wish all the oil people in Houston would pick a different pass time because they are the ones that are driving the lease prices way out of control and if it's not them than it's the ones that want a company lease and can write it off on there taxes and not worry about the price and steal it from the every day hunter.
Sorry for the long rant but it is the way I feel and the main reason why me and my dad bought a place

I'm in a fine mood. I just don't see any point in people whining about the price of something. If you don't like the price, look elsewhere. If he had it priced too high, then it won't sell, and he'll figure that out. It's a simple matter of supply and demand. To send someone hate mail over that is the epitome of petty.

I also think some of y'all don't understand how inflation works.

Oh I know
But lease prices have got out of hand and that is it you know as well as I do
I just has to mess with ya brother

Yeah, they do cost more. Supply and demand. Not much can be done about it if we want to keep hunting.

Out of control? No they haven't, they are still very fair. 10-20dollars and acre compared to 1200-5k acre purchase price.

Your rant above is an excuse.

Less leaseable land today then there was 20 years, leasing has nothing todo with what profession you are in.

A Subarban 20 years ago was 27k, today 73k

There is a value to having a lease close to a large city and the main benefit to the owner is more people looking. I don't think your price is out of line for the area, location and potential. All these morons complaining should go buy their own property and lease it to the lowest bidder.

I realize the cost of leases has risen, but so has the cost of land. I get access to some great hunting, fishing, ATV riding, horse backing, hiking, and camping land at a fraction of the cost. That land is probably worth more than I will make in my lifetime...I am not going to complain.

If that's not high enough tell them there is one listed here in Sanderson for 5800 a gun!

Your really kidding right lol I guess it goes to show that no one that wants to hunt has a cule right
But the fact is I will own my land in the next three yerars and if i would lease it out I would say give me 2'g's and kill what you want within what I have set for the party

dude I think you need to just go have a cold beer and think about what ya said no one cares about your statement

The more they can get for their lease the more power to them. If you don't want to pay then don't pay. Move on to the next place that is shot out and cheaper. Then come on here and complain about not seeing much. If they are to high then it won't lease but never seen it that way. There is more demand for a quality leases to hunt than there are quality lease available.

Case in point

So for the sake of asking, what is the original acreage priced at & size before the 900ac was brought into the conversation?

What!!!!!! you're not going to charge 500 dollars to lease out the whole thing.... you dont say....

Damn metal building builders are buying up all the hunting land for themselves.....makes about as much sense as blaming oil field jobs.

If one really wants to hunt, you can find a away. Not that hard. Ironically some of the biggest deer in TX come off public land.

I don't get the OPs factoring either, cost of those leases aren't even mentioned in the figures.

Doesn't matter though, as already stated, supply and demand. If a LO can get his price, that is his concern for the aggravation he is willing to accept. IMO, all leases are too high from the perspective of meat gain. It would be much cheaper and easier to buy beef at your market, or raise a calf. Pure meat hunters have many options to harvest meat as well.

The market will control lease prices, same with anything. Being too high is a matter of perspective. a guy pulling 6 figures with a small business will see it from his perspective, as will a fellas only pulling in 20k a year.

I guess it comes down to how much value you put into a articular lease, and value is purely subjective.

So what ya have to offer
Stxmann what ya want to offer where is your ranch at ?? I have never asked

Dude go get with your woman and go shopping you are such a couch tator you need to look for something else

This makes sense to me. Someone actually figuring in fuel for the cost of a lease. I will be showing some similar numbers to the members on my lease at the end of the season. I'm currently planning on adding $300 to lease dues next year to pay for my fuel and help to fill feeders throughout the year. I think I will get some initial complaints, but I will actually end up saving my members some money because they won't have to make 6 hour one-way trips to fill feeders throughout the year. I have asked everyone to make at least one trip during the off-season to fill feeders, and I have a few guys are a great help, and it's like pulling teeth to get the others to help.

That's $9/acre for five deer, all the extra game, feed provided, equipment provided, permanent structure lodging, and excellent deer for the area.

Like others have said, if it's too high for you, move along. No need to run down our place just because you can't afford it.

JHeflinland

Fuel and travel cost always have to be considered .IMO, I think many don't count it as "real" cost when getting a lease though, but it is a certain expense. I agree with you though, that is a cost that should be shared, never mind you doing all the work filling and hauling feeders.

Any cost associated with a lease, is an expense. I have heard guys (an old friend of mine say "man we got a good price on this lease" and tell everyone that is all it cost. When actually they spend 3x's that amount if you factor in corn, lodging fuel, food, travel. A $1500 lease will run close to 3-4k if you use it allot.

I wonder why some look at it that way? Or maybe they factoer they would spend the same $$ staying at home? IDK but if they do, they are paying twice for 2 places to stay, 2 places to eat and so on. The cost of a lease is real, as is land ownership, everything considered.

Interesting response

jshouse
Which one? I was wondering what T-rex said that was "so bad"? I read it several times and all I come up with is he gets to enjoys allot of things on his lease, for what in his mind is a fair deal?

The price in the example was $1500 for a lease in Brown County and $3500 for the lease in Gainesville I have advertised. A difference of $2000 initial cost. My point is you spend the same amount of money and then some the further your lease is from home vs a closer lease that costs more dollars up front.
In my example I did not factor wear and tear on vehicle either.

As previously mentioned, maybe I am off my rocker taking my time into consideration. But the way I see it, TIME is the only asset I can never get back, and I personally would rather spend more time in a tree and less on the highway.

The further away it is, the longer you tend to stay. When I was traveling from San Antonio to the other side of Nac, I had a lot of 4 day weekend - several week stays. Now that it's roughly 2hrs from Houston up there I will do turn-around trips and I've actually put more miles on vehicles.

Ok, I got you and that makes sense. If for no other reason than a premium cost for convenience (close to metro) Makes perfect sense and should be expected since the demand is higher. (even for a poor quality lease)

I disagree with counting your time though, as that will pass no matter what your doing and whose to say what your time, or you are worth, besides yourself. Not taking a swipe at you, just pointing out my logic.

10-4 I am taking a business approach to the example. Maybe not the correct way, but it's how I justified it. And I agree time goes by no matter what I am doing. I'd just rather be in a tree when it passes.

I personally don't think you have to "justify it", it is what it is and they can pay or move on. If it is to high, it will sit with no income.

Hang in there Rack judge some Dallas duck hunter will lease it shoot any thing that moves.

The extra dollars would make sense for me. This property is maybe 30 minutes from my house. I have a 10yr old that does not enjoy time in the car. He enjoys the time outdoors. I would utilize a place this close much more than if I had a 4-5hr one way trip. So for me if I broke it down into times that I would be able to enjoy it with my son, it would be worth some extra $. If we got to enjoy it 2-3 times as much I can see a real benefit. It certainly wouldn't bother me saving the gas and time on top of that. We all have our priorities. I may be different but I don't feel like I have to kill a deer to justify the cost. I might go a couple of years without pulling the trigger on something so how do you figure that in? If I really wanted to put $ and cents to it I'd go t a nice place and pay $3500 for a trophy animal. There's just more to it for me. Spending that much more time with my son, in that environment, would make it a much easier decision.

Kenneth's "look for something else" is what I was referring to...struck me as confusing, yet humorous.

I am figurin this may be it for me and these high end wt leases, rather put the money up and do some other hunting as I am not getting any younger and the 7-8k I spend each year on wt if you figure lease, trips, gas, maintenance feeders and stands and all the batteries and other stuff, would take me a few years to pay for trip like Africa again but I have places I can hunt wt for free maybe not giants but deer. A guy that spend what I do and wanted a trip to Africa or New Zealand could pay for it in 2 years. Trophy Wt hunting was ruined by going to Africa deer hunting in Texas just doesn't have same appeal as it did before and I am one of the ones that thought Africa was something I wanted to do but wouldn't change my thoughts on Texas deer lease. But I was wrong!

Lol

I was confused by that as well. didn't read in that Txnhnter was looking? Could be an inside joke?

Not really sure what I did or said, but must have pissed in his Cheerios somewhere along the way. Was just giving my opinion on the topic

Huuuu what did I miss something lol

TReX, Who knows?? A man hasn't done much in a day if he hasn't upset some one, so your GTG

Probably just a misunderstanding in meanings.

Tx always piss me off that's a given do t know why but he does

I've never understood why guys, for example you, act like complete douches then have your business link below your name. That just reflects very poorly on your character and probably does not want people to go to you for metal fabrication. Just some advice, but I am young and dumb.

Got you to look at what I do lol right
I am not an [censored] and not I dick I love to hunt and love to get people worked up
The thing is I know what I can do and don't wast peoples time I am a good guy you just got to get to know me

Let's all quit chasing wt and group THF hunt in Africa

Nah that's jsut not American or Texan

I've never understood why guys, for example you, act like complete douches then have your business link below your name. That just reflects very poorly on your character and probably does not want people to go to you for metal fabrication. Just some advice, but I am young and dumb. [/quote
I annt young an dumb and the link is to get you to look wich it did so
I love to hunt an fish

You'd have to give up beer to afford a hunt on my place. If you think the guy's thread you were trolling was high then you'd really get bent with my pricing.

Yeah

You paying?

Where is Colt when you need him? Bet his pappy has an old saying that starts with something like "If it walks like a duck..."

i calculate deer lease costs using this formula.

open truck window on the way to the lease and on the way back + pull wallet out of pocket and open it + pull all of the money you have just pulled out of your account + toss it out the window making sure to be going faster than 75 mph = total cost of deer lease.

south Texas leases are calculated the same way except you add in your first born given to the lease boss....


but who can really put a price on our love of the sport? I've paid a ton and not paid a ton. either way i didn't complain when i release the arrow or squeeze the trigger...

I'm fortunate not to have to pay lease fees. That said, I don't think they are out of line with demand, the ones that are will stay vacant.

I still get to hunt for free for mgmt advice, right?

Yelp... noted and it won't be that much longer

You will get the same value in trade for what your management advice is worth

Lol

Well when you have a 260" quadruple drop mainframe 8pt show up you let me know. Only way I see it being an even trade. 240" and I'm sending you the taxi bill....

You won't be to keen on my guiding fees then....

Should be a DIY hunt.

How many spikes does it take to get to 260".....

1, when it grows into a 260.

He won't see his second birthday....so try again.

Pretty sure I remember you saying you might let one live

Leave them alone....(racking up consulting fees)

I never think about the cost of my lease totaly..cause I like what it gives me..peace of mind..and pleasure..

I never think of my total cost either because I would cry.

Not sure if I would want my only lease real close to home either. Something about getting out and away from it all has a certain appeal that is worth a little extra. If I was that close, be too easy to think about all the stuff I need to get done.

I'm retired from the insurance business, your damn right, I figured lost business into any trip or vacation. Some people, have vacation time coming and don't figure the value of their time, but I sure did.

It cost me about 50.00. My fiancés family owns a ranch in La Salle county and they allow me to hunt for free. I just spend 50.00 on the gas it costs to fill the Polarus. All told it's around 12,000 acres but I just hunt on her portion, around 2000 acres. Plus axis, turkey, dove, javalina, varmints, hogs and fishing in the Nueces river.

Only thing I figure is the day bonus I lose from work. After I figure that up, I don't care to do any more figuring.

+1. To me, it being at least a moderate trip is a plus for that reason.

I should get half off of what ever I pay since I only hunt in the evenings.

I am paying more for this lease than any previous. But I have hopes it will save me gas and frustration as it is a nice place.

I'm liking the Cooke county deal. Big deer, closer to home. However, I've hunted Brownwood area and there are more deer. It all depends on what you're looking for. I prefer quality over quantity any day of the week.

I would pay a bit more for a lease closer to home. I have about a 4-hour drive. Due to health issues, I only get to make one or two trips during deer season. If I had a lease only 30-minutes away I could hunt every weekend, and some weekdays. That would be worth quite a bit!

Had a guy tell me land shouldn't sell for anymore than the amount of debt servicing selling the hay should fetch this past weekend.

His bid was not accepted.

You're lucky and I'm pretty sure that I hate you.

The price will always go up. More people, less land. It's the way it is and I'm fine with that.

If it were my land or lease id charge as much as possible too.

Me too. Haters gotta' hate, right.

Looking for a 10,000 acre low fence ranch that borders the King Ranch that will allow a max of 5 guns at $1,000 a gun and provide feeders and blinds. Must be a year round lease with year round feeding provided. Very nice lodging or no deal.

FIFY

Everyone send STX PM's, that's the deal he gave me! You forgot to add free guide services, he said he'd even cover 1/2 the mount fee

BTW, he said he could only offer this deal for the 1st "hunerd" fellas, so.........

Real cost is in what the wife spends when you are away...

Real cost is when you lose half your net worth because you spent too much time at deer camp and your handsome pool guy noticed.

aww Cam, i'm sorry lil buddy. it'll get easier tho, keep that chin up, you're better than her anyway.

Does she have a sister?

I'm the handsome pool guy.

SNAP!

I'd pay $10,000 a gun for a place like that, but the lowest I've seen in a place near the king ranch is $22,000 a gun

OMG.....whatever happened to going hunting to get away from all this crap!?

I think hunting lease's are overpriced, maybe years ago there were not as many outfitters that sub lease the hunting rights and that has effected the lease price. But it is what it is, a business. I have been hunting the same 216 acres for the past 13 years and still pay the same amount of dollars. Having said that, if I had the dollars to spend, I would be in south Texas at least once or twice.

It 'aint gettin' any cheaper.

My lease is $6900.00 a year with property tax in Lampasas county but I and the bank own the property. Will be mine in 9 years if not sooner. 1 hour drive from home to the property. Deer, hogs, turkey and exotics. My piece of heaven and get away from the city life. Kicking back and enjoying all that the good lord provides is Priceless!!!

Dave B. sounds great!

I am on the Cooke County lease mentioned above. For me, I can be in my stand in one hour and in my own bed at night. I can hunt before and after work. There are and have been some very high class deer killed in the immediate area. I have three boys and we did not kill a deer there last year, but the time we spent together in the field was priceless. Its easy to run up with them in the evenings after school to fill feeders and they all love to check the cameras. So, for me, a guy from Dallas area, who doesn't shoot anything that moves, yeah, its definitely been worth it.

I wouldn't consider time spent in the vehicle as an expense, but i brings up a point. Would someone making $30/hr, which is about $60k per year, be willing to spend nearly 10% ($3500 + 14*$95) of his gross income on a deer lease?

Yes. Some even more than that

Kinda like a golf club or fishing tournaments w higher entry fees. Every one aren't for everyone.

I would venture to say most spend more than the averages I used. After looking at places in Brown County, $1500 was on the extreme low side and most trucks do not get the mpg's I used. Do your own math and see what your total cost comes to. You might be surprised....