Frac water ponds on deer leases

I posted this in repsonse to the question about drilling on a deer lease but would like to get more feedback on this subject:

"Has anyone noticed problems because of the deer drinking from frac water pond? We have a pond on our lease that has a fence around it but have seen the deer jump it to get to the water. Frac water is contaminated with heavy metals and chemicals but the impact on the deer may not be know for awhile. Was wondering if anyone had any extended experience with a frac pond on their lease."

How is it contaminated? We hunt 12 sections with hundreds of oil/gas wells on it. Probably 10-15 frac water pits. All fenced off but yes deer still jump them. They fill them with creek water on our ranch when they start getting low. Not sure what contamination you are referring too.

I live in oil country and have noticed that since the TCEQ closed down a bunch of the pits, not necessarily frac pits, but pits that were associated with the oil business, the number of deer have declined and the size of racks have also shrunk. Better be careful what you weed out. Most wildlife will use what benefits them and eliminate what is detrimental to them. Not saying you are not right, just saying that just because it is there does not mean it is detrimental.

Can you get an 8ft fence installed? That's what I'd be inclined to request.

Frac pits are freshwater!Period.Wait a month and walk around one and see the number of perch and polywogs near the edge..

There after the salt an minerals, Which settle to bottom fast, North texas natural runs 3-500 ppm thats what is after settlement occurs. In mud it may still be 20-60,000ppm

JB,
Frac water is water that has had any number of chemicals and biocides added to it before being pumped under pressure into a well to fracture the underlying strata. The chemcials faciltiate the frcturing process while the biocides are added to kill and prevent algae and other organisms from growing in the well. When the frac water is recovered, it is contaminated with the checmicals and biocides. There are numerous companies that are employed by the oil and gas inducstry to decontaminate frac water so the water component can be recycled. So, if the frac water has to be decontaminated for recycling purposes, how safe is it for the wildlife to drink?

Most lakes are more polluted than the frac tanks around here.

Yet wrong again..All chemicals are added after the water is pulled from the pit..Biocide is not added to kill chemicals.Algea and these other organisms can't grow without sunlight and oxygen..Where are you getting your imformation?Do you not realize that these wells are drilled in the barnett shale.At a depth of 6000 plus feet which is ocean water..Chemicals do not facilitate the fracturing process, most are used to reduce friction..I have no stake into what I'm telling you, but your very misimformed..

are these ponds lined with plastic, or are they just a natural bottom?

if these are the plastic lined frac ponds that have flowback fluid and being used for the purpose of temporary storage prior to either injecting in a disposal well or going through some recycling process, the water can be contaminated with everything you mention and more.

If the fence is not adequate to keep the deer out, then they need to construct a high fence around it.

if this is just fresh water used for fracs in the future, there's nothing to worry about.

Theyre lined with olastic

They may use ponds where you are, we always used metal frac tanks brought in for that purpose. Fresh water is used for this purpose. Even if they are using ponds as the frac water, the chemicals that are put into the water is designed to reduce friction and suspend the sand that is pumped in to hole. These chemicals are designed to return the FRAC GEL back into liquid state in a set amount of time. There is no return fluid when fracing a well. The purpose of the frac is to FRACTURE the formation and pack it with porous sand. This allows the oil to seep out of the formation easier. Frac water is water that is about to be pumped down a well. They do not STORE frac water long term.

if they are, then this is process fluids...

personally, I wouldn't want my deer drinking out of it either...the water has dissolved solids, not just "salt"...since 90% of the frac water around is from shale plays, there are some components that are not good to get in your system.

not to mention the BTEX strings that are dissolved in the water as well.

talk to the landowner and express your concern. If the landowner has the mineral rights, they probably won't give a damn. If they only have surface rights, they will probably raise holy hell.

most states don't allow you to have open pits of "produced water". It goes into to those big storage tanks you see on the well pads, then the water haulers pump the tanks and take them to disposal wells or where ever their destination is.

This discussion was very informative. My thanks to all the participants.

This discussion was very informative. My thanks to all the participants.

The pits are full of FRESH WATER!! They dispose of "frac" water under ground at disposal wells

the water isn't produced during the frac, it's produced at the initial production of the well, and referred to as "flowback water".

most water is disposed of through injection wells, (saltwater disposal wells), however in this age of "green", operators are being incentivised to recycle the used frac water.


all of that water has to go somewhere that is pumped during a frac, and the vast majority of it comes back up during the first couple weeks of production.
and as far as I knew, used frac water had to be stored in tanks, and not kept in open pits, but I have heard rumors that the state was allowing this process due to the lack of equipment, and giving temporary status to allow the storage in lined tanks until the water can be transported to a disposal well, or recycling facility. This could be total BS, just something I heard. Possibly similar to the process of landfarming contaminated soils....

You heard right. Have only seen it in the north part of the Barnett, but have seen it in a few places.

New Jeep,

here is some information on companies that generate their revenue on removing solids, and preventing soil contamination from open pit frac water....

it's not "frac" water, but it's the flowback water that resulted from the frac job.

if they were just storing fresh water, they aren't going to spend thousands of dollars to line the pits in plastic.

http://ppc-site.com/fracwatertreatment/fracpitart.html

http://www.justliners.com/pit.htm

http://www.rhinomembranes.com/pdf/Frac%20Pit%20Lining%20System.pdf

Some of ya'll are a little Loopy. I work for Weatherford Int. and yes a Frac Pond is fresh water. Then it is pumped downhole while fracing the well. Then a flowback crew comes in and monitor's the well and the flowback water goes into frac tank's and battery tank's and the sand goes thru sand seperator's and into open top's and is disposed of. The flowback crew calls in tank truck's as needed to haul it to a disposal or water transfer is done and it run's down a flow line to a disposal. Now a reserve pit on the other hand is a whole other story. They are full of all kind's of chemical's and stuff. Frac pond's are FRESH WATER!!!!!!! and yes most of the time they get the water from a nearby source creek's etc.

Most of the wells I have worked on have been natural gas in East Texas. We almost always build frac ponds and use a freshwater well drilled near by to fill it. The land owner gains a water well and a well built pond for future use. We do not collapse the water well after drilling and frac-ing. The only time we line the frac pond is when the landowners won't agree to a large enough pond and we need to hold every barrel of water we can.

The ponds that are dug next to a location are usually full of drilling waste and it has nothing to do with frac return except for when there is a problem, but the game is smart enough, just like you, to not drink contaminated water. If it smells bad, taste bad or has a bad texture even if they put their mouth in it they won't repeatadly return.

If I were a landowner and someone wanted to build a frac pond on my land I would say "get after it".

one ranch we have for sale, an elk stepped on a exposed pvc line and busted it, forcing us to turn all the water off on the ranch till we fixed it.

for about a week the there was no water in the troughs. went over to the frac tank and there wasn't a single deer or elk track around the tank.

I don't think the animals would drink outta one, unless they were in dire, dire straits

Yup as I wrote earlier. Frac water pits are fresh water pumped to locations through irrigation pipe. Used frac water is hauled off and the sand is seperated. Now pits for drilling are totally different. That is the big pit just off the rig pad that used drilling chemicals run to when they are of no more use. They let these dry up and then they push them over. Our landowner makes them plant these in wheat when they are finished. Same as gas pipelines. Any deer that drinks from the drilling pit deserves to have body chemical imbalances. Lol

We have seen deer drink from fresh water frac pits, but most do not like walking on the plastic that the pit is lined with. We have found some great tools left over from oilfield workers in the field. So we do keep our eyes open.

Why don't you just go and get a sample and have it tested???

Frac water recovery is during the flowback/gas lift process which comes out of the well head/frac head through flow pipe to a frac tank which is hauled off by water trucks. Frac water pumped into the well during the frac is FRESH WATER which is pulled from a river, man made pond, fire hydrant and or any other source of fresh water.

The water source in question is definately fresh water... If it had chemichals in it used during the frac you would have dead animals all around trust me!!! A couple of chemicals used during the frac can be rust inhibitor and an antifreeze agent. One way to tell if the water is "produced" by the well is to check for salt residue/crystals all on the ground. The main ingrediants for a frac job is fresh water, sand and silicone to help the sand stick together.

As an oil field worker for many many years I can truly say times have changed drastically in the way business is being done especially on the Barnett shale with all of the tree huggers taking pictures and videos of us trying to document mishaps such as produced/contaminated water being spilled.

Injection well that was wore out and dumped in creek until trrc called, That red tank is now filled and drained into tanker and hauled off for disposal ever 2-3 days, Over all cost might of ran into $150,000+250,000 for ongoing remediation work here an other sites on lease due to number of violations.
Expect to carry locked an cocked or get kicked off when going out, gets rather nasty. Or as hauler says I dont drink the town water I know what is getting dumped. Or as howard? said we would kick you out an go right back to our way. Fairly Risky deal to report.

to my understanding used frac water does have to be stored in tanks, but I would be very leery of drinking out of the ponds, or eating a deer that drank, if there were a good deal of salt crystals indicating that it had came out of the well. Most areas of texas have high levels of underground radium in the formations, the radium bonds to the salt water and comes back up with it. I was on a testing crew once that measured old tanks and found radium levels of over 10 times the allowable limit. that's some bad stuff that once it gets in your system never comes out.

You mean tank batteries wore out, not injection well. An injection well doesn't just "wear out", nor can it spill into a creek on the surface unless the trucker dumped it in the creek. Injection/disposal wells inject produced water into previously depleted formations or formations with no producing hydro carbons.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding your post? More details please.

Sorry,, Injection well (SITE) that was >>
Case Similar to plugging drain and leaving water on.Batterys were CUT after 2 weeks+- of over flow from up hill tanks to here, To drain an access submerged pump, Replaced that with another unit Same thing+- stalled out, Green storage tank over flo was lined to ground And let run as well produced 5+- gallons ever 30 seconds or so, Note no fence, collapsed burms/battery on first set, then raised an later fenced, Order after several more spills is close it out and relocate it away from water course.

There is an interesting documentary about this topic called Gasland. They talk about the flowback water and how it is full of chemicals. The water that comes back up from the well is bad news and hence why Gas Company are exempt from any Clean Water Acts as well as the 2005 Energy Bill. For clarity, i am Republican all the way, i love my gas guzzling truck, i love guns and shooting tasty criters. I dont like ruining the water supply and the earth for our children. http://gaslandthemovie.com/

It is an eye opening documentary.

The flowback never comes in contact with the soil, it's held in the reserve pits and then goes to a disposal. Vacum trucks suck the pit's dry.

Gasland is a complete joke, it's been debunked over and over again-


In the film's signature moment Mike Markham, a landowner, ignites his tap water. The film leaves the viewer with the false impression that the flaming tap water is a result of natural gas drilling. However, according to the Colorado Oil and Gas Conservation Commission, which tested Markham's water in 2008, there were "no indications of oil & gas related impacts to water well." Instead the investigation found that the methane was "biogenic" in nature, meaning it was naturally occurring and that his water well was drilled into a natural gas pocket.

This is one of several examples where the film veers from the facts. A second depiction of a flaming faucet in the home of Renee McClure also misleads viewers about the connection between natural gas development and methane in water wells. McClure's well was sampled by the state of Colorado and it, too, showed only naturally occurring methane.

The film's claims are so egregious that the Colorado Oil and Gas Conservation Commission was compelled to set the record straight. The COGCC information sheet corrects the film's misleading depictions and addresses false allegations of methane migration in Weld County.

Later in the film, natural gas is again falsely accused when the film flashes the words "35 mile fish kill Dunkard Creek Washington County PA.'' The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency investigated this incident and tied the fish kills to coal mine run-off. Here is the official report.

In an article in the Philadelphia Inquirer, John Hanger, the secretary of the Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Protection said the film is "fundamentally dishonest" and "a deliberately false presentation for dramatic effect."

Contrary to the film's misleading claims, natural gas production is subject to federal, state and local regulations that cover everything from initial permits to well construction to water disposal. 
In rare cases where incidents occur, companies work with the appropriate regulatory authority to promptly identify and correct the issue, and implement measures to ensure it does not recur.



Here are the facts, The citizens of the US and N TX especially are being slanted by an over sensationalized media with an agenda....

We drilled a water well a few years back on our woodyard in LA and hit a gas pocket. That was a site to see water spewed about 250ft. in the air for about 2 days before it died down.

The good thing about that dried drilling return is that the gel in it retains water like you wouldn't believe. It holds water for a longer period of time after a rain and when it rains again, it soaks it back up and holds it again. It's the next best thing to surface irrigation if you spread it out and plow it in about 6". I would say one word of caution. Common sense should tell us not to do this but... Don't wade off into one of those ponds.

Edit: I need to clarify something. There is more than one kind of drilling fluid. Some companies use an oil-based drilling fluid. It is hazardous. I can't post our Operational Safety Alert on the subject. Suffice to say you don't want to get any of it on you and unless a Deer will drink diesel fuel, there's not much risk in them drinking it if they come across it.