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Texas Suppressors #8297544 06/17/21 05:15 PM
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CharlieCTx Offline OP
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I read yesterday that along with Const. Carry, our Governor also signed a bill saying you don't need to buy a Tax Stamp for a suppressor made in Texas. Given you always have to pay the Taxman, do you think this will actually make it as a law?

Charlie


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Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8297554 06/17/21 05:35 PM
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If he signed it, it is law. Texas Law. The issue at hand may be that Texas law and Federal law are against each other. Kinda like Colorado and California making pot legal. It is still illegal in federal law. Now, obviously, the DEA is looking the other way when someone in CA or CO light up a joint. Will the ATF look the other way when you light off your suppressed .308?


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Originally Posted by TurkeyHunter
And make Kamila president

She’d just end up blowing it......
Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8297620 06/17/21 06:21 PM
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This is what I'm talking about, not the same, but similar...

https://www.yahoo.com/news/justice-dept-missouri-governor-cant-010218695.html

Charlie


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Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8297627 06/17/21 06:27 PM
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Don’t be the guinea pig!


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Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: Mike Honcho] #8297631 06/17/21 06:29 PM
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Source: https://www.internationalsportsman....-soon-be-exempt-from-federal-regulation/

Today, the Texas Senate passed HB 957 which prohibits state and local agencies from enforcing federal laws on Texas-made suppressors. There are a lot of misconceptions about what this bill does, so before you start making silencers, read the fine print.

The bill passed both the Texas House and Texas Senate and now goes to Gov. Gregg Abbott for signing into law. Once signed, the law takes effect on Sept. 1, 2021.

What the Bill Does
Rep. Tom Oliverson (R-Cypress) put forth HB 957 on January 4 with 31 Republican sponsors and one Democrat. From the flurry of social media posts and chatter, you might think that this bill allows silencers made in Texas to be immune to federal regulations. This is not the whole truth. While that may be the eventual outcome, here are three things the bill actually does:

Amends the Texas Penal Code to remove a firearm silencer from among the prohibited weapons whose intentional or knowing possession, manufacture, transport, repair, or sale constitutes an offense.
Amends the Government Code to state that a firearm suppressor that is manufactured in and remains in Texas is not subject to federal law or federal regulation, including registration.
Prohibits state or local entities from adopting policies that would allow the enforcement of federal laws regulating a firearm suppressor or that imposes a regulation that does not exist under state law.
In short, the bill removes silencers that are made in Texas, using Texas-sourced materials, from the list of prohibited weapons. However, there is currently a path to owning a silencer, which is to follow the NFA laws and pay the federal government a $200 infringment tax.

The bill states that a silencer made in Texas from Texas materials with no imported material or parts are exempt from federal registration. We will dive into the implications of this further down.

The bill prevents state employees from enforcing federal laws.

The Bill Does not Protect You
This bill does not protect you from the ATF or federal regulations. It prevents the state from helping the feds, but it does not stop them from coming into Texas to enforce the federal laws. Federal law trumps state law. We have seen in other states that have passed similar laws, and the ATF simply ignores the state law. An example of this is Kansas where Jeremy Kettler purchased a “Made in Kansas” silencer that was not registered with the federal government and was prosecuted in federal court. Kansas had recently passed a similar version of Texas’s law. The gun store owner and Kettler were arrested by the ATF, prosecuted, and convicted.

The Supreme Court let stand a ruling by the 10th Circuit Court of Appeals that found the National Firearms Act falls within Congress’ power to tax.

With that being said, Texas’s law states that the Attorney General must seek a judgment from a federal district court in Texas that Texas’ law is constitutional, upon written notification by a Texas citizen of their intent to manufacture a silencer. If the federal court were to rule in the favor of the law, this could limit how much the ATF could enforce current federal laws in Texas. However, if the court were to rule that Texas’s law was unconstitutional, then the citizen would not be protected from the ATF.

It seems that the law is intentionally seeking a Texas citizen to spur a federal court case by writing to the Attorney General to obtain a court ruling.

Summary
If Governor Abbott signs this bill into law, then things could get very interesting for Texas. If the state was able to protect its citizens from federal regulations, this would be a huge win for gun rights nationwide.

One thing that gets brought up when discussing this law is the marijuana laws in certain states. It’s easy to see how states like Colorado and California get around federal prohibitions for marijuana possession and draw similar conclusions about suppressor manufacturing. However, regulating drugs and firearms are two different things. Federal law currently has a legal process for owning silencers where such provisions don’t exist with marijuana. Additionally, those states have far more marijuana users per capita than Texas does potential suppressor manufacturers or owners, making it tougher for the feds to regulate marijuana versus silencers.

Lastly, since the Texas law would define silencers as firearms, they would still have to be purchased through a firearm dealer or made at home. If it went through a dealer, it would be subject to a background check and all other firearm regulations. If the firearm dealer was audited by the ATF, which happens annually, there would be a record of the silencer sale, which could alert the ATF to enforce federal laws. When it comes to marijuana sales, there are no records of who made a purchase, so customers aren’t at risk of jail time or fines if the feds step in. That would be the opposite case in Texas.

We believe Abbott will sign the law into effect, and we can continue moving gun rights in a positive direction. Hopefully, we can see “Made in Texas” silencers on the shelves without any federal strings attached.

Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8297639 06/17/21 06:37 PM
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Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8297665 06/17/21 07:17 PM
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He signed it two days ago. I don't see a reputable Texas silencer manufacturer risking their Type 07 FFL or their Class 3 SOT to make these anyway.


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Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: rfamilyhunting] #8297766 06/17/21 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by rfamilyhunting
Source: https://www.internationalsportsman....-soon-be-exempt-from-federal-regulation/
<snip>

Lastly, since the Texas law would define silencers as firearms, they would still have to be purchased through a firearm dealer or made at home. If it went through a dealer, it would be subject to a background check and all other firearm regulations. If the firearm dealer was audited by the ATF, which happens annually, there would be a record of the silencer sale, which could alert the ATF to enforce federal laws. When it comes to marijuana sales, there are no records of who made a purchase, so customers aren’t at risk of jail time or fines if the feds step in. That would be the opposite case in Texas.



This is the key part. I don't see any upside for a gun store to sell a "Texas Made" suppressor. The amount of profit they will make from a handful of suppressors isn't worth going to jail and losing their business over. I'm sure the profit margin on a suppressor is about the same as any of the handguns or long guns they currently sell. So why even bother when they can just sell another handgun or rifle instead.


Thanks,
Rich
Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8297824 06/17/21 10:25 PM
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It says ".....or made at home."

peep

Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8297897 06/17/21 11:51 PM
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No way in hell I'd recommend anyone doing this...I can gaurandarntee you ATF will be looking for some poor shleps to use as examples of why you shouldn't do this...I won't be that example that's for dern sure.


Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: Superduty] #8297913 06/18/21 12:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Superduty
It says ".....or made at home."

peep




Meh. I know a guy that knows a few guys that have been using home made suppressors for a very long time, they just don't advertise it. They say, the law don't go round hair! roflmao

Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: skinnerback] #8297962 06/18/21 12:59 AM
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Quote
With that being said, Texas’s law states that the Attorney General must seek a judgment from a federal district court in Texas that Texas’ law is constitutional, upon written notification by a Texas citizen of their intent to manufacture a silencer. If the federal court were to rule in the favor of the law, this could limit how much the ATF could enforce current federal laws in Texas. However, if the court were to rule that Texas’s law was unconstitutional, then the citizen would not be protected from the ATF.


This is the critical path. Deviate from the path and face the penalties.


A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.
Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: Scoutdog] #8297987 06/18/21 01:30 AM
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That still offers no protection at all. The feds wouldn't appeal the decision UNTIL they have test bunnies that they have charged with a Federal Felony and arrested for same. So said test bunnies will have that mark on their record. The Feds have the ability to appeal and go thru the federal appeals court system when they want, that will be a costly process for said test bunnies. If the Federal Appeals court rules different than the District court, test bunnies are likely in for a 10 year Federal vacation as I very much doubt the SC will take up the case.


Originally Posted by Scoutdog
Quote
With that being said, Texas’s law states that the Attorney General must seek a judgment from a federal district court in Texas that Texas’ law is constitutional, upon written notification by a Texas citizen of their intent to manufacture a silencer. If the federal court were to rule in the favor of the law, this could limit how much the ATF could enforce current federal laws in Texas. However, if the court were to rule that Texas’s law was unconstitutional, then the citizen would not be protected from the ATF.


This is the critical path. Deviate from the path and face the penalties.


Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: skinnerback] #8298030 06/18/21 02:36 AM
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Originally Posted by skinnerback
Originally Posted by Superduty
It says ".....or made at home."

peep




Meh. I know a guy that knows a few guys that have been using home made suppressors for a very long time, they just don't advertise it. They say, the law don't go round hair! roflmao



Can you hook me up???


5303

Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: Earl] #8298038 06/18/21 02:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Earl
That still offers no protection at all. The feds wouldn't appeal the decision UNTIL they have test bunnies that they have charged with a Federal Felony and arrested for same. So said test bunnies will have that mark on their record. The Feds have the ability to appeal and go thru the federal appeals court system when they want, that will be a costly process for said test bunnies. If the Federal Appeals court rules different than the District court, test bunnies are likely in for a 10 year Federal vacation as I very much doubt the SC will take up the case.


You are missing what I am saying. The critical path needs to go through a federal declaratory judgement first. That is to say, the federal judgement needs to be determined before anyone goes out and buys/builds a suppressor without a tax stamp. That’s the purpose of the federal declaratory judgement – basically get the judgement without and before putting anyone (your test bunnies) at risk. Undoubtedly, if the judgement was in favor of Texas it will be appealed and drag out for an extended period of time. This path though doesn't put anyone at risk and will prevent what happened in KS.


A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.
Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8304269 06/25/21 01:46 PM
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Got this info in an email this morning from Dark Horse Suppressors.




Texas HB957 What Now?


What We Know Now and How We Will Proceed

We've been trying to get some answers about HB957, as the bill itself doesn't provide much guidance. Our phones have been ringing off the hook with folks that have the expectation to show up at our shop after September 1st and walk out the door with a suppressor. Sorry, that is not happening.
Tom Oliverson introduced the bill, so we called his offices. One of his assistants in Austin was kind enough to contact the Texas Attorney General for us and ask what the bill will do. She said the AG told her that they are suggesting that manufacturers and individuals follow the ATF rules and federal laws. The bill was introduced to initiate a court case to hopefully, get changes made at the federal level sometime in the future. She also told us that Montana passed a similar bill a few years ago and the ATF told them to follow the federal rules (we heard that people went to jail). HB957 was also introduced for the Gun Owners of America. We suggest calling Gun Owners of America,(*contact info is available in their flyer posted below) your state representative, the Texas Attorney General, or Tom Oliverson's office if you have more questions.
We called our ATF examiner about the bill and were told that if someone makes a suppressor without following the federal rules, it's a felony...simple as that. Why more clarity wasn't given to the public, why we weren't contacted as one of the few Texas manufacturers, why the boys in Austin were patting themselves on the back over the bill, we do not know.
MOST IMPORTANTLY: Per the Texas Attorney General “It was designed to initiate a federal court case, unless you want to be in that court case, don't do it.”

Flyer above is property of Gun Owners Of America. We do not own right to it or its conent.
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Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8304326 06/25/21 02:26 PM
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This space for rent
Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: 68rustbucket] #8304405 06/25/21 04:04 PM
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68Rustbucket,

As suspected, HB 957 is just words on paper, nothing more.

Nothing has changed. Still gotta jump through the Feds hoops.


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Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8304444 06/25/21 04:44 PM
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So it has nothing to do with suppressors, it’s to make jobs for lawyers.

Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8304772 06/25/21 10:38 PM
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Hit the nail on the head.

Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8304838 06/25/21 11:57 PM
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I disagree. The nature of our court system is such that only a party who can show injury and has the funds to contest the law has a reasonable chance to overturn a bad, meaning unconstitutional, law. The passing of this bill is an effort to advance the process, which is what it is.


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Re: Texas Suppressors [Re: CharlieCTx] #8305017 06/26/21 04:18 AM
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HB 957 isn't worth the paper it's written on.


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