Accuracy issue-need some help

Getting ready for my trip to Africa in a few weeks.

Took mine and my wife’s rifle to check zeros today

My .300 was dead on the money, putting two rounds close together

My wife has been shooting managed recoil hornadys in her 7mm-08 camila and it’s a pretty accurate combo.

Since she is going after a kudu and possibly Zebra, I decided to switch her to a stouter load, the only thing nosler had in stock was 140 grain E-tips. This should give 160 grain type performance, however this is throwing bullets all over the place. Worst I’ve ever seen.

Now this is an all copper load, which I’ve heard can be finicky, but anyone have any suggestions before I change ammo?

I should add that everything seems tight, scope rings, etc.

Specifically, what are the groups doing? shotgun pattern? How big a pattern? Stringing shots? Clean barrel, fouled in?

One shot will be dead on then two others will be 4” right and 2” high, then one 3” low and to the left .

Barrel was cleaned, has about 15 rounds down the tube

First thing I would do is run some of the original loads that shot well before through it. That will quickly tell you if something has gone wonky with the rifle or the scope.

I would try a different load.

If it groups one ammo or others well to me that rules out loose screws, scope issues bedding issues etc. doesn't sound like a gun problem, just that your rifle doesn't like that particular load. My 243 did the exact same thing with federal fusion.

What they said. If you have some ammo that you know works well in that rifle, then try that to see if it's just that one lot of ammo.

^^^This.

Unfortunately I didn’t bring any of the original ammo.

At bass pro now trying to find replacement rounds

This gun gets shot only a few times a year, year before last I sighted it in and it shot good groups. It has lived in the safe since then only being shot twice since, both at animals

I struck out at bass pro.

I looked on noslers website and saw they had 140 grain accubonds back in stock so I ordered 3 boxes...hopefully they get here before I leave the week after next. Those are what I wanted in the first place.

The e-tips probably would be ok on a 100-150 yard shot on a big animal..., but that accuracy was just unacceptable.

I’ve heard of rifles grouping that bad and heard copper ammo being finicky but that is just ridiculous


Chevy,

I had very poor results from fusion ammo in .22-250.

Great bullet performance but horrible accuracy. We limit shots to 100 yards with them
.

One thing that I learned when changing from standard bullets to solid copper was to clean the barrel back down to bare steel. A general cleaning will still leave some copper deposits in the very small tooling marks left over from rifling. You need to get them out.

A stout cleaning with Sweets should get you there.

I’ll give it a good cleaning when I get home. But I’m gonna stick with non-copper loads if I have a choice

Check the guard screws behind the trigger guard and on the fore end.
Are you using Tally mounts?
If using Leupold with the wind age screws make sure neither side is broken.

thats just your typical 7-08 . ill never ever buy one again.

standard bullets are copper jackets, whether you use a cup and core or a solid copper makes no diference, your sending copper down the barrel. people make things more difficult than they are, neither require anything different in cleaning, both leave the same amount of the same substance "copper "

That's false. The lead bullets that are jacketed with copper have a totally different copper alloy than the solid copper bullets, like the Barnes. Yes, they will both leave copper fouling. But the solid copper bullets will foul up a barrel MUCH faster due to the difference in copper alloy used for the entire bullet.

Like Chad said, it is my understanding that the copper used in monometal bullets like barnes etc. are made of a somewhat softer alloy to reduce pressure and increase expansion/shock/down range performance. The softer alloy results in more fouling.

Copper bullets seem to shoot better with a jump or the bullet seated significantly off the lands.

Standard bullets are Gilding metal or an alloy of copper and zinc. Some bullets like GMX from Hornady are gilding metal whild Barnes bullets are copper and Swift bullets are another that are copper.

Copper is a softer metal than the alloy of copper and zinc. The softer metal does copper foul a barrel faster than the harder alloy. Barnes bullet company will tell you to clean all traces of fouling from you barrel before switching to their bullets for a reason.

.As far as 7mm-08 accuracy, I have owned 4 different ones over the years and one a Remington 700 was a poor shooter IMO about 2 MOA. Still have that one but it is on loan to a friend and they rarely shoot anything over 75 yards. The others sub MOA and one half MOA with the loads it likes.

If wanting to use factory loads 85, I would try some Federal Premium 140gr Accubond loads if you can find them.

kmon1. me and friends have been through about 10 or 12 7-08s all were horrible shooters and required handloading, 1 was a weatherby sub moa 1 was a remington that even went to hill country rifles for accurizing. still horrible with factory ammo. 140s always seem to shoot around the 2500fps mark and is my guess why hes having good luck with reduced loads. like i said we will never buy another one, i take that back one of my buddies that went through about 5 of them was suckered into a browning LMAO . once again he is not a happy camper, shoots horrible. him and his brother went to the creedmore both guns will shoot lights out with factory fodder.
dont solids have less bearing surface to contact rifling ? compared to cup and cores because of the rings

Some do and some do not, on the bearing surface of the bullets. barnes figured out th grooves drop pressure in the hard solid shank of the bullet. Something John Nosler figured out with his lathe turned partitions of the early years, he had a groove milled over the partition to reduce pressures.

I know you have had bad luck with the 7mm-08s and I can understand frustration but I cannot ay I have had the same experience. one factory load that was very bad in my rifles though when I tried it is the Hornady Superformance which shot more like a random buckshot pattern than a rifle from my rifles. The old Hornady light magnums were a half inch shoot in my 788 but the suerformance was lucky if it put 3 shots into 3 inches at 100 yards. A tech I talked with at Hornady admitted your rifle either likes that load or hates it. He said his own 7mm-08 and 308 hated it and 3 shot 4 inch groups were the norm for what he had tried.

I remember us having discussions in the past on the accuracy of the 7mm-08 and neither of us will change the others mind

kmon, what im getting at is less bearing surface leads to less copper fouling, yes or no. hard solid shanks ? you said copper is softer. why would a softer surface with less bearing surface cause pressure, weight being equal

I am not a handloader and I can't tell you why, but I know for certain the copper bullets create more pressure. That is why when you look at hot factory loads, the copper loads have less energy. I assumed it was a combination of bearing surface (longer than same weight lead) and the core being harder than lead. Assuming all bullets are being slightly squashed into the bore?

Forgive me i am applying common sense to something that may not have a thing to do with it.

When they started issuing the M855A1 round we started seeing M4's blow up a little more often. Usually from dumbasses never following proper clearing procedures after shooting sims, but there were a few that could only be attributed to over pressure. I was told my one of the investogators in the last incident, that the round could make pressures up to 20% higher that regular M855 green tip ball!

The only real difference was the lead free projectile. Longer, and harder. Some other differences like crimped primers and etc as well, but as far as I know they were supposedly loaded to the same velocity and the trajectory should be a very close match.

like i said you all make things more difficult than they are. theres not a lick of difference in a solid or a cup and core in a cleaning regiment or handloading. overpressure ? pffft till you have to bang a bolt open with a 2x4 you aint expierenced over pressure , youd have to use pistol powder to blow up a modern bolt gun

I put a wrench to the fore end screw and was able to get a 1/4 turn out of it, maybe a tad more. Maybe this will help.


we shot a steel target today and its def. kudu adequate for around 100-150 yards. She only has to shoot twice on this trip but my accubonds are supposed to get her Thursday for the 7mm-08 and we will take it from there

Interesting vanguard. I've had 6 7-08's and never had an issue getting great accuracy with a variety of powders and bullets. That cartridge is really hard to beat.

OP, those accubonds should work great. Good luck.

For the safety of this forum I hope this post can be deleted. Many of us remember the +++p 22 Hornet. By all means reload as you wish but please quit giving advice or opinions.

I just know every time I have loaded Barnes all copper they are a pain to clean all the copper from the barrel so I avoid them.

You may want to do a little research before you spout off your "wisdom".

its common knowledge that copper bullets have a higher pressure when loaded to the same specs as a traditional lead bullet. Loading manuals suggest backing off a max load when using copper bullets.



And I've never heard of a 7mm-08 being an inaccurate round. quite the contrary as a matter of fact.

I would question the rifles they are chambered in before the cartridge itself