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Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting #8976112 12/21/23 01:23 PM
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A wildlife expert has weighed in on an image purporting to show a big cat stalking the grounds near a home in Huntsville.


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A Texas man snapped a photo over the weekend of what he believes to be a black panther near his home. Walker County resident Jerel Hall said he found the large, black wild cat lurking on his property in Huntsville, located about 70 miles north of Houston, on Saturday. The photo shows what appears to be a dark-colored feline, bigger than a house cat, with a long tail.


https://www.chron.com/life/wildlife/article/black-panther-texas-18561035.php


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Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Tbar] #8976141 12/21/23 02:11 PM
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So not so much debunking on the part of the expert other than saying there is nothing from historic science to indicate this is a black panther and the tail doesn't look long enough. That is his whole argument and while not incorrect, he isn't really debunking anything other than saying the picture, by itself, doesn't meet level of detail necessary to make any sort of determination.


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Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Tbar] #8976153 12/21/23 02:29 PM
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It's easy to debunk something that doesn't exist.

Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Tbar] #8976195 12/21/23 03:26 PM
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The expert has spoken.

Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Wytex] #8976199 12/21/23 03:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Wytex
The expert has spoken.


I guess most everyone knows that except you. What a surprise. Here's something else for you to whine and cry about........ a chupacabra doesn't exist either.

Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Tbar] #8976205 12/21/23 03:35 PM
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I mean that one wasn't even tough. Besides the fact that no black mountain lions exist, that is an obvious feral cat.

Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Jgraider] #8976230 12/21/23 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Jgraider
Originally Posted by Wytex
The expert has spoken.


I guess most everyone knows that except you. What a surprise. Here's something else for you to whine and cry about........ a chupacabra doesn't exist either.


Wow, I guess everything revolves around you.
Go brow beat your wife, she must be used to it.
My comment was about the expert referenced in the OP.
You're a condescending !#@*.

Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Wytex] #8976237 12/21/23 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Wytex
Originally Posted by Jgraider
Originally Posted by Wytex
The expert has spoken.


I guess most everyone knows that except you. What a surprise. Here's something else for you to whine and cry about........ a chupacabra doesn't exist either.


Wow, I guess everything revolves around you.
Go brow beat your wife, she must be used to it.
My comment was about the expert referenced in the OP.
You're a condescending !#@*.


You've attacked me previously in other threads, and failed. If your original post was directed towards the OP, then I apologize. I've been married to the same wonderful gal for 38 years. How about you?

Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Jgraider] #8976347 12/21/23 09:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Jgraider
I've been married to the same wonderful gal for 38 years. How about you?


I am fairly certain Wytex isn't married to the same wonderful gal as you, for many reasons.


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Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Tbar] #8976353 12/21/23 09:37 PM
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Well that escalated quickly.

Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Jgraider] #8976356 12/21/23 09:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Jgraider
It's easy to debunk something that doesn't exist.


Actually, it is a logical improbability, some would argue, impossibility, to prove something does not exist without omniscience. A lack of evidence is not proof of non-existence as a lack of evidence only proves a lack of evidence. One might say that there is no evidence to claim that they do exist, but similarly there is no evidence to support the claim that the don't exist.

With some regularity, scientists have made discoveries of things that previously that had no evidence of their existence, and yet they exist. That is possible because a lack of evidence doesn't substantiate a lack of existence. For example, a recent meteor find revealed 3 minerals never before known to exist in nature. We didn't know they existed, yet they do.


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Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Tbar] #8976366 12/21/23 10:06 PM
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My understanding is 11% of jaguars are black and that is what we call black panthers.

The jaguar range extends up to the tip of Texas and the boarder of Arizona and recently into it.

The jaguar population in Mexico is increasing gradually. Just for my own knowledge why couldn't they migrate farther north into Texas?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_panther

https://www.theyucatantimes.com/2021/11/jaguar-population-is-increasing-in-mexico/

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Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Double Naught Spy] #8976371 12/21/23 10:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Double Naught Spy
Originally Posted by Jgraider
It's easy to debunk something that doesn't exist.


Actually, it is a logical improbability, some would argue, impossibility, to prove something does not exist without omniscience. A lack of evidence is not proof of non-existence as a lack of evidence only proves a lack of evidence. One might say that there is no evidence to claim that they do exist, but similarly there is no evidence to support the claim that the don't exist.

With some regularity, scientists have made discoveries of things that previously that had no evidence of their existence, and yet they exist. That is possible because a lack of evidence doesn't substantiate a lack of existence. For example, a recent meteor find revealed 3 minerals never before known to exist in nature. We didn't know they existed, yet they do.


Dude. That was spot on.

Can’t prove the negative, but I think most of us have a pretty good idea.

Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Tbar] #8976373 12/21/23 10:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Tbar
My understanding is 11% of jaguars are black and that is what we call black panthers.

The jaguar range extends up to the tip of Texas and the boarder of Arizona and recently into it.

The jaguar population in Mexico is increasing gradually. Just for my own knowledge why couldn't they migrate farther north into Texas?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_panther

https://www.theyucatantimes.com/2021/11/jaguar-population-is-increasing-in-mexico/

[Linked Image]


They certainly could, Tbar, but what are the odds that they all slipped through South Texas unnoticed and were discovered by every single East Texan? Most importantly…..EAST Texas. Keep that in mind.

Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Sneaky] #8976375 12/21/23 10:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Sneaky
They certainly could, Tbar, but what are the odds that they all slipped through South Texas unnoticed and were discovered by every single East Texan? Most importantly…..EAST Texas. Keep that in mind.


Yes, I think that is a stretch. I guess I was referring to Texas in general.


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Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Tbar] #8976415 12/21/23 11:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Tbar
My understanding is 11% of jaguars are black and that is what we call black panthers.

The jaguar range extends up to the tip of Texas and the boarder of Arizona and recently into it.

The jaguar population in Mexico is increasing gradually. Just for my own knowledge why couldn't they migrate farther north into Texas?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_panther

https://www.theyucatantimes.com/2021/11/jaguar-population-is-increasing-in-mexico/

[Linked Image]

Yes about 10% will be melanistic but not in all areas. Melanism in jaguars typically only shows up in thick rain forest type habitat. It's believed to be an adaptation to help camouflage in the shadows. There has never been a melanistic jaguar documented in the northern Mexico population. The closest documented melanistic one was in Belize

Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Tbar] #8976576 12/22/23 07:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Tbar
Originally Posted by Sneaky
They certainly could, Tbar, but what are the odds that they all slipped through South Texas unnoticed and were discovered by every single East Texan? Most importantly…..EAST Texas. Keep that in mind.


Yes, I think that is a stretch. I guess I was referring to Texas in general.


Sure. That’s reasonable. I just find myself going back to the eastern part of our state since that’s where most of the sightings come from.

Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Tbar] #8976842 12/22/23 10:12 PM
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I hate to be the one. We definitely have black jaguars that range through Texas and New Mexico. So there are your “panthers”. They are real and i would not be suprised if there are actual panthers too.

Kind of like the mountain lions and red wolves in Missouri that don’t exist. Or the wolves of Wisconsin when they were extinct, supposedly. If they acknowledge it’s existence then it must be taken into consideration and managed, and government don’t care.


Last edited by Bryan C. Heimann; 12/22/23 10:13 PM.

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Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: 10 Gauge] #8976844 12/22/23 10:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Bryan C. Heimann
I hate to be the one. We definitely have black jaguars that range through Texas and New Mexico. So there are your “panthers”.


In East Texas? All through East Texas? Witnessed by just about every person in East Texas? Does that seem reasonable?

Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Tbar] #8976845 12/22/23 10:23 PM
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Here is your missouri red wolf. 104 pound coyote, right, sure. That’s a wolf or at least part.

https://www.thewildlifenews.com/2010/12/20/104-pound-coyote-shot-in-missouri/

Last edited by Bryan C. Heimann; 12/22/23 10:24 PM.

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Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Sneaky] #8976848 12/22/23 10:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Sneaky
Originally Posted by Bryan C. Heimann
I hate to be the one. We definitely have black jaguars that range through Texas and New Mexico. So there are your “panthers”.


In East Texas? All through East Texas? Witnessed by just about every person in East Texas? Does that seem reasonable?



Living there? No. Passing through? Absolutely. Some people telling 2nd or 3rd hand account as their own? Probably but where there is smoke there is fire.


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Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: 10 Gauge] #8976856 12/22/23 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Bryan C. Heimann
Originally Posted by Sneaky
Originally Posted by Bryan C. Heimann
I hate to be the one. We definitely have black jaguars that range through Texas and New Mexico. So there are your “panthers”.


In East Texas? All through East Texas? Witnessed by just about every person in East Texas? Does that seem reasonable?



Living there? No. Passing through? Absolutely. Some people telling 2nd or 3rd hand account as their own? Probably but where there is smoke there is fire.


Last Jaguar I believe killed in Texas was in 1903 if memory serves correctly. And it wasn’t black. Texas never had a resident population, just a transient one.

Odds are extremely high that at the time of this writing there isn’t a Jaguar on Texas soil.

There is no black Panther, people need to come to grips with that. He’s out playing footsie with Bigfoot.

There are black jaguars but they don’t exist here. There are no black leopards that swam over hear from Zimbabwe either.


With all the game cameras, video, thermal and aerial surveys do we every year, more people in the state than ever before, if it existed it would have turned up by now. It’s 2023 not 1973.




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Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: Tbar] #8976865 12/22/23 10:55 PM
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Actually, the last jaguar killed in Texas was in 1948, 3 miles SE of Kingsville TX. There are NO Black jaguars roaming in Texas or New Mexico. The nearest BLACK jaguars are in Belize over 1000 miles from the TX border. Don't know why this is so hard for people to understand. Tens of thousands of game cameras and millions of hunters and not one speck of true evidence shown by believers except, " I know what I seen!"

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I just think we way, way underestimate how far a juvenile animal will range. They might cover thousands of miles before they settle into a home range. Canines too. It has been documented.

And i don’t believe for a second that a biologist or any government employee for that matter, was just so damn efficient and good at their jobs that they found and documented the sole ranging animal in a decade.

Personally i have found a ringtail cat and a enormous black racer far outside their respective range and living there, not ranging through.


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Re: Black panthers in Texas? Expert debunks recent sighting [Re: 10 Gauge] #8976874 12/22/23 11:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Bryan C. Heimann
Originally Posted by Sneaky
Originally Posted by Bryan C. Heimann
I hate to be the one. We definitely have black jaguars that range through Texas and New Mexico. So there are your “panthers”.


In East Texas? All through East Texas? Witnessed by just about every person in East Texas? Does that seem reasonable?



Living there? No. Passing through? Absolutely. Some people telling 2nd or 3rd hand account as their own? Probably but where there is smoke there is fire.


Now you’re on to something. Smoke and fire. That’s what is really going on, I believe.

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