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Western Hunting #8173977 02/17/21 11:36 PM
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I was reading comments on an Instagram page recently talking about outlawing game cameras in some western states especially during season. I was surprised when I read a ton of comments talking about all these guided outfits that have like 10 people with 1 hunter. Said they post up all over looking for big deer and communicate via radios. Many people said they can’t stand these groups and would rather see the radios outlawed than game cams bc it gives an unfair advantage. Is this really that common? Do guides send out a bunch of people to spot deer and then just call you over to take the shot? Never hunted out west so never been there to see it myself. From the comments it sounds like some are obviously worse about it than others. If it is common what’s your opinion on it? I can see where it would def give a DIYer much less of an advantage.


Originally Posted by bill oxner
I plowed mules.
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I did build a cabin. Aka the brokeback shack.

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Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8173986 02/17/21 11:39 PM
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Western outfitters are intense. its not uncommon for a sheep hunt to involve 6-8 guys, most of them spotters. When a sheep is spotted they radio over to the hunter.


I'm not for it.


For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174029 02/17/21 11:55 PM
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There are probably half a dozen to a dozen outfits that will deploy an army of folks to find the biggest animal in a unit for a “client” (or even a whole state if a Governor’s tag). When I drew my AZ desert bighorn tag back in 2014 a prominent ex MLB player had a tag in the same unit. He had a total posse of about 45 people helping him (counting cooks and wranglers, etc.). Had about 6 different groups out looking for a ram. We were hunting a missile range and on about the 3rd day the powers that be limited him to 6 people total on the range at any one time. His group was done before we got there, this was all relayed to me by range personnel when we checked in.

IDK if I would call it “common” because not many can afford it but it is very widespread. Lots of folks working for a few well-heeled clients. Not my cup of tea.

My personal code is me, guide, and possibly wrangler if he wants to hang with us. No issue with splitting up to glass but not into different groups spread out all over a unit or state or large area.


Originally Posted By: Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174039 02/17/21 11:59 PM
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Never heard of such.

That's ridiculous.

I wouldn't outlaw it - you're still just taking 1 animal in season - but I would say it's a bit ridiculous and should be considered a poor practice.

Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174048 02/18/21 12:03 AM
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I say if you can afford it then why not, who am I to say what’s right or wrong for somebody else. That’s what they do in communist country’s and this ain’t one flag flag flag

Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174053 02/18/21 12:07 AM
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The outfits that do it are in fierce competition with one another. There us even a sort of behind the scenes game that goes on with “free agents” who play outfits against one another to get top dollar once they locate a big animal. Social media also plays a big role. It’s all about the biggun. Once he’s located he’s usually a goner. Still, many are never located by the big outfits and either make it through or are taken by regular folks.


Originally Posted By: Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174066 02/18/21 12:12 AM
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Right, the 'fairness' aspect isn't to the animals, but to the hunters. Bob the outfitter who doesn't have a team will not think it is fair that Corporate Big Game outfit has an operation that team hunts.


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Re: Western Hunting [Re: txtrophy85] #8174072 02/18/21 12:18 AM
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Originally Posted by txtrophy85
Western outfitters are intense. its not uncommon for a sheep hunt to involve 6-8 guys, most of them spotters. When a sheep is spotted they radio over to the hunter.


I'm not for it.



No doubt a lot of sheep hunts are group efforts simply because many who draw a tag have lots of family and friends who want to share in the experience. It becomes a social event. I can’t really knock that.

I’ve had several offers on both sheep and goat hunts where guys wanted to go along, film the hunts, etc. I appreciated the offers but I prefer a much more low key personal experience. Now if a close family member or very close friend wanted to go that would be different but none are really into sheep hunting. I have a buddy from BC (my bear guide from 2013) that may go on my next one and I would love to have him since he is 10x the sheep hunter I am.

Sheep hunting has lots of variation all the way from solo DIY guys in the MT Unlimiteds for weeks on end to posses of a dozen or more finding a ram and flying a hunter in for the shot where he’s out about 4 hours total. And everything in between. And not just sheep, all western big game.


Originally Posted By: Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Western Hunting [Re: Ol Thumper] #8174081 02/18/21 12:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Ol Thumper
I say if you can afford it then why not, who am I to say what’s right or wrong for somebody else. That’s what they do in communist country’s and this ain’t one flag flag flag

I don’t care either way really just had never heard of it till I read through all those comments. Does seem a little unfair if you have 40 people spread out through a unit trying to find the biggest deer but if it’s legal Then do it until it’s not.


Originally Posted by bill oxner
I plowed mules.
Originally Posted by Roll-Tide
I did build a cabin. Aka the brokeback shack.

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Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174095 02/18/21 12:34 AM
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Without desiring to start a fight, I don’t think it can be argued that those who employ the armies are much more focused on the size of an animal than on the hunting experience itself. IMO they are very much shortchanging themselves.


Originally Posted By: Russ79
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.


Re: Western Hunting [Re: Nogalus Prairie] #8174128 02/18/21 12:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Nogalus Prairie
Without desiring to start a fight, I don’t think it can be argued that those who employ the armies are much more focused on the size of an animal than on the hunting experience itself. IMO they are very much shortchanging themselves.


Nicely put. I'd never make such silliness illegal, but I'd be lying if I didn't say that I look down on those who are so shallow.


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Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174218 02/18/21 02:00 AM
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It damn sure isn’t “fair chase”


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Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174224 02/18/21 02:05 AM
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Damn, this is going to be a western high fence thread.

Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174226 02/18/21 02:06 AM
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Outfitter Doyle Moss is the world's worst 'posse" outfitter. They have an army of guys who find and keep track of the biggest animals they can find, then call some lardasss to show up and shoot it. Hero shots thereafter.

Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174232 02/18/21 02:14 AM
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My buddy drew a bighorn sheep tag in Utah year before last.

He got a great sheep, but stumbled across two other teams of guys while looking at a herd; one a 80 year old man with cancer and another guy, I’m not 100% on this but he may have had the governors tag.

They got out of the way and let the older gent take the sheep and even helped him pack it out. The other guy it was literally a race to beat him to the sheep. They came out on top and took the sheep, but the way it was described it wasn’t a peaceful hunt, it was a “ we gotta get to him before this guy and we have just a matter of minutes to get there before he does”



For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174234 02/18/21 02:16 AM
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I’ve never heard of such a thing either, and while it doesn’t seem right to me to hire an army of people I think it would be great to have a few close friends tag along for the experience.

Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174259 02/18/21 02:30 AM
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There are a lot of things that happen out in the field hunting anymore, and many are illegal, or unethical, or downright dangerous. Some you can try to eliminate by education, some things you really do need to make illegal. Flying with airplanes or drones, trail cameras (some real time with cell coverage), phones and radios, 1000+ rifle shots over your head, when you have worked two hours to get on a trophy, posses of people. Much of it ruins the reason that many of us go out there. here was just one tree on a waterhole in Arizona where I hunted this year. There were over 20 cameras here, in a 100 yard circle!!

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Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174270 02/18/21 02:41 AM
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What you all are discussing mainly happens in a particular state I would say. You're talking about the outfitters for the high dollar hunts, i.e auction tags etc..
Look up the Jimmy Johns bull elk taken last fall.
This is not common for most western outfitters.
In particular Utah and Arizona are known for their use of posses for high dollar hunters. They have out spotters that watch the animals throughout the season and trail cams over waterholes etc for keeping tabs also.
I say these 2 states because that is where the outfitters operate that do these types of hunts. Happens also others but not as much.

It is not common amongst all western outfitters. Most outfits I know in Wyoming get you 2 hunters per guide, one on one if you want to pay for it. They do not sit on animals all year so they know where they are.
We have some guys out of Utah that I believe book trophy hunts for folks , have some locals that watch one of our local moose herds for it's trophy bulls. They got pretty mad a local guy took a huge bull they had wanted for one for their guys 2 years ago or last year. It was written up in Eastman's.
Radios are used but not for calling in hunters usually. It happens sure but not all the time.
Flying to spot game has been made illegal in many states now. You can't fly and spot then land and shoot, in Wyoming anyway.

Some trophy areas for mule deer areas do get the race to the buck though.

Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174318 02/18/21 03:15 AM
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It's common to have a lot of people on tag draws that are very limited. Not just guides but also Tag holders friends and family. It's a social events on many occasions..

Utah is a good example, those limit unit tags may take a lifetime to draw, so when you do it bring everyone to help. I'd come help a friend on a LE TAG.

Biggest problem is all the pressure cameras create at water holes and guzzlers 10 cameras that ten people hitting it every few days. 20 cameras, 20 people etc.


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Re: Western Hunting [Re: Blank] #8174557 02/18/21 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Blank
There are a lot of things that happen out in the field hunting anymore, and many are illegal, or unethical, or downright dangerous. Some you can try to eliminate by education, some things you really do need to make illegal. Flying with airplanes or drones, trail cameras (some real time with cell coverage), phones and radios, 1000+ rifle shots over your head, when you have worked two hours to get on a trophy, posses of people. Much of it ruins the reason that many of us go out there. here was just one tree on a waterhole in Arizona where I hunted this year. There were over 20 cameras here, in a 100 yard circle!!

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This is unbelievable

Re: Western Hunting [Re: txtrophy85] #8174574 02/18/21 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by txtrophy85
Western outfitters are intense. its not uncommon for a sheep hunt to involve 6-8 guys, most of them spotters. When a sheep is spotted they radio over to the hunter.


I'm not for it.


Re: Western Hunting [Re: Jgraider] #8174599 02/18/21 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Jgraider
Outfitter Doyle Moss is the world's worst 'posse" outfitter. They have an army of guys who find and keep track of the biggest animals they can find, then call some lardasss to show up and shoot it. Hero shots thereafter.

Someone posted a video elk hunt on here last fall where some fat rich guy with "Man Boobs" took a long range shot on a monster elk. During the recovery I counted at least 22 people. Man Boobs barely made it to kill site and just sat there while elk was field dressed and packed out.
I'm sure he paid $$$$ for the bull.

Re: Western Hunting [Re: SapperTitan] #8174607 02/18/21 01:58 PM
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Just another example of something I would not spend all that jack on. Doesn't particularly make it wrong, just something I would not do.

I do prefer blondes.

Re: Western Hunting [Re: Biscuit] #8174610 02/18/21 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Biscuit
Originally Posted by Blank
There are a lot of things that happen out in the field hunting anymore, and many are illegal, or unethical, or downright dangerous. Some you can try to eliminate by education, some things you really do need to make illegal. Flying with airplanes or drones, trail cameras (some real time with cell coverage), phones and radios, 1000+ rifle shots over your head, when you have worked two hours to get on a trophy, posses of people. Much of it ruins the reason that many of us go out there. here was just one tree on a waterhole in Arizona where I hunted this year. There were over 20 cameras here, in a 100 yard circle!!

[Linked Image]


This is unbelievable


That's nothing. That's just one tree


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Re: Western Hunting [Re: Hudbone] #8174663 02/18/21 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Hudbone
Just another example of something I would not spend all that jack on. Doesn't particularly make it wrong, just something I would not do.

I do prefer blondes.



To be fair, that type of hunt happens with Bighorns...both Desert and Rocky Mountain in suitable terrain. Stone and Dall, you and your guide are probably gonna be the only guys on the mountain.


For it is not the quarry that we truly seek, but the adventure.
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