https://townhall.com/columnists/johnstossel/2021/05/05/successful-without-college-n2588945

I look around me and see this all the time, kids borrowing money to go to school and when they finally get their diploma then they have to get a job that pay's well enough to pay off a debt. with terms from 10 to as high as 30 years.

Then I see the kids that went through the trade school classes. Many go to work in the trade they were taught and some decide to go it on their own. I bought my first welding rig in late 70's, by the time it was rigged out and ready to work, I believe it was around 30,000 and it was on a 4 year note. The average college tuition for a public college was around 2500 a year with a 10 year note. At that time I was making 18-22 dollars an hour depending on if it was plant construction or pipeline work, most of the time it was 10-12 hour days, 6-7 days a week. Using the lesser figure we're looking at 60- 70 thousand a year which sound about right. At the same time the average salary for a Bachelors degree was a around 13,000 a year.

Lets move to today and a rigged out welder will run 75 to 80 thousand. Using pipeline welding as a base we're looking at 36-52 dollars ARM pay (Time welding, receives overtime), 15 to 25 an hour truck pay (No overtime) and around 100-150 a day per diem, Using 40 for ARM pay, 20 for rig pay and 125 Per diem and 60 hours a week we're looking at 4500 a week or just under 250,000 a year. Not to often a job runs for a full year so lets use 200,000. The average salary for a Bachelors degree in 2020 was 64,896 and the cost was 45 to 50 thousand.

I use rig welding as an example since that's my trade but this applies to all trades. Become a journeyman in your field and draw top wages, start contracting and the sky's the limit but so are the headaches. Some of the work is harder than other but the pay has always been higher than most Bachelor degree's, short term and long term. I encourage youngsters to find a trade they like and pursue it, I'm not saying don't get a degree, because a trade with a degree is an added bonus.

The average pulling unit or roustabout salary here in the Basin runs about 60,000 a year, that's straight out of high school. Most of us in the business start there an move on to better paying position as our skills increase and may go independent starting their own companies. There's a lot of wealthy folks in the US that never stepped foot on a college campus or received a degree. Once read where the majority of self made millionaire's in the US didn't have a college degree. I don't know if that's true or not but it wouldn't surprise me, 30 percent of the billionaires never received a degree.

No doubt you are correct and I wish we could influence more kids to get into welding

Auto mechanics, plumbing, and electricians are also other ways to go. All pay well after some experience and can be learned at a trade school. Last but not least there is always the military way to go to learn a trade.

I think trade school is a great idea if someone doesn’t want to go to college. There seems to be a shortage of skilled people when I try to find one.

Experience is the best teacher. Some would rather simply do it themselves.

If I President there would only be federal incentives to go to trade school or a STEM degree, aka assign degree limitations to Pell Grants.

There are a ton of programs already to take advantage of, bunch of lazy indoctrinated kids out there

I just used that as an example since I'm familiar with it. What I'm trying to say is you have to have a trade and that trade has to be something you like and people are willing to pay you for it. Seems like there's an ever increasing shortage of skilled journeymen and I don't see it getting any better. The older hands are retiring or dying and there just doesn't seem to be much interest or encouragement to fill their boots. I don't think it's the work so much as the nation wide push to try and put every child in college, and a whole lot of that is responsible for the student loan dilemma.

I already paid mine off, so I’ll be expecting a fat refund check, Joe.

(Not really, graduating and paying off my debt were two of my greatest accomplishments and best feelings in my lifetime. It’s what I signed up to do and we are close to paying off my wife’s student debt, which was three times more than mine. The feds need to get out of student loans/pushing everyone to higher education.)

I took out debt to go to school. My wife had scholarships that helped a lot, but still had some debt. We paid it off in less than 2-3 years after graduating. Neither of us made a lot of money and probably still neither of us make a lot of money.

Its hard to define a lot of money... by the talk you hear and bs posted on the internet we are barely making it. By census bureau information we doing really good.

Of the people i know who learned a trade and the people i know who went to college, the college goers are financially better off, not saying that is the rule by any means, but in general numbers I see more, more successful folks that went to college than didn't by a long shot.

They simply do the beat they can.

Three ways to make money in this world

Know what no one else knows, do what no one else can do, or do what no one else wants to do.

We all decide how we want to proceed.

I told my daughter she gets one chance at college to make and keep her grades, after that she's going to plumbing school!

Guy I used to work for told me once when I said something about good money...."Son, good money is 20k more than you're making and old is 12 years older than you are".

It was one of those sayings that sort of stuck with me...it's all about perspective was the message....and if you think about it, he's right.

They should become plumbers.

I think I have been paying $150 an hour lately!

The military paid for about 95% of my college education. Professionally I got more from the military than college.

It’s really hard to say what’s enough money. It varies with every person, so there’s no exact number. I stressed over it when we retired, but it turned out that we have more than enough and not less than enough. But, I married a frugal gal. We both came from modest money families, so we just don’t have the need or desire to spend the big bucks. That said, I am buying a new truck late this year.

There are some that simply are not college material. If that is the case then learning a trade is a great alternative. However, take income levels out of the discussion and it is the difference between making a living with your brain or your back.

Next, knowing how to manage money is a big deal. There are a lot of high income folks that are broke all the time.

Well at least im not old yet!

I love old sayings. This would make a great saying. You can take it to the bank. Haste makes waste.

One of my friends is 25 and dropped out of college after the first year because he knew it wasn't for him. He went to school to become a mechanic and is making about $100,000/yr. He bought his first home last year and is doing great. His friends that chided him for dropping out of university and going to trade school have now graduated with their bachelor's and master's degrees....and a ton of debt. Both are literally just now starting their careers at half his salary. The point is, don't make fun of others for choosing a different path.

I work at a university and I did not attend a university, but took a massage therapy course at the local community college. I'm licensed and make a decent living...I'm 20 years older than I was when I was in sales and although I don't make the money I did back then, I don't need to. I had a college kid come up to me one day and asked if I wanted to take a survey, I said sure...the last question was about my experience at a 4 year university...I told him I didn't attend a 4 year university. He said, and I remember this quote very well, "I didn't think I'd encounter someone from a trade school." I looked at him for a moment and asked him what his degree field was. He told me he was a Kinesiology major and what he wanted to do. I told him that was great, all the while knowing I'd make more money than him...

I encourage students that are struggling to look at trade schools. There is nothing wrong/shameful/whatever with not obtaining a four year degree. My best friend has his doctorate and works with the astronauts at NASA...he designs experiments to keep humans healthy for long term space flights. He works with the astronauts when they come off the ISS to readapt to gravity and check their body's overall functionality. He loves it. He makes a great living and has a really cool job. At the same time, I get to help people overcome pain, prepare to go to the Olympics, overcome physical and sexual abuse trauma, just relax, be able to play their respective professional sport, etc. I love my job. We're both successful and we collaborate with different things because we both look at things from our own perspective and it helps us see things we might not be thinking about.

I really wish parents/educators would stop telling young people the only way to be successful is to go to college. You need to have a marketable skill, but a 4 year degree is not the only way to do that. I made a small fortune every year in sales...never went to school for that, but I always studied my product, was honest with my clients and showed up to work. I also worked primarily in commission only sales and not wanting to work for free is a great motivator.

Yessir, this is an accurate statement

^^^^ in other words, work smart.

I didn't finish college, had to go to work. I doubt my income, or my life, could have been any better.

There are many hugely successful people who didnt go to college. I know a guy who was a high school drop out got his GED and learned a trade. He makes more than I do most years, but he works over 2x the hours to do it as well.

College was only a stopping place where I could mature until such a point where I could be beneficial to the general population. I graduated in five years and the general public would have been better served if I had been on the decade plan.

Just don't get too many irons in the fire.