Swaro Scope with Ballistic Turrets

Does anybody have any experience or feed back with this product?

I have a friend that switched his Swaro BRX reticle scopes over to the Ballistic Turrets. He really likes them now. I was thinking of doing Swaro on the .280 I have after talking to him about the ballistic turrets.

The new ballistic turrets are pretty nice very simple to use. Buddy picked one up and I played with it out to 400

Will be my next scope, and trying to find out if I can send my z3/av and get them added

Should be able to is what my buddy told me. He sent his scopes back. He has his turrets on his Z-6's for his 300RUM and 22-250 made to 700 yds more or less depending on the caliber. He did some of his other Swaros also just not sure which scopes they were.

Glad to hear this

Got 2 Z5s.
Great results.
Easy to use.

Have a z5 3.5-18 and love it. I have two custom turrents for 0ft elevation and 10k foot.

something you may like is the swaro reticles on the z5 are real fine

Have a Z6 2.5-15 with the target turrets, very nice and repeatable. With the current setup can get to almost 900 yards from it and the 6.5-284. One thing the cross hairs are very fine in this scope, great for targets but almost too fine for very dim light shooting at hogs.

Mil or MOA turrets are ballistic turrets. What's wrong with those?

New Swaro is lower profile and can be pre set to any caliber or have custom turret made.

Custom turret made? Based on what information? BC, MV, zero range, conditons at zeroing including Baro, Temp, Humidity, Density Altitude, Altitude?

All of those factors need to be known when zeroing then when they change it must be factored in when shooting distance. Most effecient bullets will be consistant up to 500 yards no matter the difference in conditions from zeroing conditions. However, if you live in most parts of Texas except the panhandle you need to factor those conditions. So if you zero at home and decide to go on an antelope hunt north of Amarillo or an elk hunt anywhere elk live, your turrets will not be correct anymore. The conditions out west allow bullets to fly more effeciently.

Custom made turrets are a way for scope manufacturers to part the uneducated from their money. When you are in Mils or MOA you adjust atmospherics for your current conditons and you now have a correct hold or elevation dial for your conditions, not the conditions the day you zeroed the rifle. I've seen this in action with .22-250, .308, .260, 7 Rem Mag, 7 Short Mag.

Heck last weekend my .260 that is usually supersonic to 1450 yds (at home) was supersonic to 1550 yards in the morning and that increased as the temp and DA increased. More importantly my dope for 600 to 1230 changed. So the dope used in the morning wasn't the same that afternoon due to environmental conditions changing.

You want custom turrets? Buy some of the small sticky arrows and attach them to a Mil or MOA turret. Label them for what ever increment you want.

Ok its a hunter friendly turret system. Not your 1200 yard sniper turret. And a lot more accurate then ballistic reticles

The factory turret is easily changed or adjusted

but there are mfg's that will make turrets for different elevations etc, he has two1000'
And 9000'

The one I played with was on a 270wby and it was a simple adjustement from 1-600yards. I took it 100-400 yards and no problem keeping it in a 5" circle at 400. Think my group was actually 4.75....my cousin group was 5" at 600 yards



Factory



http://www.swarovskioptik.us/en_us/products/ballistic-turret

http://ballisticprograms.swarovskioptik.com/index_mobile.html

"Custom turret made? Based on what information? BC, MV, zero range, conditons at zeroing including Baro, Temp, Humidity, Density Altitude, Altitude? "


Yes
alt
Bc
Pressure
Humidity
Temp
Mv
Zero

I was just trying to make a suggestion. It may work fine, but those of us that are serious distance shooters use Mil or MOA, most are in Mil. A Mil is a Mil no matter where on the planet you go, and ballistic calculators speak in Mils or MOA so adjusting for your location and current condition takes seconds.

I am a hunter. I got into long range shooting via predator hunting with a .22-250. I wanted to learn how to make a solid kill as far as I could see the coyote, the rest snowballed. When I am practicing I am making myself a more effective hunter. I get much satisfation out of killing hogs and coyotes farther than most hunters can. Through December and January my kills were on coyotes at 400 yds, 335 yds, 445 yds, and a hog at 300. Just because our military kills men at distance, with Mils, doesn't mean we can't kill varmints and hogs at distance with the same system.

Please don't think I'm bashing on your product. I am simply trying to show you what I and thousands of other hunters think is a better way. Take that as you wish, sir.

Not my product......I wish I owned swaro.... cause if I did we would be having lots of fun.

As I said its a very simplistic turret system that is easily adjusted.

You can use as moa if you want

While on the Swaro topic what does the Zero point adjustment mean i have a Z3 4x12x50. First one i ever could afford love it.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Returnable to zero with a hard stop. On the Swaro target turrets you take the turrets off, zero the scope than put them on. The rings you drop on from your calculated/or shot dope for the different yardages with a nice color dot and raised portion to indicate yardage. Nice setup for sure.

Much better system for hunters than MIL/MOA for under 600 yards.

Yelp^^^^
On the regular turret. If you pull up on it it frees it up and you can move the moa hashes to zero. Then push it back down and it has clicks/moves reticle again

Based on what information? I can guarantee you Swaro uses Mils or MOA at their facility then dumbs down the turrets for "hunter friendly" turrets. What do the Hunters Of Men use? Mils.

It is nothing more than a trig function. The farther away from the rifle the more vertical distance the Mil or MOA represents. It is very easy to convert to inches (if you're curious), but you can't see inches in a scope only the trig function if Mil or MOA. Once someone learns how to use one or the other they never use anything else.

I've taken enough hunters/ shooters out that have been doing it longer than I've been alive and see them become very proficient using Mils or MOA in a few hours. They made shots tighter than they thought they could and much farther than they ever have before.

I have 5 hunting rifles all wearing a Mil/ Mil scope. It is not rocket surgery to use one.

in a hunting situation would you rather turn to the appropriate color or figure out mils? which do you think would take longer.

I don't have to figure out Mils. I did that first, by inputting the data into a calculator. I use one that is free www.jbmballistics.com/trajectory I have "Shooter" on my phone, and now I have a Kestrel 4500 with Horus ballistics. I figured out the Mils based on the calculator, took calculated trajectory and confirmed it on the range. Adjust as needed. By adjust, if calculated does not match actual field trajectory, DOPE, you increase or decrease MV or BC.

I also have a printed charts in 25 yard increments. Looks like this.

Yards Elevation (Mils)

50 .3
75 0
100 0
125 0
150 .1
175 .3
200 .4
225 .6
250 .7
275 .9
300 1.1
325 1.2
350 1.4
375 1.6
400 1.8
425 2.0
450 2.3
475 2.5
500 2.7

I could go on well past a half mile with this. This is the trajectory for today's conditions. If the temp and DA increase it will be slightly different, and it is noticed around 400 yards.

No, I would not dial to a color that is an approximate. The scope has numbers on the turrets, it isn't hard to dial to a number. One won't take longer than the other, but I can assure you I have a much smaller margin for a botched shot.

Saturday I was hunting with a friend. We were on a hillside and glassing for hogs and coyotes in west Texas. He spotted a hog, I found it in the scope, I said "range it" he reported 300 yards. I was already dialed for 530 yards (2.7 Mils), I dialed down to 300 yards (1.0 Mil), got a sight picture on a walking hog, and made the shot right where I wanted it. That all took a few seconds. 99.9% of the time I hunt alone. I glass with my range finder, I range the animal, I dial to the corresponding Mil setting and make red mist. I've taken 4 animals in two months doing this very thing. Nothing less than 300 yards.

it would still be easier to turn the dial to red

or green

or even yellow

Are those every hundred yards? What happens when you need something between them. Are you going to have to carry a chart to tell you what each color means? Can you see those colors in low light?

No you can set them to any range you want using any ballistics soft ware or swaro's program. And you can adjust if you want. Same as using a mil or moa turret. or you can get any turret you want made for it.

If you can't see them in low light then you don't need to shooting that far.

At least look at the links to have a better understanding of them

"If you can't see them in low light then you don't need to be shooting that far."

I guess you've not predator hunted at night?

All my life.. You got a light that works out to 400-600 yards that works well enough to completely identify the animal?

And what is beyond the target?

I still like the Swaro scope with the colored turrets, at my age and eyes plus refusing to wear Bifocals, reading those colors on the turrets is a lot easier than reading numbers. As far as those inbetween ranges the turrets have very distinct clicks for each step up so easy to count them for the inbetween ranges to apply your dope just like with the turrets with numbers on them.

No light that works to 400 yards. I still dial for 200 to 300 though.

I think y'all like the pretty colors. Numbers must seem too scientific.

I will add my take on this.

For a true long range rig, from 500 to 1k or beyond I absolutely believe in a FFP scope and a mil/mil scope. I tape a cheat sheet from 250 to 1k in 50 yard increments and a 10mph crosswind to the stock of my gun. That data is an average of where/when I shoot most of the time.

For hunting, I go back and forth.

Dialing is definitely the most precise.
And I generally prefer a "tactical" scope in FFP, mil/mil.
Not a fan of BDC reticles in general.

Having a turret with yardage markers or indexes with your load data is great for the average hunter shooting out to say 4 hundred (which lets be honest is FAR for most hunters) works great because the environmental changes don't really effect bullet path THAT much at these distances.

It is easy and fast.

I used a Zeiss FL last year with a custom turret, sort of as an accident. They sent me one for review that have a 7mag 150g turret that pretty much lined up with my 280AI 140g load out to 500. I liked that turret a lot because I would keep it at a 250 yard zero setting which kept me good from 50-300 for fast shots.

Past that or if I had time I could pull up and dial in exactly say 375 or 150.

Simple and it worked.

A mil based scope isn't any harder if you have a little cheat sheet, range, 350, look at chart, dial. But it does take an extra second or two which can be a big deal on a big buck crossing an opening and disappearing into the trees.

I also will admit to totally screwing up recently.
Had some hogs out about 300 yards, got lined up, put the crosshair behind the ear and squeezed the trigger.

Was quite perplexed as to why it didn't drop.
Then I realized I had the turret set for a 500 yard shot as I had been at the range a few days before and just brainfarted on not checking before I shot. Luckily it was just a hog not the buck of a lifetime.

That's human error and not the fault of the gear or the type of setup. But it does reinforce my preference to hunt with a really flat shooting rifle (I had the 308 out that day) and running standard scope with no dials to screw up with.

I worked up the data with a Meopta 3-12 scope for my 280AI and feel confident out to 450 with this setup and no dials.

Fireman.
Your system works for you.
The BT is fairly simple to use for general hunting.
Does either work ?Yes
Is each pretty simple to figure out? Yes
Chevy? Ford? Dodge? Toyota?....you pick
Both " work"
To each his own.

if your any good at predator hunting then all of your shots are below 100 yds

I dont have to make ajustment to 300. I hold dead on. If you have to make more then a 2" adjustment ya might need a flatter caliber

Ha!

I'm a better shooter than a caller. Before I was able to put lead on fur, as far as I can now, we have been busted farther than 100 yards. Once we see wide set eyes (coyote) I'm looking through the scope for a body. Narrow set eyes (bobcat) are given more time, because they take more time to come in. In either case once I have a shot it is taken. Having calves and kids (goats) killed, and injured, has ticked us off for so many years that I wanted to be able to kill anything than came close enough to get a shine on their eyes. And its not hard to miss a bobcat outside 150 yards or a coyote outside 200. That is why I want a precise dial point on the turret.

Thats going to caught up to you sooner or later at night. But thats your own deal and if you feel comfortable shooting that far at night so be it

I thought .22-250 was flat. My .260 holds about the same trajectory to 400, but its a bit much for a bobcat.

Inches are irrelavent. Everyone touts shot placement, well that's what I'm doing, making very good shot placement. Last week I was at a bud's range, we started at 430 yds and went to 1280. We changed locations and could see some different targets (canyons). He described were another target was, I found it, he told me it was 302 yards. He hit it, then I hit it. I didn't really think to measure its size before engaging it. After I hit it he told me it is 3" in diameter. That's pretty tight shooting, which is what predator shooting is all about.

Don't even get me started on prarie dog pups, they're bitzy small, especially outside 200 yards.

Have you done any reach on the swaro yet?

I know what you're meaning. We make those shots in a known location with plenty of trees and berms as a backstop and cattle at our 6 o'clock. I wouldn't dare make those shots where there was a chance of hitting a person, a structure, or livestock. I don't want that on my conscious.

I had the video pulled up on the computer at the station last night and right away another Fireman came in asking me about the value of a rifle he was thinking of buying, then we got a call. So, not yet.

just saying

I just watched the 8 minute video. As I suspected, that is a 1/4 MOA turret dumbed down. Its a gimmick, but if you like it, by all means use it. They could take their perdy colored dots off and replace it with a 1/4 MOA turret with numbers and hash marks, and you have the same system, but only better.

Fine duplex reticle? So you have very little reference point in the reticle to know what wind you're holding. I guess wind doesn't exist in Swarovski's world. No way would a hunter need to account for wind ouside 100 yards. Especially at 400 yards.

Mil/ Mil or MOA/ MOA is far better. I'm sticking to my guns, sorry.

There is nothing wrong with MIL/MOA. My turrets on my Z5 are custom made to my gun with 100,150,200...550,600 yard markings. I can dial in the middle of the mountains with no drop chart when my hands are so cold I can barely feel the trigger squeeze. If you are shooting beyond 300 yards you REALLY need to practice and any system will fail when the trigger is jerked.

How about this... Lets go to the mountains at 13k feet in waist deep snow. Leave your gear with the horses and you just have your rifle while stalking. As you crest the apex, Ibex scatter and you not only have to range them, judge them and pick a good one, but they move again and were at 300 but are now at 400 in a matter of 20 seconds.

Would you rather fumble with a chart or dial and shoot.

I used my turret, and was pleased with the results. My range finder on the other hand... It was total crap in the blinding snow.

I don't fumble with anything. I happen to keep a 100 yard increment chart in my ocular scope cap.

But since you mentioned 300 yards, I have memorized 1.0 Mil. You also memorized 400 yards, I have memorized 1.8 Mil

If I didn't I could put stickers or a dab of paint on my 100 yard increments. The reason I have those memorized is because I put a thousand rounds a year through that rifle. So I get my practice, and I'm well aware of trigger control.

FiremanJG,

I'm not saying its the best option for you, but for many others it is. When my dad borrows my gun, he doesn't need to know my load and caliber, just dial. Most hunters shoot 10 or so times a year, if that. They don't put 1000s of rounds down the chamber. You can go to snipers hide forum and get a lot of people to agree with you.

Kevin

You're making my point for me. Your dad wouldn't need to know any of your ballistic information with a Mil or MOA scope either. Color the corresponding Mil or MOA line yourself and you have the same thing Swaro is doing.

All I'm saying is it is a gimmick to separate hunters from their money. And it gives them a false sense of security since there is no attention given to the reticle for windage.

Contrary to some people's belief the Mil or MOA reticle (not even talking turrets now) is not just for ranging. In fact most of us rarely use it for that. The subtensions on the horizontal bar are for wind holds and they are vital. DOPE is recorded, maintained, and memorized for wind holds. Another reason I hate BDC reticles, they give a false sense of security.

Oh, and I am a member of that forum, I've made many friends there, learned volumes, and compete in matches that are posted there. But no matter, distance shooting is distance shooting and it is more important to be a capable shooter when taking game than it is punching paper or ringing steel. We owe it to the animals we hunt.

if they only shoot 10 rounds a year they do not have any business shooting ranges that require anything more than a simple crosshair. Very few are the shooters that shoot 10 rounds a year and can reliably hit a 9 inch plate every time at 300 yards from field positions encountered on most hunts

Kmom1,

I agree, but it happens a lot.


Fireman,

If you think it's best, go for it. It's the exact same system, just a different way to present it. Swarovski isn't the only one that does this, so does Leupold (CDS). I haven't talked to a single person with the BT that didn't like it. I actually tried to get them to just make a MOA ring for me and they said "were working on it" but wasn't offered yet.

As far as windage, they have a 4W reticle but I haven't used it. Generally just hold.

What kmon1 said.

Holy frijoles!!!

A price tag of over $2000! You've got to be kidding me!

Not all of them have a Mil or MOA reticle, not all have side focus, you only have four colored rings for only four dial points. A fool and his money are soon departed. With $2000 to play with I could buy another SS 5-20X Mil/ Mil FFP, or a Vortex Viper PST Mil/ Mil FFP, still have enough money to buy all the components to load 500 rounds of match ammo, plus the powder and primers to load 500 more.

My main point is not weather the scope works. Sure it does, it is an MOA turret. My point is you're not getting much bang for your buck.

Spectators are always welcome at a tactical match, which is the best match to shoot for hunters. Since you will be in more field posistions than you will ever shoot while hunting. I invite you to come to one and watch how the guys work with Mil/ Mil or MOA/ MOA. It all happens very fast. I also invite you to take note of the scops being used. You will not find a Swaro, a Leupold, or a Zeiss. If you do it will be a rare instance.

My rifle weighs 5lbs and my scope is 15 oz, and cost WAY less than 2000, try 50% of that. The scopes you listed weigh 2lbs. That is ridiculous for a mountain rifle. I had a hard enough time justifying 15oz but the 3.5-18 range is perfect for my use.

You talk to me like I'm am idiot because I don't share your opinion so I'm done talking with you. You talk like I don't know what people use at "tacticool" events or
I've never read for hours on MOA/MIL or shot using it. I dont feel insecure about my opinion but apparently you do. I use factory ammo too! *shock*

I think cds systems are fine inside of 400yards past that small changes can be the difference between a gut shot and a clean shot.

They do offer a reticle with tick marks for windage.

The marked yardage custom turret is a nice clean option and it does simply work.

The Swaro glass is as good as it gets and the scopes are a lot lighter than tactical scopes. The Z3 especially is a damned good deal.
My brother runs the z3 3-10 with the BRH reticle on his 25-06 and loves it.
Great glass, light and compact.

Wow! Wear your feelings on your sleeve? This is a friendly debate, and you're getting mad. That's the first step to losing the debate.

The Swaro is an MOA turret dressed differently, plain and simple. And many folks won't admit that. If you are effective with it, in Texas or in the mountains, good for you. I hope every animal you make a shot at causes you no tracking. I take shots, outside 200 yards, on animals very seriously. And this optic does not seem to be worth what they are fetching. That's my main point.

While I agree the Z6 are expensive how is the Z3 and Z5 overpriced?

Were talking about the "ballistic turret". The least expensive Z3 I found that has that turret is $1059 from SWFA. There are wind hold lines, but the description didn't mention what those meant, Mil or MOA. I know Swaro glass is very good, I have the 8 x 30 Laser Guide (don't like the aiming reticle) but for glassing an area I don't need binocs, I just use the range finder to look around. But these days awesome glass without many mechanical advantages in the scope won't cut it in my book.

I think for $1059+ there are better options for 400 yard+ scopes.

I'm not mad, I just think your opinion and attitude lack respect for the "other side." How often have you traveled with that $400 Vortex PST to areas so remote it would be impossible to replace it if/when it fails? Have a horse fall on it while in the scabbard and confidently shoot it 2 hrs later? Swarovski scopes can take a beating, they are the full package for hunting. Great build quality, great optics, light weight. They aren't tactical. On anything except my mountain rifle, I shoot Zeiss Conquest because for texas hunting under 300 yards they are best bang for the buck IMO.

I don't see how I lack respect for "the other side" or anyone else. I don't know all there is to know about this subject. I constantly seek information hoping to learn something new. Typically I pull a 5% to 10% usage out of the recorded information I watch or read. I learn from other shooters more than anything. But I can say this. I shoot far more than your average hunter and I shoot much farther than your average hunter. Punching paper for load development or zeroing is a chore to me now. Hitting steel targets is practice for the times that I have hide in my sights. Most of the practice benefit is reading wind. The trajectory arc doesn't change much inside 500 yards, but accounting for wind is the real challenge. Getting out on the range in as many conditions as possible is the best practice for game day. Because of this mindset I havn't missed or gut shot an animal in several years. My opinion stems from taking the advice of those that came before me and putting it into practice. The natural order of things is to offer the same help to those that have more to learn. At least that is the way it is where I work. If you don't want to read or hear it, fine. But I think you're taking offense where you shouldn't.

A horse has never fallen on my rifle or scope. But if it did I would have to do all I could to check zero and tracking prior to shooting at an animal. But I can say if the zero was good, and the tracking wasn't I could still hold elevation instead of dialing it since I have the reticle that matches the turret.

We can agree most hunters don't practice enough.
Most LE aren't "gun guys" that shoot a lot either..

Whatever system you use you need to practice with it in varying conditions and really learn it if you are going to be shooting past 300.

100% agree!