Wind turbines on ranches

I've been approached to put 2-4 wind turbines on my 355 acre ranch in Eastland county. If you are a landowner and currently have turbines on your property, I'd appreciate your input on if you feel it's worth it or not (impact on the land, resale value, etc). My ranch is used exclusively for recreation (hunting, fishing, etc). The upside is it would essentially pay my monthly note for me.

It would definitely turn me off from buying your land if you sold. I wouldn't want them on my land.

We hunt in Comanche Co.
A few years ago there were none and the next season they were everywhere. Our land owner didn't want them on his place. If you don't your neighbor will and you will have to look at them and hear the wind noise for free. Never noticed any real issues.

Reminds me of a discussion about an antenna, and if you didn't like the companies offer you might get to look at the antenna on your neighbors property and not get anything for it.

If it pays the bills for the ranch I'd seriously consider it.

They clear a lot of land to place each one.
By the time their done placing 2-4 wind turbines on your land you may not have much cover for the wildlife

I came off of a 7000 acre ranch near Sweetwater that had 27 turbines. On the plus side, you get great roads and a good income stream. Also the deer will pay absolutely no attention to them after an adjustment period. We had several in a 300 acre wheat field and if we drove up while deer were in the field, the deer would trot over behind one of the turbines and peek around it at us. On the negative side, they really detract from the aesthetics of the land. They're noisy as heck. They break down constantly, meaning you'll have a steady stream of repair people going to them. And in the winter when it's sleeting or freezing rain you have to watch out for large sheets of ice being thrown off of the blades like rocks from a catapult. I watched one sheet that probably weighed 10 pounds fly a couple of hundred feet through the air before it landed. Also be sure to check your contract with the wind company to make sure there isn't a "no hunting within X yards of a turbine" clause. We didn't have one but I have heard that different companies have different policies about hunting nearby.

It's either your place or the neighbors. Either way you'll have to look at them. Might as well make money on them.

How much do they clear, a couple acres for each?

As everyone said the game don't care. You will have to look at them as your neighbor will most likely do it. I've heard that you can get 8K to 10K per year per turbine in South Dakota. Not Bad. Does the income go to the next land owner if you decide to sell? If so you could charge big premium to next land owner. Not a bad thing that has landed on your doorstep.

I'm being told about $12k/year per turbine. Yes, the wind rights would transfer.

I have to agree with this.

You know what I would do. You have the information to do what's best for you. Good post.

if the rent pays for the land, then the land is free to you --------------- I"ll take free land all day long.

This is a wind turbine around Arbuckle Mountains in Oklahoma!

So it looks like they cleared maybe 5 acres there? That isn't too terrible for 12k a year. I'll take that all day long.

Agreed. I just passed on buying a great place because it had a cell antenna on it. Real eye sore. And, even worse, the current owner had taken a "cash buy out" so the antenna lease was no longer paying each month. Agent said he'd be lucky to get 50% of market value for the place because of it.

If you will keep your place forever, may not matter to you. If resale is important, I'd darn sure run the numbers on monthly income vs impact to Future Value of your property.

You will hear them and feel the rotor wash, vibration from quite a distance. If they fail while turning they can throw a blade a mile or more, we know a ranch that found one , a blade, on his ranch from a turbine a mile away off of his property.

We have one, they only clear 1-2 acres. Our neighbor got 6, other got 3, other got 5. One of them is 30 feet from the fence-they should have put it in our place and given us 2, we got hosed on that deal and two transmission lines.

If you don't get them, your neighbor will and you'll get all the problems without the payout. You pretty much have to do it.

Deer don't mind them one bit and unless you live on the property it's not a big deal. Even then I bet you get used to it in a hurry.

I have a friend in the panhandle and he gets $6,000 per year per turbine.

PM me his number and he can put them on my place in Archer County!

Better than a oil or gas well.

We bought hunting land in north. Brown County at the first of the year,the man showing us the land said he could show us other places that were for sale that was more acreage an cheaper but the neighbors had wind turbines an the value had dropped almost 25%

Sounds about right on spacing. New ones are being spaced 1 turbine per quarter section.
Biggest thing is make sure you have reclaimation bond set up.

I just did a big analysis on my ranch turbine vs solar panels. Solar pulled out after trump got elected so wind won, lol. We went turbine

I can't stand the sight of them. I might let them on my place if it was inevitable I was going to have to put up with them anyway. But I would be selling and finding me another place after they went up. They better pay a bunch because they have to wreck the heck out of your land value. Especially for smaller rec tracts.

Glad my place will never have them.

Wonder what would happen to these turbines if the subsidies were to ever go away?

We would have more clean coal and NG planets.

My ranch is getting turbines to meet green energy requirement for the South East US..... 1500 miles of transition lines. Dumb. But what ever

500' in every direction-no build. The gravel road they build is one of the best. Noise is not a problem. Size matters on the turbine vs how much money you get.

In regards to Subsidies in South Dakota, the company that pays the initial capital for the turbines and roads and such are getting subsidies. What happens after that is they will sell everything to another company. It's an incentive to get wind up and running. A lot of times the same company will keep the investment.

If you don't agree with the installation when they are interested, you can bet they will approach your neighbors.

Heck no

What does the taxes do to you on your place when you have turbines?
I know you still can keep ag not sure about wildlife, just curious. They get 5-10 year tax break when installed from county.

Oil and gas wells deplete in a year

https://stopthesethings.com/2017/05/09/m...pulsing-shadow/

If it pays the note why not do it and put your current payment into a new place? Seems like youre on the cusp of having 710 acres, half pristine and half w a few eye soars

Exactly what I was thinking.

Read the contract very well. My uncle decided it wasnt worth it after reading. A lot of verbage pertaining to how much pay he would receive annually.

I work in the wind industry.

Typically, we clear about 2 acres for the pad. You can ask if they will build a smaller pad. We have some that are about an acre and the farmer plants right up to it.

On the payments, some companies offer a fixed annual payment or an annual royalty based on that turbine performance. Bigger risk/reward based on royalties. I've seen the annual payments be in the $5000-$10,000/turbine range. I've seen royalties up to $20,000 acres.

The Production Tax Credit (subsidy) goes away in 2020. Right now wind and solar are at about the same cost of energy as natural gas and it gets cheaper every year to build and operate wind farms.

Never heard of a blade being thrown a mile. Sounds like an anti-wind old wives tale.

Also, there should be no turbines built within 1.1 times the height of a property line. That is a typical setback in the industry.

As yes, you're neighbor will take the turbines if you don't want them.

I have seen no wildlife impacts on a property based on wind turbine placement. Wind turbines help a lot of ranchers and farmers stay on their land. The local communities and school districts also receive alot of tax revenue.

Good info there^

If a well depletes in a year, it was a really dumb operator that drilled it! Good production will last many, many years. I know, I'm in the bidness!

Yea, I worked on a lot of stripper wells over the 35 years in the service industry. Plus I have Royalty on some wells. Over head can eat a operator up, hauling salt water, electric bills, pumpers, pump replacements, work over rigs etc. The wind chargers just keep turning and land owners average 800 bucks per month. Flush production from a new well looks great but unless it's in a hot area it can be tough. If buying working interest in wells you better know the operator real good because some will operate you to death.

when the government subsidies quit, how much will they pay a year or month?

The turbine was on a ridge, Foote Creek in Wyoming and that sure helped it travel such a distance, documented. Looks like a tower failure somehow due to the high winds and blade failure.





2011

the subsidy is in the build. Better question is or will there be an interest in replacing them after thier useful life with out susbidies

No way, and from a real estate standpoint it devalues your land even more.

Wind turbines are a plague on the landscape

Not better that oil--but it is $, for the next 40 years.

Most studies use a life span of 20-25 years, so 40 years may be an overestimate.

The reclamation bond, IMHO is the most important aspect. If they pay for your ranch for the next 20 years, that's great, but you don't want to get stuck paying to get it back to how you want it for the 20 years after they're done with it.

Have you seen the copper and metal in that gizmo? $$$-also, what a great deer blind.

I fought a farm coming in around me with an attorney until two of my neighbors next to me rolled over. I dont have any on my land but do get an annual royalty. Dont expect to ever get more than 7K a year from a turbine, no matter what the Wind land man tells you. Cant stand them and have been on again and off again about selling my place. The worse scenario is when there is just barely enough wind to turn them because they are at a higher elevation but it feels/sounds calm at ground level. Sounds like listening to a babys heart beat on a sonogram cranked up to about 80 decibels (the closest one from the ranch house is about 1200 feet). Figured it dropped selling price of my place around $250K

Interesting no more then 7k? Regardless of contract?

I have talked to three other folks that have leases in three different parts of Texas (two that I quail hunt on) and we all average about the same depending on what KW are going for. One has 22 turbines and it was the same deal, told him 10K to 12K a year and really gets between $5.5K and $7K a year per turbine. That revenue sticks with the land as well if you sale the property, not like minerals where you can typically keep a healthy percentage. Those other three had wheat fields or mesquite scrub country so they didnt get devalued that much, so their break even is less than 10 years on property value drop.

Oh I’m familiar with turbines,

Funny I have two that have produced since 1984.
There are wells around all over Texas that have produced since the 50s.

22 turbines at $6k a year each is $132k a year in income. I would think that level of passive income would make the property more valuable. If an investor was looking at a 10% return it would make the property worth $1.32 million not counting any land value. 10 year break even seems a little off unless it dropped the value by $1.5 Million which seems hard to believe.

I'll admit I don't know anything about how the process would work....Am I missing something?

Don't forget about the declining value of the dollar. $7000/yr. will be worth about $3500/yr in 10 years time and $1750/yr in 20 years time.

Inflation is not a consideration when determining ROI as the initial invested dollars undergo the exact same devaluation over time.....and inflation is only 2-3% per year.

The windmill people put a clause in the contract that increases the payout every 5 years.

But there are no invested dollars (on the part of the landowner) are there? I am just pointing out that if X seems like a nice figure NOW, it won't seem so much 10 or 20 years from now, in terms of purchasing power.

But apparently there is some inflation adjustment built in.

I know four people that have sold their property and kept the "wind rights". And yes that has held up in court.
So the revenue from the windmills now rarely goes with the land but is held separate just like minerals.
I find the idea that one can hold rights on the wind but they can.

Where would a person look to find a property with active windmill payouts or leases?

After the lifespan or term is expired does the company take them down?

I’m just considering the fact the landowner paid X for their property. I’m not sure how it works but interested because it seems like it could be a viable investment opportunity, but I agree the purchasing power of the generated revenue will decrease over time.

Most folks who have turbines on their land are long term ranching families. I have dealt with some that are the original homesteading family. I rarely see land with turbines that are for sale. Plus, most places with wind turbines are large properties.

There is a decommissioning plan for each wind farm. It usually has to be filed with the county with a bond to cover costs if the wind farm operator is not around in 30 years.

Technically there is because you are taking Land out of production, livestock or Farm
I’m going to be hard pressed to make 7k+ per acre on corn, wheat, cattle, especially when corn has half the buying power today as it did in 1960.

At 300 bushels an acre corns going to have to Net almost $23 a bushel, ya if that happens we got bigger problems

The biggest farm going in currently is the Panhandle. Good luck it’s a gold mine for use.

Thanks for the info. Sounds like they don't come for sale often.....and that's a long ways from home.

Ya, you can find some CRP/pasture stuff every now and then. Crop land is expensive. I’m in the process of doing a Land swap on 80 acres for substation/offices. I can tell you wind leases have not caused a decrease in land prices up there.

Same distance for me