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Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly #8243923 04/20/21 11:43 PM
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Sad deal here. Shows that even the most experienced guides are at risk, and a bit alarming in that the bear spray he used didn't deter the attack.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/grizzly-mauling-near-yellowstone-kills-153207158.html


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Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8243948 04/21/21 12:13 AM
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Originally Posted by dkershen
Sad deal here. Shows that even the most experienced guides are at risk, and a bit alarming in that the bear spray he used didn't deter the attack.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/grizzly-mauling-near-yellowstone-kills-153207158.html


He was a tour guide. Not saying he wasn’t savoy, but probably explains why he had no firearm.

Until the progressives are driven out of the court system, it’s going to get a lot worse


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Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8243950 04/21/21 12:16 AM
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An unfortunate event, for sure. That area is populated by a lot of bears. One of our favorite fishing areas, and we stay at Baker's Hole campground often, as it is right outside West and very nice CG. Close to Hebgen Lake where I do a lot of Spring fishing, after ice-out. The bear was only doing what it normally does, and defending its food. All of the biologists and wardens kept pushing it the next day, and they didn't find the moose carcass until after they killed the bear and approached the site of the mauling. Obviously, it had no fear of people!!!

I probably see 2-4 bears each year, and posted some other pictures on another thread under the Montana Elk Hunting thread. We camp along the Madison below the Dam in June when we have a big family get-together, lots of kids and dogs running around, and each family has a weapon handy in the camper.

Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8244026 04/21/21 01:55 AM
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Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8244035 04/21/21 02:01 AM
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Very sad. I've hunted elk between the Madison and Gallatin rivers a couple of times. I helped tear down a camp that was empty, but apparently a Grizzly had gotten pissed there was no food and shredded everything. Dang impressive and spooky. Prayers for his family.


...and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. Gen. 1:28
Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8244221 04/21/21 11:50 AM
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"Of the strength and ferocity of the animal [grizzly bear] the Indians had given us dreadful accounts. They never attack him except in parties of six or eight persons, and even then are often defeated with the loss of one or more of their party." - Meriwether Lewis and William Clark, The Journals of Lewis and Clark (1805)


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Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8244272 04/21/21 12:42 PM
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Very tragic indeed
May he RIP and prayers to to his family


High fence, low fence, no fence, it really doesn't matter as long as you're hunting!
Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8244273 04/21/21 12:42 PM
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Terrible

Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: BOBO the Clown] #8244371 04/21/21 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted by dkershen
Sad deal here. Shows that even the most experienced guides are at risk, and a bit alarming in that the bear spray he used didn't deter the attack.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/grizzly-mauling-near-yellowstone-kills-153207158.html


He was a tour guide. Not saying he wasn’t savoy, but probably explains why he had no firearm.

Until the progressives are driven out of the court system, it’s going to get a lot worse


I find he was an avid hunter as well.
Bears have not been long out of the den. He was in wrong place at wrong time , that grizz was trying to fatten up and he got in between it and it's spring meal.
A firearm only works if you see the bear coming and have it locked and loaded for a shot. Have to carry with one in the pipe to get that 1st shot off in time. The guide that was mauled and killed last year or year before had his hunter trying to shoot an unloaded gun at the grizz.

If you al; think you cam just shoot a grizz if it's getting close, you will be in for a big surprise, federal charges if that bear was not actually charging you and putting your life in danger. They investigate every grizz shooting and you better have been in imminent danger to discharge your firearm and kill a bear. We see it almost every year up that way. Grizz attacks are not uncommon really.

Thoughts and prayers to his family.

Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8245372 04/22/21 01:20 PM
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When I was much younger I was guiding in the Cabinet Divide and a couple of trips into the Bob Marshall, I remember being scared of grizzly bears with good reason, there weren't many in the Cabinet Divide but the Bob was full. We were always on full alert in the Bob, made for some real fun trips riding out of and back in to camp in total darkness.

Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: Wytex] #8245378 04/22/21 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Wytex
Originally Posted by BOBO the Clown
Originally Posted by dkershen
Sad deal here. Shows that even the most experienced guides are at risk, and a bit alarming in that the bear spray he used didn't deter the attack.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/grizzly-mauling-near-yellowstone-kills-153207158.html


He was a tour guide. Not saying he wasn’t savoy, but probably explains why he had no firearm.

Until the progressives are driven out of the court system, it’s going to get a lot worse


I find he was an avid hunter as well.
Bears have not been long out of the den. He was in wrong place at wrong time , that grizz was trying to fatten up and he got in between it and it's spring meal.
A firearm only works if you see the bear coming and have it locked and loaded for a shot. Have to carry with one in the pipe to get that 1st shot off in time. The guide that was mauled and killed last year or year before had his hunter trying to shoot an unloaded gun at the grizz.

If you al; think you cam just shoot a grizz if it's getting close, you will be in for a big surprise, federal charges if that bear was not actually charging you and putting your life in danger. They investigate every grizz shooting and you better have been in imminent danger to discharge your firearm and kill a bear. We see it almost every year up that way. Grizz attacks are not uncommon really.

Thoughts and prayers to his family.


I’m well aware of ESA Listing laws.

Yes I stand corrected, I found a different article that gave more details. straight up wrong place wrong time and not much would of changed outcome.

The hunting guide last year had a client that freaked out, and couldn’t effectively assist


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Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8245446 04/22/21 02:14 PM
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This one was just last year, while he was hiking on a popular trail in our State Park. This is only a half mile from the cabin area.

https://www.eastidahonews.com/2020/...rizzly-attack-in-henrys-lake-state-park/

Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8245464 04/22/21 02:31 PM
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That probably does make sense to actually carry the spray in your hands. I usually carry a 357, but now I'm questioning myself if I'd be able to get off effective shots in time.

I hate reading stories about bear attacks, but that's just part of being in bear country.

Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8245488 04/22/21 02:48 PM
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I was making the point many stated they would just shoot bear if it got close, that will get you a huge fine and loads of trouble. Evidence of a charge must be there.

Who wouldn't freak out if a grizz was eating your guide. The hunter ejected the magazine from the Glock, he was unfamiliar with the gun. Then had to ride out for cell service to get help.
Bear are silent stalkers, you will not hear them coming unless they want you to.

Like I stated, you all would be shocked at how many grizz encounters there are every year. Bluff charges, taking carcasses etc. What the grizz want they get. You may only protect yourself from imminent danger, not to keep your kill.

Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8245509 04/22/21 03:11 PM
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Our camp on the Madison, about 10 miles from where it happened. We see both black and grizzly bears here, every year in Spring. Everybody wants to camp in the trees, and its so peaceful and serene! Nope, in bear country, give me wide open spaces, lots of visibility, clean camps, and no food out or coolers!!

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Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: Wytex] #8245514 04/22/21 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Wytex
I was making the point many stated they would just shoot bear if it got close, that will get you a huge fine and loads of trouble. Evidence of a charge must be there.

Who wouldn't freak out if a grizz was eating your guide. The hunter ejected the magazine from the Glock, he was unfamiliar with the gun. Then had to ride out for cell service to get help.
Bear are silent stalkers, you will not hear them coming unless they want you to.

Like I stated, you all would be shocked at how many grizz encounters there are every year. Bluff charges, taking carcasses etc. What the grizz want they get. You may only protect yourself from imminent danger, not to keep your kill.



I agree with you on imminent threat

but if he's close enough to cause me to defecate
in my new Tommy Hilfilger thong

I will take the shots... all the shots

I'll explain to the judge, give him all my reasons
as to the dire situations I was in, and show
evidence of explosive defecation due to the
"imminent threat " from the bear. Shots
were fired to prevent bear from mauling me

If the judgement is otherwise, I"ll pay the
fine and the time. At least I am alive

I have a lot of respect for bears,,,, hunting
for elk in bear country is both fun and risky

Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8245518 04/22/21 03:18 PM
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"in my new Tommy Hilfilger thong"

sig worthy

Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8245539 04/22/21 03:34 PM
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I have only been in Brown bear territory once, 2 years ago hunting moose in Alaska. Many assume, as did I, that your guides are more than competent/capable and “always ready” for any and all situations. That simply is a false assumption. I am not suggesting my guides were not but I would have done things drastically differentl immediately upon arrival to camp if I were the guide. I debated for days on end whether to pack a side arm for my trip and bear spray. Ultimately I chose not to as the outfitter didn’t require it and all guides had rifles/shotguns plus a side arm (a couple also had bear spray).

We had 1 encounter the morning we were waiting next to my meat for the super cub to extract us out. That morning a juvenile boar came in. Once down wind of the meat he made a “B-line” for it. Me, the guide and the packer all got up from our position tucked in the alders and stood between him and the meat, weapons drawn and safeties off. He made a few bluff charges, closest being to within about 10-15 yds and then lost interest and carried on his way. To say that I was calm cool and collective would be anything but the truth.

What I am alluding to above is the lack of instruction, more specifically to the quick introduction to everyone’s weapons in camp, If I were the guide, I would give a brief run down of bear situations (which did happen on my trip) how to respond in each etc. Next we would handle each other’s firearm and learn the safeties actions etc (this did not happen) Then move to the bear spray and do the same. This did not happen. After I had shot my moose and we began to both work on the meat, I then realized we are sitting ducks and that my chamber was empty and safety was on. I told the guide, “hey, I am going to chamber a round and leave the safety off, you ok with that”. He acknowledged and so I did. He never mentioned if his rifle had a round in it ready to go or not. I simply assumed it did. We were in reeds that were almost chest high. A brown bear, no matter it’s size could have easily snuck within to 10 ft before we ever saw him. Likely would have heard him sooner but no way we would have saw him. Thankfully we never did, but a huge boar was on the carcass less than 24 hrs after I had shot it.


Vigilance on all parts is required IMO. The guide should always assume the client is ignorant to someone else’s firearms and therefore should be instructed on how to use them. The Hunter should assume, maybe to a lesser degree, that the guide may not be as prepared as one thinks. A verbal conversation about “how to proceed” in a bear situation should be the first instruction in camp and one should not set out to hunt until both understand those instructions & how to work all firearms & bear spray in camp.

Just my .02.

Last edited by Theringworm; 04/22/21 03:38 PM.
Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: Theringworm] #8245565 04/22/21 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Theringworm
I have only been in Brown bear territory once, 2 years ago hunting moose in Alaska. Many assume, as did I, that your guides are more than competent/capable and “always ready” for any and all situations. That simply is a false assumption. I am not suggesting my guides were not but I would have done things drastically differentl immediately upon arrival to camp if I were the guide. I debated for days on end whether to pack a side arm for my trip and bear spray. Ultimately I chose not to as the outfitter didn’t require it and all guides had rifles/shotguns plus a side arm (a couple also had bear spray).

We had 1 encounter the morning we were waiting next to my meat for the super cub to extract us out. That morning a juvenile boar came in. Once down wind of the meat he made a “B-line” for it. Me, the guide and the packer all got up from our position tucked in the alders and stood between him and the meat, weapons drawn and safeties off. He made a few bluff charges, closest being to within about 10-15 yds and then lost interest and carried on his way. To say that I was calm cool and collective would be anything but the truth.

What I am alluding to above is the lack of instruction, more specifically to the quick introduction to everyone’s weapons in camp, If I were the guide, I would give a brief run down of bear situations (which did happen on my trip) how to respond in each etc. Next we would handle each other’s firearm and learn the safeties actions etc (this did not happen) Then move to the bear spray and do the same. This did not happen. After I had shot my moose and we began to both work on the meat, I then realized we are sitting ducks and that my chamber was empty and safety was on. I told the guide, “hey, I am going to chamber a round and leave the safety off, you ok with that”. He acknowledged and so I did. He never mentioned if his rifle had a round in it ready to go or not. I simply assumed it did. We were in reeds that were almost chest high. A brown bear, no matter it’s size could have easily snuck within to 10 ft before we ever saw him. Likely would have heard him sooner but no way we would have saw him. Thankfully we never did, but a huge boar was on the carcass less than 24 hrs after I had shot it.


Vigilance on all parts is required IMO. The guide should always assume the client is ignorant to someone else’s firearms and therefore should be instructed on how to use them. The Hunter should assume, maybe to a lesser degree, that the guide may not be as prepared as one thinks. A verbal conversation about “how to proceed” in a bear situation should be the first instruction in camp and one should not set out to hunt until both understand those instructions & how to work all firearms & bear spray in camp.

Just my .02.


I cannot disagree with anything that you said.


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Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: Wytex] #8245574 04/22/21 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Wytex
I was making the point many stated they would just shoot bear if it got close, that will get you a huge fine and loads of trouble. Evidence of a charge must be there.

Who wouldn't freak out if a grizz was eating your guide. The hunter ejected the magazine from the Glock, he was unfamiliar with the gun. Then had to ride out for cell service to get help.
Bear are silent stalkers, you will not hear them coming unless they want you to.

Like I stated, you all would be shocked at how many grizz encounters there are every year. Bluff charges, taking carcasses etc. What the grizz want they get. You may only protect yourself from imminent danger, not to keep your kill.



The bear attacks I've seen on camera ... it's incredible how fast they happen. Even an extremely experienced hunter / guide may have great difficulty getting off a shot in time, and then it's going to have to be an effective shot (which includes both skill and luck).

Sometimes, bad [censored] just happens.

Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8245598 04/22/21 04:28 PM
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Good post Theringworm.

Most need to think about who is doing the gutting and quartering ? Who is standing watch ? Both of you, then who is watching. Just the guide, you better be prepared.

Yes cabosandinh you would be alive but check into the fine amounts and jail time. Really lays it to anyone who takes a grizz without due cause. Your spoiled panties will mean squat to a judge, no pun intended.

I choose not to hunt in grizz country for a reason. Will not be applying for tag when we get a season either. Not too proud to admit, I'm a scared of grizzly bears.

Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: dkershen] #8245711 04/22/21 05:45 PM
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The last numbers that I saw listed the grizzly population in the Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem at around 750 bears. Many people feel strongly that the counts are off by as much as 100%, and the population is really double what they list. That is a lot of apex predators, in a fairly small area. Friends with cabins in the Island Park/Henry's Lake area have at least a half dozen problems with them each year. Archery elk hunters really need to use caution in these areas, both during hunts and especially during animal recoveries.

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Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: Wytex] #8245812 04/22/21 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Wytex
Good post Theringworm.

Most need to think about who is doing the gutting and quartering ? Who is standing watch ? Both of you, then who is watching. Just the guide, you better be prepared.

Yes cabosandinh you would be alive but check into the fine amounts and jail time. Really lays it to anyone who takes a grizz without due cause. Your spoiled panties will mean squat to a judge, no pun intended.

I choose not to hunt in grizz country for a reason. Will not be applying for tag when we get a season either. Not too proud to admit, I'm a scared of grizzly bears.


better be judged by the judge and 12 ,,, than be carried by 6

I can live and sleep with my decision for sure

Last edited by cabosandinh; 04/22/21 07:43 PM.
Re: Montana Guide Killed by Grizzly [Re: Blank] #8245817 04/22/21 07:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Blank
The last numbers that I saw listed the grizzly population in the Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem at around 750 bears. Many people feel strongly that the counts are off by as much as 100%, and the population is really double what they list. That is a lot of apex predators, in a fairly small area. Friends with cabins in the Island Park/Henry's Lake area have at least a half dozen problems with them each year. Archery elk hunters really need to use caution in these areas, both during hunts and especially during animal recoveries.


Yelp, because of ESA listing they error on extreme caution, basically the number is a guaranteed min. Since that number the also found that home ranges of sows is much smaller then initially thought, so densities thus population numbers are even higher.

When you start looking at the litigation points the progressives are using, it mind blowing they can’t get a judge to side with them.

It’s train wreck and completely kills the good of the ES Act.


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