Texas Hunting Forum

Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue

Posted By: DQ Kid

Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 04:11 AM

I see many on here looking for a lease for next year and it makes me ponder, is there an all time low supply of deer leases out there for the number of hunters looking? If not, is it a matter of ranchers not overly advertising their available ranches or something entirely different? What say you all?
Posted By: JMW427

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 04:59 AM

Great questions. Maybe supply of guided hunts is so high that its pulling demand away from leasing outright. Just a speculation though.
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 05:13 AM

I think one of the bigger problems is that land prices have gone up so much over the last 10-15 years that people who buy land want to hunt it themselves rather than lease it out, or they don't need the money and don't want the hassle.

People want to pay $1500 a year to hunt a million dollar property. Most people who can afford to pay that much for land don't need the $1500 and the headaches. Most hunting land leases are far too cheap compared to what land costs these days.
Posted By: dogcatcher

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 05:48 AM

Everyday there are 2500 acres lost to urban sprawl. Granted not all of them are hunting acreages, but as people want that small ranchito, larger ranches and farms are subdivided into non hunting tracks. But in the end that is the same as 365 leases per year lost.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 09:34 AM

Sincerely, I do not understand why some States preserved tracks of prime land for the good of all (State Parks), and some States did not, and refuse to.
Posted By: Chris42

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 10:14 AM

More dollars chasing the same land. Lots of boomers’ with money want a ranch.
Posted By: Sneaky

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 11:31 AM

Originally Posted by Chris42
More dollars chasing the same land. Lots of boomers’ with money want a ranch.


“Ranch.”
Posted By: JRR

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 11:53 AM

Price of leases has to be high enough that it's worth it to the landowner, whatever that might be. Folks die, places get split up among heirs or heirs sell and with the price of land as it is then leasing may not bring enough to hassle with. I know guys with land that make so much off the oil they have no interest in leasing to hunters.
Posted By: snake oil

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 12:55 PM

Originally Posted by Sneaky
Originally Posted by Chris42
More dollars chasing the same land. Lots of boomers’ with money want a ranch.


“Ranch.”



Yea they buy 125 acres and have a gate built with XXXXX Ranch....LOL
Posted By: TX Hitman

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 01:14 PM

Originally Posted by DocHorton
I think one of the bigger problems is that land prices have gone up so much over the last 10-15 years that people who buy land want to hunt it themselves rather than lease it out, or they don't need the money and don't want the hassle.

People want to pay $1500 a year to hunt a million dollar property. Most people who can afford to pay that much for land don't need the $1500 and the headaches. Most hunting land leases are far too cheap compared to what land costs these days.



As a landowner, I agree with this assessment.
Posted By: don k

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 01:25 PM

I know of several places that have gotten out of the lease market. A couple in South Texas that the oil money coming in has made it where they do not need the lease money. One where they got tired of the people wanting too much access to the property off season. One close to here the owner died and was sold then split up. I personally think times are changing and owners don't want people they don't really know having access to their property. Years ago I leased this property to 3 individuals. When they were here they seemed to think they owned it and I didn't. Cows or Sheep or me ruining their hunt. I found I could just about make as much off the Deer by doing what I do now. Sell the deer by the Head. Bucks at a certain price by the point and Does at a certain price. For about 11 months out of the year nobody is here but me,
Posted By: Creekrunner

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 01:42 PM

Originally Posted by snake oil
Originally Posted by Sneaky
Originally Posted by Chris42
More dollars chasing the same land. Lots of boomers’ with money want a ranch.


“Ranch.”



Yea they buy 125 acres and have a gate built with XXXXX Ranch....LOL


Agreed. But this has been a point of contention on here - let a man call his land what he wants, yada, yada. I get a man being proud of whatever he can afford and fulfilling his dream, etc.

My dad did it in 1968. But no ostentatious entrance and he didn't go around puffing out his chest and announcing that he has "a ranch in the Hill Country", like so many do. (Some on here.) It was a 163 acre small farm that we called, albeit not too creative, "The Farm".

We did it across the road in 1997. We always tried to get to know our neighbors, "fit in", respect the history of the area, etc. And then we were surrounded by "ego farmers"; brash, arrogant tools that are all about themselves and getting what they want. One guy put together 70 acres, built his road to wind around all over the place to make it "feel" bigger, had the creek worked on (really screwing up the flow), for one solid year, built his new house 25 yards off my fence line (so you see it as you drive up to my house), and actually got upset when I was having fence replaced that I didn't allow HIS dozer operator "shape" MY field the way HE wanted it to look.

After 21 years, and 50 in the area, we've sold, with txtrophy85's help. It's dam emotional, but the right thing to do for us. We are looking west and hopefully will be able to afford something bigger. I ain't no rancher; last relative to run cattle seriously was 4 generations ago and that terrible war between the states pretty much ruined him. 'Might try to do the wildlife exemption route. I won't be leasing out the hunting. Which, I believe, proves the above hypothesis.
Posted By: DQ Kid

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 02:00 PM

Great stuff guys, I think it is a combination of all of this and even a bit more. Keep them coming...
Posted By: Double Naught Spy

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 03:08 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Sincerely, I do not understand why some States preserved tracks of prime land for the good of all (State Parks), and some States did not, and refuse to.


If this is a reference to Texas at all, it was never a state issue. Most of Texas was in private hands when it won Independence from Mexico and became its own country. 10 years later, it entered the US as a state.
http://legacy.lib.utexas.edu/maps/atlas_texas/texas_land_grants.jpg
https://tshaonline.org/handbook/online/articles/mpl01
Posted By: Nogalus Prairie

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by TX Hitman
Originally Posted by DocHorton
I think one of the bigger problems is that land prices have gone up so much over the last 10-15 years that people who buy land want to hunt it themselves rather than lease it out, or they don't need the money and don't want the hassle.

People want to pay $1500 a year to hunt a million dollar property. Most people who can afford to pay that much for land don't need the $1500 and the headaches. Most hunting land leases are far too cheap compared to what land costs these days.



As a landowner, I agree with this assessment.


+1 as a landowner.
Why in heck would I want a bunch of guys I probably don’t know running all over my place 24/7/365 for 10 or 15 grand a year? Totally defeats the purpose of buying the land in the first place.

I think you add in DC’s post and you have the complete answer.
Posted By: Texas Dan

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 03:22 PM

Originally Posted by Nogalus Prairie
Originally Posted by TX Hitman
Originally Posted by DocHorton
I think one of the bigger problems is that land prices have gone up so much over the last 10-15 years that people who buy land want to hunt it themselves rather than lease it out, or they don't need the money and don't want the hassle.

People want to pay $1500 a year to hunt a million dollar property. Most people who can afford to pay that much for land don't need the $1500 and the headaches. Most hunting land leases are far too cheap compared to what land costs these days.



As a landowner, I agree with this assessment.


+1 as a landowner.
Why in heck would I want a bunch of guys I probably don’t know running all over my place 24/7/365 for 10 or 15 grand a year? Totally defeats the purpose of buying the land in the first place.

I think you add in DC’s post and you have the complete answer.


Increased liability is probably in the hassle mix as well.
Posted By: JCB

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 03:29 PM

There are more than enough leases to go around. The problem is unrealistic expectations from the people looking to lease the land.

How many times have yall seen this on the forum:

"Looking for a year round lease for me, my wife, and 6 kids, and a few buddies. Needs to be within 2 hours of DFW. Trophy bucks a must, pigs and exotics would be nice also. I love to duck hunt and so do my kids so need several ponds on the place. It would be nice if those ponds have trophy Bass also. Not willing to pay more than $1k per gun. Place needs to be over 1K acres with no more than 3 guns on it because I don't want to feel crowded when I bring all my kids and buddies with me. I don't have time to build stands or fill feeders so looking for a turn key place with all that done for me in advance. Cabin with electricity and water a must as well. We are a very trustworthy mob of people and will leave the land better than we find it, we just wont leave many critters on it when we leave. Please let me know what you have. Thanks!"
Posted By: TEXASLEFTY

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 04:19 PM

Originally Posted by JCB
There are more than enough leases to go around. The problem is unrealistic expectations from the people looking to lease the land.

How many times have yall seen this on the forum:

"Looking for a year round lease for me, my wife, and 6 kids, and a few buddies. Needs to be within 2 hours of DFW. Trophy bucks a must, pigs and exotics would be nice also. I love to duck hunt and so do my kids so need several ponds on the place. It would be nice if those ponds have trophy Bass also. Not willing to pay more than $1k per gun. Place needs to be over 1K acres with no more than 3 guns on it because I don't want to feel crowded when I bring all my kids and buddies with me. I don't have time to build stands or fill feeders so looking for a turn key place with all that done for me in advance. Cabin with electricity and water a must as well. We are a very trustworthy mob of people and will leave the land better than we find it, we just wont leave many critters on it when we leave. Please let me know what you have. Thanks!"


Lmao! Yep.
Posted By: BOBO the Clown

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 04:59 PM

Originally Posted by Texas Dan
Originally Posted by Nogalus Prairie
Originally Posted by TX Hitman
Originally Posted by DocHorton
I think one of the bigger problems is that land prices have gone up so much over the last 10-15 years that people who buy land want to hunt it themselves rather than lease it out, or they don't need the money and don't want the hassle.

People want to pay $1500 a year to hunt a million dollar property. Most people who can afford to pay that much for land don't need the $1500 and the headaches. Most hunting land leases are far too cheap compared to what land costs these days.



As a landowner, I agree with this assessment.


+1 as a landowner.
Why in heck would I want a bunch of guys I probably don’t know running all over my place 24/7/365 for 10 or 15 grand a year? Totally defeats the purpose of buying the land in the first place.

I think you add in DC’s post and you have the complete answer.


Increased liability is probably in the hassle mix as well.


You can sue for any thing but Texas ag tourism law pretty much shuts down the liability
Posted By: jakebunch

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 05:01 PM

There is "X" amount of land in Texas. Over 500,000 people a year are moving into Texas. Many ranches are being sold to new owners who either remove the existing hunters through pricing or retain the hunting for themselves. Although we see this frequently on the forum we are probably seeing only a small number of the total transactions. That obviously results in people looking for new leases.

Many landowners or lease brokeers are puttling too many people per acre on the property that results in overshooting and problems around the campfire. I am not faulting landowners, just making an observation. More emphasis is being placed on "trophy hunting" that leads to people looking for the ultimate lease (which is very difficult to find).

I do not agree with the comment "there are more than enough leases to go around" but I do believe there is a shortage of "good, not great" leases that results in disillusioned hunters to seek out better properties. I have done that.

All the above examples, and several that have been mentioned in above posts, have resulted in the current demand for hunting leases. My overall observation for people looking for leases is to be aware that lease prices have increased more than it appears many people are aware based on some of the expectations set forth by people who are looking for a lease. While they do exist, it may very well be unrealistic to expect to pay less than $2000 for a spot on a lease that has a reasonble gun to acre ratio.
Posted By: DH3

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 05:17 PM

I see this all the time....4 Hunters want a lease 2 hrs drive from Houston/Dallas/Austin. Must have cabin/water/electricity/TV and covered parking for vehicles. All blinds must be walking distance from cabin and come supplied with heaters and A/C's. Landowner furnishes corn and keeps feeders operating year round.
We will pay up to $250 each for a year round lease. Our class reads the bible!

PM what you have!
Posted By: Wilhunt

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 07:03 PM

There are people who indicate they are looking for a lease on this forum who are not really looking at all. I don't know if they just want to talk about it are just take part in the conversation. That is my experience after posting the need for a hunter to fill a lease a time or two. Hopefully my situation is the exception rather than the rule.
Posted By: Rustler

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 09:01 PM

The whole leases available vs folks looking thing is multifaceted.
Seriously, several dozen legitimate reasons why they seem or are harder to come by, I don't believe there is a 'top ten' of answers.
Posted By: FoxTrot

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 09:10 PM

I just lost mine...sold to be subdivided.
Posted By: Jimbo1

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 09:37 PM

Originally Posted by Wilhunt
There are people who indicate they are looking for a lease on this forum who are not really looking at all. I don't know if they just want to talk about it are just take part in the conversation. That is my experience after posting the need for a hunter to fill a lease a time or two. Hopefully my situation is the exception rather than the rule.

Yep, I had some "tire kickers" from here too! Had to rethink my whole process. Had an opening last year that I just ate the cost to save the hassle.
Posted By: sig226fan (Rguns.com)

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 10:28 PM

I can't begin to imagine joining a lease with unknown other lease members, so that would rule me out.

We're at an all time high on leases to lease, and an all time high on returning hunters. We haven't had to even advertise in a few years and have a word of mouth waiting list now. I see that we are providing good leases, for good prices, and people are beginning to see that staying in place has merit, versus lease hopping every couple of years looking for that million dollar property for 1k per year.

That fragmentation of farms is the biggest problem I see coming. It's getting worse every year, and worse closer to metro areas.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 10:44 PM

Originally Posted by Double Naught Spy
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Sincerely, I do not understand why some States preserved tracks of prime land for the good of all (State Parks), and some States did not, and refuse to.


If this is a reference to Texas at all, it was never a state issue. Most of Texas was in private hands when it won Independence from Mexico and became its own country. 10 years later, it entered the US as a state.
http://legacy.lib.utexas.edu/maps/atlas_texas/texas_land_grants.jpg
https://tshaonline.org/handbook/online/articles/mpl01



The victorious always write history, because the vanquished are dead.
Posted By: JKW

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 11:07 PM

Lots of factors-too many to place the blame (or credit) on just one.

But overall the demand is there and is certainly driving it. People will spend big money to kill large antlered deer. This style of hunting often benefits from a lower hunter density which drives up the demand relative to hunter numbers. There is also more disposable income right now than in times past. There is also much more disposable income in Texas relative to other areas.
Posted By: Wilhunt

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/17/19 11:17 PM

There are people who indicate they are looking for a lease on this forum who are not really looking at all. I don't know if they just want to talk about it are just take part in the conversation. That is my experience after posting the need for a hunter to fill a lease a time or two. Hopefully my situation is the exception rather than the rule.
Posted By: jakebunch

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 12:59 AM

In his above post Sig prettly well answered the question posed by the OP. He has an all time high number of leases, an all time high number of returning hunters, does not advertise anymore, and has a waiting list of hunters. Imagine how long that list would be if he advertised.

I had two openings on my lease last year. Posted on this forum and within an hour the spots were taken. Sight unseen. And for those who wonder about the outcome for those two, they said it is the best lease they have ever been on.
Posted By: kk66

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:52 AM

I think Don K hit it on the head above, The money you can make from leasing is a probably drop in the bucket compared to the landowner's cost of running and maintaining the place.
Add in the fact that most landowners now days aren't full time farmers looking to make a little extra money and even those that really need to make an income off opening the place up to hunting have realized that they can make more with a lot less hassle by running day hunts. Personally I would sell the place before I ever considered leasing it for hunting. Just seems way to much hassle of dealing with other people out there every weekend, etc.
Posted By: Wheelin' Outdoorsman

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 04:33 AM

This is an interesting question. For about the last year I have been on a pretty extensive search for property to buy. Not lease and hunt but to build a home and small ranch. I've been searching for a lease as well, but not nearly has hard. A couple of things I have found that may very well be impacting hunting leases. One is the turnover of land from one generation to the next via inheritance. The other is the amount of land that gone into a trust of one form or another. The other issue is the number of owners that are choosing to break up their land into smaller tracts in an effort to "develop" and make more money.
Posted By: 10 Gauge

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:18 AM

This is a great thread. An eye opener for sure, at least for me.
Posted By: Red Pill

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:00 PM

I am blessed to have access to land for hunting. I understand those who say they don't want to go through the hassle of leasing. I will say, though, that if we don't maintain or increase access for hunting, the numbers of hunters will continue to decline, and hunting will fade away.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by Red Pill
I am blessed to have access to land for hunting. I understand those who say they don't want to go through the hassle of leasing. I will say, though, that if we don't maintain or increase access for hunting, the numbers of hunters will continue to decline, and hunting will fade away.


Hate to be a cynic but the people that can afford to pay bank to hunt, still won't care one bit about those that can't. Like all things American - therein lies the root of most every problem this country has.

Keep hiring those low wage illegal aliens that don't talk back - to drive the wages of genuine American Citizens down - and soon democrats will rule Texas and take your guns and your hunting "privileges."
Posted By: don k

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:09 PM

A question for those that think there should be more private land for leasing. If you owned say 300 acres. Would you lease it out for hunting?
Posted By: PMK

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:16 PM

Originally Posted by don k
A question for those that think there should be more private land for leasing. If you owned say 300 acres. Would you lease it out for hunting?

personally, no ... but one of my previous lease owners were not hunters, merely bought a piece of property to retire on and leasing helped offset the taxes.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:17 PM

In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.
Posted By: Jimbo1

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:22 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.

And let the government decide who gets to come on your property NOPE!
Posted By: fouzman

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:29 PM


Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.


Originally Posted by The Zen Master
and soon democrats will rule Texas and take your guns and your hunting "privileges."


See there, it's already happening.
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:31 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.



LOLOLOLOL. You can't be serious?

....Obviously not a land owner.
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:31 PM

Originally Posted by fouzman

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.


Originally Posted by The Zen Master
and soon democrats will rule Texas and take your guns and your hunting "privileges."


See there, it's already happening.


roflmao Solid burn.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:32 PM

Originally Posted by Jimbo1
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.

And let the government decide who gets to come on your property NOPE!


You would not HAVE to lease your land to the State.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:34 PM

Originally Posted by DocHorton
Originally Posted by fouzman

[quote=The Zen Master]In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.


Originally Posted by The Zen Master
and soon democrats will rule Texas and take your guns and your hunting "privileges."


See there, it's already happening.


That is the point.
Posted By: kk66

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:49 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.



You know I really like cedar creek Texas. And enjoy spending my free time there but don’t want to buy a place there. How about you just let me stay in your house for free whenever I feel like. I would be open to paying $10 a night but only if you lease the house to the state first and let them open it up to anyone and everyone. I’ll only be there about 30 weekends out of the year and will take good care of the place
Posted By: Choctaw

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 03:51 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.


I'm out.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 04:02 PM

Originally Posted by kk66
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.



You know I really like cedar creek Texas. And enjoy spending my free time there but don’t want to buy a place there. How about you just let me stay in your house for free whenever I feel like. I would be open to paying $10 a night but only if you lease the house to the state first and let them open it up to anyone and everyone. I’ll only be there about 30 weekends out of the year and will take good care of the place



Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by Jimbo1
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.

And let the government decide who gets to come on your property NOPE!


You would not HAVE to lease your land to the State.
Posted By: maximus_flavius

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 04:14 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.


I think we have found the account of Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.

That would be the quickest way to assure that NO land is leased for hunting at all.
Posted By: maximus_flavius

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 04:15 PM

Originally Posted by kk66
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.



You know I really like cedar creek Texas. And enjoy spending my free time there but don’t want to buy a place there. How about you just let me stay in your house for free whenever I feel like. I would be open to paying $10 a night but only if you lease the house to the state first and let them open it up to anyone and everyone. I’ll only be there about 30 weekends out of the year and will take good care of the place


Yeah, but are you “management minded”?
Posted By: ducknbass

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 04:18 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.



[Linked Image]
Posted By: kk66

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 04:24 PM

Originally Posted by maximus_flavius
Originally Posted by kk66
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.



You know I really like cedar creek Texas. And enjoy spending my free time there but don’t want to buy a place there. How about you just let me stay in your house for free whenever I feel like. I would be open to paying $10 a night but only if you lease the house to the state first and let them open it up to anyone and everyone. I’ll only be there about 30 weekends out of the year and will take good care of the place


Yeah, but are you “management minded”?


I am, It'll just be me, the wife, the 12 kids, and my two brother in laws most weekends unless all my other buddies from work are able to come up with us.
I did forget to add that he's got to have at least 257 premium cable channels, not let the AC get no higher than 63 degrees, and be no more than 10 minutes from any restaurants I can think of.
We don't usually start drinking until 6:30 or so, and while we're management minded and will leave the place better than we find it I can't be held responsible for leaving mud tracks on the carpet as that stuff happens or responsible if one of the brother in laws gets liquored up and starts shouting or revving his truck in the driveway at 3am, shooting his gun off in the yard or acts inappropriate towards Zen Master's female relatives as the rest of us are really good guys that just want to fulfill our God given heritage of spending our 30 free weekends a year in Cedar Creek.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:05 PM

Do any of you have an argument for why the idea is bad - without resorting to name-calling?
Posted By: Dave Davidson

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:07 PM

As said in the book The Godfather. "Nothing personal. It's just business." To those who want to lease. If you owned land, how much $ would it take to get you to lease it? Most landowners enjoy their privacy and would only do it if the needed the $. It's kinda like having a spare bedroom in your home. How much would it take for you to rent it out?

From talking to those who do lease their land, they are more reluctant to raise prices to the guys who show up and help him mend fences and work around the place. I've raised a lot of kids on my place and taught them to hunt and fish. Some have moved away but still come from other places to help the old goat fill feeders. Those guys are now grown and are still underfoot.
Posted By: Nogalus Prairie

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:09 PM

It’s a bad idea because it gets Big Brother’s nose into what is strictly the business of private property owners.

Owning property doesn’t mean much if someone else can tell you what you can and can’t do with it.

All of that’s kind of elementary.
Posted By: Dave Davidson

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:09 PM

Zen, I have zero interest in having the government in any of my business. About like letting them pick a Wife for me.
Posted By: kk66

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Do any of you have an argument for why the idea is bad - without resorting to name-calling?


For one your idea requiring all leasing be done through the state is most likely an illegal restraint on trade so it will never happen. Second it’s private property rights. A landowner has as much right to decide who comes into their place and on what conditions as you do to decide who stays in your house. If you want to air bnb out your guest room that’s your business. But do you really think that the government should run that for you and decide who your boarder is going to be if you decide to rent an extra room?
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:30 PM

OK next question - sincerely, what do you tell all the poor folks, working for lower minimum wages than I made on my first job, 44-years ago (a direct result of all the low wage illegal alien labor that wont talk back - who, by the way, WILL vote democrat the instant that the folks in Austin make it so - that someone in Texas must be hiring because there are lots of them here), that would like to hunt, but have no family with land nor can afford $6K for a deer - IF they are lucky enough to find an honest guide or lease that actually has game?


Posted By: ducknbass

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:37 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
OK next question - sincerely, what do you tell all the poor folks, working for lower minimum wages than I made on my first job, 44-years ago (a direct result of all the low wage illegal alien labor that wont talk back - who, by the way, WILL vote democrat the instant that the folks in Austin make it so - that someone in Texas must be hiring because there are lots of them here), that would like to hunt, but have no family with land nor can afford $6K for a deer - IF they are lucky enough to find an honest guide or lease that actually has game?





I hunt 100% public every year I shoot ducks deer hogs squirrels rabbits there's no reason anyone in Texas cannot do the same you are a crybaby get over it
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:39 PM

Originally Posted by ducknbass
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
OK next question - sincerely, what do you tell all the poor folks, working for lower minimum wages than I made on my first job, 44-years ago (a direct result of all the low wage illegal alien labor that wont talk back - who, by the way, WILL vote democrat the instant that the folks in Austin make it so - that someone in Texas must be hiring because there are lots of them here), that would like to hunt, but have no family with land nor can afford $6K for a deer - IF they are lucky enough to find an honest guide or lease that actually has game?





I hunt 100% public every year I shoot ducks deer hogs squirrels rabbits there's no reason anyone in Texas cannot do the same you are a crybaby get over it


Name calling only make me think you are an emotional adolescent. Fair is fair.
Posted By: ducknbass

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:41 PM

Fair is a an adolescent dream.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:42 PM

Originally Posted by ducknbass
Fair is a an adolescent dream.


It was a response to your name-calling - I'm not surprised you missed that...
Posted By: ducknbass

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:44 PM

I call it like I see it. Keep playing the victim card it fits you. [Linked Image]
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:46 PM

Self portrait?

Was it the low wage illegal alien employee thing I mentioned that set you off?
Posted By: Nogalus Prairie

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:46 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
OK next question - sincerely, what do you tell all the poor folks, working for lower minimum wages than I made on my first job, 44-years ago (a direct result of all the low wage illegal alien labor that wont talk back - who, by the way, WILL vote democrat the instant that the folks in Austin make it so - that someone in Texas must be hiring because there are lots of them here), that would like to hunt, but have no family with land nor can afford $6K for a deer - IF they are lucky enough to find an honest guide or lease that actually has game?




Honestly?

I tell them about all the public land and excellent draw hunts available.
I also tell them networking with other hunters usually leads to some good opportunities if you are a good guy willing to help out others.
Finally, I tell them that the harder you work the more opportunities you will get - in deer hunting and everything else.

As much as we love it, deer hunting is a privilege-not a right.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:47 PM

Originally Posted by Nogalus Prairie
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
OK next question - sincerely, what do you tell all the poor folks, working for lower minimum wages than I made on my first job, 44-years ago (a direct result of all the low wage illegal alien labor that wont talk back - who, by the way, WILL vote democrat the instant that the folks in Austin make it so - that someone in Texas must be hiring because there are lots of them here), that would like to hunt, but have no family with land nor can afford $6K for a deer - IF they are lucky enough to find an honest guide or lease that actually has game?



Honestly?

I tell them about all the public land and excellent draw hunts available.
I also tell them networking with other hunters usually leads to some good opportunities if you are a good guy willing to help out others.
Finally, I tell them that the harder you work the more opportunities you will get - in deer hunting and everything else.

As much as we love it, deer hunting is a privilege-not a right.


Thank you! I am glad there are still a few genuine gentlemen-Americans left in this country!
Posted By: ducknbass

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:50 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Self portrait?

Was it the low wage illegal alien employee thing I mentioned that set you off?


No it's the communism.
Posted By: dogcatcher

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 05:58 PM

https://tpwd.texas.gov/landwater/land/private/hunt/deer/
Posted By: Rustler

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:06 PM

I'd say ---> TPWD public lands
---> TPWD

Also, there are many leases available for less than $6000 per season or year, much less for a deer, many outfitters that offer doe & cull hunts for considerably less, several that offer reduced cost youth opportunities.

You have to decide on priorities in life.
Drive $50,000 vehicle but can't afford a place to hunt, have grown up toys but can't afford to hunt, have 3 kids but can only afford to support 1 so you can't afford to hunt.
Have money for beer/alcohol & tobacco, cable/satellite Tv, cell phones ipads, video games, etc... basically anything that isn't a necessity, but you can't afford to hunt.
Stay at a dead end job or stuck in an area with no job growth potential, never trying to improve yourself, can't afford to hunt.
Make generally poor life decisions then blame everyone but the one that made them, you can't afford to hunt.

Seriously if you whine about or focus on what you don't have, instead of the blessings you do have, you'll never be happy, no matter whether you can afford to hunt or not.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:14 PM

Originally Posted by ducknbass
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Self portrait?

Was it the low wage illegal alien employee thing I mentioned that set you off?


No it's the communism.


Every country on Earth that lives under communism was once ruled by people like you.
Posted By: kk66

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:19 PM

Zen Master:

Not trying to be a name caller, but here's my 2 cents:

First, Why is it anyone's problem that someone else doesn't make enough to support their hobbies? When I was younger I really liked fast cars, but made minimum wage. I was lucky to have been able to work enough overtime to make the note on a truck that Sanford & Sons would've been embarrased to drive. Should someone with a corvette have let me use their's for free or for reduced price? At the end of the day for the vast majority of people, hunting is a hobby. It's a traditional and very enjoyable hobby but it's still just a hobby.

Second, Texas has over a million acres of public land open to hunting. It may not always be easy or convenient to hunt, but anyone that wants to hunt just about any native game in Texas can for less than $100 in licenses and permits, and yes I hunt public land every year. Too often people that complain about lack of access don't want just hunting, but very very good hunting. Big deer, lots of turkeys, etc. don't happen without a lot of time and money invested in habitat improvement and work. They may be the state's deer but given the time and money myself and other landowners invest each year in planting food plots, timber stand improvements, reseeding native grasses, etc. I think the landowner has a vested right in saying what happens on their property. I know personally if the state were to mandate that I had to open my place up to anyone and everyone I most likely wouldn't invest in that stuff.

Third it's about priorities. I was lucky enough to have inherited some land and to have added a little to it, but there's still sacrifices that have been made over the years to keep it. Money that was saved to take a family vacation to Disney or something went to fix fence or replace washed out roads, etc. on at least a couple occasions. I don't spend nearly as much to hunt as some folks do but manage to make at least two outfitted hunts a year. I've got friends who constantly point out how they wish they had the money to blow like that, but then get real defensive when I point out that they all drive trucks less than 3 years old, have 4 wheelers, the latest electronics and usually buy several guns a year. I drive a 15 year old dodge with 250,000 miles on it that I bought used, have never owned a 4 wheeler, don't have cable tv, eat out maybe once every two months, still used a flip phone until recently and haven't bought a gun probably at least 5 years. They prefer to spend their money on things and I prefer to spend my money on hunting. To each their own.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:20 PM

Originally Posted by Rustler
I'd say ---> TPWD public lands
---> TPWD

Also, there are many leases available for less than $6000 per season or year, much less for a deer, many outfitters that offer doe & cull hunts for considerably less, several that offer reduced cost youth opportunities.

You have to decide on priorities in life.
Drive $50,000 vehicle but can't afford a place to hunt, have grown up toys but can't afford to hunt, have 3 kids but can only afford to support 1 so you can't afford to hunt.
Have money for beer/alcohol & tobacco, cable/satellite Tv, cell phones ipads, video games, etc... basically anything that isn't a necessity, but you can't afford to hunt.
Stay at a dead end job or stuck in an area with no job growth potential, never trying to improve yourself, can't afford to hunt.
Make generally poor life decisions then blame everyone but the one that made them, you can't afford to hunt.

Seriously if you whine about or focus on what you don't have, instead of the blessings you do have, you'll never be happy, no matter whether you can afford to hunt or not.


My Honda is fully paid for.
I CAN afford to hunt but I will never pay anyone $6K for a deer that belongs to The People of The State.
I do not drink, smoke, or do any drugs not prescribed by an MD.
I do not have CATV because stupidity bores me - same for video games - I do have an iPhone that I pay for - on time, every month!
I am self-employed I make $114K working from home.
I blame no one for my place in life - I have a very easy life.

I was just wanting to know how folks treat the po!

You are mighty presumptuous - seen lots of that round here.
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:22 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
OK next question - sincerely, what do you tell all the poor folks, working for lower minimum wages than I made on my first job, 44-years ago (a direct result of all the low wage illegal alien labor that wont talk back - who, by the way, WILL vote democrat the instant that the folks in Austin make it so - that someone in Texas must be hiring because there are lots of them here), that would like to hunt, but have no family with land nor can afford $6K for a deer - IF they are lucky enough to find an honest guide or lease that actually has game?




There's not a person living in Texas who can't afford to deer hunt if they really want to.

Serious question...do you own anything? Land, house, property, business, etc...anything?
Posted By: kk66

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by Rustler
I'd say ---> TPWD public lands
---> TPWD

Also, there are many leases available for less than $6000 per season or year, much less for a deer, many outfitters that offer doe & cull hunts for considerably less, several that offer reduced cost youth opportunities.

You have to decide on priorities in life.
Drive $50,000 vehicle but can't afford a place to hunt, have grown up toys but can't afford to hunt, have 3 kids but can only afford to support 1 so you can't afford to hunt.
Have money for beer/alcohol & tobacco, cable/satellite Tv, cell phones ipads, video games, etc... basically anything that isn't a necessity, but you can't afford to hunt.
Stay at a dead end job or stuck in an area with no job growth potential, never trying to improve yourself, can't afford to hunt.
Make generally poor life decisions then blame everyone but the one that made them, you can't afford to hunt.

Seriously if you whine about or focus on what you don't have, instead of the blessings you do have, you'll never be happy, no matter whether you can afford to hunt or not.


My Honda is fully paid for.
I CAN afford to hunt but I will never pay anyone $6K for a deer that belongs to The People of The State.
I do not drink, smoke, or do any drugs not prescribed by an MD.
I do not have CATV because stupidity bores me - same for video games - I do have an iPhone that I pay for - ON TIME.
I am self-employed I make $114K working from home (no BS).
I blame no one for my place in life.

You are mighty presumptuous - seen lots of that round here.


Zen:

I think the difference in your thinking and my thinking is that you look at it as paying to shoot a deer. To me what you're paying for is the habitat, and the improvements to that habitat, that the land owner made. You can find leases in just about every area of Texas for a lot less than $6000 but you aren't going to find a place that has a great deal of investment in the habitat improvement and management plans that it takes to grow huge deer for that price.
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by Rustler
I'd say ---> TPWD public lands
---> TPWD

Also, there are many leases available for less than $6000 per season or year, much less for a deer, many outfitters that offer doe & cull hunts for considerably less, several that offer reduced cost youth opportunities.

You have to decide on priorities in life.
Drive $50,000 vehicle but can't afford a place to hunt, have grown up toys but can't afford to hunt, have 3 kids but can only afford to support 1 so you can't afford to hunt.
Have money for beer/alcohol & tobacco, cable/satellite Tv, cell phones ipads, video games, etc... basically anything that isn't a necessity, but you can't afford to hunt.
Stay at a dead end job or stuck in an area with no job growth potential, never trying to improve yourself, can't afford to hunt.
Make generally poor life decisions then blame everyone but the one that made them, you can't afford to hunt.

Seriously if you whine about or focus on what you don't have, instead of the blessings you do have, you'll never be happy, no matter whether you can afford to hunt or not.


My Honda is fully paid for.
I CAN afford to hunt but I will never pay anyone $6K for a deer that belongs to The People of The State.
I do not drink, smoke, or do any drugs not prescribed by an MD.
I do not have CATV because stupidity bores me - same for video games - I do have an iPhone that I pay for - on time, every month!
I am self-employed I make $114K working from home.
I blame no one for my place in life - I have a very easy life.

You are mighty presumptuous - seen lots of that round here.


Obviously, he wasn't talking about you specifically. He was giving examples...
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:26 PM

Originally Posted by DocHorton
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by Rustler
I'd say ---> TPWD public lands
---> TPWD

Also, there are many leases available for less than $6000 per season or year, much less for a deer, many outfitters that offer doe & cull hunts for considerably less, several that offer reduced cost youth opportunities.

You have to decide on priorities in life.
Drive $50,000 vehicle but can't afford a place to hunt, have grown up toys but can't afford to hunt, have 3 kids but can only afford to support 1 so you can't afford to hunt.
Have money for beer/alcohol & tobacco, cable/satellite Tv, cell phones ipads, video games, etc... basically anything that isn't a necessity, but you can't afford to hunt.
Stay at a dead end job or stuck in an area with no job growth potential, never trying to improve yourself, can't afford to hunt.
Make generally poor life decisions then blame everyone but the one that made them, you can't afford to hunt.

Seriously if you whine about or focus on what you don't have, instead of the blessings you do have, you'll never be happy, no matter whether you can afford to hunt or not.


My Honda is fully paid for.
I CAN afford to hunt but I will never pay anyone $6K for a deer that belongs to The People of The State.
I do not drink, smoke, or do any drugs not prescribed by an MD.
I do not have CATV because stupidity bores me - same for video games - I do have an iPhone that I pay for - on time, every month!
I am self-employed I make $114K working from home.
I blame no one for my place in life - I have a very easy life.

You are mighty presumptuous - seen lots of that round here.


Obviously, he wasn't talking about you specifically. He was giving examples...


You must have missed this part? "Seriously if you whine about or focus on what you don't have"
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:30 PM

Originally Posted by kk66
Zen Master:

Not trying to be a name caller, but here's my 2 cents:

First, Why is it anyone's problem that someone else doesn't make enough to support their hobbies? When I was younger I really liked fast cars, but made minimum wage. I was lucky to have been able to work enough overtime to make the note on a truck that Sanford & Sons would've been embarrased to drive. Should someone with a corvette have let me use their's for free or for reduced price? At the end of the day for the vast majority of people, hunting is a hobby. It's a traditional and very enjoyable hobby but it's still just a hobby.

Second, Texas has over a million acres of public land open to hunting. It may not always be easy or convenient to hunt, but anyone that wants to hunt just about any native game in Texas can for less than $100 in licenses and permits, and yes I hunt public land every year. Too often people that complain about lack of access don't want just hunting, but very very good hunting. Big deer, lots of turkeys, etc. don't happen without a lot of time and money invested in habitat improvement and work. They may be the state's deer but given the time and money myself and other landowners invest each year in planting food plots, timber stand improvements, reseeding native grasses, etc. I think the landowner has a vested right in saying what happens on their property. I know personally if the state were to mandate that I had to open my place up to anyone and everyone I most likely wouldn't invest in that stuff.

Third it's about priorities. I was lucky enough to have inherited some land and to have added a little to it, but there's still sacrifices that have been made over the years to keep it. Money that was saved to take a family vacation to Disney or something went to fix fence or replace washed out roads, etc. on at least a couple occasions. I don't spend nearly as much to hunt as some folks do but manage to make at least two outfitted hunts a year. I've got friends who constantly point out how they wish they had the money to blow like that, but then get real defensive when I point out that they all drive trucks less than 3 years old, have 4 wheelers, the latest electronics and usually buy several guns a year. I drive a 15 year old dodge with 250,000 miles on it that I bought used, have never owned a 4 wheeler, don't have cable tv, eat out maybe once every two months, still used a flip phone until recently and haven't bought a gun probably at least 5 years. They prefer to spend their money on things and I prefer to spend my money on hunting. To each their own.


I work in an industry wherein nearly every business owner claims he or she is a "Patriot," hires illegals, buys a new quad-cab dually every 2-years, and then complains about people voting democrat or getting welfare - so, I hear you!
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:32 PM

Have a great day, gentlemen - I have some work to do!
Posted By: Rustler

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:38 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master

My Honda is fully paid for.
I CAN afford to hunt but I will never pay anyone $6K for a deer that belongs to The People of The State.
I do not drink, smoke, or do any drugs not prescribed by an MD.
I do not have CATV because stupidity bores me - same for video games - I do have an iPhone that I pay for - on time, every month!
I am self-employed I make $114K working from home.
I blame no one for my place in life - I have a very easy life.

I was just wanting to know how folks treat the po!

You are mighty presumptuous - seen lots of that round here.


I didn't make a single presumption, I answered your question, included links, that's all, if you read anything else into it seems you have awfully thin skin or a persecution complex.

You sound like you have very little experience, no one has to pay $6K to kill a deer, it just flat doesn't cost anywhere near $6K for a deer. That's just trolling for a reaction.

If you owned land suitable for hunting what would you charge strangers that wanted to run around on it with firearms to use it per season or year?
Or per deer?
Posted By: BOBO the Clown

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:41 PM

Leasing projections = lazy, when we have the ability to hunt 5.7 million acres with in a 7 hours drive of cedar creek.
1.5 mil in Texas, 1+-Mil in okla, 3.2 in Arkansas.

This is in addition to 1000’s of walk in acres under Land access program funded by the farm bill, license surcharge and land and conservation bill if passed again.
Posted By: Pitchfork Predator

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 06:46 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by Rustler
I'd say ---> TPWD public lands
---> TPWD

Also, there are many leases available for less than $6000 per season or year, much less for a deer, many outfitters that offer doe & cull hunts for considerably less, several that offer reduced cost youth opportunities.

You have to decide on priorities in life.
Drive $50,000 vehicle but can't afford a place to hunt, have grown up toys but can't afford to hunt, have 3 kids but can only afford to support 1 so you can't afford to hunt.
Have money for beer/alcohol & tobacco, cable/satellite Tv, cell phones ipads, video games, etc... basically anything that isn't a necessity, but you can't afford to hunt.
Stay at a dead end job or stuck in an area with no job growth potential, never trying to improve yourself, can't afford to hunt.
Make generally poor life decisions then blame everyone but the one that made them, you can't afford to hunt.

Seriously if you whine about or focus on what you don't have, instead of the blessings you do have, you'll never be happy, no matter whether you can afford to hunt or not.


My Honda is fully paid for.
I CAN afford to hunt but I will never pay anyone $6K for a deer that belongs to The People of The State.
I do not drink, smoke, or do any drugs not prescribed by an MD.
I do not have CATV because stupidity bores me - same for video games - I do have an iPhone that I pay for - on time, every month!
I am self-employed I make $114K working from home.
I blame no one for my place in life - I have a very easy life.

I was just wanting to know how folks treat the po!

You are mighty presumptuous - seen lots of that round here.


So since you want to know, I want to know. What have you done to help someone "po"? Help someone "po" go hunting?

.......and you are wrong......the state owns the deer but they don't own the land. Road hunting is illegal so it comes down to public land or private. You will pay to hunt the states deer on private.....as it should be. We pull our own weight in this state. If your too poor to lease like I was when I was younger you hunt public land. You work and save to hunt on private land if it's important to you. You don't ask for cheese to go with your whine.

.......lastly it's none of your damn business how I treat the poor. I'd be willing to bet it's much more than you've done.......please prove me wrong.......
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by DocHorton
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by Rustler
I'd say ---> TPWD public lands
---> TPWD

Also, there are many leases available for less than $6000 per season or year, much less for a deer, many outfitters that offer doe & cull hunts for considerably less, several that offer reduced cost youth opportunities.

You have to decide on priorities in life.
Drive $50,000 vehicle but can't afford a place to hunt, have grown up toys but can't afford to hunt, have 3 kids but can only afford to support 1 so you can't afford to hunt.
Have money for beer/alcohol & tobacco, cable/satellite Tv, cell phones ipads, video games, etc... basically anything that isn't a necessity, but you can't afford to hunt.
Stay at a dead end job or stuck in an area with no job growth potential, never trying to improve yourself, can't afford to hunt.
Make generally poor life decisions then blame everyone but the one that made them, you can't afford to hunt.

Seriously if you whine about or focus on what you don't have, instead of the blessings you do have, you'll never be happy, no matter whether you can afford to hunt or not.


My Honda is fully paid for.
I CAN afford to hunt but I will never pay anyone $6K for a deer that belongs to The People of The State.
I do not drink, smoke, or do any drugs not prescribed by an MD.
I do not have CATV because stupidity bores me - same for video games - I do have an iPhone that I pay for - on time, every month!
I am self-employed I make $114K working from home.
I blame no one for my place in life - I have a very easy life.

You are mighty presumptuous - seen lots of that round here.


Obviously, he wasn't talking about you specifically. He was giving examples...


You must have missed this part? "Seriously if you whine about or focus on what you don't have"


How did he know you have 3 kids? Or drive a $50,000 vehicle? Those where examples....

And I didn't miss that part...it was a generic statement also, and a true one.
Posted By: QuitShootinYoungBucks

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 08:30 PM

Given the cost of land, IMO very few people could afford what it should cost to lease. In most business deals your 'lease' is more than paid for by the primary business-nobody is making land payments at $10-25/acre.

Zen doesn't have a bad idea but I just don't see it working. Also, you'd get a lot of under-the-table deals. Instead of officially leasing with the state, many people would just have their 'friends' come hunt on a cash-only basis. Another problem is that all land is not created equal, even within the same county. Then you get undesirables who come out and trash your place while shooting everything in sight.
Posted By: Walkabout

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 08:43 PM

There are hundreds of thousands of acres of private land in Texas where you can hunt your deer until your heart is content. It’s called PACKAGED HUNTS; less expensive than most leases. What more could you want.
Posted By: DQ Kid

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 08:56 PM

Originally Posted by Walkabout
There are hundreds of thousands of acres of private land in Texas where you can hunt your deer until your heart is content. It’s called PACKAGED HUNTS; less expensive than most leases. What more could you want.

Apparently year round, unfettered access...
Posted By: Creekrunner

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 09:04 PM

Not the first supposed Buddhist I've seen that's argumentative as hell and is positive he's the smartest guy in the room. I'm no Buddhist, but I'm pretty sure The Buddha would not be impressed, particularly with a "Master".
Posted By: Erny

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/18/19 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
In my humble opinion, leasing land for hunting should only be legal if the land is leased to the State and hunting is open to any Citizen of the State on a draw system.



Wow!!!! popcorn
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:21 AM

Originally Posted by Creekrunner
Not the first supposed Buddhist I've seen that's argumentative as hell and is positive he's the smartest guy in the room. I'm no Buddhist, but I'm pretty sure The Buddha would not be impressed, particularly with a "Master".


I'm not a Buddhist - its just an internet name. You should study why people become defensive when they hear an idea they don't like...
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:26 AM

Originally Posted by QuitShootinYoungBucks
Given the cost of land, IMO very few people could afford what it should cost to lease. In most business deals your 'lease' is more than paid for by the primary business-nobody is making land payments at $10-25/acre.

Zen doesn't have a bad idea but I just don't see it working. Also, you'd get a lot of under-the-table deals. Instead of officially leasing with the state, many people would just have their 'friends' come hunt on a cash-only basis. Another problem is that all land is not created equal, even within the same county. Then you get undesirables who come out and trash your place while shooting everything in sight.


Thank you.

Posted By: maximus_flavius

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 01:00 AM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
OK next question - sincerely, what do you tell all the poor folks


I tell them tough [censored]. The same thing that I get told when I can’t afford what I want.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 01:11 AM

Originally Posted by maximus_flavius
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
OK next question - sincerely, what do you tell all the poor folks


I tell them tough [censored]. The same thing that I get told when I can’t afford what I want.



I betcha they think the same exact thing about you, when they vote for Beto!
Posted By: colt45-90

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 01:44 AM

my buddy lost his cattle lease the 300 acres sold, the new owner pd 12 million, you guessed it from Ca. , Mike had it for over 20yrs.
Posted By: ducknbass

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 02:54 AM

Dang I spent 30 minutes today arguing with a guy from cedar Creek. That's how boring my job is. Literally cedar Creek next I'll get bored and try and sell tooth paste in Quinlan
Posted By: Txduckman

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 05:25 AM

Don't worry, land access will be AirBnB soon...

https://outdooraccess.com/#/
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 11:23 AM

Originally Posted by colt45
my buddy lost his cattle lease the 300 acres sold, the new owner pd 12 million, you guessed it from Ca. , Mike had it for over 20yrs.


So, it is greed that is killing hunting? Interesting...

Do you think those "Kalifornians" are going to honor Texas traditions?

Are the Kalifornians bad for bringing their nutty ideas to Texas, or is Mike bad for selling out to them and putting his own self-interest ahead of his fellow Texicans?

I'm asking for a friend.
Posted By: Creekrunner

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 11:29 AM

Originally Posted by Txduckman
Don't worry, land access will be AirBnB soon...

https://outdooraccess.com/#/


"Slick" website. I couldn't help noticing on the nice lady LO's testimonial - "and you get a nice check in the mail." roflmao Classic. What could possibly go wrong?


And colt45 - Where in the state did someone pay $40K an acre for 300?
Posted By: Pitchfork Predator

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 11:44 AM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by colt45
my buddy lost his cattle lease the 300 acres sold, the new owner pd 12 million, you guessed it from Ca. , Mike had it for over 20yrs.


So, it is greed that is killing hunting? Interesting...

Do you think those "Kalifornians" are going to honor Texas traditions?

Are the Kalifornians bad for bringing their nutty ideas to Texas, or is Mike bad for selling out to them and putting his own self-interest ahead of his fellow Texicans?

I'm asking for a friend.



troll
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by Pitchfork Predator
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by colt45
my buddy lost his cattle lease the 300 acres sold, the new owner pd 12 million, you guessed it from Ca. , Mike had it for over 20yrs.


So, it is greed that is killing hunting? Interesting...

Do you think those "Kalifornians" are going to honor Texas traditions?

Are the Kalifornians bad for bringing their nutty ideas to Texas, or is Mike bad for selling out to them and putting his own self-interest ahead of his fellow Texicans?

I'm asking for a friend.



troll


What's the matter, cowboy - questions too hard for you to answer?
Posted By: 10 Gauge

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:08 PM

I find it hard to believe it is so tough to find a place to hunt. My landlord, who could probably afford to hunt wherever he wants, hunts davy crockett national forest and not because it's free. Apparently the hunting there is just that good and the woods are loaded with deer.

On top of that, members of this forum have been very generous to me. The only reason I haven't hunted here yet is because I don't have the time. I'm pretty swamped.

That said, I have some relatives that pay a handsome sum every year just in property tax for just a couple of acres. A whole lot more than most people are spending for their deer lease.

If I had land I can't imagine I'd lease it to anyone for any sum, but might have to in order to cover the taxes if I ever retired. Think about that! Makes you wonder how many people lease just to cover the damn property taxes.

If you want to hunt for free, drive to a place where you can. If it's too far to make a day of it, go camping and make a weekend out of it. It's not rocket surgery. Good habitat is available damn near for free, you can still hunt for less than the cost of meat in the store if you do a little homework. Although to be fair, others did the homework for me and pointed me in the right direction.
Posted By: Pitchfork Predator

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:12 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by Pitchfork Predator
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by colt45
my buddy lost his cattle lease the 300 acres sold, the new owner pd 12 million, you guessed it from Ca. , Mike had it for over 20yrs.


So, it is greed that is killing hunting? Interesting...

Do you think those "Kalifornians" are going to honor Texas traditions?

Are the Kalifornians bad for bringing their nutty ideas to Texas, or is Mike bad for selling out to them and putting his own self-interest ahead of his fellow Texicans?

I'm asking for a friend.



troll


What's the matter, cowboy - questions too hard for you to answer?


troll
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:17 PM

Originally Posted by regularguy11B
I find it hard to believe it is so tough to find a place to hunt. My landlord, who could probably afford to hunt wherever he wants, hunts davy crockett national forest and not because it's free. Apparently the hunting there is just that good and the woods are loaded with deer.

On top of that, members of this forum have been very generous to me. The only reason I haven't hunted here yet is because I don't have the time. I'm pretty swamped.

That said, I have some relatives that pay a handsome sum every year just in property tax for just a couple of acres. A whole lot more than most people are spending for their deer lease.javascript:quickReply(7438241,1,0)

If I had land I can't imagine I'd lease it to anyone for any sum, but might have to in order to cover the taxes if I ever retired. Think about that! Makes you wonder how many people lease just to cover the damn property taxes.

If you want to hunt for free, drive to a place where you can. If it's too far to make a day of it, go camping and make a weekend out of it. It's not rocket surgery. Good habitat is available damn near for free, you can still hunt for less than the cost of meat in the store if you do a little homework. Although to be fair, others did the homework for me and pointed me in the right direction.


Thank you - Davy Crockett National Forest has a nice ring to it! I will check out your recommendations.
Posted By: 10 Gauge

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:19 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by regularguy11B
I find it hard to believe it is so tough to find a place to hunt. My landlord, who could probably afford to hunt wherever he wants, hunts davy crockett national forest and not because it's free. Apparently the hunting there is just that good and the woods are loaded with deer.

On top of that, members of this forum have been very generous to me. The only reason I haven't hunted here yet is because I don't have the time. I'm pretty swamped.

That said, I have some relatives that pay a handsome sum every year just in property tax for just a couple of acres. A whole lot more than most people are spending for their deer lease.javascript:quickReply(7438241,1,0)

If I had land I can't imagine I'd lease it to anyone for any sum, but might have to in order to cover the taxes if I ever retired. Think about that! Makes you wonder how many people lease just to cover the damn property taxes.

If you want to hunt for free, drive to a place where you can. If it's too far to make a day of it, go camping and make a weekend out of it. It's not rocket surgery. Good habitat is available damn near for free, you can still hunt for less than the cost of meat in the store if you do a little homework. Although to be fair, others did the homework for me and pointed me in the right direction.


Thank you - Davy Crockett National Forest has a nice ring to it! I will check out your recommendations.


It's about a 4 hour drive from DFW. But it is freaking huge. The TPWD managed portion is small but the entire park is huge and you can get a permit to hunt it for a whole lot less than the cheapest one day hog hunt I have found online.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:24 PM

Eventually, greed will kill Texas hunting.

Patriotic Texas business owners and land owners will continue to put their own self-interests first and hire low wage illegal alien labor that won't talk back (new democrat voters), and/or sell their land to the highest bidder from Kalifornia (more democrat voters), and then complain about what "liberals" are/have done to Texas when those democrat voters elect Beto and/or Bernie Sanders.

If people really cared about the issue they would be talking about ways to acquire excellent hunting land and convert it to State Parks or National Forests - for the benefit of future generations.

And that, gentlemen, is the underlying principle of my original inquiry.
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:29 PM

Originally Posted by regularguy11B
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by regularguy11B
I find it hard to believe it is so tough to find a place to hunt. My landlord, who could probably afford to hunt wherever he wants, hunts davy crockett national forest and not because it's free. Apparently the hunting there is just that good and the woods are loaded with deer.

On top of that, members of this forum have been very generous to me. The only reason I haven't hunted here yet is because I don't have the time. I'm pretty swamped.

That said, I have some relatives that pay a handsome sum every year just in property tax for just a couple of acres. A whole lot more than most people are spending for their deer lease.javascript:quickReply(7438241,1,0)

If I had land I can't imagine I'd lease it to anyone for any sum, but might have to in order to cover the taxes if I ever retired. Think about that! Makes you wonder how many people lease just to cover the damn property taxes.

If you want to hunt for free, drive to a place where you can. If it's too far to make a day of it, go camping and make a weekend out of it. It's not rocket surgery. Good habitat is available damn near for free, you can still hunt for less than the cost of meat in the store if you do a little homework. Although to be fair, others did the homework for me and pointed me in the right direction.


Thank you - Davy Crockett National Forest has a nice ring to it! I will check out your recommendations.


It's about a 4 hour drive from DFW. But it is freaking huge. The TPWD managed portion is small but the entire park is huge and you can get a permit to hunt it for a whole lot less than the cheapest one day hog hunt I have found online.


Thank you, it sounds great! I had never even heard of the place before - not for lack of asking...
Posted By: Pitchfork Predator

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:33 PM

The Zen Master = bs
Posted By: The Zen Master

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:35 PM

Originally Posted by Pitchfork Predator
The Zen Master = bs


Grow up.
Posted By: Creekrunner

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:35 PM

Originally Posted by Pitchfork Predator
The Zen Master = bs

troll

loser8
Posted By: titan2232

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:42 PM

There are plenty of leasing/hunting "spots" available from $300 dollar East Texas "hog" leases to your premium areas in South Texas. I didn't advertise here (family first), but we had two openings on our place for the coming season and our current rate is $6.50ish an acre for leasing rights. This price has been in the $6.00 per acre range for 24 years now
Posted By: HWY_MAN

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 12:58 PM

Quote
So, it is greed that is killing hunting? Interesting...


The fact that you can't afford or won't pay the price I put on my product has nothing to do with greed unless we classify greed as wanting something for nothing or less than market value. Nobody is making you hunt but should you choose to then hunt state land that seems to be the cheapest route, your chances won't be as good as hunting private but to do that you have to step up in price. Now should you want to really increase your chances at taking a really big buck you'll have to step it up again. Hell there's ranches out there that I can't afford to hunt so I just stay within my means. I certainly don't complain about their prices!

And about that "It's the states deer". The days the states decides to start picking up the bill for the management costs of feeding and maintaining the deer on my place I'll consider them the States Deer, other wise I determine the price and that price is based upon market value. The landowners in this state to a better job of maintaining and management than the state ever could and that's only because deer are a marketable product. If the land owners had no control over what can and can't be taken off their property every county in the state would be shot out!
Posted By: ducknbass

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 01:06 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by regularguy11B
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by regularguy11B
I find it hard to believe it is so tough to find a place to hunt. My landlord, who could probably afford to hunt wherever he wants, hunts davy crockett national forest and not because it's free. Apparently the hunting there is just that good and the woods are loaded with deer.

On top of that, members of this forum have been very generous to me. The only reason I haven't hunted here yet is because I don't have the time. I'm pretty swamped.

That said, I have some relatives that pay a handsome sum every year just in property tax for just a couple of acres. A whole lot more than most people are spending for their deer lease.javascript:quickReply(7438241,1,0)

If I had land I can't imagine I'd lease it to anyone for any sum, but might have to in order to cover the taxes if I ever retired. Think about that! Makes you wonder how many people lease just to cover the damn property taxes.

If you want to hunt for free, drive to a place where you can. If it's too far to make a day of it, go camping and make a weekend out of it. It's not rocket surgery. Good habitat is available damn near for free, you can still hunt for less than the cost of meat in the store if you do a little homework. Although to be fair, others did the homework for me and pointed me in the right direction.


Thank you - Davy Crockett National Forest has a nice ring to it! I will check out your recommendations.


It's about a 4 hour drive from DFW. But it is freaking huge. The TPWD managed portion is small but the entire park is huge and you can get a permit to hunt it for a whole lot less than the cheapest one day hog hunt I have found online.


Thank you, it sounds great! I had never even heard of the place before - not for lack of asking...



In typical helpless form you couldn't even google public land on Texas. Needed someone to hold your wittle hand.
Posted By: maximus_flavius

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 01:08 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Eventually, greed will kill Texas hunting.

Patriotic Texas business owners and land owners will continue to put their own self-interests first and hire low wage illegal alien labor that won't talk back (new democrat voters), and/or sell their land to the highest bidder from Kalifornia (more democrat voters), and then complain about what "liberals" are/have done to Texas when those democrat voters elect Beto and/or Bernie Sanders.

If people really cared about the issue they would be talking about ways to acquire excellent hunting land and convert it to State Parks or National Forests - for the benefit of future generations.

And that, gentlemen, is the underlying principle of my original inquiry.


The crack. Get off it bro.
Posted By: Creekrunner

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 01:15 PM

I'm reminded of a few former members, most here only briefly,crying but one in particular had real staying power. The type that try to come off as MENSA members, but their socratic method sux.

Are we taking up a collection later?
peep
Posted By: Mr. T.

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 01:41 PM

Originally Posted by Creekrunner
Originally Posted by Pitchfork Predator
The Zen Master = bs

troll

loser8

X2
Posted By: BOBO the Clown

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 01:45 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Originally Posted by regularguy11B
I find it hard to believe it is so tough to find a place to hunt. My landlord, who could probably afford to hunt wherever he wants, hunts davy crockett national forest and not because it's free. Apparently the hunting there is just that good and the woods are loaded with deer.

On top of that, members of this forum have been very generous to me. The only reason I haven't hunted here yet is because I don't have the time. I'm pretty swamped.

That said, I have some relatives that pay a handsome sum every year just in property tax for just a couple of acres. A whole lot more than most people are spending for their deer lease.javascript:quickReply(7438241,1,0)

If I had land I can't imagine I'd lease it to anyone for any sum, but might have to in order to cover the taxes if I ever retired. Think about that! Makes you wonder how many people lease just to cover the damn property taxes.

If you want to hunt for free, drive to a place where you can. If it's too far to make a day of it, go camping and make a weekend out of it. It's not rocket surgery. Good habitat is available damn near for free, you can still hunt for less than the cost of meat in the store if you do a little homework. Although to be fair, others did the homework for me and pointed me in the right direction.


Thank you - Davy Crockett National Forest has a nice ring to it! I will check out your recommendations.


So you come on here a troll the hell out of hunters and landowners about lease costs, but we’re to lazy to look up public land(that actually you own) hunting opportunities?

Over 5 million acres in three states, all with in 6 hours of you. Not including the land access lease program that opens up private land to the public.

Wow
Posted By: Erathkid

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by ducknbass
Dang I spent 30 minutes today arguing with a guy from cedar Creek. That's how boring my job is. Literally cedar Creek next I'll get bored and try and sell tooth paste in Quinlan

Originally Posted by ducknbass
Dang I spent 30 minutes today arguing with a guy from cedar Creek. That's how boring my job is. Literally cedar Creek next I'll get bored and try and sell tooth paste in Quinlan

roflmao
Posted By: DocHorton

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 02:48 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master

If people really cared about the issue they would be talking about ways to acquire excellent hunting land and convert it to State Parks or National Forests - for the benefit of future generations.

And that, gentlemen, is the underlying principle of my original inquiry.


That's the exact point. Most people don't care if "poor people" don't have a place to hunt. There's already plenty of public land for everyone to hunt. It's a non-issue that you are trying to make an issue.

Since you care so much yourself why don't you buy a piece of property and donate it to the state...for the benefit of future generations. up
Posted By: 10 Gauge

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 03:01 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Eventually, greed will kill Texas hunting.

Patriotic Texas business owners and land owners will continue to put their own self-interests first and hire low wage illegal alien labor that won't talk back (new democrat voters), and/or sell their land to the highest bidder from Kalifornia (more democrat voters), and then complain about what "liberals" are/have done to Texas when those democrat voters elect Beto and/or Bernie Sanders.

If people really cared about the issue they would be talking about ways to acquire excellent hunting land and convert it to State Parks or National Forests - for the benefit of future generations.

And that, gentlemen, is the underlying principle of my original inquiry.



When you work hard your whole life to buy a piece of land to retire on, and are forced to lease your legacy out to ungrateful people because your property taxes are too high to just retire in peace, you can talk about greedy landowners.
Posted By: BOBO the Clown

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 09:37 PM

Originally Posted by regularguy11B
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Eventually, greed will kill Texas hunting.

Patriotic Texas business owners and land owners will continue to put their own self-interests first and hire low wage illegal alien labor that won't talk back (new democrat voters), and/or sell their land to the highest bidder from Kalifornia (more democrat voters), and then complain about what "liberals" are/have done to Texas when those democrat voters elect Beto and/or Bernie Sanders.

If people really cared about the issue they would be talking about ways to acquire excellent hunting land and convert it to State Parks or National Forests - for the benefit of future generations.

And that, gentlemen, is the underlying principle of my original inquiry.



When you work hard your whole life to buy a piece of land to retire on, and are forced to lease your legacy out to ungrateful people because your property taxes are too high to just retire in peace, you can talk about greedy landowners.





He is ignorant or just doesn’t care to learn since all his points are already in place. , no point In explaining to him texas has actually increased its public land holding and that there is legislative measures/programs in place to pay voluntary private Landowner lease money and reduced liability for public access.


Posted By: dogcatcher

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 10:06 PM

Originally Posted by Pitchfork Predator
The Zen Master = bs

The Zen is looking for a welfare system for hunters. He wants the taxpayers of the State of Texas to buy land so he can hunt without a lease.
Posted By: Stub

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 10:42 PM

Originally Posted by ducknbass
Dang I spent 30 minutes today arguing with a guy from cedar Creek. That's how boring my job is. Literally cedar Creek next I'll get bored and try and sell tooth paste in Quinlan


Found a toothbrush to put the paste on grin

[Linked Image]
Posted By: Stub

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 10:45 PM

Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Do any of you have any thoughts on why this is not a bad idea - without resorting to name-calling?



[Linked Image]
Posted By: don k

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 11:16 PM

Quit feeding him. Stay quiet and he will go away.
Posted By: tlk

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 11:17 PM

.............
Posted By: Pitchfork Predator

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/19/19 11:28 PM

Originally Posted by don k
Quit feeding him. Stay quiet and he will go away.


He got the boot for two weeks so we won't be hearing from him for a while......... clap
Posted By: don k

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/20/19 12:00 AM

Thanks to whoever cut the cord.
Posted By: Txduckman

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/20/19 05:39 AM

Originally Posted by Creekrunner
Originally Posted by Txduckman
Don't worry, land access will be AirBnB soon...

https://outdooraccess.com/#/


"Slick" website. I couldn't help noticing on the nice lady LO's testimonial - "and you get a nice check in the mail." roflmao Classic. What could possibly go wrong?


And colt45 - Where in the state did someone pay $40K an acre for 300?


So these guys contacted a friend of mine who sent this to me and wanted to meet Texas landowners. I know they are good business folks but managing wildlife is not done in a spreadsheet. I said sorry, all land is leased or privately hunted already in Texas and I would not recommend any landowners to talk with them. He knew it already. We already have private fishing clubs, plenty of places to camp and the hunting thing has been tried several times. Hell, our own members can light urn pile without catching the place on fire. flame


And yes, I did the calculations on that land as well!! Must have been leasing cow pasture and at Legacy and the Tollway. hammer


Y'all stop talking prices. Our landowner might see this. We pay once a year and never cross paths. Don't even have a piece of paper. Never seen one in 10 years.

There are leases out there. It is who you know though... Most don't want to pay the money even if it is $6.5 an acre and you get a section and MLD tags... I don't either until it is time.
Posted By: Erathkid

Re: Is it Purely a Supply vs Demand Issue - 02/20/19 03:58 PM

Originally Posted by regularguy11B
Originally Posted by The Zen Master
Eventually, greed will kill Texas hunting.

Patriotic Texas business owners and land owners will continue to put their own self-interests first and hire low wage illegal alien labor that won't talk back (new democrat voters), and/or sell their land to the highest bidder from Kalifornia (more democrat voters), and then complain about what "liberals" are/have done to Texas when those democrat voters elect Beto and/or Bernie Sanders.

If people really cared about the issue they would be talking about ways to acquire excellent hunting land and convert it to State Parks or National Forests - for the benefit of future generations.

And that, gentlemen, is the underlying principle of my original inquiry.



When you work hard your whole life to buy a piece of land to retire on, and are forced to lease your legacy out to ungrateful people because your property taxes are too high to just retire in peace, you can talk about greedy landowners.




I couldn't have said it better. Property taxes are too friggin' high.
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