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Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters #8858728 05/27/23 11:48 AM
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jeh7mmmag Offline OP
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Afederal judge ruled Friday that four Missouri hunters did not trespass when they corner crossed and passed through the airspace above Fred Eshelman’s Elk Mountain Ranch.

Chief U.S. District Judge Scott Skavdahl granted the hunters’ request to dismiss most of Eshelman’s lawsuit that claimed the men trespassed and caused more than $7 million in damages. The men corner-crossed in 2020 and 2021 to hunt public land enmeshed in Eshelman’s 22,045-acre ranch.

Corner crossing involves stepping from one piece of public land to another at the common corner with two pieces of private property, all arranged in a checkerboard pattern. Corner crossing avoids setting foot on private land.

The ruling has implications for public access to 8.3 million acres of “corner locked” public land in the U.S. The hunters argued that the federal Unlawful Inclosures Act of 1885 prevents Eshelman from obstructing access across the corner.

more:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/j...8971cd80c947d9abbb466a6da55036&ei=82


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Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jeh7mmmag] #8858737 05/27/23 12:33 PM
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I know there's been fairly heavy debate about this previously here on THF, but I agree with this ruling. At least initially. It's hard to imagine public land, owned by tax payers, without public access, actually being public.


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Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jeh7mmmag] #8858745 05/27/23 01:15 PM
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Hmmmm....things are going to get interesting.
Adios,
Gary

Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jeh7mmmag] #8858750 05/27/23 01:27 PM
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Thanks for the update. I was curious how this might turn out.


To be determined
Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jeh7mmmag] #8858758 05/27/23 01:33 PM
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How on earth could they have $7.75 million in damages?


Oderint dum metuant - Lucius Accius
Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jeh7mmmag] #8858761 05/27/23 01:37 PM
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I don't think this will affect others states unless they appeal, the LO, and lose at the higher federal level.

Good win though in Wyoming.

Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: George S] #8858766 05/27/23 01:48 PM
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Originally Posted by George S
How on earth could they have $7.75 million in damages?


They can't.

It'sbs


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Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: kry226] #8858767 05/27/23 01:49 PM
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Originally Posted by kry226
I know there's been fairly heavy debate about this previously here on THF, but I agree with this ruling. At least initially. It's hard to imagine public land, owned by tax payers, without public access, actually being public.


Yep. That was the ruling I was hoping for. They did nothing wrong.


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Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: George S] #8858769 05/27/23 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by George S
How on earth could they have $7.75 million in damages?


Ego and the fact that they interfered with them making money off selling private hunts on public lands.


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Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jeh7mmmag] #8858829 05/27/23 04:05 PM
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"The judge’s ruling did not address the disputed allegation that one hunter, Zach Smith, did set foot on ranch property at a spot well removed from one of several contested corners. A digital “waypoint” that Smith created in 2020 on the onX hunting app is located on Eshelman property."

Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jeh7mmmag] #8858866 05/27/23 05:45 PM
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I'm pretty sure OnX let them know persons can drop waypoints without ever stepping on the property. Way points do not mean you were in that spot.
They were found not guilty of trespassing by a jury in Rawlins.
This was civil trespass for damages, again not guilty.

Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jeh7mmmag] #8858874 05/27/23 06:01 PM
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I see both sides.


Donate to TX Youth hunting program.... better to donate then to waste it in taxes

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Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: Wytex] #8858877 05/27/23 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Wytex
I'm pretty sure OnX let them know persons can drop waypoints without ever stepping on the property. Way points do not mean you were in that spot.
They were found not guilty of trespassing by a jury in Rawlins.
This was civil trespass for damages, again not guilty.



image the author probably doesnt know a track from way point. I originally read track. Regardless doesnt look like County is interested in pursing it.


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Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: BigPig] #8858881 05/27/23 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by BigPig
Originally Posted by George S
How on earth could they have $7.75 million in damages?


Ego and the fact that they interfered with them making money off selling private hunts on public lands.


the actual legal complaint was deprecation, as it would cause an influence in traffic over the ranch and interrupted operations…

it was a hell mary hoping for a settlement or pro land right judge


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Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: BOBO the Clown] #8858892 05/27/23 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted by BigPig
Originally Posted by George S
How on earth could they have $7.75 million in damages?


Ego and the fact that they interfered with them making money off selling private hunts on public lands.


the actual legal complaint was deprecation, as it would cause an influence in traffic over the ranch and interrupted operations…

it was a hell mary hoping for a settlement or pro land right judge


So, exactly what I said. up


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Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jeh7mmmag] #8858922 05/27/23 07:56 PM
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Happy with the verdict. Landowners being dicks even if the hunters did actually step onto their land.

JR

Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jrgocards] #8858930 05/27/23 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by jrgocards
Happy with the verdict. Landowners being dicks even if the hunters did actually step onto their land.

JR


get your land trashed out and fenced busted up and then see how open you are to corner crossing, or worse what until you have to spend 100k’s fighting prescriptive easements across you back yard that you didnt even know existed. Or have to spend 100k on maintaining your private roads for public use..

two sides to every coin


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Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jrgocards] #8858953 05/27/23 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by jrgocards
Happy with the verdict. Landowners being dicks even if the hunters did actually step onto their land.

JR


Comments like this are why nobody can access the public land on my three fence lines unless they want to get a helicopter.

Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: BOBO the Clown] #8858972 05/27/23 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted by jrgocards
Happy with the verdict. Landowners being dicks even if the hunters did actually step onto their land.

JR


get your land trashed out and fenced busted up and then see how open you are to corner crossing, or worse what until you have to spend 100k’s fighting prescriptive easements across you back yard that you didnt even know existed. Or have to spend 100k on maintaining your private roads for public use..

two sides to every coin


I can see your point if that was the case but many of these corner crossing issues occur in free range properties that have no fences.


All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. Edmund Burke
Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: BOBO the Clown] #8859016 05/28/23 12:39 AM
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Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted by jrgocards
Happy with the verdict. Landowners being dicks even if the hunters did actually step onto their land.

JR


get your land trashed out and fenced busted up and then see how open you are to corner crossing, or worse what until you have to spend 100k’s fighting prescriptive easements across you back yard that you didnt even know existed. Or have to spend 100k on maintaining your private roads for public use..

two sides to every coin


Stop whining!

Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jeh7mmmag] #8859067 05/28/23 01:50 AM
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I have the problem and its not whining. My land has big electrical transmission lines running across it. I don’t live there. People have crossed the locked gates 2 places away and wound up on my land. One bunch was armed and said they were carrying the shotguns and 22 rifle for protection from snakes. I explained that they were on private property and they disagreed. I left, went a little ways and called the Sheriffs office. They came out, explained to the bunch that they were trespassing. Then, escorted them back to their vehicle. BTW, they were over a mile from any public road and had crossed 2 locked gates.

I have found lures hung up in brush in my ponds and footprints in mud.

I have found leg hold traps, box traps, ejected brass, etc.

Whining?


Without a sense of urgency, nothing ever happens.

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Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: Dave Davidson] #8859077 05/28/23 02:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave Davidson
I have the problem and its not whining. My land has big electrical transmission lines running across it. I don’t live there. People have crossed the locked gates 2 places away and wound up on my land. One bunch was armed and said they were carrying the shotguns and 22 rifle for protection from snakes. I explained that they were on private property and they disagreed. I left, went a little ways and called the Sheriffs office. They came out, explained to the bunch that they were trespassing. Then, escorted them back to their vehicle. BTW, they were over a mile from any public road and had crossed 2 locked gates.

I have found lures hung up in brush in my ponds and footprints in mud.

I have found leg hold traps, box traps, ejected brass, etc.

Whining?



It's astounding how many people think a utility easement is public land. I've met highly educated, professional people that think it's their "green space" to do what they want. Several years ago some members on here thought I should let whoever just walk across my property.


...and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. Gen. 1:28
Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: scalebuster] #8859082 05/28/23 02:21 AM
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Originally Posted by scalebuster
Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted by jrgocards
Happy with the verdict. Landowners being dicks even if the hunters did actually step onto their land.

JR


get your land trashed out and fenced busted up and then see how open you are to corner crossing, or worse what until you have to spend 100k’s fighting prescriptive easements across you back yard that you didnt even know existed. Or have to spend 100k on maintaining your private roads for public use..

two sides to every coin


Stop whining!


I’m not whining my example is in reference to Idaho tough guys that a few years ago threatened to burn down Wilks Brothers ranch up there , because they closed it down due to the public BS

I have no need or want to corner cross. Its a respect thing, plenty of public land where you dont have too.


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Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jeh7mmmag] #8859096 05/28/23 02:48 AM
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I studied the case pretty in depth and I can’t say I side with the landowner. Anyone who is familiar with western properties know a landowner can control tens of thousands of acres of public land while only holding a deed to a few thousand. So double edged sword here….it would be nice to have thousands of acres of landlocked public land inside my fence, but on the other hand it’s owned by the public, so if it’s public land it should have a way for the public to access it. If public can’t access it landowner should have to purchase it at 1/2 the market value of the land.


Went pretty far as the ranch foreman harassed the hunters as well as the local Sherrif siding with the LO even when he knew he was in the wrong.


For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
Re: Judge rules in favor of corner-crossing hunters [Re: jeh7mmmag] #8859104 05/28/23 03:06 AM
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Just a question here...

What would be the difference in flying onto this type property w a helicopter vs say bringing something like a small trampoline and jumping from 2 feet one side to 2 feet the other side?

I know its a dumb question but it does seem be a splitting hairs type issue to begin with

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