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Re: Help me [Re: 270 guru] #8289681 06/09/21 06:56 PM
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Different strokes for different folks. We use the ribs and flank. A body shot turns most of the ribs/flank into a bloodshot mess, and thats best case if you dont clip either of the shoulders. Its a pretty fine line between not touching either shoulder and the guts. Most lung shot deer go down in short order, but ive had more than a handfull over the years cover 100-200 yards... in waist high or taller dead winter grass and brush that can turn into a heck of a wild goose chase even with a decent blood trail.


It's hell eatin em live
Re: Help me [Re: 270 guru] #8289726 06/09/21 07:34 PM
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I know I'm late to this party. A .224 projectile is not my go-to for deer, and never will be. I use it on hogs almost exclusively when not in deer season. But if a hog runs off I honestly won't even look for one very long. It's rare they do given I ear-hole them.

For deer, I want something with a little more oomph. But that's not the topic.

That being said, to the OP's point, a usual suspect 22-250 would not be my choice due to them normally having a slow twist for bullets in the 50-60 grain range,. I'd be looking to use a minimum of 70gr bullet knowing I was hunting deer. I've never pondered or researched this, but I'd be curious if other cartridges might push a heavy 224 better, or not? If I were building a 22-anything for deer, I'd want at least a 1:8 twist, maybe even a 1-6.5 or 7" twist. Then the cartridge pushing that bullet would be chosen based on its efficiency at doing so. That might, or might not, push me to a custom build or something, like I said I haven't gone down this road.


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Re: Help me [Re: 603Country] #8289736 06/09/21 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by 603Country
Well, speaking of my own family, there have certainly been more deer lost to misplaced body shots. But the reason is that nobody takes head shots. Quite honestly, except for one cousin that’s a superb shot, most of them aren’t great shots. Now, if they all decided to start taking head shots, guess what would happen. Heck, that’s true of me too. I haven’t lost many deer over the decades, but I have never once tried a head shot, so all the lost deer (call it 3) were all body shots. I just shoot em in the lungs. Works every time. I don’t eat the venison ribs or the lungs, so no edible meat is wasted. Why not take the easier and higher percentage shot? That said, I can see the logic in trying to drop them on the spot. I have tracked a lot of deer through briar patches. But, lung shot deer rarely run vary far. If someone says they lung shot a deer and it ran for two miles, it wasn’t lung shot at all.

I suspect that some of you might be thinking that the world of hunters is just a larger group of folks like us - good shots, reloaders, picky on optics, and such as that. And I think you’d be wrong. We are the exception, not the rule.


The old timers I grew up hunting with ( who I later had to realize were not all that experienced or knowledgeable about hunting in general ) used to preach a neck shot. Not for any other reason than it dropped a deer in its tracks when properly executed ( they were also the type to cut the deers throat immediately after). We were always told a heart shot as ok if you had to take it, but a lung shot would result in a very long tracking job.

I don’t know when this line of thinking became antiquated but it’s interesting to note how times, attitudes and opinions change from generation to generation. I also don’t know anyone who cuts a dead deers throat anymore.




For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
Re: Help me [Re: psycho0819] #8289743 06/09/21 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by psycho0819
I know I'm late to this party. A .224 projectile is not my go-to for deer, and never will be. I use it on hogs almost exclusively when not in deer season. But if a hog runs off I honestly won't even look for one very long. It's rare they do given I ear-hole them.

For deer, I want something with a little more oomph. But that's not the topic.

That being said, to the OP's point, a usual suspect 22-250 would not be my choice due to them normally having a slow twist for bullets in the 50-60 grain range,. I'd be looking to use a minimum of 70gr bullet knowing I was hunting deer. I've never pondered or researched this, but I'd be curious if other cartridges might push a heavy 224 better, or not? If I were building a 22-anything for deer, I'd want at least a 1:8 twist, maybe even a 1-6.5 or 7" twist. Then the cartridge pushing that bullet would be chosen based on its efficiency at doing so. That might, or might not, push me to a custom build or something, like I said I haven't gone down this road.


About 15 or 20 years ago a group tried to popularize a .22 caliber deer round based off the 6mm case I believe. Called it the .224 TTH and it would use a 70 grain bullet if I remember correctly. Basically duplicated the ballistics of today’s .22 creedmoor.

It enjoyed some success in small circles but I haven’t heard about it in years.


For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
Re: Help me [Re: 270 guru] #8289750 06/09/21 07:53 PM
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Things do change. I haven’t cut the throat of a deer in over 50 years. And that was back when dogs were used to run deer, and I have to think that cutting the throat of a deer that had been run hard might have been the right thing to do in the interest of good tasting venison. Hunting the way we do now, the deer are not full of adrenaline when they die. Maybe that’s why we quit cutting the throats. I’m just guessing.

As for tracking lung shot deer, it could be that the bullets are more destructive than they were many years ago. Lung shoot a deer with a mild (by comparison with today’s calibers and bullets) round and maybe they did run further. But, I used a 35 Remington back in the 60’s and I lung shot them then and they never went far.

One of the biggest bucks I ever shot was hit in the heart, and he ran maybe 100 yards into the biggest briar patch in Louisiana. There’s no perfect method to shooting deer.


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Re: Help me [Re: 270 guru] #8289753 06/09/21 07:56 PM
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Blast from the past, we never cut throats unless something was still kicking.... but my grandpa cut the nutz off every buck he shot immediately lol anyone still do that?


It's hell eatin em live
Re: Help me [Re: redchevy] #8289760 06/09/21 08:01 PM
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Bottom line to all this ridiculous talk is practice and know what you and your equipment's ethical limitations are. I bet the same guys telling everyone these are not ethical shots are the guys who shoot a box of shells a year....consequently if that is the case it sounds like they know their limitations and that's great. I won't tell you what your limitations are and YOU don't get to tell me what mine are...'merica!

Originally Posted by redchevy
Its a pretty fine line between not touching either shoulder and the guts.


That a solid 4-6" on most deer and if I felt like that was my margin of error, I wouldn't take those shots either. Perfect example of knowing you or your equipment's limitations.


Originally Posted by Phil Robertson
Don't let your ears hear what your eyes didn't see, and don't let your mouth say what your heart doesn't feel
Re: Help me [Re: redchevy] #8289761 06/09/21 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by redchevy
Blast from the past, we never cut throats unless something was still kicking.... but my grandpa cut the nutz off every buck he shot immediately lol anyone still do that?



Blast from the past indeed. I grew up hunting around several old timers that always cut the nuts off first thing lol. Never cut any throats though unless they were still alive.

My ex FIL (RIP) always cut the nuts off. I always just went along with it.

Re: Help me [Re: txtrophy85] #8289783 06/09/21 08:16 PM
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Where and how to shoot deer has been figured out longer than anyone on this board has been sucking air. That has not changed in a very long time and is not likely to change for a very long time. The biggest change to the discussions that revolve around the topic is the internet gives anyone an anonymous voice in the discussion, whether they know beans about it or not.
Originally Posted by txtrophy85
Originally Posted by 603Country
Well, speaking of my own family, there have certainly been more deer lost to misplaced body shots. But the reason is that nobody takes head shots. Quite honestly, except for one cousin that’s a superb shot, most of them aren’t great shots. Now, if they all decided to start taking head shots, guess what would happen. Heck, that’s true of me too. I haven’t lost many deer over the decades, but I have never once tried a head shot, so all the lost deer (call it 3) were all body shots. I just shoot em in the lungs. Works every time. I don’t eat the venison ribs or the lungs, so no edible meat is wasted. Why not take the easier and higher percentage shot? That said, I can see the logic in trying to drop them on the spot. I have tracked a lot of deer through briar patches. But, lung shot deer rarely run vary far. If someone says they lung shot a deer and it ran for two miles, it wasn’t lung shot at all.

I suspect that some of you might be thinking that the world of hunters is just a larger group of folks like us - good shots, reloaders, picky on optics, and such as that. And I think you’d be wrong. We are the exception, not the rule.


The old timers I grew up hunting with ( who I later had to realize were not all that experienced or knowledgeable about hunting in general ) used to preach a neck shot. Not for any other reason than it dropped a deer in its tracks when properly executed ( they were also the type to cut the deers throat immediately after). We were always told a heart shot as ok if you had to take it, but a lung shot would result in a very long tracking job.

I don’t know when this line of thinking became antiquated but it’s interesting to note how times, attitudes and opinions change from generation to generation. I also don’t know anyone who cuts a dead deers throat anymore.




Smokey Bear---Lone Star State.
Re: Help me [Re: psycho0819] #8289822 06/09/21 08:53 PM
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Originally Posted by psycho0819
I know I'm late to this party. A .224 projectile is not my go-to for deer, and never will be. I use it on hogs almost exclusively when not in deer season. But if a hog runs off I honestly won't even look for one very long. It's rare they do given I ear-hole them.

For deer, I want something with a little more oomph. But that's not the topic.

That being said, to the OP's point, a usual suspect 22-250 would not be my choice due to them normally having a slow twist for bullets in the 50-60 grain range,. I'd be looking to use a minimum of 70gr bullet knowing I was hunting deer. I've never pondered or researched this, but I'd be curious if other cartridges might push a heavy 224 better, or not? If I were building a 22-anything for deer, I'd want at least a 1:8 twist, maybe even a 1-6.5 or 7" twist. Then the cartridge pushing that bullet would be chosen based on its efficiency at doing so. That might, or might not, push me to a custom build or something, like I said I haven't gone down this road.


I just got a Tikka T3X 22-250 with a 1:8 twist to replace my Remington 788 with a 1:14 twist. I have some 68 and 75 gr bullets I'm going to load up and probably go up from there. I'm betting the 75 gr Hornady ELD-M bullets at around 3,200 fps will do a pretty good job on pigs and deer. I'm planning to put a couple of does in the freezer this year with it, and hopefully some pigs and coyotes.


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Re: Help me [Re: Judd] #8289829 06/09/21 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Judd
Bottom line to all this ridiculous talk is practice and know what you and your equipment's ethical limitations are. I bet the same guys telling everyone these are not ethical shots are the guys who shoot a box of shells a year....consequently if that is the case it sounds like they know their limitations and that's great. I won't tell you what your limitations are and YOU don't get to tell me what mine are...'merica!

Originally Posted by redchevy
Its a pretty fine line between not touching either shoulder and the guts.


That a solid 4-6" on most deer and if I felt like that was my margin of error, I wouldn't take those shots either. Perfect example of knowing you or your equipment's limitations.




Maybe so, when they are all hunched up, head down etc. it seems like a much smaller margin than 6 inches. and when your trying to put a 3-4 inch wide wound channel through there it gets grayer.


It's hell eatin em live
Re: Help me [Re: redchevy] #8289887 06/09/21 10:07 PM
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Originally Posted by redchevy
Originally Posted by Judd
Bottom line to all this ridiculous talk is practice and know what you and your equipment's ethical limitations are. I bet the same guys telling everyone these are not ethical shots are the guys who shoot a box of shells a year....consequently if that is the case it sounds like they know their limitations and that's great. I won't tell you what your limitations are and YOU don't get to tell me what mine are...'merica!

Originally Posted by redchevy
Its a pretty fine line between not touching either shoulder and the guts.


That a solid 4-6" on most deer and if I felt like that was my margin of error, I wouldn't take those shots either. Perfect example of knowing you or your equipment's limitations.




Maybe so, when they are all hunched up, head down etc. it seems like a much smaller margin than 6 inches. and when your trying to put a 3-4 inch wide wound channel through there it gets grayer.


Head down eating wheat, or I'll intentionally make a move and get one looking at me, if their head is up. In both scenarios I'm chambered, on fire, and they are already in the center of the scope. You watch them long enough eating wheat and they slowly step forward. Time the steps so that what the momentary pause happens, squeeze the trigger. Facing me, the shot goes right under the chin. Have done the same on a cow elk as well.

January 2020, I shot a big doe at 200 yards, in the last few minutes of legal light. I was rock solid, but because of lighting, I went for lungs with a 7mm-08 shooting a 162 A-Max. She ran towards me, then darted to my left. I stayed put, but my hunting mars told me he had hit a doe in the lungs, and he had started the blood trailing. In between Ballinger and Winters, TX, there's all kinds of grass and brush. We were in the dark, hands and knees trailing his deer. He hit her at 90 yards, stable shot, .308 Win and a 165 gr right through both lungs. We found her 100 yards and over an hour later. Exit was a good 1 1/2". He, the rifle and the bullet all did a fantastic job, but we had to blood trail. We got his deer gutted and hung, then went looking for mine. Same song and dance. Found her 100 yards away, through both lungs, exit 1 1/2" tracked her 100 yards in the dark. By the time she was gutted, and both deer were quartered and in the cooler, it was midnight. Both were shot around 5:30.

He told me the weekend before they had the same story. .30-06, 180 gr, 100 yard shot, great shot placement, bullet performed perfectly, 1 1/2" exit. They blood trailed her for 100 yards

Yeah, give me a brain stem shot if I can get it.

Like I said way earlier, if you are shooting vitals, you are opening yourself up for having to blood trail. And it doesn't matter a whole lot on what bullet, what cartridge, at what impact velocity. It's just the way it is. So all of us that shoot vitals need to be good or get good at blood trailing because it is going to happen.


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Re: Help me [Re: 270 guru] #8291303 06/11/21 01:55 AM
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I think I have more bow kills than rifle on Big Game so blood trails are something to look forward to.


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Re: Help me [Re: DStroud] #8291344 06/11/21 02:31 AM
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Originally Posted by DStroud
I think I have more bow kills than rifle on Big Game so blood trails are something to look forward to.


I’m glad I’m not alone, I prefer to sling lead mostly these days but I’m excited when a critter runs into the thicket out of site. The funnest part of shooting something for me is the blood trailing part. If I see it pile up I still turn into a CSI investigator following the blood watching the patterns. I thought I was the lone weird duck doing that. roflmao

Re: Help me [Re: DStroud] #8291345 06/11/21 02:32 AM
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Originally Posted by DStroud
I think I have more bow kills than rifle on Big Game so blood trails are something to look forward to.


3 blade expandable wrecks havoc on the heart/lungs.

I’ve had one long tracking job on a lung shot deer, just one. Doe shot with a .22-250 bonded bullet. She was still alive when we walked up to her. Bled good but just didn’t do enough damage.

All the ones shot with my .270 or .257 wby went down quick, normally within 20-50 yards.

If I need to drop a deer on the spot, high shoulder and it’s lights out.


For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
Re: Help me [Re: 270 guru] #8291394 06/11/21 03:33 AM
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May have to dust off the 22-250 and try it this year or my 22-250 Ackley. Shot 2 different bucks with the 450 Bushmaster both ran with shoulder shots one 50 yards the other maybe 75. The fastest killing gun I ever had was a 257 weatherby. 300 blk out for a few out to 100 yards with neck shots. Mostly pistol hunt now if im hunting small food plots with 44 mag or 460s&w 6.5 284 Norma on the pipe line. Will probably try the 22-250 Saturday evening on a pig had a group at the feeder this evening 100 yards was pushing it for the10mm Banshee. Wife wants to shoot the spotted one.

Re: Help me [Re: Ol Thumper] #8291457 06/11/21 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Ol Thumper
Originally Posted by DStroud
I think I have more bow kills than rifle on Big Game so blood trails are something to look forward to.


I’m glad I’m not alone, I prefer to sling lead mostly these days but I’m excited when a critter runs into the thicket out of site. The funnest part of shooting something for me is the blood trailing part. If I see it pile up I still turn into a CSI investigator following the blood watching the patterns. I thought I was the lone weird duck doing that. roflmao


Heck, I can always use the exercise. In addition to wanting to keep the area quiet, exercise is the reason why I leave the ATV parked until meat is on the ground.

Last edited by Texas Dan; 06/11/21 11:00 AM.

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