HIGH FENCE HUNTING or Low Fence Hunting / which is better

More and more Texas ranches are being high fenced for quality management purposes of whitetails and exotics. Low Fence ranchers are starting to see hunters demand better quality whitetails and move to high fence ranches. How do hunters feel about this? How do ranchers feel about the future of High fence hunting?

It seems to reason that HF would offer better management opportunities and therefore better trophies. I've never hunted HF so I am coming from that perspective but I struggle with "fair chase" in a HF lease.

If we defined the word HUNTING first it would in most cases but not all change the way we look at high fence vs low fence. Personally i am not interested in high fences or how big the deer are behind one!!!

I hunt that which I can afford. A lot of high fence places are out of my budget. I have no problem with them though if they are big enough or provide enough cover.

Not this topic again...........

depends on the ranch. lots of low fence places that have giant deer. I know of deer that scored in excess of 190" that have been shot within 45 min of san antonio on low fence places.

I know alot of high fence places that max out around 150".

high fences do give the opportunity for better managment, and across the board typically offer better hunting because of the managment practices involved.

it was once put to me like this.....its hard to manage your bank account if 3 of your neighbors have access to it. Same scenario goes for high fences.

right, wrong or indifferent, thats where we are at with it

I bet my boots if the garden of eden was in existance today it would have a high fence around it

Seriously? I guess the rain is keeping you from beating any dead horses or kicking stray dogs.

The gate locks can be cut the same, so it really doesn't matter

Txtrophy85 hit the nail on the head. Each ranch has its own nuances so its hard to say fair chase only applies to the LF owners/hunters. I for one don't care but then again I don't shoot from a blind anymore so HF/LF it don't matter when you spot and stalk a wt. we have 1k acres HF and I still see new animals pop up on my cam that I've never actually seen. Hell I thought we had 1 aoudad left and turns out we have 10+

And only Baptists would be inside it...

They're be no dancing and drinking...except on Friday & Sat night

Bingo on Friday night..oh wait that the Catholics...never mind.

Most of the high fence places I have seen popping up are for personal use. The market seems pretty well saturated for paying hunts. Correct me if I am wrong.

Our neighbor who is a relative of our landowner high fenced their place on our southern border a few years ago. He used to own it but gifted it to them. I have still never seen a deer inside the fence so guess they didn't want the cows to get out.

Sorry, but I think it does matter.

Not many LF ranches have 190" deer but there are plenty to go around behind a HF if you have the money to spend! Don't care what anyone does but you can't compare the two. Yes there are lots of big HF places that are legit but there are lots of small HF places that are a joke. Can't lump them all in together LF OR HF.

HF is not more expensive inch for inch. There are big expensive deer on HF, but a LF 170-180 will cost more than HF 170-180 unless you just paid for a hunt and no trophy fee. If you are getting a LF Booner deer regular on camera and think it can be hunted then there are people that will pay $25-30k + if it makes book.

I really believe there is a slow trend and demand for high quality LF hunts.

IMO its whatever makes you happy. In order for me to consider hunting a HF place, it would have to be wild deer on a large enough property with enough cover for me to consider it fair chase hunting.

D R A M A ,

Its always going to be the Haves, an the Have NOTS !

Pitchfork hit it, what ever makes you happy !

I love them both !

I'll hunt whichever I please. Why would anyone care?

Find me one person that will pay for a booner 25-30K and ill toss you 10% cash, I have access to a ranch that has them on it every year and they dont pay that for the whole place a year.

Oh and for the board of aprovals I hunt 99% HF and wouldnt have it any other ways. I hunt alot of exotics and maybe 1-2 whitetail a year.

Please enlighten us about what the Haves do when it comes to hunting.

C'mon Sneaky, this is the THF, its the same reason they care if u shoot spikes, or take 600 yard shots, or shoot hogs in the gut, or shoot a 3.5 year old buck, or u say ur buck scored 150 when we all know it wasnt over 130, or u shoot a magum, or u shoot a .223....

And i wouldnt have it any other way.

You can tell when the off season hits when these types of topics pop up

I can not believe we are doing this again....

Yes you can!

I can.

You're right, I can. It has been a couple months.

Of course. We need some form of entertainment.

M O N E Y ,

Think !!!!!

Huh!!! I know lots of people with lots of money that will not hunt HF!!

So do I, but that is the most common complaint that I hear from hunters !

I wish there was a lot more high fence haters, then maybe a few thousand less hunters would be trying to get on the Chaparral WMA. It's high fenced.

October 1st national cut a hole in a high fence day, I don't bow hunt so I don't know? just heard tell!

I know lots of people across all income levels that will not hunt HF.

If there is no difference,wonder why there are so many people who refuse to hunt HF?

I would not say plenty. A native 190" deer that isn't out of a breeder pen is still a very tall order.

Most of ya'll are confusing a high fence ranch with native genetics with a ranch that manipulates them with pen raised deer or shoots off the native herd altogether and then stocks it with pen raised deer.

I see the entire side of the coin.....we take a low fence place,then high fence it. your still dealing with a the same animals. its not like they are tame. we high fenced a 1000 acre ranch last febuarary. Rumors were that there was a hell of a buck (upper 190's-200") that was living in the area, the neighboring ranch owner shot at him as a 4 year old in the 170's and missed him 3 times. anyway, when the fence went up the buck ended up on our side of the fence. Helcopter guy saw him and the dozer guy saw him as well, and all confirmed his size. No one else saw him the entire year, not at any feeders, on camera, nothing.

by alot of logic on here, he should have immediatly become tame and been shot the first afternoon of hunting season because its a high fence and all animals are tame behind a high fence.

yeah no joke

uneducated and have a misconceptions. I'd be willing to be most hunters on here have never hunted or spent time on a high fence ranch with a native whitetail herd.

I don't believe that is does come down to have and have not. I am currently part of the have not group. If I were to become part of the have group...Let me rephrase...WHEN I become part of the Have group, instead of booking a HF hunt or buying a HF ranch, I would rather buy or lease a large, good quality LF property. As someone said earlier, I have an issue with fair chase and HF. I know, there are some HF ranches that are so big that some of the deer have never even seen the fence, personally, I just can't get past the feeling that HF deer are livestock, not wild game.

Most LF ranches in Texas and through the midwest have had a Booner around one time or another. Some places have a bunch of Booners. The Illinois outfitter I'm with has clients take 3-4 Booners each year. He has 15-20 hunters a week through the season though and he can rarely target a Booner. It just happens for some of his lucky customers and they're only out the $3,500 outfitter fee. However, he has a contact list he can call if he's got a Booner on pattern, which is rarely. They don't come in unless he thinks pretty good chance at it and they will pay a harvest of $25-30k if it does make book (net).

Look at what King Ranch gets for a Booner. I have also spent a bunch of time last couple months researching LF Texas ranches with great chance at a Booner. You can get these for $8-10k, but that is for a standard hunt and if you happen to take a Booner that’s what you pay. The jump and premium you get $25k for is a patterned deer. Most LF ranches have a contact list they can reach out if they do get on one of these deer.

Wouldn't call it uneducated....some folks just don't like the fences bc they can't feel right about it knowing how much traveling deer can do.

Rob is talking all-time BC net and he is correct. With big bonus money for any thing breaking 200gross

Yes I am very uneducated. Keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better.HF proponents can rationalize with the best of them I have come to find.

P.S. The reason your 190 buck will not be fair chase if you kill it and thus ineligible for B&C is because it cannot escape your 1000 acres. I don't care how smart he is, you have locked him in, so you know he is there on your place and there he will remain.The conditions are now your conditions, not nature's. Doesn't even take a lot of education to understand that concept. Please explain how the fact that he now cannot escape your place is a misconception.

His elusiveness is a testament to his wit.

Locking him in is a testament to man's desire to gain an unfair advantage. This is usually under the guise of "management"-as if management cannot be accomplished under fair chase conditions. What "management" really means in the context of HF is "So no one else can have a chance to take "my" animals." Just putting lipstick on the pig.

Uh, so which is better??

I'm not sure...I'm from ETX so I shoot everything that moves whether it's roaming free or tied up to a tree.

Wow...I knew there was a reason the deer pop was down in E TX and now I know why! Your shooting everything. I knew it didn't have anything to do with bag limits or ARs!

The fact that many have to ask that question is a sad testament to the state of hunting in Texas.....

I've went on 6 Elk hunts and spent thousands. I went Elk camping, Elk tracking, Elk;You should have been here yesterday, Small 5 x5 and once a nice 6x6 300 bull. Finally I went to Canada on a well managed HF ranch. Had a great time and scored on a 390 bull! I put in my dues. Did I Elk hunt? YES.

After 20 years on deer leases watching my neighbors shoot every buck I passed. Yes, I went HF whitetail hunting. It was the same when I pull the trigger just bigger deer.

Finally after spending a lot of money maintaining a yearly deer lease we added up how much we spent, Gas, Feed, Improvements, Lease fee.... We now take those same funds and go Caribou, Muskox, Black Bear , etc... hunting yearly.

If you speak of your last experience we will just have to agree to disagree. If you are prouder of the 390 than the smaller 6x6 and 5x5-you have missed the entirety of the real hunting experience IMO. You have many "diamonds", yet your quest was for cubic zirconia.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say some folks on the forum may feel there's a little difference between hunting GMUs in the States, that can be almost a million acres, and a pen in Canada. I could be wrong though and they may feel that you did put in your dues.

Never said I was any more proud of one than the other. Don't read anything into a post thats not there!

It is never about success it's the experience. I have been blessed with a lot of different experiences.

Well I'll put it this way then: the twain do not meet.

You paid your dues for the 6x6 and the 5x5.
You paid your dollars for the 390.

It isn't even worth discussing. Fun for the first couple pages and first couple threads, then it gets old. You have to remember especially in the off season there are mostly land owners, game managers, and brokers active on THF. They have a more vested interest in the high fence story line, understandable. Low fence hunters like us are challenged for our beliefs, it is bad for business to have "low fence only" hunters like us expressing personal opinions. Certainly there are plenty of opinions allowed pro-high fence and I think that is perfectly fine. I'm fine with THF if they keep a balanced approach and allow respectful opinions from both sides equally, shouldn't be any preference. You can have an opinion on your own side without being a jerk and expecting everyone else to have your same opinion. I'm fine if others want to hunt HF.

I just jumped in this thread and I am not going to waste time reading the last 3 pages because I already can figure that the arguments are. But I will tell you the facts.....

High fenced ranches = bigger bucks
High fenced ranches = easier to managed b-d ratio

Low fenced ranches= all native genetics
Low fenced ranches = harder to managed and deer take longer to grow


In my humble opinion- I would rather hunt a low fenced ranch, but I have hunted on and still hunt some very large low fence ranches in South Tx. It is a full time job during the season and off season to manage the herd. On a high fence ranch you almost always know what you have and where it is at, way easier to cull deer.

If I spend dollars to sit on the first row on the 50 yards line, or in a suite, is the game any less enjoyable than sitting in the end zone?

Have fun and be blessed.

I agree. And easier to do everything else-including killing the biggun.

If easy is the goal, HF is certainly the answer. But that's kind of the point of why it is not the same.

I only hunt the best fences...the ones that arnt mine

No.

But with HF it is not the same game.More akin to WWE than the NFL as a more appropriate analogy IMO.

Not always. I have done hunts on HF ranches that has been harder hunting than on LF ranches.

Deer are more wary in some places than others. That is not the point. That the HF locks them in is the game-changer.

I only hunt HF because the animals taste better.

I am considering a steer hunt this year. Looking for grass fed and then maybe a couple of months of feed, no hormones or drugs though. More of a custom finishing feed job. Want it to be released from the pen though before the stalk.

I gotcha covered what quality you want...standard, choice, prime?

So I am guessing that all the people who say hunting HF is not giving the deer a fair chance are also the same guys who will not use cover scents, rifles, the latest and greatest bow, game cams, feeders, blinds and the list goes on...
All of those things swing the favor to the hunter and in a lot of the western states the people think that stands and baiting are unfair and not really hunting..
Hunting is about who you spend the time with and what you make of it while you are there.....

To each their own within the laws.

I see no difference.

We have several deer that we have pictures of for 3-4 years straight that come like clock work. I shot one of them last year out of a deer blind. We are low/no fence. I don't think the fence has much to do with it, I think it is management and how the place is treated.

Well played sir.

Yeah because those Hi fence deer are all waiting in line to jump on a plain an fly to Hawaii.. They aint going anywhere anyway

I think we can all agree that HF hunting is better because you get bigger and better deer and that people that don't like HF hunting only have that opinion because they're bitter and petty and can't afford to hunt a HF?

Surely we can all agree on that, right men? I don't see anything work arguing there...

I rather talk about Savage and Remington.

You've been a savage lover from way back right..

Well prime of course. Not interested in an exotic like a Wagyu though.

So the question is, If there were no high fence ranches now, would hunters be killing numerous 170+bc bucks? Would the antler score still be about the same, say in S. Texas, as it was in the 50's and 60's?
I recall that the odds of taking a 200"bc trophy back then was one per 50,000. Has that ratio improved because of High fence ranches?
So how do hunters feel about having a better opportunity to get a BIG ONE even on a High Fence ranch or would they be just as happy with a little average one on a low fence ranch, just because it is conceived as more fair, WHY?

...if that were the case it's about the dumbest waste of money that a landowner would ever consider. Everyone cares too much about what their neighbors are shooting to be the case.

Well lets see back in he 50' and 60's deer were decimated by as I am told by over hunting and screw worm. There was no supplemental feeding and something I frequently herd my grandfather say was the one with the spots are tenderer.

You cant compare the two times.

Lol! No we can't agree on your first statement. It's one of the dumber ones in this thread.

For the right price ill put you on a wild angus... 100% kill opportunity

Good Lord can you not read?

Because one is hunting and one is shooting animals in a pen. Is it all about size of antlers to you HF guys? Is fair chase not a consideration in hunting anymore?Crap just buy a mount at an estate sale and hang it on the wall then.

And the statements that follow the first are just as dumb.

HF hunting does nothing for me. I'll take a free range 160 over any HF buck any day of the week. If you offered me a free HF I'd take it. if a big 200+ walks out with tag in his ear... DRT!

I'm just saying my preference is quality, mature, low fence bucks.

More is better...

Where was this one on the tastiest exotic topic? Sounds great to me!

well dagum, me too! anyone know where i could find one?

WOW. I'm a Green horn to this forum. I have hunted all over the world. Sad to hear the fighting and better than thou attitudes over LF vs HF. Man I hope Bowhunters vs Rifle hunters don't feel the same toward each other. If so the hunting industry is in trouble.

You aint seen nothing yet!! Better put your man panties on.

Do all the guys bashing HF hunt feeders if so not a helluva lot of difference wait at feeder shoot deer I don't hunt wt in HF as matter fact I have only shot one HF critter but for the exotics I have no real issue with it and I really could care less how anyone hunts if they enjoy it and keep the tradition alive I really couldn't give a damn how they choose to do it.

Probably @ your feeder this year in July-Sept...until he goes on vacation until march.

For sure!

We are doomed...

LF is only harder because it's more difficult to manage the lease hunter.

We are doomed...

Folks around here argue over ethical shots on pigs.

Haven't had a "dogs crossing fence and scaring deer" threads in a while.

And magic bullets don't forget the magic bullets

This poor old dead horse must be a Zombie. You just can't kill it. I know of HF ranches where most that bad mouth them would get lost and probably sh*t themselves to death crying for momma before they could find their way out. Most that are bad mouthing HF were probably born on pavement and have never even hunted LF without a guide.

No such thing as an ethical shot on pigs...they're just shots whether in the rooter or tooter

Yep that is 90% of it for sure! We have great guys and good property and 150's or better go down every year

++++++++++++++++++P++++++++++++

High Fence Ranch = $$$$$ thats all it is about is $$$... People pay big $$ to kill big deer. ... They don't care if it is in a 5 acre pen as long as it looks like the picture that was emailed to them and it is breathing before they shoot it. . . . . Times have changed my friend.

We are certainly living in a bizarre universe when the HF guys talk smack to those that hunt fair chase. You HF shooters are the mountain men and the fair chase guys are city boys now?

A few posts above the point is how easy the HF is and wondering why all the fuss about fairness?

You HF apologists will say anything. That's all I can come up with.

Bottom line who gives a damn just hunt

That shows you can't come up with much. Like I said before I know HF ranches if you were dumped in th middleof it with out your phone,gps or compass you would probably cry youself to death before finding your way out.

this

Neither is better, but they are both better than not hunting.

Agreed. This (repeat) thread is the dumbest argument that keeps coming around. Maybe we should argue gun v. bow and trash talk each other about fair chase. This is hunting--not philosophy class.

BTW, I pay more per acre for my low fence lease in South Texas than I ever did hunting high fence leases in East Texas.

No it just shows you talk chit to people you don't know a thing about is all.

HF rocks and LF is for Obama supporters. We should all have a fair advantage to the same deer. PFFFFFFFFFFFFF Get real and get over it. I have hunted LF ranches that were less of a challange than hunting a zoo dang near. Just get in the woods, who gives a rats azz how tall the fence is.

...we gonna shock the world!

I have probably forgot more than you will ever know.

So if I dropped off in this HF ranch...can I shoot whatever to survive until I get bored and follow the fence until it hits the gate & rd...or air strip....

I hate all fences 'cause I hate openin' gates.

I have probably forgot more than you will ever know.[/quote]




Like anyone could ever know that.

LOL!!! It really sounds scary doesnt it!!

Amen to that!!! To each their own. Just get out and have fun. And take a kid hunting or fishing its the best thing my dad ever did for me.

Finding water in that barren country would be the biggest prob.

just do like the illegals do walk the high line wires that dead end at the deer camp and then party like rockstars then keep heading north

Correction!!!!

No body is challeged for their beliefs until they bast other peoples beleifs.

Just an FYI.


Both have their purpose. Blasting one over the other is stupid, especially when it does effect you in any way

I fault no man or women for highfencing their ranch after all its their damn land they paid for it not me. I hunt low fence, high fence, private, public, state, and federal every year.

My opinion is that the sky is lime green.....and photoperiod has jack diddly squat to do with triggering teal migration......






they can be wrong as heck. grin:

This is dumb, you pay your money and please yourself, what anyone else thinks is irrelevant. If you think the LF/HF debate gets hot, try explaining hunting over a corned sendero, to a northern hunter. You'll end up on the reciving end of the same arguments the LF people use against HF hunters.

Do you say these things because that is what you would do? Don't project your fears on others just because you never mastered basic woodsman skills.

I get ya, you work hard all year, and you deserve to be driven to a nice, plush blind overlooking a feeder at exactly 100 yards while the "guide" goes to the pen to release your pre-paid, half-starved deer 400 yards away and out of sight. It makes a beeline to the feeder that just went off, you shoot a trophy, then go back and tell your wife and kids what a great hunter you are.

I did that one time as I has helping a guy drag a 160" deer out of alfalfa feild pretty damn funny, yankee make fun of texas boys, when he had 50 deer in a 120acre alfala pivot to choose from. He shut up after I asked him he wanted me to take his picture in a plowed feild down the road

That's funny, I don't get out of truck in okla or kansas until its time to shoot, and there isn't a feeder any were for 100+ miles.

I am glad you found the humor in it BOBO. I grew up hunting in Michigan. HF, LF I don't much care, but I find it hard to believe anyone could get lost in a fenced in area, high or low, as Don K suggested.

Now when I hunted in federal lands in the UP of MI? You could walk off the wrong side of the road and never be seen again. If the hypothermia doesn't get ya, the bears, wolves, wolverines, Mtn. Lions, etc. will. I guess you learn things out of necessity.

You'll get carried off by a rabid pack of vulture size Mosquitos or drown in our hood.

I'll bet. The black flies are pretty serious up north but thankfully by deer season all bugs are dead since it is usually about 20 degrees. Having said that, I much prefer hunting in TX.

MI has wolves?

I willing to bet I know a high fence ranch that you would get lost on. But in all fairness its was 21k of deep east texas swamps, pines and bayous.

You think your the only one on this forum that has done a DIY hunt by your self in the wilderness? Come on man.

I'll bet you a buncha $ you could drop me off on it and I wouldn't get lost!

Like anyone could ever know that. [/quote]

Everyone's brilliant and indestructible on the internet.
(Usually because it's the only place they can be.)

Hunting is hunting wether you walk 6000' and 10miles a day or drive a pick up truck and walk 30' to a blind.

You want to be grizzly adams knock yourself out, but as soon as you bash someone hunting beliefs because you look down apon it, your no longer a hunter your just a big ego trip...nothing more nothing less

I bet your right you grew up on the damn thing.... you know every hole in the fence

I never said I was the only one BOBO, come on man. You are just trying to be difficult . It's just that I find it hard to believe you can get lost inside a fenced in enclosure.

I am sure there are many more experienced hunters than I. The difference between myself and many others is that I continue to learn while others believe they know it all.

Apparent it goes both ways

I'd walk south......South gate is right next to the beer stores.

Re-read your last sentence then think about getting lost again in a HF

And yes, MI has wolves. The DNR says 2000 pair but it is likely closer to 10000. Mom had them in her yard 2 winters ago. Still no season for them there though, too many tree huggers. Wait until they cross the ice one winter into the LP and then you will hear the huggers scream. Each wolf eats between 12 and 20 deer each year they say.

Lol

Just checking

I have learned to read a compass.

I am not the one talking smack about my hunting skills so, no, it doesn't.

I don't mind saying that it's my experience that the biggest talkers are not the biggest doers. This seems especially true when the talk is that HF is the tough guy way and fair chase is for city boys.

Me too but take it away and bet you get in a bind.

Ironically looks who puts who on the defensive first...thats my point

You come by the poking naturally. ..I call it a conditioned trait or motivator so you can't help it. first shot fired in these threads come from........... those that think their way is the only way

I got lost one time and had no compass. I spent most of the day wandering around and was ready to give up when the rest of my group found me. Then again, I was 6.

And why would you take my compass away?

I would think it is self-evident that it would be quite a task to get lost in a HF. Just walk until you hit the fence and follow it around until you get to the breeding pen or the protein shed-whichever comes first.

Lol....that's pretty funny ill give you that.

X2

life is so linear until you start walking............

Grizzly Adams didn't need no stinking compass.....all the rivers and stream traveled down hill....... until you get to the swamp

I was talking about you 6year old walk about

I'm closing this one down..... went and read whole thread

Some of yall act like no body should turn their back to each other at a campfire. ..

Kind of unsettling