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Leasing Question
#9170184
01/15/25 08:34 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 2,337
cleatas
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We hunt an area with largeeee wheat fields everywhere and we don't have a lot of land that's actually huntable, but we have enough and it's a fair price. My question is this, we are potentially going to be asked to take on close to 3k acres at let's say $20 an acre but half of that is wide open wheat field. Is it normal to pay the same $20 an acre for the 1,500 acres of wheat field that is completely useless to you? And no, the deer are not stacked in the wheat fields. Just wanted to see if anyone has had this scenario with that much open land.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9170187
01/15/25 08:38 PM
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 7,378
onlysmith&wesson
THF Trophy Hunter
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I don't think you can price a place based on acreage alone. You just have to look at it, consider EVERYTHING and come up with a fair price. If it's worth what they're asking they'll get and keep a group year after year. If it's not, they won't get it or if they do, the group will turn over yearly.
An unethical shot is one you take, that you know you shouldn't.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: onlysmith&wesson]
#9170190
01/15/25 08:40 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 2,337
cleatas
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I don't think you can price a place based on acreage alone. You just have to look at it, consider EVERYTHING and come up with a fair price. If it's worth what they're asking they'll get and keep a group year after year. If it's not, they won't get it or if they do, the group will turn over yearly. that's exactly what I said...I am trying to think of ways to explain that to the landowner if we can't afford to keep it because I promise you, he can lease it but they won't stay long at all and he's back to square one.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9170207
01/15/25 08:53 PM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 4,018
Texan Til I Die
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I hunted a 4 section place that was about 75% wheat fields. We paid the same per acre for all of it. But to be fair, the deer DID absolutely load up into the wheat. It wasn't unusual to count over 100 deer as the sun was coming up. Also had a lot of axis and blackbuck.
Silver spurs and gold tequila keep me hanging on. Pretty girls and old cantinas give me shelter from the storm.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: onlysmith&wesson]
#9170210
01/15/25 08:54 PM
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 9,704
freerange
THF Trophy Hunter
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I don't think you can price a place based on acreage alone. You just have to look at it, consider EVERYTHING and come up with a fair price. If it's worth what they're asking they'll get and keep a group year after year. If it's not, they won't get it or if they do, the group will turn over yearly. Good answer.
At some point in life its time to quit chasing the pot of gold and just enjoy the rainbow. FR Keep your gratitude higher than your expectations. RWH
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: Texan Til I Die]
#9170215
01/15/25 08:59 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 2,337
cleatas
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I hunted a 4 section place that was about 75% wheat fields. We paid the same per acre for all of it. But to be fair, the deer DID absolutely load up into the wheat. It wasn't unusual to count over 100 deer as the sun was coming up. Also had a lot of axis and blackbuck. This place/area is not that way at all...you may see 5-10 deer in a wheat field. The population of deer just isn't that great and there are zero exotics. The wheat is grown for him to graze cattle and its absolutely zero use as far as hunting goes.
Last edited by cleatas; 01/15/25 09:00 PM.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9170248
01/15/25 09:45 PM
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 7,378
onlysmith&wesson
THF Trophy Hunter
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Does it border your current leased property?
An unethical shot is one you take, that you know you shouldn't.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9170249
01/15/25 09:46 PM
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 5,165
TPACK
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No way I`d pay that price for what you described. You`ll have a revolving door of hunters every year that are not happy with the quality and number of deer for that much $$$$. They`ll be one and done and move on. I`ve been on a few of those places. Three that I can think of in my hunting lifetime. As soon as the season was over, I loaded my blind and feeder and never came back. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: onlysmith&wesson]
#9170377
01/16/25 12:45 AM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 2,337
cleatas
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Does it border your current leased property?
A portion does. The rest does not.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: TPACK]
#9170378
01/16/25 12:46 AM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 2,337
cleatas
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No way I`d pay that price for what you described. You`ll have a revolving door of hunters every year that are not happy with the quality and number of deer for that much $$$$. They`ll be one and done and move on. I`ve been on a few of those places. Three that I can think of in my hunting lifetime. As soon as the season was over, I loaded my blind and feeder and never came back. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. That’s the predicament with this whole situation. If he can make it worthwhile price wise then it’s fine but for the money I feel he’s fixing to come back with I’m sure we are gonna pack up and go too. And yes he will lease it but whoever gets it won’t stay long at all.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9170630
01/16/25 03:09 PM
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 7,378
onlysmith&wesson
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Does it border your current leased property?
A portion does. The rest does not. Decide what it's worth to you and talk it out. Forget about $/acre. I don't think about price per acre. I think about the experience I'll have there, ALL things considered.
An unethical shot is one you take, that you know you shouldn't.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9170636
01/16/25 03:19 PM
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 11,445
DQ Kid
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No way I`d pay that price for what you described. You`ll have a revolving door of hunters every year that are not happy with the quality and number of deer for that much $$$$. They`ll be one and done and move on. I`ve been on a few of those places. Three that I can think of in my hunting lifetime. As soon as the season was over, I loaded my blind and feeder and never came back. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. That’s the predicament with this whole situation. If he can make it worthwhile price wise then it’s fine but for the money I feel he’s fixing to come back with I’m sure we are gonna pack up and go too. And yes he will lease it but whoever gets it won’t stay long at all. I personally would not deer lease a place with majority or near majority of acreage in cultivation and damn sure would not pay 1:1 if for some reason I did. Deer will go into cultivation as hungry but ultimately they require brush cover to traverse through and bed in. Sounds like you may have previously kicked this conversation around with the LO, if so, how was it taken by him? If you haven't, I'd recommend simply having an honest discussion with him about it and your concerns. Maybe propose a 25-50% discounting per acre of a portion of the ag acreage. If he refuses to consider it, you may very well have your answer as to next steps of consideration.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9170673
01/16/25 04:10 PM
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Joined: Aug 2023
Posts: 18
Ranger Hunter
Light Foot
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Light Foot
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Id tell him, that you will pay $20 an acre, for the actual "huntable " acreage and that the rest of the plowed ground is useless to your group.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9170779
01/16/25 07:08 PM
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Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 375
Okie Newton
Bird Dog
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I think I agree with ranger!
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: Okie Newton]
#9170802
01/16/25 07:32 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 2,337
cleatas
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Id tell him, that you will pay $20 an acre, for the actual "huntable " acreage and that the rest of the plowed ground is useless to your group. I think I agree with ranger! I agree, we can try that route and we will, but i bet he says no. And also $15/acre...it's not worth $20 but if he agrees to paying for huntable land only and he is set on $20 then we may have to bite the bullet if we want a place to hunt. Has a small house on one of the places with kitchen, shower bunkroom, etc so it makes it a little more worth it. Its nothing fancy but damn sure beats having to deal with campers or motels
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9170818
01/16/25 07:55 PM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 725
JTS
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I would find it hard to say that wheat fields are worthless. They are a good food source for your deer to keep them healthy during some tough months of the year. My wheat fields get lots of deer that graze in them.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9170928
01/16/25 10:26 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 4,681
4Weight
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Id tell him, that you will pay $20 an acre, for the actual "huntable " acreage and that the rest of the plowed ground is useless to your group. I think I agree with ranger! I agree, we can try that route and we will, but i bet he says no. And also $15/acre...it's not worth $20 but if he agrees to paying for huntable land only and he is set on $20 then we may have to bite the bullet if we want a place to hunt. Has a small house on one of the places with kitchen, shower bunkroom, etc so it makes it a little more worth it. Its nothing fancy but damn sure beats having to deal with campers or motels Cleatas, that is what I was thinking, 15 for the whole deal or a combo of 20 on the cover and 12 on the wheat. Good luck..
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9170963
01/16/25 11:01 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 4,802
chalet
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Figure how many hunters you can hunt on it, multiply that by a fair rate per hunter and thats your price for the whole place.
I've got a smaller lease that per acre cost is pretty good but over half of it is mostly flat pasture with some light brush that doesn't hold deer. Because of that only three of us hunt( and we don't hunt a whole lot so it works) what should fit at least 4-5 guys so cost per hunter on the place is about the going average. We shoot very few deer and nothing very big so cost per deer I'd say is above average. That said I have a good time out there so it is what it is.
Last edited by chalet; 01/16/25 11:03 PM.
Shoot. Eat. Repeat.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9170975
01/16/25 11:16 PM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 8,635
Stompy
THF Trophy Hunter
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I don't see how the math works on this one. If I'm reading it right, 3000 acres at $20 per acre, but only 1500 acres is huntable due to 1500 acres of farmland? That's $60,000, 1500 acres is big enough for around 7 hunters, that's $8,571 per hunter.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: Stompy]
#9171112
01/17/25 02:27 AM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 2,337
cleatas
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I don't see how the math works on this one. If I'm reading it right, 3000 acres at $20 per acre, but only 1500 acres is huntable due to 1500 acres of farmland? That's $60,000, 1500 acres is big enough for around 7 hunters, that's $8,571 per hunter. Ok so we have 828 acres now…406 of that is wheat field…so for huntable land plus the house it’s costing us $38 an acre. If you price it in total then we are paying $20/acre for all of it plus the house. Yes the house accommodations have to count for something. I’m assuming the LO will want $20/acre for the whole 3,000 bc that is basically what he’s getting now. We made it work for now bc it’s all we could find so yes, your math is mathin just fine. And you’re also correct about price per hunter bc we cant put enough guys on it to make it affordable.
Last edited by cleatas; 01/17/25 02:29 AM.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: Stompy]
#9171123
01/17/25 02:47 AM
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 9,704
freerange
THF Trophy Hunter
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I don't see how the math works on this one. If I'm reading it right, 3000 acres at $20 per acre, but only 1500 acres is huntable due to 1500 acres of farmland? That's $60,000, 1500 acres is big enough for around 7 hunters, that's $8,571 per hunter. Well, i wouldnt put 7 guys on it, so thats about $17,142 per man…….
At some point in life its time to quit chasing the pot of gold and just enjoy the rainbow. FR Keep your gratitude higher than your expectations. RWH
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: freerange]
#9171125
01/17/25 02:49 AM
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Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 8,635
Stompy
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
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I don't see how the math works on this one. If I'm reading it right, 3000 acres at $20 per acre, but only 1500 acres is huntable due to 1500 acres of farmland? That's $60,000, 1500 acres is big enough for around 7 hunters, that's $8,571 per hunter. Well, i wouldnt put 7 guys on it, so thats about $17,142 per man……. I wouldn't either, I was just throwing some math out there.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: Stompy]
#9171145
01/17/25 03:10 AM
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Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 9,704
freerange
THF Trophy Hunter
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I don't see how the math works on this one. If I'm reading it right, 3000 acres at $20 per acre, but only 1500 acres is huntable due to 1500 acres of farmland? That's $60,000, 1500 acres is big enough for around 7 hunters, that's $8,571 per hunter. Well, i wouldnt put 7 guys on it, so thats about $17,142 per man……. I wouldn't either, I was just throwing some math out there. I know, but couldn’t resist. Besides, it took me so long to read the MD outfitter thread that I was about half asleep when I got to this one. Had to use my calculator on the math……… Alls good Stompy.
At some point in life its time to quit chasing the pot of gold and just enjoy the rainbow. FR Keep your gratitude higher than your expectations. RWH
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9171288
01/17/25 02:46 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 2,337
cleatas
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yall are both right and yea we had 7 guys and it hunted 7 just fine because this is not one place, its multiple different locations. It would be nice to not have 7 but we had to in order to afford it and also we were never all there at the same time. But sounds like ya'll are thinking the same way i was in regards to paying the same amount per acre for the large fields also.
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Re: Leasing Question
[Re: cleatas]
#9171300
01/17/25 03:10 PM
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Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 11,445
DQ Kid
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If me, think I'd posture it that the fields are simply "much less huntable acreage than the covered, brushy pastures" not that they're worthless. If he balks, maybe have him consider a scaled approach on those fields acreage, something like $20 per on first 400 acres, $15 per on next 400 acres and $10 -12 per on last 400+ acres and the $20 per on all wooded acreage. At least with that layout, he may feel you are fully valuing some of the fields, also reflecting you've put some real thoughts and effort into it...
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